Toyota Auris - the new Corolla

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...If the Auris remains a hatchback/wagon thingy and goes with 230 BHP, GM has a great competitor: The 2009 Chevrolet HHR Turbo (SS). It should have between 230-260 BHP from the same engine found in the Solstice GXP. Of course GM will have to do some extensive modifications to the car, but if the previous photos showed us anything (search for it in the Auto News section), it looks like they mean business.

Hell, GM may surprise us and say that it has 300 BHP like the SRT-4. But that I doubt, as the Delta chassis would need some extensive modification to apply that kind of power in a reasonable way.
 
I was unaware of the HHR Turbo, though it would make perfect sense for it to have the same turbo engine being used across the board for other performance model. And no doubt GM will be able to undercut the price of a comparable Toyota, which will appeal to a larger group of purchasers. But as you said, a great deal would need to be done to realize this project, and GM's rather poor build quality would work against I feel. Especially sense they tend to skip on fit and finish.

I was expecting a reaction in regard to the GTi as well, so I must have remained with in the "not bashing VW" area.

So do you think Toyota may follow up on this, or are they just pulling everyone's leg along with all their fun cars?
 
Yaris Turbo... uhmmmm... understeer?

The boys next door (Thailand) have the current turbo version, the Vios 1.5 Turbo, and while it's got decent grunt (still only about 150 ponies or less), there's just a bit too much understeer, thanks to the lack of an LSD and an unresolved rear suspension.

While my respect for the Corolla went up one or two notches in test-drives of new ones (steering ain't the best, but the suspension seemed well-resolved on the street), I lost much of it at the last track-day. While slithering around in the wet in the Proty, I was dismayed to be held up by a guy driving a new Corolla, plowing through the course with tons of understeer, poor body control, and a hopping rear end that either had too little shock damping, too little rear end compliance (damn stupid torsion beam) or both. Granted, it accelerated well for a small I4, and even on the edge of adhesion, he didn't spin out like many others did, but on the BRC's midfield (uhmmm... picture Infineon Sports Car course, in reverse... not exactly the same, but those are the kind of turns it had...) it looked horrible. We had runners in modified AE92s and AE101s, and, even given that they had modified shocks and springs, they seemed tons better. (sorry, Kent...)

It might be a different story for the XRS suspension set-up, but I'll only believe it when I see it...

If the Auris is supposed to much better than the Corolla, that won't be hard... almost every compact I've driven recently steers better and combines better suspension compliance with decent traction. The Corolla may have been fairly good compared to the class of 2000, but right now? :( It's really past time Toyota upgraded this car.
 
It could be worse. It could have come out looking like this or this. I'm actually glad Toyota has held some restraint in how ugly they tried to make the new Corolla.
 
*Yawns* Any thing else, Toyota? Nope? All right then, I'll go to the Honda dealer then.
 
Honey, I Shrunk the Camry!

...I agree with everyone else here, very boring indeed. It is as if they have managed to suck every droplet of life out of the car, even by comparison, the Saturn Ion seems more exciting than this. Vanilla? No, my friends... This is FRENCH Vanilla, and I fear for the end of Toyota as we all knew it. Performance fans, this is the last leg of Toyota as a credible company when it comes to small cars. Sure, there is the Yaris, the true Corolla in my eyes, and I suppose the Scion tC as well.

Too bad really, the Auris could have been something special here in the US.
 
What? French vanilla is way better than regular vanilla!

Back on topic: Toyota is really really good at pandering to the “I just need to go from A to B” kind of people, so I can’t blame them for this uninspired blob of blobiness.

The wavy-bottomed lamp covering are starting to annoy me though – Audi, Saturn, Toyota, Ford, Honda, Acura, they’re all doing it. Pure fad.
 
The car looks boring no doubt, but this thread should be called: "How much bashing can you do to Toyota? Click Here."

You people are treating car companies like they are your local [insert favorite sport here] club. Specially from YSSMAN and Poverty, the car isn't even out yet and it is already, slow, boring, "lack of feel", etc... You complain that Toyota didn't make exciting cars anymore and when it seems that they are about to change that, the negative comments still endure. I'm sorry but that is just hate and contempt speaking.
 
well hopefully this might lighten the mood. I saw in Autosport magazine a picture of Alain Prost testing an ice racing version of the Auris, and IMO, i think it looks MUCH better in racing form. here's a picture of the racing Auris.
 

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daggoth
The car looks boring no doubt, but this thread should be called: "How much bashing can you do to Toyota? Click Here."

You people are treating car companies like they are your local [insert favorite sport here] club. Specially from YSSMAN and Poverty, the car isn't even out yet and it is already, slow, boring, "lack of feel", etc... You complain that Toyota didn't make exciting cars anymore and when it seems that they are about to change that, the negative comments still endure. I'm sorry but that is just hate and contempt speaking.
Click to expand...

How much money would you put on Toyota's Corolla replacement not being 'bland', 'average', 'dull' yet reliable?

The Corolla will always be these things and nothing more.

It's like saying that any car that is ever produced in the future wearing a Maybach badge will be 'tasteful' and 'classy' - it's just never going to happen.

Stereotypes exist for a reason. ;)

nitro_2005
well hopefully this might lighten the mood. I saw in Autosport magazine a picture of Alain Prost testing an ice racing version of the Auris, and IMO, i think it looks MUCH better in racing form. here's a picture of the racing Auris.
Click to expand...

Except it's a silhouette special sharing very little with any real Auris.
 
TheCracker
How much money would you put on Toyota's Corolla replacement not being 'bland', 'average', 'dull' yet reliable?

The Corolla will always be these things and nothing more.
Click to expand...

None, I've said the car looks boring and I think probably won't be much different than the current one. I believe that even the 225 hp version won't be much of a kickass.
The problem is that many GTP users criticize EVERYTHING the company does. Am I the only one that sees so much hatred for the Prius here? Camry? - Bashing. Lexus going hybrid? - Bashing. LF-A? - Bashing, "has no feel". And please check out YSSMAN thread about the Lexus F division...

And also, Corolla = Bland, Average, Dull -> I'm going to say (at a high risk of getting flamed) AE86.
 
nitro_2005
well hopefully this might lighten the mood. I saw in Autosport magazine a picture of Alain Prost testing an ice racing version of the Auris, and IMO, i think it looks MUCH better in racing form. here's a picture of the racing Auris.
Click to expand...

How ironic it may sound, it's still ugly. Why don't they just go on on the previous Corolla, that was a very pretty car, especially the Compressor version 👍
 
Allow me to be a bit frank here, daggoth. It isn't a mater of "hating" or "bashing" Toyota or any of their subsidies, it is a matter of talking about things the way they are. Toyota runs about dangling these wonderful little cars to us, and then turns around and gives us these boring, "dead on the inside" cars that completely go against everything that the small-car market should be.

So, explain to me then why I have to love the new Corolla? I'd take the Auris any day in this situation, at least it looks exciting. Toyota is going to have to work quite hard to work me over, it is as easy as that. When they can build a car that is involving for the driver, not just the computers, maybe I'd consider one as a reasonable ride...

...But until then, GM, Volkswagen, Ford, and Nissan get my votes in most segments these days...
 
TheCracker
Wow, one arguably interesting model in 40 years 👍
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say that. There's the Supra (all versions), MR2 (and maybe the MR-S), 2000GT . . . I'm sure there's others out there . . . I think . . . I mean, it's been 40 years. No one's that boring, are they? Oh, wait...I forgot we're talking about the same company that canned the MR-S for being "too sporty".

Maybe it's more about a changing of the guard over the past ten years, rather than the company's mission as a whole. They haven't exactly been like Nissan or Mazda, but even Honda is starting to follow the same route. (the Civic Si/Type-R being the lone holdout).


daggoth
None, I've said the car looks boring and I think probably won't be much different than the current one. I believe that even the 225 hp version won't be much of a kickass.
The problem is that many GTP users criticize EVERYTHING the company does. Am I the only one that sees so much hatred for the Prius here? Camry? - Bashing. Lexus going hybrid? - Bashing. LF-A? - Bashing, "has no feel". And please check out YSSMAN thread about the Lexus F division...
Click to expand...

As has already been said, stereotypes exist for a reason. I would also point out that most people on this board look for cars with passion, with some modicum of excitement. You simply do not get that from the aenimic drive that is the IS300/250/350. While we do talk about the state of the minivan segment from time to time, it's not a market that caters to anything resembling "excitement", and generally excels at what it sets out to do. Toyota, on the other hand, expects to satisfy driving enthusiasts with the Corolla S, which wouldn't worry your average geriatric driver. And then there's the styling....

There's hope -- a sliver of hope -- from this questionably-named L division (or F division... :rolleyes:), but I'm not holding my breath.
 
Toyota always had a reputation of rather boring and not too speedy but never, I mean, never, can you not agree a Toyota isn't reliable. If you think a Toyota is unreliable, I would seriously slap you...

But once they make a sportscar, it seems they're very succesfull. The Supra for example, the only real fast car they ever build, and what a car! It's still a high wanted sportscar to have, a shame Toyota quit producing them after '99.

The Celicas had quite the reputation as well, the GT4 was a good competitor against the Ford Escort WRC, although higher priced.
 
Toyota is trying to move away from sporty-ness, because now that they have Scion, that sporty car would steal from Scions sales. But this isn't an issue elsewhere.

Just to clarify: Scion xB = Toyota bB Scion xA = Toyota Ist/Vitz
Scion tC = Toyota Avensis

I know most of you know that, but others dont. :) The only reason there is a problem with a sporty Toyota here, is the fact that the tC comes standard with 160hp at appox. $16K, and with the TRD blower, its a pretty cheap 200hp at $23K
 
harrytuttle
I wouldn't say that. There's the Supra (all versions), MR2 (and maybe the MR-S), 2000GT . . . I'm sure there's others out there . . . I think . . . I mean, it's been 40 years. No one's that boring, are they?
Click to expand...

We were talking about the Corolla, not the whole Toyota range.
 
I've driven several SEVERAL Corolla's, ranging from the early 80's to the late 90's. We basically have a small Toyota group here, and the FX-16 GT-S AE82 is a blast to drive, despite being front wheel drive. The AE86 is also great fun, awesome little project car, well till it became "cool" and is was over valued now. Older RWD 4 door Corolla's, while lacking power, are still fun. Any my '99 daily driver ZZE110 is nothing amazing, I still enjoy pushing it through corners.

And the AE92, AE101, and AE111 are all sporty looking models with sporty numbers.

No, the Corolla is not amazing beats everything car. But it has always been a nice combination of factors. Its not super dead beat boring to drive, offers good gas mileage, relatively comfortable to be in, runs forever and ever, and offers quite a bit as a platform for auto-x I feel.

The Auris appears to be Toyota realizing that they need another sporty variant in their line up again. It may not just turn the whole line up around right off the bat, but give it two generations and Toyota might actually realize once more people do want a truly sport like car from them.

But Toyota will always hold to their reliability first, then everything else after that. Its how they got to be where they are now.

And YSSMAN, you seem to ignore the long term reliability of those makers you are preferring right now. GM and Ford are doing okay, but still nowhere near Toyota, and the last time I checked on reliability and problems on VW's, they had more problems than the Koreans. My preference for Toyota is that I can enjoy their cars and beat them into the ground and still keep them years and years.

Toyota may not appeal to you guys, but they seem to be doing something right... why else would they be one of the most successful car companies in the world?

Final note on the MR-S. It was axed in part because of Scion, and in part because it was barely selling. Problem I feel was it had similar performance to a Miata, but the name is not nearly as well known. If they had dropped the 2ZZ-GE in there instead of the 1ZZ-FE, they could have had a poor man's Elise on their hands. It was just a bad call on their part thinking they could cut effectively into the Miata's area in such a short time.
 
Azuremen
But Toyota will always hold to their reliability first, then everything else after that. Its how they got to be where they are now.

And YSSMAN, you seem to ignore the long term reliability of those makers you are preferring right now. GM and Ford are doing okay, but still nowhere near Toyota, and the last time I checked on reliability and problems on VW's, they had more problems than the Koreans. My preference for Toyota is that I can enjoy their cars and beat them into the ground and still keep them years and years.
Click to expand...

Heres the thing though, I would much rather have a car that I enjoy with a few extra "problems" than a boring, "reliable" car. I personally don't trust most reliability reports, as they are always going to be a little right and a little wrong. I personally think Toyota's quality is a bit overrated, particularly in contrast to Volkswagen, and quality levels have taken a slight dip for the Japanese.

From what I understand, the Avalon is full of problems, far beyond what any modern Toyota has been, ever. I wouldn't be surprised to see some issues happen with the Camry as well, although nothing major has showed up so far. I personally think the new Camry receives a lot of glory it doesn't deserve, particularly with the interior quality and overall driving dynamics. I'd much rather go with the older Honda Accord in that regard, hell even my two-generation-behind Jetta in most cases.
 
I'd prefer the older Camrys over anything mentioned...Was it the early or mid-90's Camry? Anyway, I do remember they had quite an engine in it. I still see them much and I everytime think "What a car !" when I see it...I don't like the new Camry or Avalon either, the older cars still remain the best IMO.
 
MatttheTuner
Toyota is trying to move away from sporty-ness, because now that they have Scion, that sporty car would steal from Scions sales. But this isn't an issue elsewhere.

Just to clarify: Scion xB = Toyota bB Scion xA = Toyota Ist/Vitz
Scion tC = Toyota Avensis

I know most of you know that, but others dont. :) The only reason there is a problem with a sporty Toyota here, is the fact that the tC comes standard with 160hp at appox. $16K, and with the TRD blower, its a pretty cheap 200hp at $23K
Click to expand...
Actually, you were only right with the xB, the xA you were half right, and the tC, WAY off the mark.

Toyota ist=Scion xA
Toyota bB=Scion xB

The tC isn't sold as a Toyota ANYWHERE. A North American car only atm, but apparently, it will be going to Europe soon.
 
What I meant was that the tC was based off of the Avensis, which I know is a family sedan.
 

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