Time gap vs player percentile, GT Sport vs Forza Motorsport 7

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo Sport' started by breeminator, May 14, 2019.

  1. breeminator

    breeminator

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    This week's Daily Race B has provided a great opportunity for some stats analysis, because it matches a FM7 monthly rivals from June 2018.

    So, here is what I have recorded from that FM7 rivals:
    Top time 3:54.405
    My time 4:01.510, time gap = 3.03%
    My percentile on the world leaderboard was top 1.92%, i.e. 1.92% of players were above me, the rest below me.

    Looking at the EMEA leaderboard on K', we currently have:
    Top time 3:52.824
    3.03% slower = 3:59.879 = 1364th out of 15210 = top 8.97%

    So the same % time gap of 3.03% has a massively greater % of players in it in GT Sport than in FM7, 8.97% vs 1.92%.

    This has made me ponder why that might be. I can think of three main areas that could cause it:

    1. Different player demographics - the player base doing daily races might be genuinely biased more towards the top end than the player base doing the monthly rivals in FM7.

    2. Different motivating factors - the monthly rivals in FM7 don't incentivise people to necessarily try to put in the absolute best performance they can. If you've done enough to earn all the rewards, many people might not bother beyond that. OTOH GT Sport rewards everyone trying to do the best QT they can, if they want to achieve the best possible DR.

    3. Different physics - maybe the GT Sport physics allow more people to get closer to the best time? My hunch is this is less likely than the first two.

    I just found it quite interesting that there is such a big difference, and would be interested in any insights people have into why it's the case.
     
  2. kub_man

    kub_man

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    Obviously avg pilot level (distribution curve) is more skilled in GTS.
     
  3. GOTMAXPOWER

    GOTMAXPOWER

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    The last Forza I played was FM6, if 7 is the same the physics will effect how quick players are. The cars slid around a lot (Whether that is or isn't realistic is a conversation for another thread) so you need more finesse to get your maximum on any lap, Gran Turismo is more predictable so you can drive consistently, I think that helps you get closer to your personal maximum.
     
  4. mthomas_95

    mthomas_95

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    People are so used to Gr3 in GT that will account for a fair chunk of the difference I reckon. Generally the slower the cars the closer the percentage gaps are and vice versa. Below is how many have got within 3.03% in EMEA (and 107% rule in brackets, just for fun ;))

    Interlagos Gr4 - 26.6% (81.1%)
    Le Mans Gr3 - 9.0% (60.0%)
    Autopolis SF - 4.2% (45.1%)
    Brands F1500 - 1.3% (17.1%)
     
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  5. zzz_pt

    zzz_pt Premium

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    I think way more people use a steering wheel in GT too. Given that Forza is pushing their esports competition with controllers, a lot of people who drive with a wheel and want some more and better competition don't play Forza.

    I have no data, just what ai know from both games.
     
  6. Pigems

    Pigems

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    I thought Forza was a lot closer to GTS until I saw a few clips last week, physics wise it’s basically Need for Speed, I don’t even know if the guys were using brakes in the clips I saw, guys would smash into walls hard and then catch the player in front a couple corners later anyway, it looked waaaay less realistic than GTS.
     
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  7. Nomadpt1

    Nomadpt1

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    I think the fact that your faster with ABS off, in FM7, means that every lap has diferent braking points between every player so the diference is more aparent in FM7.
    While in GTS you are faster with ABS on so is very easy to hit braking points consistently, therefore times will be closer between players
     
  8. Sven Jurgens

    Sven Jurgens

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    Does Forza have BOP or does tuning play a part?
     
  9. DC2_Evan

    DC2_Evan

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    Sort of, but for online there is not. It's basically run what you want, full tuning and upgrades are allowed within that class (E-S, R, and X)
     
  10. Tired Tyres

    Tired Tyres

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    I'm D class in GTS but that is in 14 sport races in three sessions. In F7 I do the Rival event at Indianapolis against the ghosts of Indycar racers and I'm in the top 9% in Europe after three sessions.

    Not like for like of course but as close as I can realistically get since I don't have Gold.
     
  11. breeminator

    breeminator

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    That's definitely not the case. FM7 physics with road cars feels pretty similar to GTS road cars IMO. FM7 race cars are more slidey, they don't gain as much grip over the road cars as the race cars do in GTS.

    For the rivals event I mentioned above, no tuning was permitted, it was basically the exact same thing as this week's GTS Race B, the same track with the same type of car. IIRC it even had the Huracan being used for the world #1 time as well.
     
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  12. Pigems

    Pigems

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    All I meant was the driving style needed to be fast. It looked like you needed to slide the car through nearly every corner in Forza just like NFS has always been, whereas is GTS you actually have to drive somewhat properly to be fast. That’s all.
     
  13. breeminator

    breeminator

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    No, definitely not the case, sliding is slow in Forza as well. This is a lap by the fastest hot lapper in Forza, the track limits have been tightened since it was recorded:
     
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  14. Xlxy90

    Xlxy90

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    Look at how much faith the driver is putting on the astroturf not being made of oil!

    Any trips towards the green stuff in GTS results in being flung rear first in to the nearest grandstand..