A-Spec Conditioning? Why People Can't Make it Through the First Two Turns Cleanly?

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Won't do much for the 'deliberate slam into you idiots', though.:sly:

Having gone through this issue extensively on Shift, I can assure you that some of the FASTEST drivers will happily barge around, and flagrantly cut chicanes etc..

There's a whole new generation of gamers that seem to think that, if you CAN exploit a game, you SHOULD.

Now, get off my lawn! :grumpy:

+1 I am not thinking of the guys that just lack the skill and bump you off but those 'players' that flagrantly hit you, drive the wrong way around and generally seem to get their jollies from spoiling the experience for others.
 
I would say A-Spec is almost certainly to blame. Having to barge through that many cars in three laps in incredibly unrealistic and promotes bad driving. There's also the issue of "rabbit" cars which inevitably start way too close to the front, thus, you'll be trying desperately to push through the slower cars before the actual threats leave without you.

I know in online, it's hard to remember the other guy is a human who wants to win too, and thus break the habits of full-contact outbraking, semi-punting, and all the other cheaty moves which may be semi-required to push through a field of AI bots before the two laps are complete.
 
Haven't done S licence in long time but i do remember it being tough as far as contact goes ? I may be wrong, feel free to correct me if that is the case.

A teenager with a DS3 who just want's to smash **** up, is not gonna sit there and grind the IA licence etc..
I would feel very confident if i set the room to Gold IA licence holders only that i was going to have a good clean race, where people tried their utmost to avoid contact.
( Accidents happen though, that's part of what makes watching racing fun )

I own a wheel, and didnt bother with most of those licences after they started to force using traction control and skidrecovery. I didnt want to learn how to win this single test I want to drive. They are silly, and in actual fact so is the rest of the offline game, I gave up on that too so general "level" numbers dont mean a thing.

I guess you would miss out on my clean racing in your lobby.


Setting high damage doesnt fix the issue either, as someone will enter and not know its on and wipe out the full grid first corner of the ring and then they will just leave!


As others have said, the iRacing ranking system sounds interesting. From what I understand you get plus or minus points for clean races and contact. Having this "new" level/rank as a filter would be ideal.
 
I play several other games online and this cheating and trolling (deliberately sabotaging other's games) is nothing new. If you participate in public races, EXPECT it to happen. Lay back on the first lap and pick off the racers one by one as they make mistakes. Watch for faster cars coming up from behind and let them go by. Add good racers to your friends list and eventually you'll build up a list of people to play with that are like you and you'll never have to enter a pub race again.
 
In a older nascar game i used to play they had a thing called LPI or laps per incedent (spelling) it worked great to keep out the people that would crash all the time. You could set this number as low or as high as ya wanted.
 
I'm not saying I was one of those jacks that would ram people like you over and over, but coming from A-Spec to online I did have some trouble braking appropriately to respect other peoples racing lines. I could stay on the track but tailing somebody gave me trouble because I brake as late as possible and most people don't. I quickly got used to this tho.

I think your theory is valid.
 
I'm not saying I was one of those jacks that would ram people like you over and over, but coming from A-Spec to online I did have some trouble braking appropriately to respect other peoples racing lines. I could stay on the track but tailing somebody gave me trouble because I brake as late as possible and most people don't. I quickly got used to this tho.

I think your theory is valid.

Agreed. When I first started online I did a lot of reading about it and it was mostly horror stories so when I actually took the plunge I tried clean rooms and my first corner I ended up right up the back of someone with absolutely no malicious intent. I had only driven A-spec against the AI and this was all I knew, so from my experience, A-spec is almost entirely to blame for bad driving from well-intentioned but less skilled drivers.

The issue of internet morons crashing around, going backwards, bumping you off track for having the temerity to try and make a clean pass them on a straight coming from their slipstream? That's a little more difficult to solve. Limiting entries based on licence levels etc is a reasonable idea however it more than likely makes clean online racing even less accessible for people like me who enjoy the racing and cannot be bothered spending 6 hours trying to chop another .003 off their braking time in a DB9 (or whatever it is).

Rating people on their online behaviour and being able to discriminate (or is that illegal) on that basis sounds the fairest, although the hardest tio implement. Certainly the damage and penalty thing works however it is limited by having your right hand rear wheel near smashed off at the 1st turn through no fault of your own, so maybe a front half/rear half statistic collecter of impacts in online races? I also like the idea of offenders being unable to do their damage and then quit the race. Make them wait it out.

I am sure this is a lot easier to talk about than it is to implement in-game though.
 
I really, really don't get it, well actually I think I do get it, but I'll get to that in a second. I'm serious here, you all know who you are. I'm speaking to all of you 1st lap, 1st corner-hooligans who just destroy any kind of enjoyment for a grid of other racers. What is it about this situation that you can't use two brain cells and realize that a race is not won on the 1st or 2nd corner of the of the race through driving obnoxiously, mainly using other people as guard rails? Is it because you're so used to racing against the AI in ridiculously overpowered cars? Are you just too used to knocking them off the road on your way to getting your next gold trophy as soon as possible, taking a 10 second lead by the 3rd turn in your car that outmatches them by 300hp? Has A-Spec conditioned you this way, to be so inconsiderate, so mindless?

I tried and failed in every room and race tonight to find a group of drivers who could make it through the first two turns, much less the first LAP, with clean driving. I'm talking about five different rooms, all different drivers. Sure, one race was with F1 cars, but it was on Suzuka. There is PLENTY of room on that track to allow for clean driving with even the slightest hint of consideration for any of the other participants.


I just finished out my night with a race on the Indy Road Course. There's a recipe for destruction right there... everyone hits 180mph at the start of the race and has to slow down to make the first turn = disaster. I was in the lead on the first turn, got plowed as expected because I took the first corner at an appropriate speed, but I managed to hold onto it through turn one despite at least 10 other drivers' best efforts to include me in their demolition derby. I get to the very next turn (1 second later?), I get plowed right into the sand, oh and by the same guy I saw leading the pack in destroying my bumper on the first turn. This was not a RUB either. I'm talking about serious impact. Oh but that was still okay because guess where all of the other fine drivers were, back BEHIND me in the sand still recovering, you know, just trying to get their cars to face in the correct direction again.


So I drive as clean as I can for the rest of the race, people fly off the track here and there and I get back into 2nd place before the last lap. I have no shot at 1st by then since the first place driver managed to escape the carnage from earlier and cut through from the back (half the battle of online racing? sad), and I'm just trying to keep it clean and hold onto 2nd. So I get to the hairpin on that track and guess what, I get plowed right off into the grass again by the same guy who hit me 2 times earlier. I make the comment, "Man if you hit me one more time..." And he replies, "Come on man, it's the last lap." To which I reply, "And what does that mean, it's a license for you to drive dirty and throw me off the track?" No reply. Turns out the driver was the host. I said nothing more, took my 3rd place and left as soon as the lobby reloaded.



- It's A-Spec's fault, I know it, well that's my theory. The problem here is that A-Spec doesn't really teach people how to RACE, nor do license tests for that matter. It teaches them how to drive like neanderthals clubbing their way toward their next gold trophy and prize car. Strict penalties in A-Spec events, including the enforcement of 2 tires on, AND more importantly having a significant clean race bonus could really do a lot to improve the quality of driving out there among the interwebs. I remember way back in the days of my first Need For Speed game when it was a big deal to finish the race with the clean driving bonus because it paid off. Think about what that could do for these pickle heads ruining any chance for a lot of other people to have and enjoyable racing experience.

Find an organized, clean lobby. I totally feel for you. There are many clean, fast racers out there that know how to race properly. Once you find them, all you'll want to do is online race. I have no desire to do anything else.

Nick
 
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