Why this "lighting system" is unrealistic.

xTornado78x

xTornado78x

10
Canada
Canada
xTornado78x
Hi everyone,

Something bothers me alot about the graphics engine. Daytime and night time are very well made but... Racing at sunrise and sunset looks very wrong, and some tracks looks glitchy. Here's why:

- Headlights are extremely bright! They illuminate the ground better than the sun itself! Even if it is 20 degrees above the horizon... But they are just fine and realistic at night.
- Track lights are casting shadows around the car (as they should when its dark) but in broad daylight.
- On some tracks, track lights shadows are visible around the car whatever the time of day (Racing on Apricot hill at noon, for exemple, looks weird in that way).
- On some tracks, headlights reflections are visible on the road all day long when they are on. How many watts those lights have? 1 million? In real life, those lights would probably set trees on fire...
- Opponent's headlights are glitchy, sometimes they illuminate the road, sometimes they don't.
- The sky around the sun is too dark when it is very low above the horizon.

I am a photographer in my spare time, I took many, many pictures of sunsets and sunrises in my life, and I can't compare any of them to what I can see in Gran Turismo 6.

Polyphony Digital maybe should ask real, professional photographers just for this.
 
I've also noticed that when it's set to sunset (maybe sunrise too) the sun starts to flicker in size, fluctuating rapidly from bigger to smaller. I'm guessing that this, as well as what you've pointed out, are just glitches that will hopefully be sorted out in future updates.
 
xTornado78x
Hi everyone,

Something bothers me alot about the graphics engine. Daytime and night time are very well made but... Racing at sunrise and sunset looks very wrong, and some tracks looks glitchy. Here's why:

- Headlights are extremely bright! They illuminate the ground better than the sun itself! Even if it is 20 degrees above the horizon... But they are just fine and realistic at night.
- Track lights are casting shadows around the car (as they should when its dark) but in broad daylight.
- On some tracks, track lights shadows are visible around the car whatever the time of day (Racing on Apricot hill at noon, for exemple, looks weird in that way).
- On some tracks, headlights reflections are visible on the road all day long when they are on. How many watts those lights have? 1 million? In real life, those lights would probably set trees on fire...
- Opponent's headlights are glitchy, sometimes they illuminate the road, sometimes they don't.
- The sky around the sun is too dark when it is very low above the horizon.

I am a photographer in my spare time, I took many, many pictures of sunsets and sunrises in my life, and I can't compare any of them to what I can see in Gran Turismo 6.

Polyphony Digital maybe should ask real, professional photographers just for this.
Click to expand...
It's a game on a 7 year old, £200, consumer level system. This isn't output from a Pixar render farm. Allowances have to be made. Short cuts have obviously been taken in the lighting simulations to prevent the PS3 crawling around on its hands and knees...
 
I'm surprised to see someone complaining that headlights are too bright. I've found most to be way too dim.

I wonder... Do you use an
a)LCD,
b)LED, or
c)CRT TV-set for play?
 
It's not really a question of hardware capabilities, I'm sure PD can solve this by adjusting the brightness of headlights AND desactivate the "track lights shadows" for daytime racing.

Those effects are just fine when it's dark, but are incoherent when it is sunny.

I would not be surprised if those "unnecessary" light/shadow effects causes framerate issues when racing at sunset and sunrise.
 
xTornado78x
It's not really a question of hardware capabilities, I'm sure PD can solve this by adjusting the brightness of headlights AND desactivate the "track lights shadows" for daytime racing.

Those effects are just fine when it's dark, but are incoherent when it is sunny.

I would not be surprised if those "unnecessary" light/shadow effects causes framerate issues when racing at sunset and sunrise.
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About the headlights, are you sure it isn't the TV brightness setting? I have no idea as I've yet to get the game, then I can tell you my opinion.

I guess they can fix some lighting issues in an update?
 
sparkytooth
About the headlights, are you sure it isn't the TV brightness setting? I have no idea as I've yet to get the game, then I can tell you my opinion.

I guess they can fix some lighting issues in an update?
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No, this is not my screen. It's not a brightness/contrasts or colors issue, but wrongly adjusted effects in the 3D environnement. Whatever the TV of PC monitor we can use or whatever the settings.
 
xTornado78x
No, this is not my screen. It's not a brightness/contrasts or colors issue, but wrongly adjusted effects in the 3D environnement. Whatever the TV of PC monitor we can use or whatever the settings.
Click to expand...
Ok, fair enough. I bet PD can tweak this stuff later on.
 
Well videogames vary a lot, they are not developed with the industry standards in mind like movies and tv shows so a correct calibration might not work with all of the games, you pretty much have to calibrate your TV by your own tastes.

I don't have the game but from the videos I've seen it does seem a bit extreme, it looks like one of those "dynamic" presets that TVs have for showroom purposes, overly saturated colors, too much contrast with crushed blacks and some kind of "motion-smoothing" crap or "soap opera effect" turned on.

Probably another reason why I haven't purchased the game yet, I'm very picky with these things.
 
PepeMickey
Well videogames vary a lot, they are not developed with the industry standards in mind like movies and tv shows so a correct calibration might not work with all of the games, you pretty much have to calibrate your TV by your own tastes.

I don't have the game but from the videos I've seen it does seem a bit extreme, it looks like one of those "dynamic" presets that TVs have for showroom purposes, overly saturated colors, too much contrast with crushed blacks and some kind of "motion-smoothing" crap or "soap opera effect" turned on.

Probably another reason why I haven't purchased the game yet, I'm very picky with these things.
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You're picky about everything GT.
 
Anyone notice how headlights don't reflect off-of other cars though ?, that keeps bugging me when I'm running down a A.I. or a friend online.

That, and sometimes I feel too much 'focus' is given to the astronomy-system, You can be running around Panorama at night, unable to see a majority of the track outside of your headlights, yet the sky is lit-up like the forth of July, stronger than it'd ever be, imo, in real life. It too becomes distracting at times.

Yeah-yea, future-patches and all that 🤬, but still, lil' too much 'scatterbrain' focus from PD at times I think.
 
Kurei
Anyone notice how headlights don't reflect off-of other cars though ?, that keeps bugging me when I'm running down a A.I. or a friend online..
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They do... perhaps it's only from Premium models?

I was following a friend down the Mulsanne straight and had to switch to dip beams, the glare from the reflection was ruining my "side vision".
 
TenEightyOne
They do... perhaps it's only from Premium models?

I was following a friend down the Mulsanne straight and had to switch to dip beams, the glare from the reflection was ruining my "side vision".
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That's possible, I can only recall it (recently) with a standard Audi saloon of some sort (A4 I think ?) in a career event.
I'll try to test premium vs. standard tomorrow and see what results I get, and post here if I remember.
 
bodger
It's a game on a 7 year old, £200, consumer level system. This isn't output from a Pixar render farm. Allowances have to be made. Short cuts have obviously been taken in the lighting simulations to prevent the PS3 crawling around on its hands and knees...
Click to expand...

Yeah, if only there was a much more powerful system released around the same time as the time 💡.
If PD lack the skill to do it properly on the PS3, at least have the common coutesy of making the game for a platform that has the required power. Instead we got GT6. A mess of a game, every bit as broken and horrible as GT5.

How PD is still allowed to carry on making games is beyond me, as just about everyone could do a better job.
 
This thread should be called:

Why this "lighting system" is unrealistic or why this is a game and not real life...

Not to bug you, by the way. Hopefully this doesn't come across as hateful.
 
Nurburgthing.
I'm picky too, about peoples opinions on things they've not expierienced themselves.
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Watching videos and reading threads like these all over the internet is more than enough to know that there's something wrong with the graphics.

Do I need to play it to know how the game looks like?
 
PepeMickey
Watching videos and reading threads like these all over the internet is more than enough to know that there's something wrong with the graphics.

Do I need to play it to know how the game looks like?
Click to expand...

No, you need to play the game to form a valid opinion. Watching a few videos and reading a few online rants / complaints doesn't stand up against long term, first hand expierience.
 
PepeMickey
Watching videos and reading threads like these all over the internet is more than enough to know that there's something wrong with the graphics.

Do I need to play it to know how the game looks like?
Click to expand...

If you don't like the graphics of GT6 then fine, find another racing game. GT has already millions of fans, 1 less...
 
rickykaka3
If you don't like the graphics of GT6 then fine, find another racing game. GT has already millions of fans, 1 less...
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It looks like 5 million fans aren't even gonna bother and trust me, I play a lot more games in this genre alone, that doesn't mean I don't want GT to get better.
 
I noticed that sometimes ad sunrise/sunset the lights will reflect on the asphalt, sometimes they won't. I'm inclined to believe those that you listed aren't faults with the graphics engine per se, but rather glitches that could be corrected in a future bugfix patch.
 
Still scratching my head at the comments that lighting is "too bright". I don't see anything like that. PD appears to have tailored this version to LED TVs and ignored the fact that many of us use LCDs.
 
Too bright? If anything certain tracks at rare times are too garish and under lit. I'm using an ISF calibrated Panasonic VT65 plasma, with nigh on perfect 6500k and as many know, best in class black levels and contrast (barring OLED). My guess is some people have their LCD/LED TV's set on settings that have too much contrast or brightness. Perhaps even set to Dynamic mode *shudders*….
 
Just in case some people misunderstood my first post... I said, in a nutshell, that the headlights are too bright during daytime, but they are just fine at night. And I'm talking about how PD set up the graphics engine, it has nothing to do with your screen settings.

Normally, headlight reflections should not be visible when the sun is up. Same problem for the shadows that are scattered by track lights around your car. PD just have to desactivate those effects after sunrise and before sunset for the tracks that uses the day/night cycle. (yes, only those tracks have that problem)

Everything would make more sense, and maybe... it could save some fps too.
 
I tested whether or not player-headlights reflect off A.I. cars, and was going to post about it, but it appears I've been beaten to the punch, another thread already exists.

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/headlights-dont-reflect.296417/

Basically, it appears this 'error' was most-likely deliberate, (not "confirmed", but most-likely) in order to ease the burden on the PS3's dated hardware, a bit disappointed personally, but knowing PD's history - I should've expected it.
 

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