Cars you grew to love and cars you grew to hate...

Jim Prower · Jul 30, 2008

I could certainly see why. The R34 is so overused in tuner media, that a lot of people might get tired of it.

YSSMAN · Jul 30, 2008

Not just that, the car is just over-hyped in general. Don't get me wrong, its fast, but it isn't as fast as a lot of people make it out to be. That could explain it easily...

Joey D · Jul 30, 2008

Not to mention it's unbelievably ugly.

YSSMAN · Jul 30, 2008

Well, the R34 isn't that bad, but yes, the R33 was the best-looking of all of them.

Tornado · Jul 30, 2008

I wouldn't go that far. While not as nice looking as the R32 or R33, the R34 is hardly ugly. Maybe a bit chunky, though.

Joey D · Jul 30, 2008

From a design standpoint it's awful, the lines are rough and it just doesn't flow well...especially with that out of place rear spoiler. I've never liked the way the R34 looked, I agree though the R33 looks good.

YSSMAN · Jul 30, 2008

I think the problem with the car is that it makes it look larger than it actually is. When I found out that it was a shade smaller than a VW Passat, I was really surprised. For some reason I had it in my head that it was nearly the size of a Toyota Camry.

Tornado · Aug 3, 2008

So I finally put some thought into it:

Grew to Love:
Ferrari F430 -

This was more of a "hate by association" thing than anything else. Allow me to explain: I hate the 360 Modena. I hated it when it was first shown, I hated it when it was on sale, I hate it now, and I will likely always hate it. Being one of the best cars in Hot Pursuit II did little to remove my feelings towards it for replacing one of the best cars in Hot Pursuit (long story, much of which I would have trouble explaining without portraying myself as shallow, though those that know me can probably guess the admittedly very-superficial reasoning). There is also some subplot involving how I view it as the Ferrari that started cheapening the brand in my eyes (mostly the Spider version), and this will become an essay before I explain my reasoning behind that.
Long story short, I expected the 360 replacement to be much of the same. While I still don't view it as the ultimate (normally aspirated) V8 Ferrari like with the F355 (for various reasons, which are also hard to explain), I grew to have incredible respect for the car as what is essentially the best post-Enzo Ferrari (as in the man, not the car that later became a Maserati platform) ever made. It destroys corners, is more balanced than a scientific scale, has just the right cord between power and weight and simply dominates any other car ever sold in the price segment, and more or less every Ferrari ever made previously. It even looks good after the unfortunate run of Enzo/612. Hell, the Scuderia is essentially greatness incarnate, being nearly the only sports version of a car that I can think of that makes the car better in every way.

Aston Martin V8 Vantage -

Like all post DB7 cars, I came into this thinking it to be a step back at what Aston has always done best: Being sex on wheels. The fact that it shared the name of my favorite Aston annoyed me even more for various reasons, not the least of which being that it makes it impossible to find any decent pictures of that classic piece of $200,000 engine wrapped in GT clothes. Then, I read the reviews pouring in. "Better than the DB9" was one I heard a lot, being like a DB9 without the (useless) rear seats, somewhat tighter looking styling and more sporty character (without compromising its GT ability), all for less coin. It wasn't even any slower, oddly enough. The fact that they recently put a bigger engine in it makes me not understand the point of the DB9 even more.
While I still think it should have a different name, I have to say that it is by far my favorite Aston made since the DB7 (Née XJS), and it is easily a better car than the DB7 was as well (though that probably goes without saying). I also would say that this is the best looking of Ian Callum's "make a DB7...again" designs due to its muscular body that doesn't contrast the original shape (as it does on the DBS) or look too large from certain angles (as seen on the Vanquish).

Ford Mustang GT D2C -

200px-2005_Ford_Mustang_GT_Coupe_in_Redfire_with_Bullitt_wheels_KFoley.jpg

Now, don't get me wrong: This is not a complete role reversal. I still think that the SN-95 Mustang was a better car overall (especially in the styling department), and I'm still completely annoyed by the total lack of restraint that Ford has over the car (special editions coming out every year, for example). The car is retro to the point of compromise, with poorly done design elements put in to look retro rather than be functional and poorly done retro styling on top of that.
Yet, something about it clicks with me in a way that it didn't when it first came out, and everything else has failed to connect with me in every retro copycat car before or after it (the Camaro does not fit into this category; and the Prowler/Fiat 500 are also above blame). Whereas I still view the Thunderbird, SSR, New Beetle, Challenger and FJ Cruiser to be total wastes of the platforms they are built on; I can respect the Mustang for being a perfect representative of what people want in that price segment. At the sub-25k price of a Mustang GT, you buy into a strong history of American history. The 350Z may be a better handling car only slightly more money. But who cares? That is missing the point of the Mustang GT. Cheap, reliable and fun performance in the form of a heavy left foot and plenty of rubber to burn. Call it American hooliganism if you want, and maybe it is because of the reviled retro styling, but I can think of no other new cars under $30,000 that can match the aura of the Mustang (its really only when it goes above the $30,000 mark that I start to have problems with it anymore). I'd take mine with the Bullit package and Torq Thrust wheels, please.
This Mustang talk brings me to my next car:

Nissan 350Z -

Another incomplete role reversal. I still like the Z32 more and still think it to be a superior car. At the same time, I think Nissan should be commended from taking a step back and making the Z-car an everyman's sports car once again. With prices climbing into the mid-40s before Nissan bailed out of America with the Z-car, and with a large majority of Z-car buyers being used to 15 years of the car being a GT, it took guts to refocus the car back to its "Japanese Corvette" roots that had been forgotten after two decades of needing forced induction to offset weight and emissions setbacks. The car exploded on the scene over half a decade ago after no one being sure how it would turn out, and handily became the darling of the sports coupe market. It finally shed the stigma attached to the car since the late 70s as that of a GT car than a sports car (regardless of how great the Z32 was in the handling department), and happily shied away from the sickening retro designs that Nissan floated around a few years prior to launch.
Everything about the car calls back to its early life as the 240Z. There are no rear seats. The engine is a sweet revving, torquey 6 cylinder. The car hustles through turns with a purpose, connecting and communicating with the driver in a way that is more natural than its direct competition at the time. Much like the current GTI, the 350Z recaptures the spirit of the classic Z-car without throwing away all of the good parts of the prior car and without copying any elements of the original. Its up to individual tastes whether or not it is better that way, much like it is with the Golf, but the effort in this day and age is to be commended regardless. Yeah, the convertible is nasty looking and silly; but that car was clearly a niche filler than serious entry, forgiving its misgivings right off the bat. To buy a convertible (or automatic, for that matter) Z is to miss the point of the car, to miss the direct handling, the harmonic engine/transmission combo, the tightly wound (though admittedly controversial) style that screams "sports car" at the top of its lungs. Back when the 240Z was around, there were dozens of cars competing with it. Now that only the Corvette remains, it seemed as though there was no market for such a car any more. Thank you Nissan, for proving everyone wrong.
Speaking of Corvettes:

Chevrolet Corvette C6 -

When this car was first shown running around in camo around 2003, I was unimpressed. It looked like one of those body kitted C5s that were so popular among dentists who happen to be separatists, and the thought of losing the flip up headlights terrified me. I'm still on the fence about the flip up fiasco, and I still think it seems like Chevy didn't do enough to separate the C6 from the C5. Yet now I realize that I wasn't particularly a fan of the C5 either (looks dumpy from certain angles and overweight from others), and that the C6 is a much more purposeful car. It was tightened up and given some lypo, making it seem more sporty and composed. It also (far more importantly) finally accomplished the goal that GM had so mismanaged with the 1984 'Vette: being a world class sports car in all performance categories without compromising others.
The C4, while improved greatly after a few years of suck (lets ballpark 1989), was only a potential world beater upon the arrival of the ZR-1, which added immense weight, complexity at the expense of more "modern" technology. The Viper's immense rawness and gluttony also overshadowed it by being more of an American approach to European cars than the 'Vette was, in addition to being faster. The C5 upped the Corvette's standing in the world stage by making it more usable and practical, the Z06 taking the charge at being the fixer of the ZR-1s flaws. It even became a dominant force on the world stage in motor racing, stealing back honors from its arch rival the Viper. Yet something was once again remiss when put up to the spotlight of Europeans finest. While faster than its opponents in a straight line, it was held back again by its pedestrian roots and parts with the base C5 enough that it even began losing to cars it should have dominated (Boxster, BMW M5).
With the C6, GM pulled out all of the stops. They gave the base model Z06 rivaling power and handling poise. And for the Z06 they decided that would go all out with development, something the Corvette guys probably wanted since 1983. As a result, it’s not hard to see the C6 as a marvel of what seemingly obsolete and outdated tech can do when put to the right use. It is the car that finally achieved the Corvette’s 20 year goal to be a respected sports car on the world stage rather than some straight-line novelty from America. With that taken into account, it’s hard for me to hold onto my initial pessimism for a car that is so great.

You know, this took over an hour to write. Screw it, I’ll do cars I grew to hate later.

Centro · Aug 3, 2008

I loved this

but as it evolved I started to hate it, and now it became this piece of qraup.

Spec M · Aug 3, 2008

Hyundai has earned my respect specifically for the production of this car and its amazing price. This is probably one of the best values on the market today.

The DOHC V8-375hp RWD Genesis.

They went pretty far with the elegant factors, having a console system much like the iDrive, and a Lexicon sound system, which Rolls Royce or Bentley (I forget) also uses.

superberkut · Aug 3, 2008

YSSMAN
Not just that, the car is just over-hyped in general. Don't get me wrong, its fast, but it isn't as fast as a lot of people make it out to be. That could explain it easily...

In 2001 it cost more than a Porsche 911, with more weight and less aesthetic appeal. It certainly did not deserve to be placed in tuner media, but it was inevitable as it was already a part of Japanese culture, which also happened to embrace the tuner car.

Anyways, Toronado: +1

homeforsummer · Aug 3, 2008

superberkut
In 2001 it cost more than a Porsche 911

Depends where you live I guess. In the UK an R34 was £54k, a 911 nearer £65k.

superberkut · Aug 4, 2008

I suppose so, being in Canada and all, but the magazine I was reading at the time was, oddly enough, British.

Leonidae · Aug 4, 2008

Cars I've learned to love..

Originally disliked every BMW (thanks to a bad E30 experience) , but then I got to drive E36 and fell in love..

Yes, I'm aware that it has pushrods and hemispherical combustion chambers, but I don't give rats ass. The engine can be changed, and so can the suspension. I just like the looks.

and Cars I've learned to hate..

You have no idea how much I hate this car.. I poured over 1000 in one and it still wasn't in roadworthy condition. Fix Or Repair Daily indeed..

M-B W144 or something like that, the one with 2l asthmatic diesel engine and vertical lights. it was the most scary car I've ever driven. steering was the definition of vague, you couldn't tell if you got gear on when you shifted, the brakes welt like they were relying on gravity to stop the car, and turning circle could compete with Pluto's orbit. oh, and did I forget to mention the utter lack of life in the engine? floor it or not, it didn't do anything else but release a huge cloud of smoke from the exhaust.

archangel62 · Aug 7, 2008

Zheng1337
Nissan Skyline R34 GTR 👎

I used to be quite fond of this car, but after a while, I began to dislike it. I can't really put my finger on it, but I suppose it's because I feel that it looks too much like a tuner car.

You're nuts! I know there are some not-nice R34s out there, but that particular one is so hot I saved it! lol.. I can appreciate that their styling is a bit overdone sometimes, but they're crazy cars. RB26DETT? Yesh please. 4wd and 4ws? Very cool. I can't say I like the idea of a computer fixing my mistakes all the time (turn off ASM in GT3/4? lol) but man, I'd love one of these.

And, how could you dislike tuner cars? Tuning cars is awesome - which is why a road Supra in GT3, on racing mediums, will keep up with the LM's. It's when people rice the crap out of bad cars that things go wrong, like plastic chrome wheel covers, or three wings on the back of an FF. But yeah, my two cents anyway

Tornado · Aug 7, 2008

IIRC, most of the drivetrain bits in the R34 and before were mechanical rather than computer run like in the R35.

JCE · Aug 7, 2008

👍 Cars I've grown to really like:

[my god could this car get any sexier?]

2008_lamborghini_gallardo_picture%20(21).jpg

👎 cars I've grown to hate:

[do not like the 2.0L engine saloon version]

Omnis · Aug 7, 2008

Probably the best example of a car I grew to love:

AE86 Levin.

JohnBM01 · Aug 7, 2008

So this is about cars I've hated in the past but grown to love? Two recent American cars come to mind. The first is the new Chevrolet Malibu. Here's what I typed for a picture in my Myspace Photo Album on the 2008 Houston Auto Show: "okay, liked it, love it!" I've slowly become fond of the new Chevrolet Malibu. This model looks a hell of a lot better than the Malibu Maxx in 2003 or so. It is even comfortable to sit down in. I don't have a license, but it would be a car I wouldn't mind owning. The car is beautiful on multiple dimensions. I find beauty in subtlety. Surely this car is lovely. I'm actually suprised I don't see too many of these on the road even as I slowly grown to love this car.

From a FWD people-mover... to a RWD beast I initially hated. I'm talking about the Pontiac G8. Current Pontiacs I like include the Solstice and the newer Vibe (which I like more than the very first Vibe). Mistakes come along (Aztek, G6, Torrent, G6 GXP), but I slowly begun to love the G8. I think myself and M5Power were the only ones who liked the 2004-ish Pontiac GTO while most others cried "bland." Because if one company's newer designs look terrible, it's always fine to stick with previous-gen car design to fall back on. I even liked the GTO drift cars like the one "Mad Skills" Rhys Millen drifted. This G8, however, was something I've somewhat gotten used to without thinking that graduates of the Chris Bangle University - College of Car Design made a disasterous-looking car to be sold in showrooms. It's actually a pretty cool car with pretty cool design. Its design is plenty aggressive without looking like it should be in a Burnout game.

Cars I've grown to hate, there is one hands-down pick: every Hummer besides the H1. Honestly. I don't see any practicality to these. It's the official vehicle of teen girl spoiled brats in "My Super Sweet Sixteen" (though I do watch the show a lot). I got into the Hummer H1 and H2 at the Houston Auto Show in the past. Those things are too cramped up front... and I'm a 6'0" guy! I'm never excited about big SUVs. Almost never have been. I don't see myself owning one. But especially not the Hummer H2 and H3. I used to like the H2 and hate the H1. Now it's the reverse since this truck has been so milked and overrated. I'm going to get flamed for saying this, but these newer Hummers have been nothing but fads. The H1 is the original Hummer and the only one I'd ever get if I was looking for a big American SUV. I'd even ride one if I were an Army Ranger (that's how I feel being in one).

So two cars I grown to love and one I've grown to hate, agree or disagree at will.

slidesquad#1 · Aug 7, 2008

archangel62
And, how could you dislike tuner cars? Tuning cars is awesome - which is why a road Supra in GT3, on racing mediums, will keep up with the LM's.

Umm..what? I know this is predominantly a GT board and all, but the relevance of what you said in real life is precisely zero.

I've always loved how the R34 looks, and think that the sedan is a lot better than the coupe though, the lines flow a lot better in my opinion.

But, on topic,

I'm a big Subaru fan, and when this came out I thought they'd completely lost it. I still think it's somewhat awkward from some angles especially with that not quite there spoiler that's on the car pictured, but it's grown on me remarkably, and I seriously considered replacing my old Legacy with one before I decided to see what the 'dark side' was all about.

It's still no 22b though.

archangel62 · Aug 11, 2008

lol, it just took less explaining than real life examples.

Real life example: you can compare a factory "sports pack" to the original, pay the difference, and get maybe a slight power gain and a body kit... Or, you could spend the price difference on a turbo conversion, or upgrading stock turbo, and get twice the power. Same goes with handling, except for the real high budget sports cars. A properly tuned set of coilovers will **** all over just about any factory suspension setup.

And whilst it's a stupid comparison, I bet $30,000 could make any of the later model Skylines (R32/33/34) smoke Ferrari 360's, beit track, hills or straight line.

Modding cars is awesome! Because unfortunately, companies are almost always forced to make compromises; to meet budgets, and the needs of soccer mums and businessmen.

exigeracer · Aug 11, 2008

Toronado
I also would say that this is the best looking of Ian Callum's "make a DB7...again" designs due to its muscular body that doesn't contrast the original shape (as it does on the DBS) or look too large from certain angles (as seen on the Vanquish).

Ian Callum did not design the V8 Vantage. He did the DB7, however Henrik Fisker stepped in to help with the current lineup. Venari claims he had less to do with the designs than most believe though

Cars you grew to love and cars you grew to hate...

Jim Prower

The Big Blue Ford.

YSSMAN

Super-Cool Since 2013

Joey D

YSSMAN

Super-Cool Since 2013

Tornado

Joey D

YSSMAN

Super-Cool Since 2013

Tornado

Centro

Spec M

superberkut

homeforsummer

Bonbonbonbons!

superberkut

Leonidae

archangel62

Tornado

JCE

Omnis

Not Even A Real Mod

JohnBM01

21 years!

slidesquad#1

archangel62

exigeracer

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