Why Does GT4 Get Such Praise?

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United States
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I could never wrap my head around why the worst game in the series handling wise, well apart from the first GT game, always got such good reviews, sure i love the variety, but if you compare things like the offroad physics to GT2 and 3, youll find that cars are literally incapable of oversteering for one, and no matter what you cannot keep the inside of a corner unless you have the escudo, I understand that gran turismo is by no means meant to be a true simulator, like GPL for example, but I just cant understand why polyphony had to screw up the physics so bad, and why this game is considered the holy grail of racing games by many, because it is not, GT3 is better in literally every way aside from quantity, it just makes me sad that still to this day, nothing in the series has come close to GT2, and GT5 XL, the latter, unfortunately got a bad wrap because it re-used visuals from the PS2 games, but when i comes to playing a game/sim for the physics, i could care less if my cars are rendered as 2d sprites, as long as they feel nice to drive. i just hate that my playthrough has been totally ruined by those awful special condition events, even dirt and snow tires feel like racing slicks on a frozen lake, i played a little bit of RBR and Dirt Rally 2.0 to confirm my suspicion, and alas, GT4 is THE WORST handling game in the series, I bet it feels more bearable with a wheel, but by no means is this game doing anything better than gran turismo 2 and 3 ever could, if you avoid one game in this series, GT4 is the one to skip, if you like your driving to feel intuitive, even if its not realistic, you wont find it in GT4, you can set the car up and get something close to playable, but nothing will ever be as good as enthusia or even the prior games in the GT series

and in enthusia's analog controls are terrible, even with a wheel!
 
I could never wrap my head around why the worst game in the series handling wise, well apart from the first GT game, always got such good reviews, sure i love the variety, but if you compare things like the offroad physics to GT2 and 3, youll find that cars are literally incapable of oversteering for one, and no matter what you cannot keep the inside of a corner unless you have the escudo, I understand that gran turismo is by no means meant to be a true simulator, like GPL for example, but I just cant understand why polyphony had to screw up the physics so bad, and why this game is considered the holy grail of racing games by many, because it is not, GT3 is better in literally every way aside from quantity, it just makes me sad that still to this day, nothing in the series has come close to GT2, and GT5 XL, the latter, unfortunately got a bad wrap because it re-used visuals from the PS2 games, but when i comes to playing a game/sim for the physics, i could care less if my cars are rendered as 2d sprites, as long as they feel nice to drive. i just hate that my playthrough has been totally ruined by those awful special condition events, even dirt and snow tires feel like racing slicks on a frozen lake, i played a little bit of RBR and Dirt Rally 2.0 to confirm my suspicion, and alas, GT4 is THE WORST handling game in the series, I bet it feels more bearable with a wheel, but by no means is this game doing anything better than gran turismo 2 and 3 ever could, if you avoid one game in this series, GT4 is the one to skip, if you like your driving to feel intuitive, even if its not realistic, you wont find it in GT4, you can set the car up and get something close to playable, but nothing will ever be as good as enthusia or even the prior games in the GT series

and in enthusia's analog controls are terrible, even with a wheel!
Because it forms part of a trilogy between GT2, GT3 and GT4. These are the three best Gran Turismo games ever made from a one player perspective. All real road cars understeer stock. Manufacturers would get law suits left right and centre if they didn't.

Incidentally don't claim GPL as a SIM. They made it harder to drive than a real car of the same era and if you do that your game isn't a SIM.

No one has been happy with off road in any GT game.
 
Because it forms part of a trilogy between GT2, GT3 and GT4. These are the three best Gran Turismo games ever made from a one player perspective. All real road cars understeer stock. Manufacturers would get law suits left right and centre if they didn't.

Incidentally don't claim GPL as a SIM. They made it harder to drive than a real car of the same era and if you do that your game isn't a SIM.

No one has been happy with off road in any GT game.
Driving a lotus 49 in GPL is actually much easier than the real thing, and much easier than even in assetto corsa, GPL is actually a very easy sim to drive with the right plugins, what made it hard for people back in the day was mainly the fact that cars would break traction quite easily with careless throttle input, like a real F1 car of the time would, what makes GPL and many other papyrus sims (and I racing) so realistic is the tire model, nothing has come close until rfactor 2 was released, maybe live for speed but I've never tried it because subscription services suck, part of why I hate iracing with a passion, even if online racing will always be better than with ai. A purpose built rally car for example, like the ford escort, should be able to oversteer quite easily, yet in GT4 it's quite hard to do even off road, I'm constantly not getting enough grip with purpose built off road tires I might add, not to mention that grip is so minuscule that you have to take any corners off road in first gear, no matter how you set the car up, because you always slide off of the apex and outside of the corner, add the rules for all of the special condition events and you have a beautifully created disaster in my eyes. Gran Turismo 4 doesn't suck, but when the PSP version of Gran Turismo, and the second game in the series are more intuitive, I start to find things a little funny, although PSP GT runs on GT5's physics model, so it gets a pass just because 5 is my favorite game handling wise, and as for manufacturers purposfully making road cars and economy cars understeer heavy, turning off assists like ECS and TSC should nullify that, sure some road cars come with a button on the dash, and some require some changes in the computer, but it's almost always a surefire way to get a little less stability, and more performance out of any car that has those features, I'd know, my jag has none, and is extremely ocersteery compared to saloons in it's class, my old malibu felt like I needed to counter steer for every pound i threw around with it's ECS systems disabled. GT4 feels like the only game that forces assists even when you turn them off in your car settings. Again, I don't hate the game, its an amazing game for what it did, but it just isn't near as good as i remember, and finding that out halfway into my first playthrough in over a decade, really disappointed me. But I went back to GT2 and had a blast so I can't really complain, different strokes for different folks I guess. Sorry if this is a little tangent like in nature, I'm typing this on my tiny phone screen - not home tonight
 
I really didn't like driving AWD race cars in GT4. I quite enjoyed the countless Skyline GTR clones though, I think the adjustable differential was the problem, even setting everything as open as possible felt too tight in corners. It seems more like a locked transfer case was employed instead of a center differential. Any other drivetrain felt mostly ok, maybe a little pushy but liveable.
 
Driving a lotus 49 in GPL is actually much easier than the real thing, and much easier than even in assetto corsa, GPL is actually a very easy sim to drive with the right plugins, what made it hard for people back in the day was mainly the fact that cars would break traction quite easily with careless throttle input, like a real F1 car of the time would, what makes GPL and many other papyrus sims (and I racing) so realistic is the tire model, nothing has come close until rfactor 2 was released, maybe live for speed but I've never tried it because subscription services suck, part of why I hate iracing with a passion, even if online racing will always be better than with ai. A purpose built rally car for example, like the ford escort, should be able to oversteer quite easily, yet in GT4 it's quite hard to do even off road, I'm constantly not getting enough grip with purpose built off road tires I might add, not to mention that grip is so minuscule that you have to take any corners off road in first gear, no matter how you set the car up, because you always slide off of the apex and outside of the corner, add the rules for all of the special condition events and you have a beautifully created disaster in my eyes. Gran Turismo 4 doesn't suck, but when the PSP version of Gran Turismo, and the second game in the series are more intuitive, I start to find things a little funny, although PSP GT runs on GT5's physics model, so it gets a pass just because 5 is my favorite game handling wise, and as for manufacturers purposfully making road cars and economy cars understeer heavy, turning off assists like ECS and TSC should nullify that, sure some road cars come with a button on the dash, and some require some changes in the computer, but it's almost always a surefire way to get a little less stability, and more performance out of any car that has those features, I'd know, my jag has none, and is extremely ocersteery compared to saloons in it's class, my old malibu felt like I needed to counter steer for every pound i threw around with it's ECS systems disabled. GT4 feels like the only game that forces assists even when you turn them off in your car settings. Again, I don't hate the game, its an amazing game for what it did, but it just isn't near as good as i remember, and finding that out halfway into my first playthrough in over a decade, really disappointed me. But I went back to GT2 and had a blast so I can't really complain, different strokes for different folks I guess. Sorry if this is a little tangent like in nature, I'm typing this on my tiny phone screen - not home tonight
Try breaking up your text into paragraphs. It makes it easier to read.

No Papyrus game from GPL to Iracing has been a SIM. They made a design decision to make the cars harder to drive than they are in the real world so that less players would be good at it. I have no idea why more players being good is a bad thing but that is how it is. Iracing was changed into an actual SIM during lockdown when real race drivers started using it and complaining about it.
 
I do agree the physics should have been better. I would say it is not the stock understeer habit on majority of cars that's controversial, but being unable to trigger oversteer and maintain it by countersteering. Dirt and snow tracks are some of my favourites because the physics model is a bit different there, you can keep the rear end slide at an angle, even on FWD cars.

The tracks, the content, the presentation, it is all great, GT4 excels in those areas for sure, but driving part alone isn't its strenght.
 
I think GT4 had a lot to like about it. The music - both originally-composed and licensed - is absolutely sublime, and is the best in the series. The tons of tuners was awesome, too, as were the city courses. Not to mention more obscure cars that we haven’t really seen in more recent titles, like various Alfa Romeo models, or the Honda Today G (which many would know from the anime/manga “You’re Under Arrest”) and the Toyota Sera.

But the game also had flaws, some more egregious than others. For example, only six cars per grid - though this would be the last game in the series to have this limit. There was also the license tests, which were as extremely hard as they were extremely numerous. Not to mention the 24hr races, which seemed like an admirable idea, except you’re more or less alone with said five AI cars and no dynamic time-of-day/weather, though I perfectly understand that just having the Nordschleiefe itself was impressive at the time.

Customization was also very limited. GT7 easily takes the crown in that regard, with GT6 coming in a solid second.

So yeah, there’s a lot to like about GT4, and indeed, there’s quite a bit of content - cars, tracks, and music tracks - that I’d want to see return to the series. But there’s also a lot I’d rather get left behind, though I think some of the issues I had with GT4 were due to technical limitations at the time, which I perfectly understand. I’m honestly still amazed we had the Nordschliefe on a console title even back then.
 
Try breaking up your text into paragraphs. It makes it easier to read.

No Papyrus game from GPL to Iracing has been a SIM. They made a design decision to make the cars harder to drive than they are in the real world so that less players would be good at it. I have no idea why more players being good is a bad thing but that is how it is. Iracing was changed into an actual SIM during lockdown when real race drivers started using it and complaining about it.
im not a writer, so youll either have to bear with me or just give up on reading what i have to say altogether, but by that logic, polyphony did the exact same thing with GT4, again, its not a bad game by any means, just not the improvment i was expecting over the previous games in the series, so much so that i still believe gran turismo 2 and 3 are the best in the series, loose surface simulation and wet physics turned me off of GT4 because I cant bear how it feels to drive on these surfaces, compared to any other sim/game, even enthusia, which is 10 times harder
 
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Try breaking up your text into paragraphs. It makes it easier to read.

No Papyrus game from GPL to Iracing has been a SIM. They made a design decision to make the cars harder to drive than they are in the real world so that less players would be good at it. I have no idea why more players being good is a bad thing but that is how it is. Iracing was changed into an actual SIM during lockdown when real race drivers started using it and complaining about it.
Speaking as someone who is currently developing a new mod for GPL using physics found in games like Assetto Corsa and rFactor2, I have to disagree.

For its time, GPL utilises some very in-depth physics calculations and therefore must be regarded as a sim. The "issues" which contribute to the difficulty are that a) Those calculations had to be simplified in order to run on the computers at the time (most people were lucky to even have a 500MHz CPU at the time) and b) The "parameters" chosen are not as accurate (realistic) as those seen in modern racing games. E.g. In terms of peak tyre slip angles, tyre temp modelling etc.

Unfortunately the Lotus 49 in iRacing is still horrendously difficult to drive and that could be because they chose to give it a 56% weight balance, whereas other racing sims puts the weight balance at around 62%. iRacing's team had access to a real Lotus 49 but AC had access to all of the paperwork from Classic Team Lotus so I'd say AC has the better data. I don't think the real car was that unpredictable and snappy to drive otherwise neither Clark not Hill would have made it through the season alive.
 
im not a writer, so youll either have to bear with me or just give up on reading what i have to say altogether
Guess what, this type of logic will not satisfy any of your arguments - despite your topic being interesting.

It's not about being a writer, that's how forums where TYPING on keyboard are friendly to access and read. Help us so we can help you.
 
I think disabling, or heavily lowering driving aids values helps a lot to enjoy driving, I mostly drive with no driving aids or 1-1-1 on really fast cars which do need them, if you never do this you'll be stuck with understeer in a lot of cars.

That being said, as most major games, people tend to overrate it, GT4 and GT1 are my fav in the series, in contrast to most I don't like 2 or 3 at all, for me 3 is the weakest of them all, but that's just me, they're all good games.

GT4 Was sort of the big jump towards modern GT feeling, and the graphics are outstanding and clean, the game features a lot of content and cars to have fun with, it definitely delivered on release, also it aged really well, I can play it today and it still feels fresh and fun to play.
 
GT4 is the worst of the series in terms of physics, no doubt. It's as if the physics engine fails to implement inertia at the rear of the car. Boggles my mind how this game is so highly regarded within the community when one of the most basic physics components is seemingly missing. Sad thing is, this missing piece of the puzzle was present in the earlier games.
 
The game was so huge. The fact that I could do a track day at Sears Point with other cars on track in my GT500 nissan gtr was just the best.

There was just so much to do. And introducing Photomode with such a great music playlist made it one of my most played games ever.

I was over the moon when GT7 had Soul Surfer from Daiko Kashi as that track was simply my favorite from GT4.

Oh and B-Spec was awesome to be able to grind for credits.

And the tracklist was to this day, the best one in the series.
 
Much like with Doctor Who, everyone has their GT incarnation. I don’t mean “favourite” or “best”. I mean the very GT which makes you feel you’re the only one who really gets it.

Over the years I’ve treated GT (4) less and less serious, and the more laid back my attitude became towards physics, tyre models and gameplay quirks, the more I’ve found enjoying myself.

PS3 era GTs didn’t really grip me fully, though 3D was fun for quite some time, and PS4 GTs… I’m too old for this loot box shenanigans. GT for the PSP is neat though.
 
I mean it wasn't an unheard of opinion in the short term after release that GT3 was a better game than GT4 in its design and structure other than quantity. The physics in particular were always lamented as being kinda bad and at best a sidestep from the physics that GT3 had that had been bootstrapped and tweaked from the first game; and the AI was always atrocious even by the standards of the time.



But there's a hell of a lot of quantity to just overlook and most of it is unparalleled for the time in terms of quality too.
 
I mean it wasn't an unheard of opinion in the short term after release that GT3 was a better game than GT4 in its design and structure other than quantity. The physics in particular were always lamented as being kinda bad and at best a sidestep from the physics that GT3 had that had been bootstrapped and tweaked from the first game; and the AI was always atrocious even by the standards of the time.



But there's a hell of a lot of quantity to just overlook and most of it is unparalleled for the time in terms of quality too.
As a game and single player career experience, I definitely preferred GT3 in terms of structure and progression. GT4 was just a content monster, it has some fantastic circuits and once you get used to the handling, which I think is more realistic than 3, just not as fun as 3, there's a lot to enjoy in GT4.

But it also started the single file race starts, albeit with only 6 cars per race it wasn't that big a problem here, and had a lot of cars that didn't really fit into any specific events which comes down to the volume of cars the game featured.
 
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