Out of curiosity: Different front/rear tires?

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MistyRainne
The game goes out of its way to let you equip different types of tires for the front and rear wheels, but is this ever actually useful?

I remember when trying RWD/FR, that using grippier tires for the rear helped a lot, then it tended to break traction more evenly; but, even at the time, I could tell it felt unnatural to do that.
 
Only time it seems to really be useful is when there is tire wear. At least in a general sense.

The only exception I've come across is this current drift trial where apparently a lot of people are doing CH front CS rear.
 
The unbalanced nature of running different compounds is rarely worth the benefits.

However there are situations where a car has too much grip in either the front or rear which can cause problems - ideally you want to adjust your suspension to overcome this, however if you're in a rush (In a tournament for example) changing compounds can be a quick temporary fix.

The only exception I've come across is this current drift trial where apparently a lot of people are doing CH front CS rear.

I would strongly advice against doing this.
 
My GTR '07 likes Race Mediums front and Race soft rear, then wears even!

Assuming you can drive the car smoothly, you can tune tire wear to be even through suspension, LSD, ballast and brake balance, and take advantage of higher grip at both ends of the car.

The unbalanced nature of running different compounds is rarely worth the benefits.

However there are situations where a car has too much grip in either the front or rear which can cause problems - ideally you want to adjust your suspension to overcome this, however if you're in a rush (In a tournament for example) changing compounds can be a quick temporary fix.

I found this "unbalance" to be so uncomfortable I abondoned this idea in favour of tuning adjustments. Even on the Yellowbird, the most unbalanced car in the game, I find going down just one compound in the front makes the car understeer and as a result, makes the already loose back end even more unpredictable. At least with the same rubber on both ends of the car it's predictable what's going to happen and you can get used to it with enough practice.
 
When tuning FF cars with racing tyres I found out it could be useful for some of them to use racing softs in the front and racing mediums or even hards in the rear. This would make the car looser, getting rid of much of the understeer, and also much more interesting to drive, behaving in some ways like a MR car.
 
When tuning FF cars with racing tyres I found out it could be useful for some of them to use racing softs in the front and racing mediums or even hards in the rear. This would make the car looser, getting rid of much of the understeer, and also much more interesting to drive, behaving in some ways like a MR car.
Technically, that doesn’t remove understeer (front wheels losing traction), that just adds oversteer (rear wheels losing traction), which FF cars normally don’t have. You can get a similar effect – without using different rear tires – by shifting the brake balance to the rear, so the rear wheels run out of traction sooner. Brake into a turn and the back should slide out, kinda like a RWD powerslide, except you maintain it with the brakes rather than the throttle, and you can get out of it more easily by laying down power (because this doesn’t rely on the power wheels losing traction), and the fronts will pull the car back into line, so it transitions smoothly from sliding to driving.

However, there’s more to cornering than just rotating the car, you also have to overcome momentum. If you do one without the other, you’ll just slam sideways into the outer wall. If the car won’t rotate, that’s just a symptom; if you manage momentum correctly, the rotation will reflect that.

That said: In a FWD, you don’t have to rotate (as much) in order to lay down power toward the turn, because the power wheels are steerable. If you’re coasting through a turn at the limit of traction, add a touch of power and it will actually turn faster, because you can add power – and thus momentum – in the direction of the turn. (In RWD, you can only lay down power in the direction the nose is facing, which contributes to the very momentum that the (unpowered) steer wheels are trying to overcome in the first place.) This gives you access to a part of the traction circle you can’t access by unpowered steering alone, and this is why FWD actually has less understeer than RWD in experienced hands.

(The same can be said of 4WD, to some extent.)

Add a touch of braking – thus, using all three inputs at once! – to slow down and shift weight (and traction) onto the steerable power wheels, and boring old FWD can become quite acrobatic! :dopey: (Especially in Rally driving, but also useful as an emergency/corrective measure on tarmac.)

This all stems from car control and things like suspension/brake setup, without needing (nor wanting) different kinds of tires in front and back, which brings me back to my original question.

Indeed, with weight transfer management, you can adjust the front/rear traction balance pretty much at will, not just in the pits. With different tires on each end, it means you have to do this just to get equal balance when that’s called for, such as coasting through a turn, which itself presents little opportunity to shift weight around.

The only different-tires context (that I can think of) that doesn’t involve simply which end gets more traction, is dry vs rain tires. I suppose, in this case, you could make one end gripper in dry conditions and the other end gripper in wet conditions. But is there any point to that? The inconsistent behavior would be far worse than the loss of traction as rain accumulates on the road (or evaporates from it).
 
^ That's a lot of good information. Quite impressive.

For FR cars (used as the example as that is what I use most of the time for whatever reason) in a longer race, I will often use softer tires on the front, coupled with always setting my brake bias at about 3-1, with the assumption that softer tires in the front will help my car corner a bit better while giving me more even tire wear throughout the stint.

It has worked pretty well for me and I have never noticed the car feeling unbalanced, or even really any differant than when I use the same on both ends. But maybe I haven't been paying enough attention, or not talented enough to notice.

Having said that, this is an interesting topic that maybe I was just taking for granted. Some test laps may be in order.
 
I haven't tried it in GT5 yet, but i used it in GT3 and 4. In some endurance events i ran hard rears and medium fronts. Simply so the rear tires would hold long enough so i would not have to pit an extra time (or not at all in some races).
 
The only exception I've come across is this current drift trial where apparently a lot of people are doing CH front CS rear.

I tried this and have seen the benefit. Using a 720hp '07 Mustang in the American car drift seasonal, CS rear actually let me keep greater angle at slower speeds and rack up them points. That's probably about as useful as this tactic gets.
 
I would strongly advice against doing this.

Thanks drift king, but I have a few drift set ups like this and I've actually come across people doing the equivalent in real life. It works sometimes.
 
I used mediums on the rear softs on front on my final stint of the Indy 500 due to the way i drive abolutley wrecking the right rear tyre, did 30 laps i think on it and finished the race
 
There is an advantage to equal or softer front tyres, but only if you have an attention span shorter than a lobotomized gnat. For ridiculously short races, it's an effective strategy.

For any kind of actual race, and where it's legal, equipping harder tyres on the rear is a far better strategy. The reason being that on a racetrack, a car with worn out rear tires is slow, undrivable and unsafe. A car with worn out front tires is just slow.

That is, of course, assuming you setup the car to be fastest when about 1/2 way through tyre wear (and if the game wasn't broken, fuel load) like you should. Onboard controls like traction control, brake balance, anti-rollbar jackers and in low end cars, ABS, are methods often used to reduce front end grip or get the absolute most out of the rear, in order to keep the car managable throughout the range of tyre wear (and ideally, fuel load) during the stint. They all sacrifice speed for drivibility. A worthwhile sacrifice proven by nearly a century of trial and error.

The fact you even needed to ask this question shows you have never run a race long enough to need to pit for tyres. I recommend you try it. With GT5 unable to model static friction (i.e. a 'driving on ice' model), it's pretty obvious why you'd stick harder tyres on the rear when you can.
 
I used racing hard (rear) & racing medium (front) on my Pug 908 for the Le Mans 24hr A Spec race & got pretty even tyre wear.
 
I use different compounds when our group runs a series (Season 3) every other Saturday. The series has Tire/Fuel Consumption on at FAST. Cars are stock and only thing you can adjust is brake balance. Mixed group of DS3 / Wheel users and only thing that can ruin your race are mistakes and not being consistent.

I run with Front @ Soft and Rear @ Medium, but this depends on the lap count and how quick the other guys are or are not. If 2nd place is with in .1 tenth of my best time during quali, I will mix the tyres up. If I have a few tenths in the bag, I don't see any need for it, but to just run it all out and do a 2 stop strategy vs 1 stop.

As for lap times, it really depends on the car. It can be a tenth or less slower, but the drop off in lap times is a bit slower vs having full softs on. Also, tried this with the Ford GT Test Car at the 24H Enduro...not a good idea as the car was really unpredictable.
 
I did the same as Jaywalker - Drove at LeMans in the 24... found I was chewing the rears up faster than the fronts. Swapped to Medium/Hards and the tyres went off at the same rate and were more balanced over a stint.

Running Soft/Hards at a twisty track can make a car pretty slippery at the back and hone your car control as you need to work harder to keep the rear in check.. s smoother softer lines into corners and the like. (Or you can drive like a loony and scream Powah! as you vulcanise the rear tyres like a boss.)
 
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