Your thoughts on the WRC at this point in time?Rally

[hlar]

Hey guys. I've always been a rally fan. My love rally died down a bit for the past 4/5 years but back to loving it again. I was just wondering, what are you thoughts on the WRC at this point in time? Personally, I don't really like the direction the cars are going in. I'm all for more power which equals higher speeds, but I just don't like the way the cars look with all the new aerodynamic features. I used to adore, and still do adore, the 2000-2005 seasons, especially the 2005 season. This was because of the amount of manufactures, teams and drivers each with their own characteristics. Solberg for example used to always put all his effort in a took risks (2005 that is) and Grönholm was that superb driver who mostly always stayed on the road yet didn't take ant risks.

And the cars weren't all that aerodynamic gaps on the sides and low floors etc. From the exterior point of view, they just had a spoiler, bigger bumpers and added suspenion plus a whole lot of power. It was pure rally! Not all this aerodynamic mumbo jumbo. I still love rallying, but will always look back at previous years of rallying as the best.

Also, the WRC hasn't really touched upon the other parts of the world like it used to do. They used to have rally safari in Kenya, the rally Japan and rally New Zealand. But the only countries out of Europe in the WRC calendar now is Mexico, Argentina and Australia.

Anyway. Still love watching the WRC none the less! And it still holds that sense of thrills and spills. Just to sum up, I love the addition on more power, but would really like more manufacturers and more rallies outside of Europe.

This is the kind of rally cars I love:


Oh, loving the new GTPlanet flat style look

 

[JC_Dude]

Even though I'm a fan of the two Sebastiens, I think they killed the sport. We have to go all the way back to 2003 to find some other than Loeb or Ogier take the title. For me it doesn't really matter, because we've still had some insane moments, but at one point we had just 2 manufacturers, few sponsors wanted to chip in and the talent ran away from WRC to other series. It's coming back now and is getting better, but we're far away from the heyday of the early 2000s. I like the new cars, the Fiesta looks a bit like it has a double chin, but then again, Ford's forgotten how to design a good looking car, so there's that. The other cars look great and are fantastic to watch. Ultimately, we need someone new to win a title to reinvigorate the WRC. Otherwise the cynics will always have the argument of the series turning into a one-man show. VW's domination exactly hasn't helped either. It's kind of like the Mercedes in F1. No one wants to tune in if they basically know who's going to win. Cheering for the underdog gets old very fast for those not as invested in the sport, especially if the underdog doesn't seem to get any closer.

Sorry if this is a bit rambly, but I just kind of started writing and it turned out like this. I love the WRC and want it to go back to the spotlight it once was under. 2017 seems like a decent step forward in terms of competitiveness.

 

[hlar]

Even though I'm a fan of the two Sebastiens, I think they killed the sport. We have to go all the way back to 2003 to find some other than Loeb or Ogier take the title. For me it doesn't really matter, because we've still had some insane moments, but at one point we had just 2 manufacturers, few sponsors wanted to chip in and the talent ran away from WRC to other series. It's coming back now and is getting better, but we're far away from the heyday of the early 2000s. I like the new cars, the Fiesta looks a bit like it has a double chin, but then again, Ford's forgotten how to design a good looking car, so there's that. The other cars look great and are fantastic to watch. Ultimately, we need someone new to win a title to reinvigorate the WRC. Otherwise the cynics will always have the argument of the series turning into a one-man show. VW's domination exactly hasn't helped either. It's kind of like the Mercedes in F1. No one wants to tune in if they basically know who's going to win. Cheering for the underdog gets old very fast for those not as invested in the sport, especially if the underdog doesn't seem to get any closer.

Sorry if this is a bit rambly, but I just kind of started writing and it turned out like this. I love the WRC and want it to go back to the spotlight it once was under. 2017 seems like a decent step forward in terms of competitiveness.

Completely agree 👍

 

[Simmpa]

Voted yes simply because It´s alot better than the last years of VW domination and three drivers from three different manufacters who are quite close in the race for the WDC. Also they did scrap the absolutely ridiculous road order position from 2015-2016 which always favoured the driver laying last in the championship, altough I agree It´s not as good as in 2005 before the mass exit of manufacturers and Loebs domination but we can´t always dig too far in the past.

The biggest issues I think WRC suffers from right now:

1. Too few events on the calendar
2. Too short lenght of each rally
3. Only 3 non Europeran events
4. Only 4 teams
5. Idiotic tiny loops counted as stages
6. Suicidal spectators who never learn (Monaco this year)
7. WRC license given to lousy game developers

 

[hlar]

Voted yes simply because It´s alot better than the last years of VW domination and three drivers from three different manufacters who are quite close in the race for the WDC. Also they did scrap the absolutely ridiculous road order position from 2015-2016 which always favoured the driver laying last in the championship, altough I agree It´s not as good as in 2005 before the mass exit of manufacturers and Loebs domination but we can´t always dig too far in the past.

The biggest issues I think WRC suffers from right now:

1. Too few events on the calendar
2. Too short lenght of each rally
3. Only 3 non Europeran events
4. Only 4 teams
5. Idiotic tiny loops counted as stages
6. Suicidal spectators who never learn (Monaco this year)
7. WRC license given to lousy game developers

Just wish the WRC could give their license to a game like DiRT... Or at the very least get a better developer and take a brake for a year

 

[C-ZETA]

I do like the WRC now, yes. And the last time the WRC was any good, prior to this year, was in 2003.

From the time the World Rally Cars came about in 1997, the series was nigh on perfect. As more manufacturers came around, more drivers made their name, the whole thing became astonishingly competitive. Makinen might have gone and won the last three championships before the millennium but in 1997 he was run close (albeit still by Subarus at the time), then Toyota came back in '98 and came a short walk away from winning at the first attempt. Then Ford got their act together, and McRae, in '99 and eventually got competitive. Citroen saw what their front-wheel drive monster was doing on tarmac and eventually got thoughts on taking the whole damn thing. Oh yeah, and Peugeot came back. And then in 2000 Marcus Gronholm came almost out of nowhere in one of their cars and went and won the whole shebang in their first full year back. Except reliability struck him hard the next year and '01 became a most stupendous year. Makinen would have won that had Mitsubishi not got designs on introducing their new-gen Lancer towards the end. Even then, had it been any good, he still would have done it. Instead, Richard Burns went and won it in a championship where 1st to 6th was covered by 11 points. That competitive.

And yes, Peugeot got their act together again and 2002 was ultimately a cakewalk for Gronholm. But such is the nature of sport, sometimes. And just look at the points table. You see all the drivers there and you realise they all did something in rallying. Then in 2003 Peugeot lost its reliability again and Petter Solberg went and won the next year...just ahead of Seb Loeb, in his and Citroen's first full year with a WRC car.

And then it all went wrong. Because in 2004 Loeb kept getting better, and Citroen even more so. Which would have been fine if the others had managed to live with him. But they didn't. Not even nearly. Ford didn't kick on at first. Neither did Subaru. Peugeot actually thought the solution to their problems was a coupe-cabriolet based 307 with a 4-speed gearbox. Skoda's promise came to nought when the Fabia failed. Mitsubishi might have made it interesting had their new-gen Lancer been any good at all. But it wasn't. So they didn't. And Hyundai had gone the year before, and Seat long before then. And it only got worse in 2005.

By 2006, the whole thing was just destroyed. Peugeot's manufacturer support had gone. Subaru's new Impreza wasn't doing crap and even Gronholm going to Ford didn't help them at first. Loeb monstered the season to such an extent that even an injury couldn't stop him winning the title. The records say he won by 1 point, except actually he wrapped up the title with two rallies to go after Gronholm finished 5th. So his last two wins just made it all look much better than it actually was.

Gronholm gave it a fair good go the next year, mind. But he still lost. Bless his 2007 heart. And then he went and retired. So Mikko Hirvonen tried to challenge him instead. And still lost. Bless his 2009 heart. And as for 2010...god knows what happened there. Again, no one got close to Loeb. Incidentally, the WRC itself had lost its collective mind by this point and was switching rallies around like no tomorrow. Taking the classics off the calendar in favour of the likes of Ireland, Norway and Bulgaria. Some rally hotbeds they are; they haven't come back since 09-10. The driver line-up was utterly threadbare by this point, and Subaru had cocked up to the point where they'd walked out as well (and god knows what Suzuki were getting at), leaving the series with a whopping two works teams. Oh yeah, and a lot of its TV coverage was vanishing ever more.

2011 was another failed Hirvonen challenge (bless his 2011 heart). Except by now Seb Ogier was building himself up as the spawn of the Loeb and Citroën devil. He promptly upped sticks and left for Volkswagen, who didn't even have a WRC car...yet. So 2012 was another Loeb walkover. Mostly because Citroën had replaced Ogier with...Mikko Hirvonen. Which ultimately screwed Ford over, and made the championship a non-event. Mini also showed up somewhere down the line. But if they'd been any good they'd still be kicking around right now.

And then Loeb stopped doing the full calendar! Great! Except Volkswagen had their new Polo ready and had Ogier in to drive it. And it was a mile better than anyone else had. Add to that the fact they'd taken Latvala off Ford and left them completely at sea, and the result ended up being the same. Just with a different Sebastian cruising to the title. The same happened again in 2014, and again in 2015. Still...at least Hyundai were showing up again.

But then last year something odd happened. First, WRC decided to make the cars more powerful and aerodynamic for this year, which would make it look a damn sight better. And then they made one rule change - they turned the running order for Day 2 on its head. Unfortunately Ogier, clearly not happy with possibly losing all his winning, promptly lost his ****, and with the series' only competitive driver crying over the rule change, they put it back for this year. Indeed, it stopped him so much he won the first two rallies. Then the rule changes really bit and he didn't win for another six rallies, with as many winners as we'd seen for years. And the result was Ogier still walked it. Even at that point he was still well ahead, but then he went and won four in a row just to restore order. Still, that mid-period was great while it lasted...

Luckily, VW went and shot their image to pieces. So they wouldn't come back for the new era. But even though that might have done its bit for the start of this season, the result has still been something special.

The new cars have worked like a charm. The power and aero has made them phenomenally quick, the driver line-up is as good as it's been for a long time and the opening of this season has been unpredictable in all the right ways.

Sure, Ogier is still leading the championship right now. But his Ford is not the fastest car and he's done it through sheer consistency, and he's now really proving just why he's the best in the championship for real. Neuville and Hyundai are clearly the fastest, but he messed up at Monaco and Sweden so if he's gonna win this year, he'll have to come from behind. And the rallies themselves have had just the maddest results. Who could have seen Toyota and Makinen winning their second rally back? Who could have seen Kris Meeke taking what looks to be a pretty weak Citroën and winning - while crashing through a car park? Who could have seen Elfyn Evans come within a bridge, and less than a second, of winning in Argentina? This is the thing. The one thing I want from a motorsport series, above all else, is no idea who's going to win, and what's going to happen next.

I predicted the WRC would finally come good again this year. It's been even better than I could have imagined. All it took was 80 more horses, more wings and some ground effect. And a bit too much diesel to come out of a car, but sshh...

 

[catamount39]

Only said no because coverage for rally here in the states is basically non-existent. The brand new cars are quite amazing, and WRC has definitely good things going for it. While I'm not really with the whole essential outlawing of privateer entries, I do understand why they did it (sort of). The only thing I wish WRC had was a skosh more in the car diversity department. Nothing against hatches, as each type of car has its purpose in racing, just wish that WRC had a tad more diversity in the silhouettes that we see. It'd be great to see smaller sedans and coupes in the top class, but unfortunately it doesn't look likely that they'll ever comeback to the top ranks of rally. The Toyota Yaris WRC is refreshing though, as it has crazy aero and its a very small car compared to the others in the paddock. Which is nice. While it'd be great for the Group A early-mid 90's era to return, this is a nice setup I think. Not perfect, but definitely a new bright era for the top class of rallying.

And as a side note, the lower ranks of rallying under the various banners in different parts of the world, has also seemingly seen a nice rebirth. R5 and R2 are looking rather strong, as is R4.

 

[TheElbows]

While it seems they're doing fine business-wise...there simply isn't any worthwhile coverage of WRC in the United States. Couple that with boring rally locations and I can't get excited about it. Honestly I find the ERC 10x more enjoyable to watch (more personable drivers, more interesting cars, and much, MUCH better locations for rallies). I think rally is one of those things which suffers with the more money which goes into it (with super teams, super cars and unstoppable driver/car combinations).

Rally as a whole seems pretty healthy, but the WRC just doesn't excite nearly at all.

 

[catamount39]

While it seems they're doing fine business-wise...there simply isn't any worthwhile coverage of WRC in the United States. Couple that with boring rally locations and I can't get excited about it. Honestly I find the ERC 10x more enjoyable to watch (more personable drivers, more interesting cars, and much, MUCH better locations for rallies). I think rally is one of those things which suffers with the more money which goes into it (with super teams, super cars and unstoppable driver/car combinations).

Rally as a whole seems pretty healthy, but the WRC just doesn't excite nearly at all.

That statement of money actually holds true. Think of the NARC(right?) here in America. That championship needs some coverage, because the action there is amazing. Hell, Subaru have essentially a factory team there with Vermont Sports Car. And yeah the ERC is very interesting as well (you wouldn't happen to know how to watch it would you? ). Rallying on the lower levels is very exciting.

 

[TheElbows]

I haven't watched it this season, but last season someone had the ERC stuff up on YouTube - it was all from the Eurosport channel which we don't normally get here in the US. I normally wait a season or so and try to find a YT source to watch it all.

 

[hlar]

While it seems they're doing fine business-wise...there simply isn't any worthwhile coverage of WRC in the United States. Couple that with boring rally locations and I can't get excited about it. Honestly I find the ERC 10x more enjoyable to watch (more personable drivers, more interesting cars, and much, MUCH better locations for rallies). I think rally is one of those things which suffers with the more money which goes into it (with super teams, super cars and unstoppable driver/car combinations).

Rally as a whole seems pretty healthy, but the WRC just doesn't excite nearly at all.

Only said no because coverage for rally here in the states is basically non-existent. The brand new cars are quite amazing, and WRC has definitely good things going for it. While I'm not really with the whole essential outlawing of privateer entries, I do understand why they did it (sort of). The only thing I wish WRC had was a skosh more in the car diversity department. Nothing against hatches, as each type of car has its purpose in racing, just wish that WRC had a tad more diversity in the silhouettes that we see. It'd be great to see smaller sedans and coupes in the top class, but unfortunately it doesn't look likely that they'll ever comeback to the top ranks of rally. The Toyota Yaris WRC is refreshing though, as it has crazy aero and its a very small car compared to the others in the paddock. Which is nice. While it'd be great for the Group A early-mid 90's era to return, this is a nice setup I think. Not perfect, but definitely a new bright era for the top class of rallying.

And as a side note, the lower ranks of rallying under the various banners in different parts of the world, has also seemingly seen a nice rebirth. R5 and R2 are looking rather strong, as is R4.

I haven't watched it this season, but last season someone had the ERC stuff up on YouTube - it was all from the Eurosport channel which we don't normally get here in the US. I normally wait a season or so and try to find a YT source to watch it all.

The ERC and even the WRC2 are great. The cars are more exciting in my view although not faster, there is just more variety and driver variety. Unless I pay to watch WRC+ I can't watch the WRC2. I do have Eurosport, but never seem to see ERC on...