What do you perceive to be the function of the campaign? (In any GT game, for that matter.)

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo Sport' started by MIE1992, Sep 16, 2019.

  1. MIE1992

    MIE1992

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    For GTS, my view is that the campaign (GT League) is meant to be a showcase of new content, being the frequent additions of tracks/cars, as well as being for obtaining more credits to buy said cars, and potentially to also practice clean racing. There's also challenging yourself to get the bonus for using underpowered cars, too.

    But I think for a more broader view, I think the campaign should an expanded, more discreet training, where you continue to learn more about the features of the game, as well as familiarize yourself with various cars/courses. But I also think the campaign could also be where the player can experience interesting rulesets that they may encounter online. (And I think there should be more online races that reflect regulations seen within the campaign.) For example, not just limitations to cars, but potentially various limitations to tuning. You could potentially only be able to tune a few sections, (e.g. downforce & final gear ratio) rather either than any of them or none.

    This is putting aside other singleplayer modes, such as the Special Events, (e.g. hillclimb) which could be another area where I'd like to see an online element. But I see a potential for many more ways the rules could change in the campaign, beyond what cars are permitted. It'd overall be an educational experience, either in regards to driving and tuning, rulesets, or something otherwise educational, like an event that features Group C cars, or an event that's limited to Bertone-designed cars. I think a lot of GT games have done something like this, like having a race for a specific line of models.

    As for prizes, I also don't know if they'd always need to be cars. What if special skins could be a prize? Like if there's a campaign event much like the X2019 Endurance Series in GT League, getting gold could obtain you the FIAGTC Nations Cup skins.

    Also, I think that you could keep the option to tune your car in most cases, (it wouldn't really be GT without this option - just look at that Honda Civic that won at SEMA) but you could obtain a bonus for winning a race with a car left stock. I also believe that many events that don't use N-series cars (e.g. Gr.1, Gr.3) should have BoP enabled, and that when BoP is enabled and tuning is disabled, BoP should also affect downforce and the final gear ratio. However, for some of those events, BoP could be enabled while tuning is enabled, so you'd be able to tinker with those respective areas alongside everything else.

    There were some other ideas I had for events, too. For example, there could be an event resembling the J-Sports Meeting, but specifically limited to the "Gentleman's Agreement" JDM cars of the 90s/00s. Another event could have more powerful, modern Japanese cars, like the Nissan GT-R, Honda NSX (2nd-gen), the Lexus RC-F, and the Toyota GR Supra; another could feature pre-1979 Japanese classics like the Toyota 2000GT, Nissan Skyline GT-R KPGC10, Honda 1300 Coupe 9 S, etc.

    But I'd really also propose there being some classes made for historic race cars, too, with at least two additional classes: one for historic prototypes, and another for historic GT cars. Respective examples include the Ferrari 330 P4 & Ford Mk.IV, and the Shelby Daytona Coupe & Alfa Romeo TZ2. Essentially, they could be "Gr.1 Historic" and "Gr.3 Historic."

    EDIT: In the next game's campaign, I also don't think it's necessary to have like, three Red Bull X20xx events, especially when they'll largely have a lot of overlap in the featured circuits. Maybe they could be under the "Red Bull" brand, much like other automakers had events in GT4, and you could still have one event for the X2014 Jr., the X2014 Standard, and the X2019 Competition, and to diversify things, the courses in each event could correlate to those introduced to GTS as each Red Bull car was introduced to GTS. So for example, since the X2014 models were added in the same update, the X2014 Jr. event could have courses in GTS before the update, and the X2014 Standard event would mostly feature courses added to GTS after the update, but before the update that added the X2019. The X2019 event would largely feature tracks introduced after the update that added the X2019. But the Red Bull Ring would be in each event, too - except in each event, the RBR may have different conditions, such as a higher chance for rain in the X2014 Standard or X2019 events. (Assuming dynamic weather returns.) Heck, the X2014 Jr. event could perhaps feature the Short layout of RBR, while the other two feature the full layout.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2019
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  2. Nielsen

    Nielsen

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    Themed driving challenges with emphasis on consistency and situational awareness.
     
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  3. bil coz

    bil coz

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    GT League. Its there for novice players and it's needed. The sad part is that everybody got to do that stupid oval race at some point in order to buy cars.

    It would be nice if doing laps in time trial mode or scores in drift trial paid much more.

    Also the game should reward people who spend so much time creating awesome liveries or taking great photos. Wouldnt be too hard to come up with a decent system, not even based on likes and reposts.
     
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  4. Kevstah2004

    Kevstah2004

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    You mean like actually teaching people how to pass their driving test IRL rather than just how to be a joyrider?
     
  5. DanSHW

    DanSHW

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    I always liked the gift cars for completing a set of races, and trying to complete the events while buying the minimum number of cars, but as they already had the DWG, they couldn't really put that into GTS when they introduced GT League.

    It's not bad for practicing clean driving if you want to drive clean, especially given how erratic some of the driving can be, but if you're not a clean driver, there's no motivation to do so, it's much easier to win using other cars as braking or cornering aids, and nothing to discourage you from doing that aside from the CRB.

    Also, I know this isn't the event wish list thread, but I'd have liked to have seen one-off endurance races instead of the series we've got, fond memories of the 4hrs of the Nurburgring in a low powered but nimble Alfa battling against the big Merc 300SL.
     
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  6. AlanH49

    AlanH49

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    To try out cars I’d ordinarily overlook and earn credits. Just this week I’ve started grinding the Nostalgia 1979 events with an OP 330P4. Finally pick up all the high roller cars. There’s something quite chill about stomping AI competition after the intensity of online racing.

    I will say more recent GT League races are much tougher. That’s if you choose to run a stock car and the same tyres as the AI.
     
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  7. sirjim73

    sirjim73

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    I think PD needed a modular format for GT League because of the relative lack of tracks at launch and their knowledge that a lot would be added later.

    So it's very much been a setup to showcase new tracks when they have been added, and to give players the opportunity to use new cars outside of Arcade Mode (except for certain Group X cars like the McLaren P1 GTR!).

    Certainly that's how I've used the GT League. Plus to accumulate credits to buy cars.

    The modular setup seems to allow PD to add new races without a significant amount of effort being involved (relatively speaking), even more so when they are in existing events. I've noticed this year that the number of new events has decreased compared to last year and more updates are used to fill out existing events rather than create new ones.

    The alternative to this approach would have been to expand the Missions and challenges, other than the Circuit Experiences (which reminds me, I wonder if we will get a Red Bull Ring wet circuit experience with the next update?). I suspect this may have been the original intention before the late addition of GT League.

    I agree that the reward system is and always has been very skewed and I don't believe it should have been designed that way.

    And your point re the BMB race was certainly true for a while. But since the addition of the GR.2 races, GR.1 races, X2010 Standard races there's been a lot more ways to earn credits relatively quickly in GT League. I haven't gone near that BMB race in nearly a year.

    Anything that falls into "race 6" upwards has definitely got tougher. I still can't get near gold on that GR.2 RBR wet race, even with the car on max power.

    I'd add the chill part of the AI racing being a key reason for me enjoying GT League and not racing online. Everyone is different and is obviously entitled to wish for different things from games, but in my case I have a job with plenty of stress and a busy life outside of it, the last thing I need is more stress in my leisure time.
     
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  8. Satomiblood

    Satomiblood

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    Themed racing series with a gradual difficulty and payout model. It's the same general idea as past titles, but the execution isn't as good. There's no semblance of career progression.
     
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  9. AlanH49

    AlanH49

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    I won the Gr.2 wet race with a stock NSX but it requires a near flawless drive and to make the pass for the lead at earliest opportunity. The most difficult so far is the Monza 1979 Nostalgia race. One of the races has an XJ13 that’s 2 seconds quicker than you’re capable of. You can only win by blocking on the straight’s. You can however reload the race and sometimes get an AI grid that can be passed by lap 3.
     
  10. MatskiMonk

    MatskiMonk Premium

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    I'd agree with this.

    Aside from the bolded bit*, I'd agree with this also. Livery and decal creators, and photographers do get the worst deal since there's zero credits paid out for that, nearly every other game mode gives you some kind of prize payout. I'd imagine it might be somewhat open to abuse though if they did, and they'd probably need to overhaul the whole system so it wasn't the same few assets attracting all the likes.

    *It's not for Novice players, I've been playing GT for 20+ years and I still spend most of my time in GT League, it offers the closest thing to the experience I want from Gran Turismo and is part of the reason I've stuck with the franchise for so long. It's not perfect, but I may well not have bought GT Sport without it.

    ____


    On the wider topic of payouts... Below is the graph I've been working on of how quickly the GTLeague events payout out (in Cr/Sec) (1st place, no bonuses). When people talk about wanting better payouts for other things, it is worth remembering that a lot of the payouts in GT League aren't that good.

    GT Sport _ GT League.png
    Allowing for reasonable Car Handicap bonus, playing from the first race to the last yields about 28.1m Cr., as you can see below.. the steeper the gradient the faster your getting Credits... early on, and late on, it's not that quick...

    GTLeague playthrough cumulative Cr. Balance _ Inc. Car Handicaps (1).png
     
  11. bil coz

    bil coz

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    well to each his own, but the majority of decent drivers probably doesn't spend much time in there, how can you tune a car in there or even work on getting faster, you can't really compare your times from 1 lap to the next... Other cars are just wasting track space really.
     
  12. MatskiMonk

    MatskiMonk Premium

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    As you say, each to their own. My experience of online racing has rarely been of decent drivers or close racing and I don't see why online is required for the other things you mention.
     
  13. George Jakob

    George Jakob

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    GT 1-4 the "Meat" of the game
    GT5 very big part of the game but the leveling system hurt it and online overshadowed it but its the "meat" of the game now since the servers closed (R.I.P. :() .
    GTPSP technically didn't have one but you could create your own so :tup: . GT6 Just a sidelines thing you could do wit a ridiculous Mario Kart-ish star reward system.
    GTS Just random events they had to include because people complained :censored: it dosen't even count towards game prograssion.
     
  14. bil coz

    bil coz

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    Online is not required for what I mentioned. Arcade Time Trial mode is.
     
  15. George Jakob

    George Jakob

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    Technically everything does since you can't save offline.
     
  16. MatskiMonk

    MatskiMonk Premium

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    Ah, fair enough. Is that where the majority of decent players are? I'd have thought the implication is that they'd have been racing online for the wins and the glory.
     
  17. MIE1992

    MIE1992

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    I think that instead of "Time Trial," there ought to bring back Free Run mode, and in this hypothetical iteration, you could do stuff like customize tire/fuel consumption rates and enable different levels of penalties and/or ways to serve them. This would especially be useful for practicing for various Sport Mode/FIAGTC races. And meanwhile, the actual Time Trial mode will be more like that in GT3, where you were tasked with clearing a certain time using a provided car on a specific track. There could be times based on those exhibited in the lap guides - both set by Hamilton and various FIAGTC contestants.

    Maybe it doesn't even need to be for a ton of tracks like in GT3, but there could be a series of motifs, like using Senna's F1 car at Interlagos, or a Red Bull X201x car at one of the courses used recently in F1 such as Suzuka or Monaco, or the W08 at Nurburgring GP.

    I think there's even further opportunity to have motifs where the car is partially named for a circuit, and this could be part of how what cars are picked as prizes. Here were some more examples of that:

    Lexus IS-F -> Fuji Speedway
    Nissan Skyline GT-R V-Spec II Nur -> Nurburgring Nordschleife
    Pontiac Le Mans GTO -> Circuit de la Sarthe

    It could also expand to cars that've been especially successful at that circuit, like if you had the 2018-spec Toyota TS050 for the time trial at La Sarthe, and the gold medal time could reflect this, by being the qualifying time, or one of the best laps set on that circuit by that car, etc.

    Better yet, this whole thing could also be made as part of a successor to Circuit Experience, rather than having every provided car be a Gr.4 or Gr.3 machine, and the idea on the gold medal times reflecting real-world times could still be implemented, perhaps if only for the full lap time attack rather than for the sectors.

    EDIT: I'm sure with all the cars, PD could find a way to have a car be assigned to each track. Not all of them would need a very solid motif, either, but just as many as they can, especially when you combine real-world times set by manufacturers testing their cars, the FIAGTC lap guides, and times set in real-world motorsport events like the Senna GT6 event. (And I think a lot of that content should be revived, including a lot of the info included in the segments, and the timeline, etc. - maybe if Senna returns as a "brand" in Brand Central, they could have this be part of an event like how many brands had their own events in GT4. But maybe they could also play around with the presentation to make it a bit more succinct, like turning the slideshows before each event and the respective text into museum segments.)

    EDIT2: I can't recall if it does this already, but I think the Gran Turismo channel should feature the videos from prior games, like the GT6 Mario Andretti short film, or the intros by Gordon/Loeb/Vettel in GT5.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2019
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  18. Magog

    Magog

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    I don't play online so for me the campaign IS the game.
     
  19. MIE1992

    MIE1992

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    I also wonder if the campaign would be good as a way to introduce player what they could end up seeing in Sport Mode? For example, if there was a Sport Mode race that limited players to boxer-engined cars, or what tracks are likely to feature which cars, and so on. I think there could be some genuine synergy between the campaign and the online component(s).
     
  20. bil coz

    bil coz

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    I meant the offline part of the game. Time Trial is the place where you can do the most interesting stuff in the game, which is spending quality time alone with your cars on a track.
    I really struggle to see the rest as anything than dull work for credits, or something to use when you make your friends try the game..
    obviously I meant PSN+
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2019