1970's vintage Cup

[ManiacRS]

Bit of History

Before 1982 the Federation International de l'Automobile (F.I.A), had devided divided the various racing cars into 6 main categories, Groups 1 to 6.

Groups 1, 2 and 4 were the ones that were most famous because they included cars that were eligible for rally racing and touring car racing. The most famous types of racing for production based cars...

Famous Gr.2 cars you might have heard of were the Ford Escort Mk.I RS1600, Lotus Cortina, Talbot Sunbeam and the original 10valve Audi Quattro ...

Famous Gr.4 cars include monsters like the Lancia Stratos, a limited production Ford Escort RS2000 (for homologation purposes), the Renault 5 Turbo and others...

After 1982 Gr.1 and 2 was replaced by Gr. N and A and Gr.4 was replaced by Gr. B!!! Groups 5 and 6 were also incorporated into the Group B regulations.

Race series

So what I am proposing here is a race series with cars from the '70s... There are cars in GT5 that some of you have been dreaming since you were children... Either you or your father that is... Anyway...

I think it will make for some excellent racing. And where do the various groups, I've been talking about, fit in; you might ask...

Since we can't have multiclass racing in GT5 (too few spots in the server), we will do it like this.

Cars that were eligible for Gr.2 will be able to have the upgrades allowed by Gr.2, while Gr.4 cars will have to be closer to stock.

In detail,

Gr.2 Cars allowed upgrades:

1. Racing air filter
2. Full exhaust except for the exhaust manifold which will remain stock.
3. Sports ECU (which is the closest we can get to larger carburators)
4. Engine Stage 1
5. Fully customizable transmission
6. Full Drivetrain
7. Any suspension you like()
8. Rigidity reinforcement

No weight reduction, of any form, allowed and no aerodynamics... of course...

Note 1: You are allowed to use ballast to improve the weight distribution if you are prepared to carry the extra weight.
Note 2: You can opt to drive a car with less upgrades if you want.

Gr.4 Cars allowed upgrades:

1. Fully customizable transmission
2. Full Drivetrain
3. Any suspension you like

No weight reduction, of any form, allowed and no aerodynamics...
Also, no rigidity reinforcements allowed

Note 1: You are allowed to use ballast to improve the weight distribution if you are prepared to carry the extra weight.
Note 2: You can opt to drive a car with less upgrades if you want.

Race format:
1. Races will be approximately 45 minutes. The number of laps will be chosen accordingly.
2. Cut track regulations will be inforced by the game unless otherwise stated before the race, in the race thread...
3. Standing starts with false start check
4. Penalty: light
5. Damage set to heavy
6. Tyres: Comfort Soft or worse.
7. Race start: Sundays 18:00 GMT

Incident reports:
Any incident reports will be reported to me and decision will be made by the race stewards. Race stewards will be me, Hemi426ka and A_Novi. If Hemi and Novi can't make the series two different stewards,from the participants, will be appointed by me.

Series schedule:
The series schedule is not yet decided but will include tracks that resemble tarmac rally stages and old racetracks (were possible).

For example:

Nuerburgring Nordschleife 24hour layout,
Eiger Short (maybe reverse),
my Mt. Aso track,
Laguna Seca,
Tsukuba and so on

Note: Race scheduled explained in post #30

Registering your interest:

To register your interest just post in this thread with your PSN ID.

You don't need to state the car you'll drive because you will be allowed to change car for every race. We're doing this for the fun of driving these demanding classic cars, not to simulate a professional championship.

P.S. If you don't know in which category your favourite car is, they are divided like this:

Gr.2 cars: Over 1,000 examples sold
Gr.4 cars: Over 500 examples sold
Note: Cars with less than 500 examples sold, like the KPGC110 Skyline GT-R, will not be allowed.

The race stewards reserve the right to impose restrictions to balance the cars' performance, if deemed necessary.

Restrictions list:


1.The 2002 Turbo has over 1,000 units sold but will be restricted to Gr.4 regulations plus racing air filter and sports exhaust!!!
2. The Mazda Cosmo Sport (110S) L10A '67 will be allowed in Gr.2. The L10B will not be allowed
3. The Mini Marcos will be allowed in Gr.2
4. The Alpine A110S will be restricted to Gr.4 regulations
5. The Alpine A310VE will be restricted to Gr.4 regulations
6. The Nissan (Datsun) 280Z-L will not be allowed
7. The FIAT 500 will be allowed with all upgrades available, except turbocharging
8. The Lotus Europa is eligible for Gr.2 but will only have titanium racing exhaust from the exhaust upgrades and only sports ECU from the engine upgrades
9. The Nissan (Datsun) 240ZG has over 1,000 units sold but will be restricted to Gr.4 regulations plus racing air filter and sports exhaust!!!
10. The Nissan Skyline 2000GT-R (KPGC10) is eligible for Gr.2 but will only have titanium racing exhaust from the exhaust upgrades and only sports ECU from the engine upgrades


Musclecars will not be allowed to keep the grid balanced.

 

[ManiacRS]

Registration list: 12 spots available

1. ManiacArchon {Race Steward}
2. Hemi426ka {Race Steward}
3. A_Novi {Race Steward}
4. Skulus
5. Makiskan
6. cc570
7. GTP_hessi
8. karim talgo
9. tfed

P.S. Sorry for the double post, but the OP is already long enough for the information to be easily understood.

 

[JLawrence]

How are you going to be able to regulate the restrictions you have designated?
And why such low level tires? I race a 63 Triumph Spitfire on Hoosier Vintage TD tires (which are period correct) and they equate to the racing hard compound. Is it just for the extra challenge of it?

 

[ManiacRS]

Yes it is for the extra challenge and to provide the least powerful cars with advantage of tyre wear. With such low HP outputs, slicks would mean that the stronger engine would always win...

Still, you should consider that the tyres the game considers comfort soft are pretty high performance for these cars.

The Bridgestone Potenza S01 for example are considered Comfort soft, since the cars that had them on as OEM can be purchased with comfort soft. And this tyre has double compound rubber, CAD designed tread and so on... Pretty high tech as far as tyres go. And don't forget that in rallying, for the last few years and even today, tyres have to have a percentage of the tread with a pattern. And the game has the rally cars as wearing Sports Medium tyres...

As for the regulations, there will be random PP checks. I have all the eligible cars so I can find out their PP after the modifications.

But as in every race series in GT5 there are holes in the regulations that can be exploited. It is down to the indvidual to adhere to them. Finally... You'd be surprised how many things you can find out by watching the car go round the track...!

 

[JLawrence]

You'd be surprised, we run 440Pp on RH tires in the Vintage Sports Car Series, and the fastest two cars thus far have been the BMW2002 and the Nissan 240z which both have a lot less power than the Camaro, GT350, Jag, and even the Stratos.

But regardless, this sounds pretty fun. What time is 1800 GMT as opposed to EST?

 

[426kahemi]

Great idea m8!
I confirm my participation to Gr.4 with BMW 2002 Turbo.
And I look forward to great racing

 

[ManiacRS]

I look forward to racing with you too m8... We seem to have epic battles every time we race... Hemi426ka confirmed!

JLawrence, you need to take 5 hours out of the GMT time to get EST. So 13:00. The series will probably start on the 21th of August if we get more than 8 people. And I estimate that the cars here will be 390-410PP. But the Comfort Soft tyre means that extra HP will not be the easy solution... The torque of the 2002 becomes a problem if you let your guard down... The 240Z is excellent for this series actually...

Should I reserve a spot for you, Sir?

P.S. Pics of a test we did for this series:

These are from my battle with Skulus, both racing the Alpine A110S, built to spec as mentioned in the OP.

 

[CrystalSpeed]

I confirm my participation to Gr.4 with Lancia Stratos

 

[ID_racing]

This is a great idea, on which date do you think that the first races will be held?

 

[asdfg11]

Hello, what sort of weight, pp, hp are these cars generally ? I am interested but not sure on car choice.

 

[JLawrence]

The timing doesn't work out for me if it's going to be on Sundays

 

[ManiacRS]

This is a great idea, on which date do you think that the first races will be held?

The races will start on 21st of August. Which is the weekend after this one...

Should I add you to the brave racers of this series?

Hello, what sort of weight, pp, hp are these cars generally ? I am interested but not sure on car choice.

Asdfg, I have done quite a few test and with these regulations the cars are pretty close to each other... For example, I have my best laptimes with the Stratos (416PP). And by a long margin too. But over 45min of racing a lot of mistakes creep in and tyre wear is significant. Also, we might get 1 or 2 wet races, or a few wet laps in a race... Can you imagine the Stratos in a wet track... Interesting, isn't it?

The PP is between 390 and 420 which is a big difference. But the cars are really equal over the race distance. Another example is the Mini marcos. When you tune it to the specs mentioned in the OP it goes up to 430PP. Which is the highest. But it's FF, so it'll suffer at the starts and it only gets 110bhp (completely run in). That's 80 less than the 2002, Stratos and so on... So in the straights, it will fall back, and in the corners it will understeer...

As for the weight, each car must be at it's stock weight...

And finally, we will not have a fixed car choice. You'll be able to change your car after every race... Well, Hemi won't... But you will... So you get to drive all the great cars in this series. I've already built 4 cars to spec for me. There are a few cars with restrictions in the upgrades you can put on, check the end of the OP for them...

The timing doesn't work out for me if it's going to be on Sundays

Yeah but, my schedule doesn't work if it's going to be on any other day... Still, do drop in if you can sometime.

Latest News:

First race will be in the Nuerburgring Nordschleife 24h.

Date & Time: August 21st 18:00GMT
Race length: 4laps
Time progression: 30 (so we get a full day of racing)
Weather changeable!!!

Personal Comment:

These cars have a lot of vices, due to the variety in weight distributions and suspension solutions... You need to know how to treat them to get the most out of them... I am convinced that in this series the best driver will win. And it will be really hotly contested, as it's shapping up!!!

So come on... The more the merrier!!!

Robin Hood's Merry men

Who put that link there??? Why, you little...

 

[ID_racing]

The races will start on 21st of August. Which is the weekend after this one...

Should I add you to the brave racers of this series?

I'm booked for races 21/8 and 28/8, if I wasnt Id join in..

 

[JLawrence]

Wasn't asking you to change it bro, just a statement. I would enjoy running this series, but I couldn't make any kinda commitment to be there regularly.

 

[CC570]

I am interested in taking part in this series.

 

[ManiacRS]

I am interested in taking part in this series.

OK, CC570, name registered!

 

[hessi]

I'm definitely interested, but won't be able to make the 21st. All Sundays after that are ok though, so in case you guys don't mind I'd join you from the second race onwards:

GTP_hessi

 

[ManiacRS]

NP m8... You can join then...

There will probably be 6 races, so plenty of chances to go sideways are still available...

Name registered!

 

[CC570]

Are cars from the 60's allowed as long as they meet homogulation requirements?
Specifically I am looking at the Isuzu Bellet and the Nissan Fairlady (sr311).

 

[ManiacRS]

I'd rather we kept it from the '70s only... The Mazda Cosmo sport is from the late '60s but I've allowed it so we can have a rotary engined car in the mix...

Besides, the Isuzu and the Fairlady are both great cars to drive, especially with these add ons, but will never compete with the Alpine, 2002 and 240ZG... I don't hink they will even compete with the Celica... And also there are similar cars to chose from, so...

And given the opportunity, let me say that the series will start this Sunday!!!

I had said that we'll do it if we get 8 people registered, but we have 7 and it's close enough. Also, I really want to race these cars like that!!!

So, get practicing people!!! On Sunday, the show gets on the road!!!!

 

[hessi]

So, get practicing people!!! On Sunday, the show gets on the road!!!!

Practicing? Since when do we need practice? And what do we practice for? Did you decide on a track yet?

I've not decided on a car yet, but have 4 favourites that I hope to drive at some point - can any car be used by more than one player during a race?

btw, changed my schedule, this Sunday is ok for me. Although I might have quite a hangover... ;-)

 

[ManiacRS]

If you look up the thread, I said a few posts before that the first race will be 4 laps of the Nuerburgring 24h layout with changeable weather and time progression set so we can have a full day-night cycle!!! (post 12)

I have also frequently said that, any driver can drive any car and can change from race to race. So if you think a car is better suited to a track, or you have multiple favourite cars, go ahead and drive them!!!

Since the info might be lost in the length of some of my posts, I will say it again.

Race info:


Date: August 21st 2011
Race start: 18:00 GMT
Room Open: 16:30GMT
Track: Nuerburgring 24h
Race length: 4 laps
Weather: Changeable
Time progression: 30
Penalty: Weak
Damage: Heavy
Tyres: Comfort Soft

Please make sure the car you drive has not got any special restrictions, and if so adhere to these regulations. The restrictions are mentioned in the last few lines of the OP!!! They are designed to make racing closer. Also I can, if I think I have to or am requested to do so, check whether your car is built to spec, for almost all of these regulations...

The point here is to have as much fun as possible!!!

 

[CC570]

I'd rather we kept it from the '70s only... The Mazda Cosmo sport is from the late '60s but I've allowed it so we can have a rotary engined car in the mix...

sigh. . . okay.

Besides, the Isuzu and the Fairlady are both great cars to drive, especially with these add ons, but will never compete with the Alpine, 2002 and 240ZG...

Disagree, maybe another race .

 

[CC570]

Will the race be held in a private lounge or public lobby? If the former can the host(s) send friend requests please.

 

[ManiacRS]

The race will be held in an open lobby room so I can monitor the number of participants. The rules are very particular here so we can't have people just dropping by...

 

[asdfg11]

Enjoy your race today I look forward to seeing the results.

 

[hessi]

Okay... this is going to be interesting.

Just took the 110 out for a spin, night time, raining. Somehow managed to avoid beating the car up too badly and ended up crossing the line after 14:30. I'll reckon I'll just let you pass at the start line and race myself and the damages I'll inflict upon my car. I despise night races, can't stand rain and suck with the online physics...

 

[ManiacRS]

Room was up at 16:30 GMT, but I experienced some technical difficulties. I restarted the game and the room should be up in a few minutes again. Drop in for some pre race practice.

And Hessi, it's very unlikely that we will have rain, but that laptime is very respectable if we do...

P.S.

Room Open.

Room Name: GTP 1970s Vintage Cup

Room Number: 1472 - 6118 - 3658 - 4759 - 5588

 

[hessi]

Room was up at 16:30 GMT

"was up"? Mate, you're at GMT+1 at the moment, it's 16:21 GMT at the time I'm writing this.... better hurry up then... ;-)

 

[ManiacRS]

OK, first race is behind us... I think we all had good fun, and Hemi got a well deserved victory!!!

Please let me update you guys on the season schedule (and sorry for the delay):

Race 2: Laguna Seca
Race 3: Tsukuba
Race 4: Mt. St. Fridays (my track from the track editor, made in the Mt. Aso Tarmac template).

Races will be aproximmately 45 minute long. Give or take a few minutes.

For the last 2 races I will put up a poll and you guys can choose from 4 tracks...

P.S. Poll up. Madrid is the same one as the one in the seasonal recently...