TUNE THE CARS FFB SETTINGS FIRST!!! (setups included)

[mister dog]

Now that i got your attention, i want to stress it is very important to tune the individual FFB settings of the cars in the pit menu first, before you start jerking around with the car itself and change the suspension, brakes etcetera.

Why? Because some simple adjustments to those can change around the car's feel and behavior significantly, and you want to get that right first.
I'm currently taking out each car to tune it's FFB settings, before i get further into the game and start tuning the suspension because of that reason.

These are the important ones:

Basically: Master scale: don't up it too much, 26 is fine in most cases.
Fx: FFB when acc/braking
Fy: How heavy your wheel feels when cornering
Fz: How much FFB over bumps and kerbs
Mz: How much FFB when losing traction

Once you start playing around with those sliders, it has a great effect on all of the cars, and compensates for any 'lack off' or 'to much' effects on your particular wheel.

Do take notice that in the main FFB settings of the game (options/controls/FFB calibration menu), you have to put the 'deadzone removal range' to 0.15 on most wheels first. This will enhance the overall FFB. All my other main ingame FFB settings (in the wheel/FFB calibration menu), are default.

On wheel settings for my CSR menu are FFB 100 and everything else OFF if available or 000. Rotation is 900 degrees and damper is set at 100 in the Fanatec profiler.

I use a CSR, so your wheel might be a bit different, but now that you understand the parameters i mentioned above, you can compensate for that

First example:

Renault Megane RS:

A lot of people have been complaining about this car, and rightfully so as it feels like a truck in corners. This was due to the Fy scale being at 100 which made the steering way too heavy and caused FFB clipping (FFB went over the top and went numb because of it).

Take the car standard to the track and drive one lap, so you can take in how it felt on default. Then go to the pits and save these FFB settings (don't forget to press save):

Master scale: 26
Fx: 100
Fy: 60
Fz: 150
Mz: 130

Now the Megane should feel like a modern day front-wheel drive car with power steering.
Let me know how it works out for you

1971 Mercedes-Benz 300SEL 6.8 AMG:

Master scale: 26
Fx: 110
Fy: 114
Fz: 130
Mz: 130

Formula Rookie:

Master scale: 26
Fx: 100
Fy: 130
Fz: 170
Mz: 120


I will post more FFB tunes soon.

 

[mister dog]

Reserved.

 

[GTAndy36]

Can I just say something real quick.

I've done nothing but test FFB since release day, with a friend. He's on the PC, and I'm on the PS4. We've both got the same wheel, Thrustmaster T300... and we're both getting wildly different 'feels' through the wheel. His FFB is super smooth on turning and weight transfer, whilst mine on the PS4 feels very grainy in comparison. All of the FFB we've described to each other sounds pretty much the same, but the smoothness simply isn't there with the PS4.

We're guessing this has something to do with the lack of a PS4 configuration tool, as on the PC you can set a number of parameters outside of the game to help certain aspects, like FFB strength etc. As us PS4 users know, if we want a softer FFB we can only change it in the game, which again as we know, we don't really want to take off 100 due to forces being numbed down.

I've been working on ways to get the FFB smoother on the PS4, and I'm pretty happy with what I've got so far... but it's far from perfect. But I feel it's something that's being over-looked by a lot of PS4 wheel users, the fact the FFB isn't as smooth as it could and probably should be.

Another thing being over-looked by a huge amount of gamers, both console and PC, is the global FFB settings as stock are kack, so they need changing as well even before you get to sorting out FFB per car.

I've tried out various settings from PC users, and none of them translate very well to PS4 with the T300 without a lot of tweaking. I know immediately looking at your figures, that the Megane setup won't transfer at all well to my setup. The grain will be astronomical.

 

[mister dog]

Can I just say something real quick.

I've done nothing but test FFB since release day, with a friend. He's on the PC, and I'm on the PS4. We've both got the same wheel, Thrustmaster T300... and we're both getting wildly different 'feels' through the wheel. His FFB is super smooth on turning and weight transfer, whilst mine on the PS4 feels very grainy in comparison. All of the FFB we've described to each other sounds pretty much the same, but the smoothness simply isn't there with the PS4.

We're guessing this has something to do with the lack of a PS4 configuration tool, as on the PC you can set a number of parameters outside of the game to help certain aspects, like FFB strength etc. As us PS4 users know, if we want a softer FFB we can only change it in the game, which again as we know, we don't really want to take off 100 due to forces being numbed down.

I've been working on ways to get the FFB smoother on the PS4, and I'm pretty happy with what I've got so far... but it's far from perfect. But I feel it's something that's being over-looked by a lot of PS4 wheel users, the fact the FFB isn't as smooth as it could and probably should be.

Another thing being over-looked by a huge amount of gamers, both console and PC, is the global FFB settings as stock are kack, so they need changing as well even before you get to sorting out FFB per car.

I've tried out various settings from PC users, and none of them translate very well to PS4 with the T300 without a lot of tweaking. I know immediately looking at your figures, that the Megane setup won't transfer at all well to my setup. The grain will be astronomical.

Really depends, i'm on PC and the stock general FFB feels great out of the box on my CSR, like i mentioned only the deadzone removal range needed some upping. Apart from that all i need to do is start tuning the individual FFB for each car and that's it; FFB heaven.

Also what do you mean with grain, like a rough feeling or vibration?

 

[GTAndy36]

Yeah, just very rough. The T300 is smooth on many racers, including GT6. The fact it feels rough on PCars for the PS4 is slightly worrying.

 

[Goruk]

Yeah, just very rough. The T300 is smooth on many racers, including GT6. The fact it feels rough on PCars for the PS4 is slightly worrying.

That´s because Thrustmaster wheels have spring enable on the PS4 drivers, and that is why they violently correct as soon as you losse grip.

 

[GTAndy36]

That´s because Thrustmaster wheels have spring enable on the PS4 drivers, and that is why they violently correct as soon as you losse grip.

Yeah, that's definitely a contributing factor.

I don't think it's solely down to that though. Until they take it off, I can't be sure. It needs to be done as soon as possible because it's making the game very tricky to make realistic.

My mate on the PC doesn't know how to take it off on his game either. He's got it off in his config, but he still feels the game has the centre spring issue coming in regardless.

 

[TT92]

Yeah, just very rough. The T300 is smooth on many racers, including GT6. The fact it feels rough on PCars for the PS4 is slightly worrying.

It feels like it uses gear drive (which it most definitely doesn't) and the gears are not meshing properly. It feels, rough, notchy and definitely not smooth. Almost like there are only 10 positions from lock to lock of the wheel and it jumps to each step :-( Sometimes it is better, mostly it is worse.

I also sometimes get a high frequency vibration in the wheel, nearly same as a wet finger on a wine glass rim and it nearly makes the same noise too. Again session dependant. As is at the start at a new track and the wheel is turned 45deg left and buzzes. Unplug USB cable, reset wheel and it is fine until I change tracks. Also not consistent.

Also the wheel feel not only changes so much from car to car BUT from track to track and session to session on the same car on the same track. IMHO this comes back to the game not remembering settings and generating it's own random numbers like it does for car tuning settings.

Have I described what everyone else is feeling with their T300 on PS4?

 

[giorgos21]

Now that i got your attention, i want to stress it is very important to tune the individual FFB settings of the cars in the pit menu first, before you start jerking around with the car itself and change the suspension, brakes etcetera.

Why? Because some simple adjustments to those can change around the car's feel and behavior significantly, and you want to get that right first.
I'm currently taking out each car to tune it's FFB settings, before i get further into the game and start tuning the suspension because of that reason.

These are the important ones:

Basically: Master scale: don't up it too much, 26 is fine in most cases.
Fx: FFB when acc/braking
Fy: How heavy your wheel feels when cornering
Fz: How much FFB over bumps and kerbs
Mz: How much FFB when losing traction

Once you start playing around with those sliders, it has a great effect on all of the cars, and compensates for any 'lack off' or 'to much' effects on your particular wheel.

Do take notice that in the main FFB settings of the game (options/controls/FFB calibration menu), you have to put the 'deadzone removal range' to 0.15 on most wheels first. This will enhance the overall FFB.

I use a CSR, so your wheel might be a bit different, but now that you understand the parameters i mentioned above, you can compensate for that

First example:

Renault Megane RS:

A lot of people have been complaining about this car, and rightfully so as it feels like a truck in corners. This was due to the Fy scale being at 100 which made the steering way too heavy and caused FFB clipping (FFB went over the top and went numb because of it).

Take the car standard to the track and drive one lap, so you can take in how it felt on default. Then go to the pits and save these FFB settings (don't forget to press save):

Master scale: 26
Fx: 100
Fy: 60
Fz: 150
Mz: 130

Now the Megane should feel like a modern day front-wheel drive car with power steering.
Let me know how it works out for you

1971 Mercedes-Benz 300SEL 6.8 AMG:

Master scale: 26
Fx: 110
Fy: 114
Fz: 130
Mz: 130

Formula Rookie:

Master scale: 26
Fx: 100
Fy: 130
Fz: 170
Mz: 120


I will post more FFB tunes soon.

Are these for wheel only?

 

[rams1de]

Are these for wheel only?

Yes. They are basically a set of instructions from game to wheel.

@mister dog What global settings are using for Force Feedback and Tyre Force?

 

[GTAndy36]

It feels like it uses gear drive (which it most definitely doesn't) and the gears are not meshing properly. It feels, rough, notchy and definitely not smooth. Almost like there are only 10 positions from lock to lock of the wheel and it jumps to each step :-( Sometimes it is better, mostly it is worse.

I also sometimes get a high frequency vibration in the wheel, nearly same as a wet finger on a wine glass rim and it nearly makes the same noise too. Again session dependant. As is at the start at a new track and the wheel is turned 45deg left and buzzes. Unplug USB cable, reset wheel and it is fine until I change tracks. Also not consistent.

Also the wheel feel not only changes so much from car to car BUT from track to track and session to session on the same car on the same track. IMHO this comes back to the game not remembering settings and generating it's own random numbers like it does for car tuning settings.

Have I described what everyone else is feeling with their T300 on PS4?

Essentially, yes. It definitely doesn't feel like it does on other games. I know there's probably more happening, but the notchy geary feeling is definitely prevalent... coupled with the centre spring force... it just makes the whole experience seem wasted. I can tell what the game is trying to do, it just doesn't translate the information to the wheel properly.

For want of a better word, it's really hacking me off!

 

[mister dog]

Yes. They are basically a set of instructions from game to wheel.

@mister dog What global settings are using for Force Feedback and Tyre Force?

Yes for the standard Fanatec CSR. Sorry i forgot to mention that all my other main ingame FFB settings (in the wheel/FFB calibration menu), are standard apart from deadzone removal range which i upped to 0.15.

On wheel settings for my CSR are FFB and Sho 100 and everything else OFF if available or 000. Rotation is 900 degrees and damper is set at 100 in the Fanatec profiler.

I will update te OP

 

[MowTin]

Yeah, just very rough. The T300 is smooth on many racers, including GT6. The fact it feels rough on PCars for the PS4 is slightly worrying.

I'm using a logitech DFP. In Project Cars I sometimes get this skipping feeling as my car is sliding. I see the FFB output and it's not clipping. It feels like my tires are skipping a little as they slide. It's like instead of smoothly dragging across the surface they are taking tiny little hops. But I see this oscillation when I look at the FFB output.

Anyone know what that is?

 

[mister dog]

I'm using a logitech DFP. In Project Cars I sometimes get this skipping feeling as my car is sliding. I see the FFB output and it's not clipping. It feels like my tires are skipping a little as they slide. It's like instead of smoothly dragging across the surface they are taking tiny little hops. But I see this oscillation when I look at the FFB output.

Anyone know what that is?

Do you see a white line below the yellow one in the FFB app when that happens?
If yes that's a known bug that introduces canned vibration effects all of a sudden. Go back to pits and out again and it should be gone, but if you would have it during a race that would be ****** of course.

 

[azidahaka]

Ps4 t300 here. Used the settings posted in the topic in main forum (snow settings) and the changed ffb overall to 65 and master scale to around 18. It's smooth, you can feel and and all bumps of the track and it is "rightly" heavy like all moder cars are. Give it a try and thank me later guys!

 

[Cmorales1979]

Do you see a white line below the yellow one in the FFB app when that happens?
If yes that's a known bug that introduces canned vibration effects all of a sudden. Go back to pits and out again and it should be gone, but if you would have it during a race that would be ****** of course.

Is the white or the yellow line supposed to be moving, in the proper configuration? I have never seen my yellow line moving...only the white line. It sounds like you are saying the white line is canned FFB and not actual???

 

[mister dog]

Is the white or the yellow line supposed to be moving, in the proper configuration? I have never seen my yellow line moving...only the white line. It sounds like you are saying the white line is canned FFB and not actual???

Yes indeed, send you a PM.

 

[Sureboss]

This is really useful, thanks @mister dog I've been waiting for someone to explain what each bit does.

 

[HBR-Roadhog]

I'm using a logitech DFP. In Project Cars I sometimes get this skipping feeling as my car is sliding. I see the FFB output and it's not clipping. It feels like my tires are skipping a little as they slide. It's like instead of smoothly dragging across the surface they are taking tiny little hops. But I see this oscillation when I look at the FFB output.

Anyone know what that is?

What car are you driving when this happens and what track. Some cars will skip a little and you will feel that through the wheel. the kart and super karts will do a lot of this due to the lack of suspension. Cars with a tight suspension setup may do this as well especially when on a slightly bumpy surface.


On Topic: I'll try some of those on my Elite wheel and see how it feels. I will likely need to tone down the master scale a little due to the stronger FFB on the Elite vs the CSR but will give it a go and play around a bit with them.

Thanks for the info in the OP

 

[mister dog]

I'm using a logitech DFP. In Project Cars I sometimes get this skipping feeling as my car is sliding. I see the FFB output and it's not clipping. It feels like my tires are skipping a little as they slide. It's like instead of smoothly dragging across the surface they are taking tiny little hops. But I see this oscillation when I look at the FFB output.

Anyone know what that is?

Try messing around with the smoothing sliders below the ones i mentioned in the OP, i had this too whilst turning the wheel on some cars and upping the respective Fy smoothing slider helped with that.

If it's only when sliding i would try the Mz smoothing, as that one is related to FFB forces when losing traction.

 

[napalmhardcore]

It feels like it uses gear drive (which it most definitely doesn't) and the gears are not meshing properly. It feels, rough, notchy and definitely not smooth. Almost like there are only 10 positions from lock to lock of the wheel and it jumps to each step :-( Sometimes it is better, mostly it is worse.

I also sometimes get a high frequency vibration in the wheel, nearly same as a wet finger on a wine glass rim and it nearly makes the same noise too. Again session dependant. As is at the start at a new track and the wheel is turned 45deg left and buzzes. Unplug USB cable, reset wheel and it is fine until I change tracks. Also not consistent.

Also the wheel feel not only changes so much from car to car BUT from track to track and session to session on the same car on the same track. IMHO this comes back to the game not remembering settings and generating it's own random numbers like it does for car tuning settings.

Have I described what everyone else is feeling with their T300 on PS4?

Oh good, it isn't just me.

I bought the game a while back but because my T300 had to go in for repair (which I pray I never have to do again) I only actually booted it up yesterday. I didn't realise what a mess the force feedback in this game is. Don't get me wrong, I want to like this game and having the ability to tweak is a good thing. However I think it is the developers job to have at least a semi-decent baseline to work from.

It is like they've said "Yeah, we don't really know how to do force feedback. Here's the tools, you do it". Many of these settings should be tucked away in an advanced menu that the average user never need touch. The settings should also all be available from a single menu that is accessible from the pits. I am finding it hard to believe after all this time in development and with all the community input that this is what they arrived at.

Managed to get a couple of RWD cars feeling just about acceptable, then I tried the Focus RS and it is unusable. Even after some tweaking it feels absolutely awful. Seeing how Project CARS 2 is now in development (even though throughout development I was given the impression that this would be a continuously evolving product) I'm having my doubts this will be fixed. This game is competing for my time with other racing games/sims and it isn't doing itself any favours.

Sorry for the rant. I've spent probably about 5-6 hours fiddling around with settings and maybe about an hour or two actually driving and I'm still not happy with the settings.

 

[azidahaka]

Instead of 5-6 hours tinkering randomly you should have spent 5 minutes searching on the forums mate

 

[napalmhardcore]

Instead of 5-6 hours tinkering randomly you should have spent 5 minutes searching on the forums mate

In every other sim I've been able to figure out force feedback settings pretty quickly without looking on the internet. Plus, everyone says the same thing: "use this guys settings" (referring to Jack Spade). I don't want to just use some random guy's settings (no offence meant to Jack as it seems like he has put a lot of time in). I want to know what the settings do, how they work, how they relate to each other and I want this info from the developers so there is no room for interpretation or guesswork. The fact that a forum member is considered the definitive authority on the matter and that SMS doesn't seem to offer a decent explanation of the settings is pretty poor in my opinion.

As much as I respect the work that has been put in by Jack, some of his explanations are a little vague. I want to understand how he arrived at the settings he did.

An example is the soft clipping setting. I have a basic idea of how it works (being a musician I understand the basic principles of compression) but the explanations and naming are just plain confusing. I mean half input. What the hell do they mean? Do they mean that by putting the slider to 1.0 you are compressing the full signal to half (2:1 ratio)? By increasing the full output setting it seemingly decreases the strength of the output. So is it basically the makeup gain but in reverse? It is counter intuitive and the accompanying description in game is insufficient. Also all information relating to this assumes that forces above 1.0 get clipped, but I have not seen it explicitly stated that this is the case.

The scoop settings is another poorly explained setting. It is basically the opposite of compression below a certain point that is user definable (default 70% I believe). OK that is obvious by the description, but they go on to say that it is to account for the way that "some devices" react at higher input settings (basically I think the forces begin to flatten out). What devices (yes I gather they mean force feedback wheels)? Do all wheels react the same way to this setting at its default value? Is it only when the wheel is outputting above 70% of its total torque output that it is needed? Would that not mean that when running with lower force feedback settings you would get an unwanted boost/peak in force feedback at the high end? Again, none of this is explained.

You have to visit the forums to be informed that SOP stands for seat of pants. They couldn't have included a note in the options menu telling us this? When looking at descriptions given by Jack Spade, he states that certain settings have to be set equal to certain other settings (though in certain cases this is not possible because a .1 is added to certain values but not the corresponding setting). If this is true and using settings that are not equal to the corresponding setting will only acheive undesirable results, why not just have on and off, with on being automatically matched to its corresponding setting?

Personally I don't mind tweaking a bit, but giving minimal explanation for what the settings do is just poor. I'm slowly beginning to wrap my head around it, but I know for a fact that a lot of people don't have a clue what any of this stuff means or how to use it effectively and I doubt many people have the patience to figure it out.

This stuff should be setup out of the box. We shouldn't have to go on the net, download or printout settings from a forum member and enter them in for each car. Most of these settings, as I said, should be tucked away in an advanced menu that only the people that like tweaking should ever need to use.

 

[UkHardcore23]

Its shocking we need to set our own ffb for each car...why was it not based on physics/programmed for each car? How are we supposed to know how each car feels when racing.

Sure sms wanted to give the user the options for how they want the car to feel but imo that is the wrong way to go...i want to feel what the car really drives like not how id like it to feel.

Im not convinced JOS ffb settings work that well for the ps4 and t300...hes on a logitech wheel and on pc.

 

[Titzon Toast]

To me it looks like we were just given an open Dev kit for the per car ffb settings.
I've always just used JS's settings myself until now.
Tonight though, I'm gonna pick a FR car, set my Master and SOP scales to 30, and all of the spindle settings to 0. I'm then going to turn each one them up to 100 one at a time to see what effect they really have on my wheel.

 

[Gavin Vickers]

My G29 steering wheel does feel epic on Project Cars thanks Logitec and got T300 up stair's inverter burned-out week after got PS4 aaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh if my mum didn't help with New wheel i was up the creak with out a paddle

 

[shoemaker]

In every other sim I've been able to figure out force feedback settings pretty quickly without looking on the internet. Plus, everyone says the same thing: "use this guys settings" (referring to Jack Spade). I don't want to just use some random guy's settings (no offence meant to Jack as it seems like he has put a lot of time in). I want to know what the settings do, how they work, how they relate to each other and I want this info from the developers so there is no room for interpretation or guesswork. The fact that a forum member is considered the definitive authority on the matter and that SMS doesn't seem to offer a decent explanation of the settings is pretty poor in my opinion.

As much as I respect the work that has been put in by Jack, some of his explanations are a little vague. I want to understand how he arrived at the settings he did.

An example is the soft clipping setting. I have a basic idea of how it works (being a musician I understand the basic principles of compression) but the explanations and naming are just plain confusing. I mean half input. What the hell do they mean? Do they mean that by putting the slider to 1.0 you are compressing the full signal to half (2:1 ratio)? By increasing the full output setting it seemingly decreases the strength of the output. So is it basically the makeup gain but in reverse? It is counter intuitive and the accompanying description in game is insufficient. Also all information relating to this assumes that forces above 1.0 get clipped, but I have not seen it explicitly stated that this is the case.

The scoop settings is another poorly explained setting. It is basically the opposite of compression below a certain point that is user definable (default 70% I believe). OK that is obvious by the description, but they go on to say that it is to account for the way that "some devices" react at higher input settings (basically I think the forces begin to flatten out). What devices (yes I gather they mean force feedback wheels)? Do all wheels react the same way to this setting at its default value? Is it only when the wheel is outputting above 70% of its total torque output that it is needed? Would that not mean that when running with lower force feedback settings you would get an unwanted boost/peak in force feedback at the high end? Again, none of this is explained.

You have to visit the forums to be informed that SOP stands for seat of pants. They couldn't have included a note in the options menu telling us this? When looking at descriptions given by Jack Spade, he states that certain settings have to be set equal to certain other settings (though in certain cases this is not possible because a .1 is added to certain values but not the corresponding setting). If this is true and using settings that are not equal to the corresponding setting will only acheive undesirable results, why not just have on and off, with on being automatically matched to its corresponding setting?

Personally I don't mind tweaking a bit, but giving minimal explanation for what the settings do is just poor. I'm slowly beginning to wrap my head around it, but I know for a fact that a lot of people don't have a clue what any of this stuff means or how to use it effectively and I doubt many people have the patience to figure it out.

This stuff should be setup out of the box. We shouldn't have to go on the net, download or printout settings from a forum member and enter them in for each car. Most of these settings, as I said, should be tucked away in an advanced menu that only the people that like tweaking should ever need to use.

has this been rectified now with the 5.0 update ? or do people still recommend using jack spades settings.looks to me like its a lot of faffing around to to do each car. From what I can gather, With the t300rs Am I ok to go ahead with the global settings and ffb 100 and tyre force at 40 ? I don't the wheel to overheat, but at the same time I want to fight the wheel a bit and feel everything. Any advice on this would be much appreciated and save me a lot of time. Regards

 

[mister dog]

has this been rectified now with the 5.0 update ? or do people still recommend using jack spades settings.looks to me like its a lot of faffing around to to do each car. From what I can gather, With the t300rs Am I ok to go ahead with the global settings and ffb 100 and tyre force at 40 ? I don't the wheel to overheat, but at the same time I want to fight the wheel a bit and feel everything. Any advice on this would be much appreciated and save me a lot of time. Regards

I would recommend Jack's files. Using Bumps + myself as those felt a bit weak on my wheel. Now most of the road cars feel perfect, and if i don't like the feel of a particular car it's very easy to modify. Just go into Jacks folder in my documents, open the file of the car with notepad and up or lower the number of the Fy, Fz and Mz angle slightly, based on the advice in the OP here.