A.I programmed to lose when wining!

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BETOGTR

BETOGTR

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BETOGTR
Well this happened some time ago but I just remembered it , in the FGT championship race which takes place on "the ring" I was around the 10th lap when I was rammed by the A.I and ended up on last place with a big gap between me and the car in front , I kept racing and noticed that near the end of every lap the car in 1st place sometimes even 1st and 2nd place will spoon out this happened every single lap until I got in 4th place by the end of lap 16th on lap 17th and 18th nothing happened and by the end of the last lap I was in 2nd place and in the same spot as always the car in 1st place spun out , the bad thing is that I didn´t noticed and I crashed with him and ended the race in 4th place
Anybody else has noticed this kind of thing?
It´s too much of a coincidence that every A.I car that got in 1st place spoon out in exactly the same place when I was way behind so I think that the A.I is programmed to do that
 
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I noticed this too. I think it happens when the AI is "x" distance from the nearest car. When I was battling to keep first, the two cars behind didn't spin out. As I got further ahead, they started to overshoot the braking zone to try and catch up, went into the grass and panicked, causing their car to spin out.
 
It's called rubber band AI, when your winning, they go faster and when your losing, they make "mistakes"
 
For me, half of them span out on that last chicane on EVERY lap. The half that got through span out next time...... IT was laughable. In the end i was winning by so much i stopped and watched the madness. One went off followed by another. As the first moved back on the track the third hit him sending them both off. This repeated itself with more cars...... Won by 2 laps IIRC

I was winning pretty much the whole race so didnt have anything to do with the purposely making mistakes. I can only assume that perhaps they were going too fast to catch up and clipping the grass......... Much like b-spec bob does when frustrated.
 
I found that only the AI behind me and directly in front of me span out. For example when i was in 3rd all the cars behind me span out, as did the 2nd place car. The 1st place carried on as normal.
 
In the current seasonal event, I was trailing the California by about ten seconds into the last lap, but turned the first right-hander and it was only a couple of seconds ahead.

I think something similar happened in an earlier bonus race driving the Audi TT at Cape Ring.
 
UK-Gamer
It's called rubber band AI, when your winning, they go faster and when your losing, they make "mistakes"
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It would be nice to be able to switch that off , so when you do a awesome comback you could really be proud about it!!
 
Just reading the thread while seeing my bob do the exact same thing on this event. However I believe it might be just some mistakes with the script thats responsible for a racing line for bobs
 
They still crash in that spot if youre in first place. So, no, they arent programmed to lose and there is no rubber band AI.
 
LordSandwich
They still crash in that spot if youre in first place. So, no, they arent programmed to lose and there is no rubber band AI.
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Yeah, they spun pretty much every lap for me. Was fun watching their arrows on the map go through there and spin around every time. :dopey:
 
LordSandwich
They still crash in that spot if youre in first place. So, no, they arent programmed to lose and there is no rubber band AI.
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If that´s true then A.I is just dumb in general , but I kept an eye on the map and no one spun out after I got 4th
 
LordSandwich
They still crash in that spot if youre in first place. So, no, they arent programmed to lose and there is no rubber band AI.
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They may not be programmed to lose, but their pace actually differs greatly with your own performance.

I noticed this when I was doing the Vitz/Yaris race with the basic Yaris you win somewhere.
The first time around I was lapping something like 2.25's, and finished 4th, just 4 seconds behind the leader.
Next time with some upgrades I was running 2.22's, and I was surprised to find I still finished only 3rd, although this time one second closer to the leader.
Then after more upgrades I got the laptimes down to 2.18, and I finally won, but only by 1 second...
 
I remember in GT3, when a race in Laguna Seca started, a Shelby would always spin out in the first turn.
 
To know how the AI workd you only have to watch bob.... you can see how being behind traffic, leading cars or having cars on their tail affects how 'Hot' he gets, this then affect his pace.
 
4743hudsonj
Well your terrible at calling BS then. Its not hard when half the ai is doing donuts on the grass.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQ2xVgd_SQw

skip to 5:35. its not me but if you watch the ai on the map you will see that you FAIL, just as bad as the ai. Then skip to 5:50. the video says the same thing
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Yes I am well aware that the AI regularly crash here, but you claim of ''i stopped and watched the madness'' and ''won by 2 laps'' is just complete rubbish.
 
chippy1000
Yes I am well aware that the AI regularly crash here, but you claim of ''i stopped and watched the madness'' and ''won by 2 laps'' is just complete rubbish.
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Well thats your [incorrect] opinion. Them spinning out give you a ridiculous advantage. Its easy to gain 2 laps on them over the 20 available. Then stopping for 30 odd seconds to watch whats going on. Nothing implausible about that....not if your fast enough anyways.
 
4743hudsonj
Well thats your [incorrect] opinion. Them spinning out give you a ridiculous advantage. Its easy to gain 2 laps on them over the 20 available. Then stopping for 30 odd seconds to watch whats going on. Nothing implausible about that....not if your fast enough anyways.
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Actually, it is virtually impossible to build a decent lead in the FGT series, so if you did it, either your lying or just one freaking good driver. The rubber banding is ridiculous, so you will never be very far behind or very far ahead. Basically, the race is designed where really only the last 2 laps will decide whether you win or not. The championship has the rubber banding, but I havn't noticed it in the individual races.
 
OP: This is old news. The AI aren't programmed well at the end of the Nurburgring GP. That, and there's bad rubberbanding. If you are behind, AI is slow, so you can catch up. If you are ahead, AI is quicker.
 
4743hudsonj
To know how the AI workd you only have to watch bob.... you can see how being behind traffic, leading cars or having cars on their tail affects how 'Hot' he gets, this then affect his pace.
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Yeah people confuse this for rubberbanding. This is particularly obvious in endurance races. Once the field separates their lap times will be slower regardless of what place the user is in.

CPU cars also arent stock all the time. They tend to mod their cars up to a certain point to match your car. This also seems to confuse people into thinking rubber band AI exists.

Im quite certain that if you start a race and take a commanding lead after the first couple of turns then maintain a half lap lead for the entire race, then enter the same car into the same race and stay half a lap back the entire race that the AI will post very close lap times for both races. If the starting grid is exactly the same for both races then the lap times should be almost identical.
 
This thread is so full of weird claims. Glad atleast some people are calling the BS.

1. The A.I. spin at that Nurburgring chicane with lots of different cars, so it's not FGT, it's the track. And it's not about them being near you, or ahead of you, or behind. They do it all the time.

2. The FGT is not hard to win. You should win all the races by atleast 40 secs. I did. And on a track like the Nurburgring where the A.I. is bad, it's possible to win by many laps. Whether or not you have time to actually stop and watch the A.I. is another thing, though.

OK. That's as much as I can say as solid fact. About the rubber band AI, I don't think there is such a thing in GT5. My guess is that the AI is the same in A-spec as it is in B-Spec. If you want to see how it works, go to a b-spec race, but watch some other driver, not your own.

1. They work the same as your bob, but no one is telling them to increase their pace, so if they don't have anyone around them, their pace will drop to extreme blue. This is why they slow down, not because of a rubber band.

2. If this is how the AI works, then what happens on the Nurburgring is that the hotter the AI driver is, the more likely he is to mess up that chicane. That's why it may seem that they are more likely to spin when you, or anyone, is near them.
 
Definitely a problem on the track. Noticed it on the first lap. I was racing fairly clean off the start after deciding to take the 'shortcut' at the first corner by jumping my FGT. It was basically a Initial D esq turn where I was sideways before the corner and just decided oh well. Gained two positions.

Charged up to fourth place before the Schumacher S where I lost a second or two. Despite this, I managed a nice draft and with really late braking, was on the third place car's spoiler for the chicane. Right after clearing the chicane I see the first and second place cars spinning. The third place car didn't spin but slammed right into the second place car who had spun onto the track. I cleared the wreckage and had a 15 second lead by the next split. This happened to a small percentage of the cars every lap but not always the leader.

However, to corroborate the 'rubber banding' effect, the pack, as it were, always stayed together and my lead never increased past 45 seconds. This despite the fact that my lap times were consistent and the percentage who spun. In fact, I set my fastest lap on the 17th lap and the AI actually gained during that lap.

On laps that I wasn't focusing 100% I would watch the split times. The AI at one point would gain over 10 seconds leading up to the final chicane and then lose it immediately after. Again my lap times were withing 1 second of my best time.

I feel that rubber banding for a championship such as this is a decent decision. Ignoring the tires/nurburgring GP problems it made for some decently close races. The problem lies for those of us that are easily faster than the AI. It seems once you get first the cars behind you become more of a sideshow. If you make a mistake the AI might get close enough to draft but by then the rubberband ends and you retake your big lead. It makes for a very boring 20 laps.
 
The AI constantly spin out after the last chicane at the Nurb FGT Championship.
 
I'm not sure it's fair to call this 'rubber band AI' as it's not that simplistic. 'Rubber band' artificially slows the cars down rather than the drivers; this is more like Forza's pressure system which causes mistakes in the drivers in front if you're on their tail.
 
The reason that the cars spin out at nurb gp is because they sonetimes go over the kerb which is quite high which unsettles the car and puts them in the grass on the exit of the corner. Its like the AI dont realise that there is a kerb there at all.

Also all A.I. drivers act like B-spec drivers with a hot and cold system. They will only spin out when they are hot. If they are battling with another AI car they will go hot. If you hit them they will go hot. (This is why only the cars around you appear to spin out).

I did this race many times and everytime the driver who finished second would only spin out a maximum of 4 times and only lose about 10 seconds each time. So I dont think it is possible to win by 2 laps. However if you are good you will lap some of the lower placed AI cars and watch them spin out. Funny

The AI cars spining out has nothing to do with AI cars being programmed to lose, but just bad AI programming. GT has always had dodgey AI, maybe Kaz thinks that it give GT series a unique character and that we all love it really. We don't. Maybe PD where to making to many premium models to care???!!?? Who knows?

Lastly, Im afraid to that GT does have rubber banding. I can only notice it on the FGT championship. Probably it is the only race where all the drivers have similar cars, is long enough to remember lap times, has replay value and the FGT is too fast for me to control properly.

On Fuji, the AI cars will lap at about 1.20.xxx if I am behind them but when Im in the lead they lap at about 1.16.xxx

On Indy they lap at 1.16.xxx if I am behind them but when Im in the lead they lap at about 1.11.xxx
Same at Monaco and Suzuka. But on Nurb I cant tell.
 
4743hudsonj
Well thats your [incorrect] opinion. Them spinning out give you a ridiculous advantage. Its easy to gain 2 laps on them over the 20 available. Then stopping for 30 odd seconds to watch whats going on. Nothing implausible about that....not if your fast enough anyways.
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So basically you are the only one who thinks it's possible to take a 30 second break and then win the race by two laps, feel free to post a video of YOU doing this to keep the very small amount of credibility that you have left.
 
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