Koenigsegg Agera R

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IceMan PJN
I personally despise it due in part to it looking like the head of a cyborg pig but mainly because of all the incessant undeserved hype about a car that's impressive on paper and then that's as far as it goes. The Bugatti Cyberpig requires several miles of the most optimal roadway that you can find on the planet just to reach its top speed, meaning you couldn't realistically hit it on any road or highway or even any racetrack (laps around Daytona just won't cut it) so it's a top speed that's essentially worthless.

Top speed is also about the only thing it can do, once you've given it time to get there, since it handles like a van. "Okay, but it's really fast for a two-ton van!" That's fine if it was supposed to just be a people-carrier, but it's a supercar, and relative to other supercars it handles like a sack of bricks. It's impressive if you're running it against minivans, but if you lap a race track next to proper supercars the illusion of impressiveness is shattered.

The Cyberpig has a 8.0-liter W16 engine with four turbochargers and just got in the 1000-horsepower range (a bit under for the regular Veyron and a bit more for the Super Sport). Ferrari's FXX Evoluzione gets 850 horsepower from a 6.3-liter V12 with no turbos. One would kind of figure that with greater displacement and four friggin' turbos that the Veyron should be capable of more power since the FXX Evoluzione gets more power per liter with no turbos than the Veyron does with turbos. A friend's dad modified a Mustang for a few thousand bucks and it gets 900 horsepower from a 401 in³ (about 6.57 liters) engine and he's just a backyard tinkerer.

I wouldn't hate the thing so hardcore if people didn't worship it so passionately.
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Wait... So you mean to tell me that the Veyron SS wasn't 3 tenths quicker around the Top Gear test track than the Gumpert Apollo, which is a purpose built track car? I wonder what other lies I've been fed over the internet :sly: By the way, simple car logic comes into play here. The FXX's motor isn't designed to be pushed flatout for miles of testing at 250mph+. The Veyron's motor had to be capable of holding 1000+hp reliably. Your dad's friend's Mustang would need bags of ice too keep it cool at a standing mile.
 
IceMan PJN
I personally despise it due in part to it looking like the head of a cyborg pig but mainly because of all the incessant undeserved hype about a car that's impressive on paper and then that's as far as it goes.
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It's the fastest car in the world. What more does a car need to deserve this so-called hype?
The Bugatti Cyberpig requires several miles of the most optimal roadway that you can find on the planet just to reach its top speed, meaning you couldn't realistically hit it on any road or highway or even any racetrack (laps around Daytona just won't cut it) so it's a top speed that's essentially worthless.
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But that doesn't stop it from being the world's fastest car, now does it?
Top speed is also about the only thing it can do, once you've given it time to get there, since it handles like a van. "Okay, but it's really fast for a two-ton van!" That's fine if it was supposed to just be a people-carrier, but it's a supercar, and relative to other supercars it handles like a sack of bricks. It's impressive if you're running it against minivans, but if you lap a race track next to proper supercars the illusion of impressiveness is shattered.
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I can only assume you've driven the Veyron to it's limits, as well as a fleet of other supercars?
The Cyberpig has a 8.0-liter W16 engine with four turbochargers and just got in the 1000-horsepower range (a bit under for the regular Veyron and a bit more for the Super Sport). Ferrari's FXX Evoluzione gets 850 horsepower from a 6.3-liter V12 with no turbos. One would kind of figure that with greater displacement and four friggin' turbos that the Veyron should be capable of more power since the FXX Evoluzione gets more power per liter with no turbos than the Veyron does with turbos. A friend's dad modified a Mustang for a few thousand bucks and it gets 900 horsepower from a 401 in³ (about 6.57 liters) engine and he's just a backyard tinkerer.
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Even though it has a quad-turbo 8.0L W16, it still achieves over 100HP/L.
I wouldn't hate the thing so hardcore if people didn't worship it so passionately.
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Are they wrong in doing so? I've never once seen a person worship it "so passionately" before.
 
Christ...250mph on the backstraight of the Nurb..... We need to find out what this car can really do.
 
ND4SPD
Christ...250mph on the backstraight of the Nurb..... We need to find out what this car can really do.
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Remember that it's a relatively light car, that helps acceleration but not top speed. This car will get to speed faster than most other other cars most likely, but it may not be faster. We would need to see how the speedo was moving at 250 to get a better idea of how far from its top speed it was.
 
The problem with maxing out a car, is finding the right test track.

Rule out Nardo, because it's not possible to reach a true top speed there, due to several factors like the road surface and the fact that it's one continuous turn.

Ehra-Lessien does have a 5-mile straight, but is exclusively for use by the Volkswagen Group (it's where they maxed out the Veyron and Veyron SS).

Most others don't feature a straight long enough to get anyway near 270, if that's even the true top speed.

However, Shelby Supercars speed tested their Ultimate Aero on a 12 mile, closed off stretch of US Route 93 in Nevada. They still managed to beat the original Veyron.

Speaking of Shelby Supercars, they will hopefully be soon bringing out their Tuatara hypercar, which could be another challenger for the record.

But despite all this, Koenigsegg have held a speed record before, and I have little doubt that they can do it again.
 
Every time I hear Agera R, I get excited. It's such a lovely car and I do hope Koenigsegg makes its way to GT. It's long overdue. Sweden needs to be recognized on the supercar level. Volvo's got a long way to go :P

I imagine the SSC Tuatara will soon break the Veyron SS's record. Supposed to have a 2lbs/1 hp ratio.
 
I would have thought that the bragging-rights and marketability of such a feature as that of a world record in production car top-speed would readily push car makers like Koenigsegg to give everything they've got into breaking it as soon as possible. Strange.
 
Dennisch
Nothing to add to those 5 comments. :lol:
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So why did you bother? The bandwagon was already full like a Bangladeshi train carriage.

Seriously, I can see what IceManPJN was on about anyway. He only made one mistake; he didn't realise he should refrain from expressing anything other than popular opinion.

Actually he made two. The Veyron doesn't look like a Pig's head. It looks like a bowling shoe.

bowling-shoes-flickr-stevensnodgrass.jpg


red_black_bugatti_veyron_001_of_300_1-568-426.jpg
 
peter_vod69
So why did you bother? The bandwagon was already full like a Bangladeshi train carriage.

Seriously, I can see what IceManPJN was on about anyway. He only made one mistake; he didn't realise he should refrain from expressing anything other than popular opinion.
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If you're going to accuse people of being on a bandwagon, you might want to put up some facts or at least a less fallacious argument. Is it possible that multiple people can have the same opinion because it makes sense?
 
peter_vod69
Seriously, I can see what IceManPJN was on about anyway. He only made one mistake; he didn't realise he should refrain from expressing anything other than popular opinion.
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No. He didn't realize that he should refrain from expressing anything other than informed opinion when commenting on something. And if you seriously think he was right just because he went against the grain, I suggest you learn the same lesson.
 
Zenith013
If you're going to accuse people of being on a bandwagon, you might want to put up some facts or at least a less fallacious argument. Is it possible that multiple people can have the same opinion because it makes sense?
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It was a bandwagon because a bunch of forum members decided to jump on his post and bag him without pausing for a moment to consider his point of view. Despite his poorly expressed views, he does have something of a point. Namely that, in some regards, the Veyron was a one-trick pony. Hell of a trick, mind you.

With regard to the handling, the fact of the matter is that it cannot overcome the laws of physics. Simply put, it is too heavy to be as quick around a track as the very fastest hypercars.

Backing up that opinion I present:

Some facts:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Top_Gear_test_track_Power_Lap_Times

Yet more facts:
http://www.thering.co.uk/Nurburgring_Lap_Times.htm

Toronado
No. He didn't realize that he should refrain from expressing anything other than informed opinion when commenting on something. And if you seriously think he was right just because he went against the grain, I suggest you learn the same lesson.
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Opinions are just that. Opinions. If took a moment to think about what that means you would see that both sides can be equally informed, without being necessarily wrong or right. In fact, if you think you are right just because others share the same view on a given subject, then I'd suggest that you could learn a lesson or two about arrogance.
 
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peter_vod69
It was a bandwagon because a bunch of forum members decided to jump on his post and bag him without pausing for a moment to consider his point of view. Despite his poorly expressed views, he does have something of a point. Namely that, in some regards, the Veyron was a one-trick pony. Hell of a trick, mind you.
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You see, it seemed to me that his actual point was that the Veyron was the receiver of
incessant undeserved hype about a car that's impressive on paper and then that's as far as it goes.
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So what was a minor portion of his post suddenly constitutes his entire point? What about all the stuff that had nothing to do with that statement? What about all of the stuff that applies to every car on the market today? Since that apparently had nothing to do with his apparent "point," why say it?

peter_vod69
With regard to the handling, the fact of the matter is that it cannot overcome the laws of physics. Simply put, it is too heavy to be as quick around a track as the very fastest hypercars.
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Fantastic. Wonderful. Lovely. And yet altogether a different statement from
"Top speed is also about the only thing it can do, once you've given it time to get there, since it handles like a van. 'Okay, but it's really fast for a two-ton van!' That's fine if it was supposed to just be a people-carrier, but it's a supercar, and relative to other supercars it handles like a sack of bricks. It's impressive if you're running it against minivans, but if you lap a race track next to proper supercars the illusion of impressiveness is shattered."
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Which is nonsense.




Going along from that:
peter_vod69
Backing up that opinion I present:

Some facts:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Top_Gear_test_track_Power_Lap_Times

Yet more facts:
http://www.thering.co.uk/Nurburgring_Lap_Times.htm
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So your ace in the hole to prove that Iceman wasn't just talking out of his ass, to prove that everyone was just ganging up on him to bandwagon rather than because he was wrong, and to prove how arrogant everyone was being for dismissing his post, are a couple lap time leaderboards where the Veyron compared favorably to other hypercars which he in no uncertain terms said would not happen?




...




'Kay.


peter_vod69
Opinions are just that. Opinions. If took a moment to think about what that means you would see that both sides can be equally informed, without being necessarily wrong or right.
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He went so far as to say that the Veyron was a bad car compared to other cars because it had a "low" specific output. Which, in addition to being the stupidest, most useless measurement ever conceived, also doesn't even have the benefit of being true for his argument when the Veyron had one of well over 100 HP/L.


Now, I have no idea what universe justifies calling that "informed," but it sounds like a hell of a place. I should probably visit.

peter_vod69
In fact, if you think you are right just because others share the same view on a given subject, then I'd suggest that you could learn a lesson or two about arrogance.
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Considering you couldn't be white knighting any harder if you had instructions, I'd suggest you take your own advice before doling it out to others.
 
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peter_vod69
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Top_Gear_test_track_Power_Lap_Times

Yet more facts:
http://www.thering.co.uk/Nurburgring_Lap_Times.htm
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Problem is, Veyron has never gone head to head with anything, so laptimes are of limited value. I wouldn't be surprised if there were quite a few "lesser" supercars that out performed the Veyron, but there is very little data to go on.

hawkeye122
I love how you cite Wikipedia as facts.
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Wikipedia is the most underrated source of information on the internet.
 
What I never get with all the Veyron hate is that it's also the quickest production car around mostly any track in GT5. And I have many times come back to the point that people just don't seem to know how to drive the thing as there are few if any other cars with that kinda level of performance in the game. It doesn't have poor handling (sheesh give me a Veyron over an Enzo any day of the week, in GT land anyway), people just seem to forget that 1. It was never designed as a race car so stop assuming it will handle like one and 2. You are getting understeer BECAUSE YOU ARE APPROACHING THE CORNER ABOUT 50MPH FASTER THAN IN ANY OTHER ROAD CAR! Ahem.

And no i'm not a Veyron fanboy, though I do think it's an awesome achievement and actually like the styling (sheesh give me a Veyron over the busy and boring styling of a GTR or LFA any day of the week) but i'm relatively mature, realistic, a half decent driver (virtually anyway) and I don't hate on something just because a lot of other people seem to.

Again I invite any decent GT drivers to take any three tracks and test the Veyron's times against any other production road cars in the game (stock, same tyres). And drive them all to the max, no pussyfooting to throw the results :-)
 
Tyger
2. You are getting understeer BECAUSE YOU ARE APPROACHING THE CORNER ABOUT 50MPH FASTER THAN IN ANY OTHER ROAD CAR! Ahem.
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I agree with this part. I actually came up with that conclusion a long time ago.
 

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