...

[JAGUAR1977]

Most cars in GT5P are road cars, they will never give you the gritty feeling or grip/bite a race car does, the tuned cars are as close as it gets.

Immersion wise, the engine sounds were the biggest let down in GT5P, much of that has been rectified in the update, if race cars like the XJR-9LM, Sauber C9, Mazda 787B, 205 T16 EVO II etc show similar engine sound improvements, I reckon they will be the best in the sim world. The best I've heard in rfactor are the HistoricX and Epsilon mod.

Physics wise, I'd put GT5P at 90% of HistoricX, and at least equal to most quality mods, each of which have their own quirks and faults.

As for tracks, that's the one area I believe GT5P is far ahead of rfactor, other than VLM's tracks. I would imagine one of the areas PD will improve is extra atmosphere at the track.

The biggest drawback of all for rfactor is the fact so many great mods drop out of favour online so quickly, which is doubly bad considering rfactors limited userbase. Hotlapping and pick up and play online races are why I play sims, I became tired of getting into a mod, then seeing it drop out of favour after a month or so later, not to mention being limited to a handful of AAA tracks, with niche circuits hardly getting a look in.

 

[supersonic-88]

I've pretty much always had the opinion that PC sims are the way to go if you want a real driving experience, while console based games are aimed more at the arcade type crowd. While previous GT games have been enjoyable to play, they've lacked a lot of the things which make PC sims great. Damage, really good physics, sound and so on.

For example what's really annoyed me about past GT games has been the ability to not spin the car out. Even with all driving aids off, you can still plant your foot straight to the floor, and the car won't spin or even lose any sort of noticeable traction. Compare that to a PC sim and you'll be sideways. Finally in GT5P, this seems to be fixed, which shows they're going in the right direction to make the game better.

What i'd like to see worked on also is the racing experience. The best i've found with this is GTR2, where i can seem to always have great offline races with the AI. With GT5P, along with the rest of the series, the races always become stale and boring, eventually making the game become tedious.

So at the moment, PC sims are still ahead for me, but GT5P is definite improvement, which if continued upon in the right way, could challenge PC sims.

 

[Kryz11]

I've pretty much always had the opinion that PC sims are the way to go if you want a real driving experience, while console based games are aimed more at the arcade type crowd. While previous GT games have been enjoyable to play, they've lacked a lot of the things which make PC sims great. Damage, really good physics, sound and so on.

For example what's really annoyed me about past GT games has been the ability to not spin the car out. Even with all driving aids off, you can still plant your foot straight to the floor, and the car won't spin or even lose any sort of noticeable traction. Compare that to a PC sim and you'll be sideways. Finally in GT5P, this seems to be fixed, which shows they're going in the right direction to make the game better.

What i'd like to see worked on also is the racing experience. The best i've found with this is GTR2, where i can seem to always have great offline races with the AI. With GT5P, along with the rest of the series, the races always become stale and boring, eventually making the game become tedious.

So at the moment, PC sims are still ahead for me, but GT5P is definite improvement, which if continued upon in the right way, could challenge PC sims.

👍👍
Yeah GT5P could be first Console SIM racer to challenge PC. Al tho there is no damage for now, pretty much all is there. Even Race for the Xbox360 already seems like a TONED Down Sim and turn out to be an sim/arcade and I thought that would be PURE sim as PC RACE 07 game.
So Congrats PD to change the shift and challenging PC sim racing with Great physics and realistic car handling/characteristics!

 

[RedSuinit]

I think that when they introduce damage (fall update, PLEASE don't take too long!) that GT5 will feel much more like a perfect sim.

Luke

 

[TorqueHappenS08]

But see, that's the problem right here... i'm not giving too much credit to one or another... I've played both, tweaked both and took time to asses both products and made an informed decision... your assumption and example is as flawed as the video we are talking about.. you take a video of a very nice GT5 replay (which is unavailable now btw, but i've seen it before) and a very arcadey Grid video...

If you go play GRID, and put all the settings at "expert", no aids, no catchup and AI at expert... i guaranty you'll have a hell of a hard time with the game. It'll be fun and challenging, just like GT4/5p are... add the number of cars (20) and car damage, and its increasingly more complex then GT5p, and dare i say... more fun.

But following on your example, on the other hand, take Prologue, put everything at easy with Aids (and for the sake of the GRID video you posted) race in 3rd person view and you get the exact same arcadey and cheapy feel GRID gives out in the video/demo.

At this point, I'm thinking that a lot of people put GT5(p) on a podium without even considering it, and trashing every other games out there on the sole principle that "it can't be as good as GTx" (as i was saying earlier). I understand the differences, but i also see the benefits of them.

Also, comparing GRID to burnout?? GTA?? I'm sorry, but this can never be taken seriously... it can be your own opinion of course, but to this, i'll have to call "bull****" or "misinformed"... because there is no way you can compare those games going further then "they are race games".

edit: Ok i see you've changed the prologue video now. I'll say its a hell of a better video to "promote" prologue, however, since its an official game trailer, i'd put the GRID trailer as well for objective comparison... else its kind of wasted.

Like so:

Ok, all i have to say is, if this is a thread about gt5p versus pc sims. how in the world could you include grid in this? spam maybe..


with that being said, based on experience with most of the top pc sims on the market, and a g25, i can say that gt is now more likely at live for speeds physics engine, witch is a huge feat:tup: and dare i say almost up to GTR2s standards? and so with that gt is finaly starting to show its true colours, but it still has a long way to go.

 

[RedSuinit]

Ok, all i have to say is, if this is a thread about gt5p versus pc sims. how in the world could you include grid in this? spam maybe..


with that being said, based on experience with most of the top pc sims on the market, and a g25, i can say that gt is now more likely at live for speeds physics engine, witch is a huge feat:tup: and dare i say almost up to GTR2s standards? and so with that gt is finaly starting to show its true colours, but it still has a long way to go.

Because someone brought Grid into it, talking about how much better it was than GT, and posted a video about how not exciting GT is.

Luke

 

[TorqueHappenS08]

Because someone brought Grid into it, talking about how much better it was than GT, and posted a video about how not exciting GT is.

Luke

yep, couldnt have said it better myself man:tup:

 

[m00ndancer]

GRID is an arcade racer okish in it's own right (If you like that kind of stuff)
I had the game for 4 days and returned it. GT5P is not even remotely comparable with GRID. The closest game to GRID is Flatout 2 on PC . Back to topic:

I agree with most of the post here that GT5P has the potential to be a sim, but have a long way to go before that. But I hope PD will make the game I still miss regardless of platform.

 

[Kryz11]

with that being said, based on experience with most of the top pc sims on the market, and a g25, i can say that gt is now more likely at live for speeds physics engine, witch is a huge feat:tup: and dare i say almost up to GTR2s standards? and so with that gt is finaly starting to show its true colours, but it still has a long way to go.

You are right, but at the same time I think is Neck to neck with PC sim racing. Sure it is missing, damage, day and night cycles, good online play, weather effects, and maybe more RAW camera and little detail like more smoke, tire marks, etc....
But the HANDLING characteristics are there. Feel of the cars are most important and should always be put first before what I mentioned on top in SIM RACER. I think GT5P suppresses GTR2 in handling terms, car responses/physics/feedback and with wheel feel (feedback). But that is my personal Opinion. And I bet GT5 has better TRACK layouts then GTR2, but currently I can not say anything until we have two of the same tracks and compare them.
But true and FINAL say can be said that GT5 is better then SIM racing is when FULL GT5 comes out with DAMAGE, good online, weather effects, day and night cycles, and good online features and play.

 

[lonestar420]

Unless you have raced professionaly with the cars in the game I dont see how anyone can make a judgement about what is realistic and what isnt.

 

[craste]

I've been playing iracing.com this evening and It is the most realistic driving game I've ever had a go on - PD need to take a big look at this game.

 

[dzidza]

I've been playing iracing.com this evening and It is the most realistic driving game I've ever had a go on - PD need to take a big look at this game.

And while you where playing i.racing did u play sport production cars or cars design for racing. there is a big difference. the physics model of gt5p is very good, challenging. of course it can be better, it always can be better and still ppl wouldn't be satisfied. it will happens with damage, there will still be punkters, and it is going to be frustrated, unless we have private lobbies.

 

[cmpinberkeley]

I've been playing iracing.com this evening and It is the most realistic driving game I've ever had a go on - PD need to take a big look at this game.

Yes, iracing.com looks fantastic. Physics look good, very good looking damage modeling, complete statistics of EVERY event/practice you do, tracks your indiscretions such as off-track excursions/spins/contact and USES the data, an impressive list of tracks already, and lastly, it appears to have a sustainable revenue stream to continue to pay for on-going developments.

Appears as though it may be a little expensive to play, but if the quality and functional features are what they appear to be, it might be worth the money! We'll see how it evolves and how good it really turns out to be...

I agree with your comment. Kaz says he doesn't pay attention to what the competition is doing, but iracing has many of the things we all want but are still waiting for in GT5P.

I've never done PC sims and GT5P is my first "sim", but if GT5P fails to deliver soon, then I will probably give iracing a go.


iracing FAQ: http://www.iracing.com/contact/faq.php?lc=4

 

[craste]

Appears as though it may be a little expensive to play, but if the quality and functional features are what they appear to be, it might be worth the money! We'll see how it evolves and how good it really turns out to be...

I agree with your comment. Kaz says he doesn't pay attention to what the competition is doing, but iracing has many of the things we all want but are still waiting for in GT5P.



iracing FAQ: http://www.iracing.com/contact/faq.php?lc=4

I don't mind paying a bit extra for somthing good which will constantly improve. I know its sad but last night I was playing iracing and was purposley skidding all over the place and then watching back the replays to see the skid marks left - they are great, especially when you do 360 spins - they fade in and out (darker/lighter) dependant on the amount of 'skid' in progress not just daft black skid lines - they have really analized it.

What was very intresting also is that when you change gear manually and you dont take your foot of the accelertor (auto clutch enabled as I have a DFP not a G25 wheel) the car lurches forward as it would in a real car if you didn't lift - GT5P should do this- but it just changes up as if you have lifted the throttle.

GT5P is the best looking game out of there (Car wise) if they get the 'feel' of the cars sorted then it will be great - at the moment it feels like the roads are to smooth - too perfect - wheres the imperfections i want to feel these through the force feedback.

 

[Matrixi]

Don't really see why you kikie got you got so offensive from my post, but I'll reply anyway (even though it's an ancient quote)!

That's what I do IRL. I take private lessons (for 5 years now), car control, defensive, offensive. My instructor is a real professional (brother of ex F3000 pilot Jeffrey Van Hooydonk). I took exams in two major auto training school and I passed both exams (practical => car control in all of it's aspects).

All I can say is, power to you man. Go show them F1 drivers you bad boy!

GT5p or pc sims are not truely realistic. They maybe come close but they are not realistic. If pc and console games had 100% realistic physics then all the cars in all the games/sims would handle exactly the same in every game but that is not the case. So all the games/sims on pc/console would use the same physics engine and they could concentrate on other aspects of the game (graphics, game play etc...).

How do you define "realism"? If not a single simulator is realistic for you, then what do you use as a preference? You have to compare real life to some simulator to say none of them are realistic.

These games still have to be fun to play. If they had true realistic handling, nobody would buy these games because there are too difficult to play

Wrong. I would buy such a "game" (or a simulator) and many others who seek for the most hardcore driving simulator would too. The definition of "fun" for me is as hardcore as it can get, not smoothed out and easied out for the mass public.

(racing cars, not simple stock cars like in GT5p). If real life racing car were as easy as in the games, with a true realistic physics engine, than everybody could become a Michael Shumacher! And I'm not even talking about the G-force, the high speeds, fear of crashing, I'm only talking about the car physics (in all of it's aspects e.g. tire physics, handling etc...).

I don't agree. You can't learn to drive as fast as real life drivers without g-forces acting around you, no matter how good the simulation is. Maybe I'm just having a hard time seeing your point here.

Then you're missing a lot of/very important information!

Duh. It's not like only thing I do in a sim is throw the car sideways and judge the entire simulation from that. It is only one of the direct and simplest things that shows how properly coded the physics engine and the tires are.

And you can?
You said it yourself that you use oversteer as a benchmark to see if a game has realistic handling. Then you say that real life race car drivers can't give enough information to make the physics in a game more realistic.

Sigh. And I can what? Feel the g-forces in a racing simulator? Not without a hydraulic platform such as Force Dynamics. Ever driven one of those? I have and I can tell they are VERY accurate to real life. It doesn't take high levels of IQ to understand that racing drivers who have all the feedback they need (visual, sounds, g-forces, smell etc.) are lacking a lot of that information when a game developer asks them to give feedback what to improve on a driving simulator by shoving them in front of a arcade 180 degree steering wheel and making them drive a few laps.

Unless the core of the sim is 100% perfect (which none of them are, and doubtfully will ever be) all the real life racing experts do are give wrong information how to change the sim. They simply do not have enough information on what is happening around them in the simulation world compared to what they are used to feeling in a real car. The case might be different, if the developer would make them sit in a Force Dynamics device with a proper 900 degree steering wheel. Isn't GTR1/2/RACE/RACE07 a perfect example of that? Most screwed up physics and tire grip levels a man has ever seen. How has real life racing drivers helped the creation of those sims exactly, you tell me?

So, what you are saying is that you are better than real life race car drivers?

Excuse me? Better at what? Race driving? Honestly doubt it. Helping at developing a driving simulator? Maybe? I don't recall claiming myself to be better than race drivers, no idea where the hell you pulled that from.

(your words exactly), (ingame I guess) but you know exactly when a game has realistic handling by just driving with a car and oversteer a bit.
I guess that all major game developers have to hire you!

I won't even bother replying to a poor troll comment.

Read my previous post again.

Eh? What for? You are the one who quoted my post! Weird.

That is what I have been saying all long. The physics engine can't be 100% realistic (with the present computer gaming technology) but it can come close.

You quote yourself and say that is what you have been saying all along? Oo-kay.

GRID is fun but it is no match for true hardcore sims or even GT5p IMO.

Clearly our definition of "fun" differs a lot. Arcade car games are never, ever fun for me. And never will be.

Again, I hardly see why you are being so offensive. My post wasn't directed to you, but you reply and quote my post with an offensive tone while all I do is try to make a point on the topic.

 

[minimal]

I haven't seen any PC games since ages, but even then GT was far ahad in terms of physics.

I had some hairy situations IRL, and I think GT comes really close. Of course, you can't simulate what you feel in a real car, but still...

And I find the damage issue really funny. PC sims punish you with much minor damage that what you would expect in a collision in real life. In other means, you wouldn't be able to drive further after most gaming collisions - and what's the point if it isn' realistic? If you have an accident in GT, your lap/race is ruined anyway for the most of the time, then why bother? I don't miss it all.

Anyway, when speaking about benchmark PC sim, which game is it actually?

Regarding tracks: it was really funny, but when I've vistied the 24 hours race at the Nürburgring, I've seen the same bumps on the track as in the game, that was stunning. Like that one before the hard left corner at Adenau, at the bridge (in fact, way before, just after the easy right if you know the circuit). )

 

[unimental]

I haven't seen any PC games since ages, but even then GT was far ahad in terms of physics.

The GT series has never been "far ahead" of PC sims in terms of physics. That's precisely what makes GT5P pro mode so special... it's a huge jump over the physics of previous GT offerings and is impressing many PC sim racers.

Anyway, when speaking about benchmark PC sim, which game is it actually?

Depends on who you ask, but iRacing, rFactor (with the right mods), Live For Speed and NetKar Pro are the cream of the crop at the moment.

 

[iam220]

I haven't seen any PC games since ages, but even then GT was far ahad in terms of physics.

GT1 came out around time of Grand Prix legends on PC, so no, it was not far ahead of in terms of physics, in fact it was always inferior.

And I find the damage issue really funny. PC sims punish you with much minor damage that what you would expect in a collision in real life. In other means, you wouldn't be able to drive further after most gaming collisions - and what's the point if it isn' realistic? If you have an accident in GT, your lap/race is ruined anyway for the most of the time, then why bother? I don't miss it all.

In gt5p your lap is not ruined if you bounce off the walls or use the rear end of an opponents car to slow down for a turn.

Anyway, when speaking about benchmark PC sim, which game is it actually?

iRacing, without a doubt. Everything else pales in comparison (Although netkar pro holds up quite decently). After playing that, I just can't go back to any other sim and that seems to be the general consensus from the iRacing community.

Kaz is being way too arrogant if he's ignoring the competition, because as of now, the competition has him beat. By a large margin too.

 

[RSection8]

I haven't played any games on my pc in years. Got a ps3 for Xmas and gt5p with the g25. I've been playing the hell outta it. I thought it was the most realistic simulator i played.

I stumbled on this thread and thought I'd give LFS a chance since it's a free demo d/l. I've been playing it for about 4 hours now. As for as car physics go GT5p doesn't have anything over LFS. The cars feel awesome I couldn't believe how real it is. If you want a fast lap, you have to hit every corner perfect. It's pretty cool. And I love the feel of the force feedback. I thought gt5p was awesome but LFS is up another level.

I'm not really sure if I want gt5p to be that realistic or not. I think a part of me does, and a part of me doesn't. I'm just glad I d/led LFS.

 

[panjandrum]

OK all, give me some advice:

I've looked into PC sims quite a bit, but found that, even compared to GT4, none of them really had the right combination of factors. I'm looking into them again now because I'm still extremely unhappy with GT5P after the August update. I simply find that the cars are now too easy to drive, and too similar in feel. Please understand that a lot of my enjoyment of GT4 came from experiencing, to some degree, what the real car would have been like. This was especially true of the tricky or unusual cars, which I took real pleasure in mastering. I don't want to start arguing this here, there is a thread for that, but I do want to point out why I'm again looking for alternatives to the GT series.

In most of the PC sims, there simply isn't a huge array of truly modeled cars like there is in the GT series. I've mentioned this elsewhere, but I'll put it here also to see if anyone can suggest a current PC racing SIM which meets these requirements:

1) Fairly realistic physics. Doesn't have to be the "king of physics", but must be reasonably true to life.

2) A huge number of real car models, current and past, accurately modeled. Specifically I look for interesting sports cars and super cars. I'm not really much interested in racing cars except for a few odd machines like the old Lancia Stratos rally car.

3) Large selection of real tracks, accurately modeled, and with considerable variety (not just a rally sim, for example). Fantasy tracks are fine also, but it is the real tracks I'm most interested in. Absolutely must include Nurburgring, period.

4) Good force-feedback system. It is no good to me if the physics are real if I can't feel it. Obviously I'm a wheel user.

4) Excellent graphics. Sorry, but I don't have interest in something which meets all the other criteria but has outdated graphics.

So far, I just can't find a PC sim which meets these criteria. Some of them meet one or two very well but then fails completely otherwise. A lot of people praise the Live for Speed physics, but I tried that and it is just a big nothing for me. Hardly any tracks, close to zero real cars, and even the graphics didn't impress me at all. rFactor has many of the same problems as far as I can tell.

What am I missing here guys (and gals)? Where should I look for a PC sim which is anywhere near as complete as the GT series?

Thanks!

 

[unimental]

OK all, give me some advice:

...

What am I missing here guys (and gals)? Where should I look for a PC sim which is anywhere near as complete as the GT series?

To put it simply, you won't find a PC sim which meets your criteria. PC devs and publishers don't have the bankroll or revenue stream to provide a ton of well modeled production cars like the GT series does.

However, for physics, graphics and accurate tracks, GTR Evo (due any day now, and includes all RACE 07 content) is probably your best bet. Combine that with GT Legends for two solid titles which have a great selection of old and new touring/GT cars and tracks without having to go hunting for great mods. They won't hit every point on your list, but the combo comes close right out of the box.

 

[El Drifto]

rFactor has tons of mods and content to keep you busy for years.

I love how cars sound so raw and dirty in rFactor.
GT5 is too clean and polished.

 

[El Drifto]

Double post

 

[iam220]

OK all, give me some advice:
...
Thanks!

Hrm, that's a tall order. Like the poster above me mentioned GTR evolution might be your best bet. I haven't played it, but because It's based on the ISI engine I can safely assume that the physics and graphics are not exactly top notch .. but they may work for you. I don't think that game includes any stock road cars so that might not be your thing. You should probably give rfactor another whirl, the realFeel plugin and the histroyX mod are a must for that game. You can find more mods @ rfactorcentral.com. Although you'll have to have the full registered version before you can install any of those. The original contents of that game is crap.

It's weird, cause I rarely come across a sim lover who places more importance on graphics and the existence of "real cars" over physics. Maybe you're new to the scene? It's too bad because if you can get over those factors you'd really enjoy LFS. It might not have much "real life cars" but all cars are modeled after their real life counterpart. So does it really matter that the "FZ50" is not called a "porche 911" if it drives like one?

But given your current criteria, I'd say your best match is ....... GT5P

 

[JAGUAR1977]

This is how I see it (don't take it too seriously):-

All PC sim racers believe they, and their sims, are superior to console sims.

rfactor racers believe 'their' sim is superior to GTR2, and vice versa.

Both believe 'their' sim is superior to Race 07 and GTR Evolution.

LFS users believe that sim is better than all of the above.

And finally, iRacing users now believe that sim is superior to everything, even a match for the real thing!

In reality, or should I say in my experience, I don't see a great deal of difference between all of them, physics wise. (I haven't played iRacing yet, so can't comment on that).

If GT5'P's cars were in an rfactor mod, I've no doubt they'd be Hall of Famers, and fit into that sim with ease.

As a total, intergrated, package, I don't believe GT5P, and especially GT5, will be beaten. Even if the physics end up being 5%-10% off what others consider to be 'real' (which can be a very personal issue, many PC sim racers consider X PC sim to be unrealistic, when in actuality it's personal preference, or being used to a particular type of car), the selection and quality of cars, tracks and features will be so overwhelming, it will have to go to the top of your sim list.

I'm in this to drive real cars on real tracks, plenty of them, I play sims because I want that dream car experience. I can drive my road car around town all day long if all I want is a 100% 'real' experience, an experience no sim, PC or console, can match.

 

[JosVerstappen]

iracers should believe that their sim is superior cause theire paying **** loads of money for it

 

[iam220]

Jag, you see it that way because that's the way it is!

Currently from the mentioned sims:

iRacing >>>> LFS >> Rafctor > GTR2/RACE.

Of course they're going to feel similar, that is because they're all trying simulate the same model. One that is parallel to the physics that surround us. As expected, some do a better job of this then others and while personal taste is a factor it goes beyond that. 5-10% makes all the difference.

Now, I'm sorry but it's becoming a pet peeve of mine when people say "oh if I want a real life sim I'll just drive my car! hur hur hur"; I don't know about you but I think it's extremely stupid and dangerous to be driving your road car around town near its limits. While driving it from point a to point b in accordance to traffic laws is boring. The only other alternative is track days, but unfortunately , at this point in my life in not I'm the financial situation to be able to afford that. Which is why to me, the most important aspect by far are the physics. If I was to choose between a sim with 200 cars at 85% accuracy and one with 5 cars at 95% accuracy; I'd choose the later. So for that reason i'd be hesitant to put GT5P at the top of my sim list.

We play sims for different reasons, you say you play them for the "dream car experience" and I play them to shave off a tenth of a second from my personal best lap time, don't really care that much what car I'm doing it with. Different strokes for different folks I guess.

If the GT5'P's cars were in an rfactor mod, I've not doubt they'd be Hall of Famers, and would fit into that sim with ease.

Agreed! I think GT5P has better physics then rfactor anyways

JosVerstappen: You got me there!

 

[NLxAROSA]

This is how I see it (don't take it too seriously):-

All PC sim racers believe they, and their sims, are superior to console sims.

rfactor racers believe 'their' sim is superior to GTR2, and vice versa.

Both believe 'their' sim is superior to Race 07 and GTR Evolution.

LFS users believe that sim is better than all of the above.

And finally, iRacing users now believe that sim is superior everything, even a match for the real thing!

Not too serious answer: you can add to that list: GT5P racers believe 'their' sim is superior to all of the above. Which ofcourse, we all know, it is!

 

[JAGUAR1977]

Jag, you see it that way because that's the way it is!

Currently from the mentioned sims:

iRacing >>>> LFS >> Rafctor > GTR2/RACE.

Of course they're going to feel similar, that is because they're all trying simulate the same model. One that is parallel to the physics that surround us. As expected, some do a better job of this then others and while personal taste is a factor it goes beyond that. 5-10% makes all the difference.

Now, I'm sorry but it's becoming a pet peeve of mine when people say "oh if I want a real life sim I'll just drive my car! hur hur hur"; I don't know about you but I think it's extremely stupid and dangerous to be driving your road car around town near its limits. While driving it from point a to point b in accordance to traffic laws is boring. The only other alternative is track days, but unfortunately , at this point in my life in not I'm the financial situation to be able to afford that. Which is why to me, the most important aspect by far are the physics. If I was to choose between a sim with 200 cars at 85% accuracy and one with 5 cars at 95% accuracy; I'd choose the later. So for that reason i'd be hesitant to put GT5P at the top of my sim list.

We play sims for different reasons, you say you play them for the "dream car experience" and I play them to shave off a tenth of a second from my personal best lap time, don't really care that much what car I'm doing it with. Different strokes for different folks I guess.



Agreed! I think GT5P has better physics then rfactor anyways

JosVerstappen: You got me there!

You can argue all day long about physics, it was always assumed some sims had too much grip, then along came some RL drivers and state there's too little. I can only comment on the Evo 8/9, and to me that feels spot on.

 

[Kryz11]

You decide...


I go with GT5P with SIM aspect. not because of SHINY Graphics.