Tyrewear: grip or drifting?

[A86]

Rather than knowing wich is faster I want to which driving style causes the most tyrewear? Utilizing your tyres to the maximum grip capability or just drifting?
And which is the most difficult to master, I personally think it's grip if mastered properly I think it's faster than drift. What are your opinions.

 

[Alfaholic]

Rather than knowing wich is faster I want to which driving style causes the most tyrewear? Utilizing your tyres to the maximum grip capability or just drifting?
And which is the most difficult to master, I personally think it's grip if mastered properly I think it's faster than drift. What are your opinions.

1 easy answer: Enter a race which shows tyre wear. Park nose first against an immovable object, and then floor the throttle in 1st gear so that the wheels are spinning but you are not going anywhere. Watch the tyre wear indicator change colour before your very eyes.

So, spinning the wheels increases wear rate. In practise I can usually get a lap or so more out of my tyres by avoiding making tyre screeching sounds under braking, acceleration and cornering, but often suspension settings, like camber and toe, seem to have a bigger impact.

In my opinion some cars are easier to drift (Stratos) and others are easier to grip (Lotus Elan). As a general rule I find cars with low power output scrub off lots of speed when you slide them, and its hard to recover that speed. Cars with lots of power can sometimes be steered on the throttle to overcome some handling quirk but unless it's a rally based car slow in and fast out is usually the quickest way.

 

[Mt. Lynx]

Drifting is a real havoc on tyres, so if your looking for tyrelife - don´t drift.

As for wich is faster, I´d say grip, since a slide in effect makes you slow down, even in the hands of an expert. But it certainly looks a lot cooler with drifting, and from my point of view, it´s also harder to do. At least properly. I have great respect for those who can do this, and do it fast! Very impressive indeed!

 

[RenesisEvo]

The AI never, ever, ever, spins its tyres - that's how unrealistically perfect the AI drives. This is why they can get silly amounts of life of their tyres compared to a human driver. Spinning tyres = disintegrated rubber, both in real life and the game. So if you want long tyre life, don't ever drift/slide or anything.

Sometimes you can get better tyre wear than the AI. LE Sarthe for the FGT C'ship - the AI continuously corrects the car over the bumps, resulting in massively premature front tyre wear, requiring a pit stop after 3 laps. I managed 6 laps on a set of tyres with wear slightly biased toward the rear.

 

[DuckRacer]

1. Drifting causes a lot more wear than grip racing.

2. Drifting MAY be faster around some particular corners, but around the track it's slower.

 

[pSI civic]

you have to keep in mind drifting IS NOT racing. its a show off. drifting is about going side ways as cool as you can. racing is about getting around faster then anyone else. drift is slow and kills tires. there is no point to it.

 

[Wolfe]

you have to keep in mind drifting IS NOT racing. its a show off. drifting is about going side ways as cool as you can. racing is about getting around faster then anyone else. drift is slow and kills tires. there is no point to it.

I'm getting tired of hearing this ranting from you. I'm tempted to ask if you're insecure just because your Hondas can't drift, but I have more respect for you than that.

"Drifting is not racing" - Yes and no. Drifting and racing are two very different (almost opposite) things, yes, but there can be such a thing as Drift racing. "How can this be?" you ask? Well, what's wrong with trying to get around a course as fast as possible while drifting the entire time? Refusing to believe that such an activity is "racing" is just like refusing to believe that hurdling (track and field) is racing. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't argue, "Hurdling is dumb because they jump over those hurdles. That's not racing! If they were racing, they'd just run around the hurdles. That's faster!"

Being forced to drift while trying to get through a course as fast as possible is simply a limitation, similar to being forced to avoid pitting and ramming other cars.

Drift racing is just another form of competition.

"Drifting is showing off." - Oh yeah, that has to be the reason why I enjoy drifting in deserted parking lots over the winter. 'Cause, you know, everyone can see me when I do that. It has nothing to do with having fun. 💡

"Drift is slow and kills tires. There is no point to it." - So? Racing is dangerous, deadly even. It kills tires, doesn't take you anywhere (assuming you're racing on a circuit), and burns a lot of precious fuel and oil. Obviously, there's no point to it at all, and it is an activity that must be stopped.

 

[pSI civic]

there are a few drifting hondas out there... and i didnt say anything about sliding around aimlessly in a parking lot covered in snow. what i'm talking about is the guys that get into their blinged out nissans and drive sideways with the door open acting like fools.

 

[Gabkicks]

honda nsx... is rwd. i hate it when people call civics getting sidewayz drifting.. weather it technicly is or not i dont like to hear it

 

[Wolfe]

there are a few drifting hondas out there... and i didnt say anything about sliding around aimlessly in a parking lot covered in snow. what i'm talking about is the guys that get into their blinged out nissans and drive sideways with the door open acting like fools.

The Honda S series and NSX's can drift, yes. They are the exception, but are also in the minority.

Anyway, if you feel that you can denounce the existence of an entire branch of motorsports and behind-the-wheel amusement just because you disapprove of drift rodeos (that's what I call them, anyway), go right ahead. By the same logic, I could despise all forms of racing and motorsports because I disapprove of kids in fart-can-equipped Hondas revving their engines and speeding away from stoplights every friday or saturday night.

It seems that "drifting" is a much broader term than you realize. It encompasses everything from D1 Drift Competitions to having some fun in a parking lot or on a deserted road. Drifting, by definition, is just purposefully breaking rear traction in order to slide sideways, and maintaining this slide. It has nothing to do with "blinging out" a car. It has nothing to do with showing off, being goofy, or having the door open. It has nothing to do with any manufacturer, or even any country of origin. It's just driving sideways.

 

[Kylehnat]

Drifting is to motorsport as figure skating is to hockey. Just because they take place on the same surface doesn't mean they have anything in common. Drifting is entirely different than racing. Drifting is mainly about style and tire smoke, where racing is about speed and curb-grazing precision. I respect the best drifters, for they have mastered a difficult craft. However, I strongly discourage anything that high-schoolers think is "racing" (drifting and street racing). Racing does not involve keeping the car sideways or seeing who can go the fastest on the freeway in their ricer.

To answer the original question, drifting will wear your tires out faster, because a tire skidding over an abrasive surface will tear it to shreads pretty quickly, as well as flatspotting the tires (not an issue in video games).

 

[RenesisEvo]

Racing does not involve keeping the car sideways.

I take it you've never seen a rally car in action then?? In low grip conditions, and for certain tail-happy cars on even tarmac, drifting is an unavoidable consequence of trying to go fast. My good friend races a Locost - and he drifts that whilst racing - not because he is showing off, but because that is the fastest way to drive that car (because the back end swings round all the time. Poor set-up? I think not for a 300kg RWD car with no weight at the back). The entire field at the meeting had their cars sideways through various bends - and this is a race course - Brands Hatch no less. So whoever said that drifting and racing are two different things - erm, yes, but that doesnt mean that they cannot co-exist.

Don't confuse drifting - which is simply an oversteery-slide, with drifters - people who intentionally do oversteer-slides to show off/pretend to go fast (because as much as drifters want to believe otherwise, drifting is always slower).

 

[RenesisEvo]

A tire skidding over an abrasive surface will tear it to shreads pretty quickly, as well as flatspotting the tires (not an issue in video games).

Flat-spots only occur when the tyre is locked in the same position and dragged across the tarmac - that does not happen when going sideways unless you yank the handbrake. Hence why locking-up under braking gives flatspots. Providing the tyre is rotating, wear will be even. Believe it or not, but a tyre skidding across a surface does not always mean that it will wear really quick - providing the slip angle is low enough the tyre can "slide" whilst gripping the tarmac fully, i.e. not scrubbing, and thus not much wear.

 

[Specialized]

you have to keep in mind drifting IS NOT racing. its a show off. drifting is about going side ways as cool as you can. racing is about getting around faster then anyone else. drift is slow and kills tires. there is no point to it.

1. A competition of speed, as in running or riding or motorsports
2 races A series of such competitions held at a specified time on a regular course:
3. An extended competition in which participants struggle like runners to be the winner:
4. Steady or rapid onward movement: the race of time.#
5.Sports. To compete in a contest of speed.
6.To move rapidly

The above was taken from the dictionary. If you look at the examples its quite obvious that drifting is racing seeing as it fits all the criteria.

So there we have it DRIFTING IS RACING!!

 

[Kylehnat]

I take it you've never seen a rally car in action then?? In low grip conditions...

That's just it, though. The surfaces in rally stages do not offer grip, so there is really no way to drive without drifting the car. It is still ideal to be pointed in the correct general direction, which if you notice, rally cars usually are (to within 30 degrees or so). Holding the car at 45-60 (or even 85) degrees to the direction of travel is damaging to speed, even for rally drivers. In any case, rally drivers make the best of the road surface they're given; drifters do not. And trees are more painful and dangerous to hit than cones.

 

[THE ED3]

It seems that "drifting" is a much broader term than you realize. It encompasses everything from D1 Drift Competitions to having some fun in a parking lot or on a deserted road. Drifting, by definition, is just purposefully breaking rear traction in order to slide sideways, and maintaining this slide. It has nothing to do with "blinging out" a car. It has nothing to do with showing off, being goofy, or having the door open. It has nothing to do with any manufacturer, or even any country of origin. It's just driving sideways.

point taken.

 

[DuckRacer]

1. A competition of speed, as in running or riding or motorsports

As far as I know, the D1GP awards winners on style and smoke and he like, not on speed. But I may be wrong.

2 races A series of such competitions held at a specified time on a regular course:

It somewhat fit in to that.

3. An extended competition in which participants struggle like runners to be the winner:

Don't know if drifting fits in to that.

4. Steady or rapid onward movement: the race of time.#

See answer #1.

5.Sports. To compete in a contest of speed.

See answer #1.

6.To move rapidly

See answer #1.

The above was taken from the dictionary. If you look at the examples its quite obvious that drifting is racing seeing as it fits all the criteria.

Actually, it would fit in to one of the definitions, unless you count #3, which still drifting defies the other 4 definitions.

So there we have it DRIFTING IS FOR SHOW!!

Corrected.

 

[THE ED3]

As far as I know, the D1GP awards winners on style and smoke and the like, not on speed. But I may be wrong.

that is correct.

 

[Wolfe]

If I'm not mistaken, maintaining a high speed is factored into the judging, and if you're behind, passing your opponent is rewarded greatly in the judging.

In any case, that doesn't change the fact that D1GP = Drifting, but Drifting != D1GP.

 

[F310B]

'Grip is faster than drift' is not really a statement that makes sense. It's not right or wrong, it just doesn't make sense. When driving a car fast a driver will usually appear to be 'grip' driving, but sometimes will also 'drift'.

Sliding a car for sliding's sake will never be faster. But sometimes, taking the optimum line through a given corner in a given car, will result in some sliding/drifting.

Driving a car as fast as possible might cause you to drift in some corners. Think of it that way. Not the other way which is 'drifting in some corners might cause you to go faster'.

Even in F1, drivers used to drift, or 4 wheel slide until recently. They don't much anymore, since traction control was introduced.

I think 'grip' and 'drift' are simplistic notions which cannot be applied to the theory of driving a car as fast as possible, without a lot of justification.

 

[F310B]

The AI never, ever, ever, spins its tyres - that's how unrealistically perfect the AI drives. This is why they can get silly amounts of life of their tyres compared to a human driver. Spinning tyres = disintegrated rubber, both in real life and the game. So if you want long tyre life, don't ever drift/slide or anything.

True, spinning your tyres does increase tyre wear, and the AI don't do that. But even without traction control, I can sometimes make my tyres last longer than the AI. I can do this because I use the steering better - the AI tends to use rugged inputs that wear out the front tyres, because they induce understeer.

 

[Wolfe]

'Grip is faster than drift' is not really a statement that makes sense. It's not right or wrong, it just doesn't make sense. When driving a car fast a driver will usually appear to be 'grip' driving, but sometimes will also 'drift'.

Sliding a car for sliding's sake will never be faster. But sometimes, taking the optimum line through a given corner in a given car, will result in some sliding/drifting.

Driving a car as fast as possible might cause you to drift in some corners. Think of it that way. Not the other way which is 'drifting in some corners might cause you to go faster'.

Even in F1, drivers used to drift, or 4 wheel slide until recently. They don't much anymore, since traction control was introduced.

I think 'grip' and 'drift' are simplistic notions which cannot be applied to the theory of driving a car as fast as possible, without a lot of justification.

👍

 

[Zardoz]

Claiming that drifting is "racing" is like saying that rap is "music".

 

[THE ED3]

Claiming that drifting is "racing" is like saying that rap is "music".

GREAT POINT!

 

[Wolfe]

Claiming that drifting is "racing" is like saying that rap is "music".

Making an argument that distorts and exaggerates the viewpoint of the opposing side isn't productive in the slightest.

 

[NSX-R]

I'm getting tired of hearing this ranting from you. I'm tempted to ask if you're insecure just because your Hondas can't drift, but I have more respect for you than that.

"Drifting is not racing" - Yes and no. Drifting and racing are two very different (almost opposite) things, yes, but there can be such a thing as Drift racing. "How can this be?" you ask? Well, what's wrong with trying to get around a course as fast as possible while drifting the entire time? Refusing to believe that such an activity is "racing" is just like refusing to believe that hurdling (track and field) is racing. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't argue, "Hurdling is dumb because they jump over those hurdles. That's not racing! If they were racing, they'd just run around the hurdles. That's faster!"

Being forced to drift while trying to get through a course as fast as possible is simply a limitation, similar to being forced to avoid pitting and ramming other cars.

Drift racing is just another form of competition.

"Drifting is showing off." - Oh yeah, that has to be the reason why I enjoy drifting in deserted parking lots over the winter. 'Cause, you know, everyone can see me when I do that. It has nothing to do with having fun. 💡

"Drift is slow and kills tires. There is no point to it." - So? Racing is dangerous, deadly even. It kills tires, doesn't take you anywhere (assuming you're racing on a circuit), and burns a lot of precious fuel and oil. Obviously, there's no point to it at all, and it is an activity that must be stopped.

Now wolf, I usually agree with you on many subjects, however on this one I may have to disagree.

Motorsports to ME, is competetion of speed. Nothing less, nothing more. The most speed you can get on the back straight, the most speed you can get in every corner, and the most speed your pit crew can offer are the determining factors of your race. Drifting, however, include something that is not accounted for speed: Style, angles, smokes... That for me, classified drifting as "Not-so-motorsportie". Yes, I like the competetion and speed it still offers despite other judging factors, but to me, it's more of an entertainment than motorsport.

 

[NSX-R]

Even in F1, drivers used to drift, or 4 wheel slide until recently. They don't much anymore, since traction control was introduced.

The vintage F1s had very narrow tires, and old engineering didn't provide great structural integrity to offer grips force. Same goes with the tires and track conditions.

 

[Wolfe]

Now wolf, I usually agree with you on many subjects, however on this one I may have to disagree.

Motorsports to ME, is competetion of speed. Nothing less, nothing more. The most speed you can get on the back straight, the most speed you can get in every corner, and the most speed your pit crew can offer are the determining factors of your race. Drifting, however, include something that is not accounted for speed: Style, angles, smokes... That for me, classified drifting as "Not-so-motorsportie". Yes, I like the competetion and speed it still offers despite other judging factors, but to me, it's more of an entertainment than motorsport.

Maybe it's my German heritage, but I look at "motorsports" as being exactly what it says. Motor sports. Motored sports. Sports with motors. Anything with cars, bikes, boats, etc., that is a sport, I consider to be a motorsport. And drifting is just as much a sport as "extreme sports" (skateboarding, inline, snowboarding, etc.) are, because both involve competition, judging, and physical activity.

Also, since when are sports not entertainment?

 

[NSX-R]

Well, if you put it that way... however in my opion, there is a scale in sports, and on one end, it's competetion, on the other one, entertainment. Now snowboarding is fun to watch and so on, but you don't feel such competitive atmosphere you would when watching football. DTM, BTCC and JGTC gets my blood going like crazy and D1 gets me smiling and laughing...

 

[Wolfe]

Well, if you put it that way... however in my opion, there is a scale in sports, and on one end, it's competetion, on the other one, entertainment. Now snowboarding is fun to watch and so on, but you don't feel such competitive atmosphere you would when watching football. DTM, BTCC and JGTC gets my blood going like crazy and D1 gets me smiling and laughing...

That's an excellent way to put it, and I agree completely.