997 GT2 Vs. 430 Scuderia

[McLaren]

We've been discussing this for a while on UCP with a lot of good debates going on, so now I'd like to see where GTP stands between these 2 fierce competitors.

First up is the Porsche, a $200,000, 530Hp machine capable of lapping the 'Ring just as fast as the Carrera GT.

2nd, is the Ferrari. This 503Bhp has already lapped Fiorano less than 1 second slower than the monster Enzo. MSRP is est. around $260,000.

What makes these cars perfect competitors is the simple fact that not only have Porsche & Ferrari engineered 2 cars to match the times of their previous 612/660Hp flagships with only 503/530Hp, but that both cars are built for the track. Each car has shown once again, the power of handling & braking technology over raw horsepower, and will make for interesting comparison on various tracks.

*Note: This comparison is not about what is or isn't a track car. This comparison is also only about the GT2 & 430. It does & should not include the GT-R, Z06, 911 Turbo, etc.

 

[exigeracer]

The fact that Ferrari is such an arrogant, egotistical company, especially regarding the 430, I would sway from the Italian car. Then again, potentially buying the lesser car just because of the moral values of the company backing these machines would be a stupid move.

The last GT2 was one of the scariest cars of recent memory, and this one looks to pack the same punch. I would feel very scared driving something with that kind of reputation. Such raw power going through two of the wheels seems like a recipe for disaster, especially considering the dynamics of the 911 regarding oversteer and forgiveness in messier situations. I would be forced to drive it 8 tenths, even in optimal conditions. Why would you want to always have that little chip in your confidence, especially with ridiculous speed, money and safety involved?

I think Ferrari finally nailed the 430's looks on the head with the Scuderia, and the car, from what I've read, seems to be so perfectly balanced and responsive in every aspect. There seems to be so little wrong with it. Sure, to feel the most of the driver and car relationship, you have to turn off the aids, but those are there for a reason. Even I, a purist who wants nothing between my foot, fingers and ass and the road, would gladly use these aids in most driving situations.

That said, the Porshce is still a redonculously good car. The looks especially, with almost all 997s becoming more and more fussy in the design department, the GT2 looks outstanding, clearly the msot seductive 911 of the range. I just feel that if I were to have a Porsche of that calibre, it is far easier to strip out these things into motorsport-specific beasts as it is.

I've witnessed some really good F430 track action, they are definitely cars I could be comfortable in.

 

[Tornado]

I've read that not only has the changes to the Scuderia made it exponentially faster on the track, but have also managed to make it even better as a day to day piece. I still am not a fan of the F430 (though it is the least offensive of the current Ferraris) but this particular model has swayed me a bit. Color me impressed.

 

[Omnis]

Got interior pics?

 

[Keef]

Got interior pics?

I vote Porsche. Ferrari is far to stuck up and reliant on technology. Porsche is forced to engineer the actual car, rather than the computer. Having the engine in the rear instantly puts Porsche at a disadvantage, and yet they're still among the best sports cars on the planet.

 

[McLaren]

Got interior pics?

430 Scuderia

997 GT2

The fact that Ferrari is such an arrogant, egotistical company, especially regarding the 430, I would sway from the Italian car. Then again, potentially buying the lesser car just because of the moral values of the company backing these machines would be a stupid move.

The last GT2 was one of the scariest cars of recent memory, and this one looks to pack the same punch. I would feel very scared driving something with that kind of reputation. Such raw power going through two of the wheels seems like a recipe for disaster, especially considering the dynamics of the 911 regarding oversteer and forgiveness in messier situations. I would be forced to drive it 8 tenths, even in optimal conditions. Why would you want to always have that little chip in your confidence, especially with ridiculous speed, money and safety involved?

I think Ferrari finally nailed the 430's looks on the head with the Scuderia, and the car, from what I've read, seems to be so perfectly balanced and responsive in every aspect. There seems to be so little wrong with it. Sure, to feel the most of the driver and car relationship, you have to turn off the aids, but those are there for a reason. Even I, a purist who wants nothing between my foot, fingers and ass and the road, would gladly use these aids in most driving situations.

That said, the Porshce is still a redonculously good car. The looks especially, with almost all 997s becoming more and more fussy in the design department, the GT2 looks outstanding, clearly the msot seductive 911 of the range. I just feel that if I were to have a Porsche of that calibre, it is far easier to strip out these things into motorsport-specific beasts as it is.

I've witnessed some really good F430 track action, they are definitely cars I could be comfortable in.

Walter R. had this to say.

Well, doubt no more. Our friends over at Auto Motor & Sport Sweden recently interviewed Porsche test driver and rally god Walter Röhrl, who discusses his experience with the new supercar. He claims he has done the Nordschleife in an incredible 7:31m, even faster than the factory figure we provided. Röhrl also goes on to say the GT2 is so fast that even he’s sometimes scared of its power and that despite being RWD only (the Turbo is AWD) it’s still able to put down all of its 530hp effectively.

 

[ferrari_chris]

I'm going with the Ferrari on this one.

From everything, I've heard, seen and read, the 430 is a brilliant car. A spectacular car. I've not heard the same great praises draped on the GT2. It's a good car, for sure. And very powerful. But it's not the excellent car that the 430 has been reported to be.

So for that reason, I think the 430 is the better car.

 

[Omnis]

I'll take the Ferrari.

 

[TS]

I'm taking the Porsche.

While they both seem to be amazing performance cars, the 430 may be a little over the top with all the suspension/gearbox adjust ability and all the other performance oriented doodads. The Porsche, however, appears to be a little more civilized for city/highway driving. (which most owners would most of the time) But it's still capable of beating most anything that you see at track days.

 

[Keef]

I think all that adjustability is dumb. It's never going to get used. An owner is simply going to find a setting he likes and stick with it. He might put it on the stiff setting for the 3 track days he attends each year. Nobody asked the question, but Ferrari answered it anyway. Now the car is overly complex, and Ferrari bragging about all this technology is getting old. Who cares if you have it; nobody uses it!

 

[Kent]

Scuderia Hands down.
First off, just in response to the first post... I've heard the Scuderia matched the Enzo at Fiorano and a recent video by "Tiff" from 5th Gear showed him match his own Fiorano Enzo time in the Scuderia. That doesn't matter much because at this point in the game, I'd be more worried about aspects other than performance, I mean they are both incredible! (GT2 and Scuderia)

I think the interior of the Scuderia is much better in both style and substance. Maybe the GT2 pic's display system isn't my style but based on the interior shots and video footage, I'd say the 430 wins. 👍

Then consider the amazingly well refined (what?) Mattatino (sp?) system in the Scuderia and you've got a great everyday car without the quirks of 530hp sitting behind the rear axle. So in that spot I'd say the Ferrari again.

The only place I'd say Porsche is in relation to the paint on the Scuderia.
Literally (and this may seem crazy), if the Scuderia is not availible without the strips down the middle of the hood and roof, I'd have to say the GT2 wins on it's classic good looks (even if they are characteristic of porsche). A solid paint job goes a long way. So count one for the GT2.

All in all, that's 2 to 1, Ferrari over Porsche.
I'd take the Scuderia.

 

[JCE]

Porsche, because I hate Ferrari and "Scuderia" sounds like some disease you catch from a prostitute.

 

[Revheadnz]

I voted for the Scuderia.

The Ferrari in a heartbeat, without any hesitation. From various automotive reviewers the general consensus is that the Ferrari is wonderful car which manages to improve in many ways over your everyday "garden variety" Ferrari 430.
Whereas the Porsche GT2, while a spectacular and invigorating experience when taken in isolation, is supposed to pale in comparison to the Scuderia.

And to look at, oh my. The Ferrari is a Ferrari, enough said. The 430 may not be the best looking Ferrari ever built but the Scuderia looks hot inside and out. I'm not sure if I'd have a red one, maybe yellow or black.

I'm not a fan of the 911 GT2 in terms of looks, not the exterior or the interior pic which *McLaren* posted. The interior looks uninteresting next to Scuderia. The flares and big spoilers which the GT2 has affixed to it muscle it up but I'm not too much of a fan, I prefer the styling of a standard Carrera or a Turbo.

 

[exigeracer]

Röhrl also goes on to say the GT2 is so fast that even he’s sometimes scared of its power

If someone who managed to tame one of these:

says that the car is scary, I'm willing to bet it would be quite pant-****tingly scary with anyone else behind the wheel.

 

[SagarisGTB]

Porsche, because I hate Ferrari and "Scuderia" sounds like some disease you catch from a prostitute.

Umm, scuderia simply means "stable" in italiano.

Oh, I voted Ferrari. Its no contest between a machine of pashion and a psycho-beetle.

 

[McLaren]

I think all that adjustability is dumb. It's never going to get used. An owner is simply going to find a setting he likes and stick with it. He might put it on the stiff setting for the 3 track days he attends each year. Nobody asked the question, but Ferrari answered it anyway. Now the car is overly complex, and Ferrari bragging about all this technology is getting old. Who cares if you have it; nobody uses it!

This is bit of a silly argument Keef. I can say the samething for any car like 430 Scuderia such as, "Why bother building a car like the GT2 or 430 if 70% of them won't even see the track?"

They add all that technology in it so the owner can find what suits him. Sure, not every owner will use different settings, but not every owner will use the SAME setting as everyone else.

 

[YSSMAN]

Personally speaking, this would be a very difficult decision for me. Porsche as a brand has always built my favorite sports cars second only to the Corvette, and similarly, Ferrari is without a doubt the greatest sportscar company in the world... Bar-None. This being said, cars that perform this similarly, both appealing to my differing opinions of performance, really makes everything seem that much more difficult.

The 911 GT2

Building off my much-loved GT3, the GT2 is what I love most about cars; Scarier than hell to drive, happy to kill you if given the opportunity. Its "bat-f'in-S" crazy, and yet, can be quite civil with all of the modern bits and pieces packed in to make you feel at home with other luxury sports cars. I still love the 911 in all of its forms, second only to the Corvette in all cases, so obviously the GT2 starts with a leg-up. I like the look of the car; Menacing, yet certainly subdued enough where it would take a keen eye to spot it from a distance. But the thing is, it just seems "soft" by comparison to the Ferrari. It just feels big, even when you look at it, seeming heavy and un-natural. I can't imagine it being particularly easy to drive either, particularly a 8/10s+ on a track (God forbid public roads...).

The Ferrari F430 Scuderia

As noted before, Ferrari (in my book) is THE company that builds sportscars on the global perspective. Generally speaking, Ferrari does it first, and everyone else is just playing catch-up. With the Scuderia however, it isn't necessarily that. Instead, they refine, rebuild, and tune the car into something that is truly spectacular; Lighter, more powerful, and certainly faster than any before. I love the look, and more importantly the sound of the Scuderia, and those alone are almost worth the entry price. And then you look at the sticker. An extra $60K for a car that isn't any faster than the Porsche? That, and only cocks drive them?

===

The Decision

In the end, I'm going to have to take the Porsche for much the same reason that Clarkson would have a C63:

IT. WILL. KILL. YOU. SOMETIME.

You only feel alive when you are close to death, and with the GT2, that should happen quite often...

 

[JCE]

Umm, scuderia simply means "stable" in italiano.

I was being a smartass.

 

[neanderthal]

porsche

who has more race wins? who has more pedigree?

not 1960s stuff, last ten years stuff. last 5 years stuff. who is really developing racing stuff for thier products stuff. who is making advancements in that field stuff.

ferraris may have phenomenal performance. but they seem frail and brittle to me. porsches are far more "worldy" and "tested." much more hardy and less prone to breaking down with everyday use. that means repeated laps at the 'ring without major repairs.
just my opinion.

a single flying lap, perhaps the ferrari. a whole season, definitely porsche.

 

[Turbo Lag]

Ferrari. I just like it more honestly, just the car. Nothing wrong with the Porsche though.

 

[Muzaffar]

The Decision

In the end, I'm going to have to take the Porsche for much the same reason that Clarkson would have a C63:

IT. WILL. KILL. YOU. SOMETIME.

You only feel alive when you are close to death, and with the GT2, that should happen quite often...

My thoughts exactly. I would vote for the GT2 because of that. Having raw power at the back wheel and having to control the car from spinning out. Only pure driving enthusiast would be looking forward to be driving this car. The Scuderia F430 is not to say a bad car, its just that, as Jeremy Clarkson would say "Ferrari nowadays build their cars with maths and science, and has been winning ever since". I mean Ferrari just builds complicated things such as traction control, launch control, F1 gearbox with paddle shifter and such just to make the car more exciting. However, Ferrari just totally miss the point of making the car with the "Italian flare and passion" that they used to back in the day. The GT2 is just plain and simple, but more powerful and cheaper than the Scuderia F430 as well. 👍

 

[McLaren]

porsche

who has more race wins? who has more pedigree?

not 1960s stuff, last ten years stuff. last 5 years stuff. who is really developing racing stuff for thier products stuff. who is making advancements in that field stuff.

Can't this go either way? Ferrari's success in Formula 1, while Porsche's success lies in ALMS (although another team is switching to Ferrari in 2008), & various racing programs (to be fair, Ferrari has really only concentrated on F1)?

As for who's putting racing stuff in their products, it's pretty equal since Ferrari has incorporated F1-made technology in their cars for years now.

 

[JCE]

My thoughts exactly. I would vote for the GT2 because of that. Having raw power at the back wheel and having to control the car from spinning out. Only pure driving enthusiast would be looking forward to be driving this car. The Scuderia F430 is not to say a bad car, its just that, as Jeremy Clarkson would say "Ferrari nowadays build their cars with maths and science, and has been winning ever since". I mean Ferrari just builds complicated things such as traction control, launch control, F1 gearbox with paddle shifter and such just to make the car more exciting. However, Ferrari just totally miss the point of making the car with the "Italian flare and passion" that they used to back in the day. The GT2 is just plain and simple, but more powerful and cheaper than the Scuderia F430 as well. 👍

Excellent post. +virtual rep The Porsche would most likely feel more "rewarding" when you pull off that perfect corner or slide. The Ferrari just gives you a larger t-penis (t for technology)...whos to say you even did that corner yourself? I'm speaking unbiasedly right now too. Older Ferraris like the 288, 355, and the F40 were my kinds of Ferrari's. Balls to the wall excitement...with a large handful of death served to you daily. I love it.

 

[Blackbird.]

I'll take the GT2.

 

[McLaren]

Ok, I pretty much see that everyone chooses the GT2 over the 430 due to lack of aids needed, but I'd like to see who you all think will come out on top? In other words, who do you think is going to be faster? Remember, the Ferrari's aids aren't necessarily going to be helping it.

 

[Blackbird.]

I just like the appearance of the GT2 more. But if there was a LP640 i'd take that over the other two in a heartbeat.

 

[Leonidae]

Ferrari for me. it is proper sportscar with mid-engined layout, has always been a serious 2-seating sportscar, and it sounds a ton better.

 

[YSSMAN]

Ok, I pretty much see that everyone chooses the GT2 over the 430 due to lack of aids needed, but I'd like to see who you all think will come out on top? In other words, who do you think is going to be faster? Remember, the Ferrari's aids aren't necessarily going to be helping it.

I'd make a wager and say that under most circumstances the Ferrari would be faster given its more *nimble* nature by comparison to that of the Porsche. Again, that largely depends on where the cars are being compared, etc. Give the GT2 any lengthy stretch to open up and I'm positive that it will blow the doors off the Ferrari without much of a problem...

Number one...
Yes Capitan?
Engage WARP 12
Yes sir!

...KAAAA-POWWWWW...

I'm sure the acceleration in the mid-range is absolutely stellar in any gear with the Porsche...

 

[Div is back]

"Ferrari is a scaled down version of God"

Porsche is an up scaled version of the Beetle.

 

[F1GTR]

Ferrari. I just love how the engine sounds, how it looks and well, it's a Ferrari isn't it?