A very specific first-car suggestion thread, now with extra rant!

[EA11R]

Yes! I am a sixteen-year-old, I am looking for a car, and I do want your suggestions thereof!

I've read many other threads regarding the subject, and seen many clever suggestions, which I'll likely heed regardless. But, I post anew, here, because I have a very specific, and odd, set of criteria regarding what would make a perfect first car. I believe that this requires backstory.

I never noticed much about my parents' cars until the day I attended a used-car test-drive (for my sister) of a Mk3 Volkswagen Jetta and a BMW E30 convertible, both priced at about $3000, and both exactly twice as old as we were told they were. We tested both, and both were completely different from anything I had experienced before. The seats hugged me like they really cared, and disassembled under my father's obese behind, luckily without the salesman's knowledge. To reach anything within the car was easy, everything was immediately reachable and close. The road noise was huge, it suddenly felt as though all cars were made of foam, and this one was made of less, allowing so much more tangible movement. The engine was weak, so he was flooring it, and everything was broken. I was captivated.

Then, the ride home: It's Dodge Ram Time, regrettably. The truck was comparatively humongous; to adjust the windscreen-mounted GPS -as was my duty- entailed essentially a 1.5-metre-hike. The plateau-esque seat was barren, with nothing else anywhere remotely near to lean upon or use. I noticed that I'd constantly been either bracing or sitting diagonally in the massive truck, just so I could stay vertical. The road only existed from my prior knowledge, for I could not sense it presently. And it was fancy. Hideously vulgar, impress-the-neighbours fancy. It had (still has, actually) 20-inch wheels, and chrome hemi-badges abound. Horrendously ostentatious, sedatingly refined (-ish; Apply american-car stereotypes here), and rejectingly spacious.

I have a similarly-lengthed paragraph for nine other vehicles I have experienced, but I expect I've made something resembling a point. I shall be more explicit.

The level of refinement of the parents' vehicles leads to a removal of the feeling of movement, the fanciness and fashion implies that I care about how I am seen, the size rejects my thin body mercilessly, and the car never gets a good exercise. All of this sedative refinement is what I attempt to avoid. The ghetto-quality of the used Germans woke me up, forced me to notice the car rather than gadgets; the size fits my body-type (I wish I could make that sound as wonderful as it is); and the fact that everything is broken (or absent), cramped, and slow repels insecure people who buy cars like my dad's.

I've obsessed over this set of ideals, and come up with many cars (with varying degrees of availability) which adhere beautifully to them, but I, ever greedy, request more. This isn't a very practical thread, myself being unemployed, so I place no price cap upon it, especially since the cars I seek are definitively cheap.

My list:
Austin Se7en (easily the most unattainable and perfect)
(rear-engine) Volkswagen Beetle (pretty, fits requirements)
Toyota Tercel (absolutely fits my requirements)
Mk3 Jetta/Golf (The first compact car I rode in, loved)
Volvo 240 (Perhaps too large, but excellent regardless)
Volkswagen Van (A Beetle, but groovier! It is my eternal shame I don't know the actual name.)

A final note: Civics are moot, for where I live, they are far too common (my family contemplated recently purchasing one from next-door neighbours, for instance) for me to, in good conscience, expect people to find it at all. I'm absolutely livid that every single car* with which I associate has countless clones running around town. Every time I wait for someone to pick me up from somewhere, I have a bare minimum of 3 false-alarms as a clone-car whizzes by. It's not nonconformatism as much as utility which I seek.

*Literally, every single car: White FF V6 Wingless 17-inch-wheel Mk2 Vue, Silver Hemi Megapimp Ram Quad Cab, Black Non-plastic Large-wheeled company-stickered Avalanche, Pearl-White 6-Spoke-Wheel Saturn Outlook, Grey/Green 2002ish Altima, White Mercury/Nissan Van, Yellow Mk1 New Beetle, White Dakota Quad Cab, Grey-Green Trailblazer, Beige Explorer, Silver All-The-Trimmings 300C, Grey 17-inch-wheel HHR, et 🤬 cetera.

*um*

💡 Anyways, any suggestions? I'll accept recommendations both automotive and psychiatric in nature.

 

[ND4SPD]

Price range?!

 

[hamstrings]

A non-broken BMW E30 coupé?

If you can find one without the huge diving board bumpers, then you're set. They are classic, not pretentious. Their light weight will get you going quickly with the inline six or the 16-valve four banger in the final years. Get the stick shift. The back seat is usable if you pick up a few passengers. Cloth seats are practical. Crank windows. No early overpowered airbags. They are drivers' cars.

I love old spunky cars. They all have some sort of story. And names too if you're buying from an individual. Bertha. Ginger. Smelly Belly (an Aries, no idea why the owner named it that. Car was never in a flood nor smelled funny).

Whatever car you get, have it inspected before buying.

 

[EA11R]

^Overpowered airbags?!

E30s are excellent, I still remember how the E30 my dad broke felt distinctly oversteerish at low speeds. I imagine that's a pretty volatile statement, but that was the impression. However, they're perhaps just a bit too expensive.

I just noticed that it seems I've censored a lot of the things which would lead to a cheap car, so let's just toss a price top of $3000 into the mixer. I should warn that it seems I am in a chemically rediculous state of mind. Something about vacations...

Not to mention, BMWs seem to be associated with hordes of terribly unpleasant people; salesman, mechanics, stereotypical owners (quite a lot of different stereotypes, I just realized), et cetera.

 

[hamstrings]

Early airbags projected with considerable force. Manufacturers have slowly reduced the force of expanding airbags over the years. I'm small in stature, so I wouldn't want to be hit by the driver's side airbag in my friend's first gen Lexus LS400.

As always, wear your seatbelt.

 

[Gil]

For a first car, that is likely to be mistreated, whether by intention or ignorance, get yourself a:
Ford Focus or Escort, Chevy Cavalier/Pontiac Sunbird -- of Course, get the newest one you can afford with the lowest mileage. Keep it basically stock, change the oil every 5,000 miles with a tire rotation thrown in for good measure, and if you don't wreck it, it'll last a lot longer than you'll want to have it around.

If your folks, or grandparents know any older folks, particularly those that have been recently widowed in the last 18-24 months, there is likely a low-mileage, though usually larger, nearly mint sedan that is looking for a new home at a bargain basement price.
Yes, it sounds predatory, but a wealth of first cars are found that way.
Cars such as:
Ford Sedans: Crown Vic's, Marquis, Town Cars, Topaz's, etc
GM Sedans: Regal, Cutlass, Grand Prix, Bonneville, etc.
Then there are the Plethora of Corolla, Camrys, Sentras, Accords, Celicas, etc that fall into the $3-5,000 catagory.
The only caveat here is you want a car that has at least 5000 miles per year on the odometer. A ten year old car with really low mileage may be sound mechanically, but will likely need a lot of it's "perishable" parts replaced or refurbished due to "rot" from just sitting about.
But if you can afford to replace belts, hoses, seals, tires, and shocks, you might still come out ahead. It's just a hassle to do all that stuff from the jump, when what you really want to do is get in and drive.

 

[Jay]

Was expecting you to want a Cappuccino, or you can't get them in the US?

 

[McLaren]

Was expecting you to want a Cappuccino, or you can't get them in the US?

I don't think we got them. I've only seen one, and the owner told me it was a pain to get it.

 

[nk4e]

A accord. I believe that Project Mag. has several issues involving the Accord.

 

[EA11R]

Was expecting you to want a Cappuccino, or you can't get them in the US?

I don't understand grammar, but I know that that's certainly not an option. It couldn't have been sold in America.

 

[Azuremen]

I owned and autocrossed a 1994 Tercel. Still miss the damn thing because it was light and tossable and I could just drive the piss out of it and not get into trouble.

Rawr, Tercel. It survived a couple of accidents, got around 40 MPG, burnt a little oil at around 130,000 miles, and started every time I wanted it to. Parts were cheap, there is quite a bit of play because of platform sharing with the Starlet in Japan, and the sub 2000 pound curb weight just made it fun.

And they can be bought for dirt cheap. DIRT CHEAP.

 

[Greycap]

Volvo 240 (Perhaps too large, but excellent regardless)

Being one of the few 240 owners here I can only say, choose it. I wouldn't say it's that large - doesn't feel as big when driving as it is - and seeing that I'm 5'8", 135 lbs, it doesn't take a giant to drive it.

On the good side:
- it's cheap to begin with
- it's cheap to continue with as long as spare parts go
- it's practically indestructible (the technical side)
- it's roomy enough for five adults and quite a lot of stuff
- it's safe enough to enable you to experience your first crash and walk away
- it's very easy to park, a ridiculously small turning circle for its size
- it's very predictable if you overdo it into a slippery corner

On the bad side:
- it's not all that economical, depending on the engine though (mine did 34mpg on the highway)
- it's not a road rocket by any means
- it's certainly not the coolest car around
- it's highly likely to be in less than mint condition

But if you're looking for a reliable daily driver that starts every single day regardless of the weather and takes you where you want it to without too much drama, it'll do very well.

 

[EA11R]

What on earth are you on about? The Volvo 240 is the eighth-coolest car on the road!Yes, I have reeducted my friends successfully. Point? Besides, cool cars are for unfavourable people, or those with excesses of money.

Actually, it didn't occur to me until you posted it that the Volvo is both slow and safe. With my friends, that makes a positively awesome machine. We're not smart people, as far as groups go.

About the roominess: I want a car that's small on the inside, so I don't have to utilize creative postures. I'm 125lbs and 5'10", how large would that seat feel? The ideal is Miata-esque room, but I only expect to see that in a... Miata. Which I certainly can't get, because I'm a young male and that's a sportscar. Hello, Insurance!

Either way, Volvo seems to be the car, because my dad has a list of American ideals to which a car may aspire, and my car must meet one of them. Frankly, that Tercel is a bit unattainable to me: small, efficient, Japanese, plain, old, light; all of which my father is opposed to. The Volvo, though, looks boxy! Though he probably wouldn't let me buy an estate, so I'd have to go four-door.

One critical thing for me is a manual transmission, but I would need to learn to use manual on my car, since noone uses the cooler gearbox anymore. So, I won't be able to drive the car before buying, my father will have to do that. Basically, how's the gearbox? And, based upon this paragraph, is there anything not obvious I'd have to tell him to watch out for?

 

[Nightmage82]

Besides, cool cars are for unfavourable people, or those with excesses of money.

beauty is in the eye of the beholder. as soon as you get YOUR car, you will love it, regardless of what it is. just get something reliable...

 

[Greycap]

What on earth are you on about? The Volvo 240 is the eighth-coolest car on the road!Yes, I have reeducted my friends successfully. Point? Besides, cool cars are for unfavourable people, or those with excesses of money.

Interesting to see that someone sees the old brick as cool... I just see it as what it was back then, something of a high class car with style that is hard to put a finger on. It just has that style, even after 20 years. I don't even know the words to describe it but it used to be the car of choice for the rich estate owners and the spirit still lives in the sturdy and (in its own odd way) expensive feel of the car.

As the previous poster says the beauty indeed is in the eye of the beholder, I can look back at the car every time I walk away from it and say to myself that I have a damn fine car. Few people agree with me but I don't care, it's my car after all.

Actually, it didn't occur to me until you posted it that the Volvo is both slow and safe. With my friends, that makes a positively awesome machine. We're not smart people, as far as groups go.

Well, slowness is a relative thing but you're not going to do 0-60 in less than ten seconds with a stock non-turbo model. I haven't tried with mine but 12 seconds is probably a quite safe bet. About the safety, I know a guy who crashed his 240 into a wooden lamp post at 50 mph (fell asleep at the wheel) and walked away. The car was fully repairable. It has crumple zones both at the front and the rear and is built like a tank all round.

About the roominess: I want a car that's small on the inside, so I don't have to utilize creative postures. I'm 125lbs and 5'10", how large would that seat feel?

Seeing that you're taller than me, no problem. Everything is in reach and the seat is, well, hard to explain but if it seats me well it can't be that large.

One critical thing for me is a manual transmission, but I would need to learn to use manual on my car, since noone uses the cooler gearbox anymore. So, I won't be able to drive the car before buying, my father will have to do that. Basically, how's the gearbox? And, based upon this paragraph, is there anything not obvious I'd have to tell him to watch out for?

The only thing that bugs me in the gearbox is the first gear ratio, it's a tad too short. PD got many things wrong with the GT4 version of the Volvo but one of those they got right is the gearbox, the ratios are 100% correct for the five speed M47 transmission with the 3.73 final ratio so there you have a way of seeing how it does. Just make sure you get either the M47 (the preferable option) or the M46, a four speed box with an electronical overdrive (the second option, make sure the overdrive works if you take it). Stay away from the four speed M45, not because it's a bad transmission but because you'll want that fifth gear to increase the mileage.

The strength of the drivetrain... they successfully used the stock M45 and M47 gearboxes, as well as the stock Dana differentials, in rallycross over here and the cars were producing well over 300 bhp. Mine puts out 116 bhp and it's the top end injection engine so you can imagine how much abuse those things withstand in road use. The only thing that can go wrong is the synchromesh of the third gear if you try to grind it in without proper clutch use.

The things to look for... first, try to get a '86 or later example. They have galvanized bodyshells up to the roof pillars. Second, pay attention to the rear wheel wells. That's pretty much the most serious place in which these things rot and if they're OK, the rest of the body highly likely is. Third... I don't think there is a particular third other than that check the overall condition of the car. Worn out driver's seat, slipping clutch, worn out dampers, the usual stuff. Then again replacing the clutch is cheap and the dampers are even cheaper, got the dampers and springs changed myself last month. New rear springs are in order for the summer because these ones are too soft.

Oh, and if you have multiple engine choices, get the biggest one possible. Partly because it has torque you need to move the mass and partly because it saves fuel. No, I'm not nuts. The B230 series consumes less than the B200 because the torque does the work with less throttle. B230F is the one to go for, then B230E, B200F and B200E in that order. It's printed on the cam belt cover, visible when opening the hood.

 

[Joey D]

Isn't a Austin Se7en basically a classic Mini? Be prepared to spend stupid amounts of money for one that is in pretty poor condition.

I would go with a Toyota Tercel, a buddy back in high school had one although I don't remember the year. The thing just wouldn't break and he drove it like it was a Ferrari. It was decently fast and fun too, not to mention cheap on insurance and easy on fuel consumption.

 

[neanderthal]

IMO the best first car is a Mercedes 240D. You wont get anywhere fast, it's heavy and slow, and safe. You definitely want a stick as the auto redefines and emphasises slow.

Seats are flat though.

You can also get cheap Mercedes 300Es in that price range.
But beware the old adage "there is no car more expensive than a cheap Mercedes."

 

[Keef]

You don't sound like the type to tune a car. Civics can be the most anonymous cars on the road and they can also be some of the most individualized and recognizable, but of course not without some money and work. So, no Civic for you then.

I guarantee you that just about any car with no more than two front airbags, a mechanical throttle linkage, proper hydraulic brakes and steering, and no stability/traction control of any sort will bring back the feeling of "movement". I know exactly what you're saying, thus I bought a Civic that's 10 years old now. Even something a new as a Mazda Protege is relatively uncommon and unassumingly sporty. And if you man up you can make it much more sporty, noisy, rattly, and generally more "mechanical" feeling than even it's 5+ year old structure should feel.

Not crappy enough for you? There comes a time to trade the unrefined-machine-like qualities--basically, crappiness--you're looking for for some reliability and livability, as many of my friends' swapped and tuned Civics have taught me. Mine might be a little heavier and not slammed and not tuned, but hey, at least it starts every time and I don't have to screw with it. Busted-ass vehicles don't impress girls either, unless you find a big burly man-woman who works at the local Jiffy Lube.

 

[YSSMAN]

Having owned an MKIII Jetta (1996 Wolfsburg), I'm usually one to recommend the cars with caution. Overall, the're pretty decent cars. I like the way they ride-out and drive, the fuel mileage isn't half bad, and depending on if you're in a VW-friendly area, parts and service can be had for cheap.

I personally would try to avoid the earlier cars, as there were a lot of production problems down at the Mexico plant. The 1996+ models are usually a fair bit more reliable, but keeping in mind that it is a VW, thats never an exact science. If you can, check for 98 and 99 models, they seem to fair quite a bit better overall. The power windows, as I recall, seem to have a lot of problems. As do the distributors and plug wires on the 2.0L 8V. Other than that, look out for transmission issues as well. My Jetta died because of some stupid thing that a lot of MKIII cars go out on, one of my dealer friends had at least three Jettas and Golf suffering from the same problem that I had on his lot.

BUT! A good Jetta or Golf in decent condition can be an incredibly enjoyable experience. I still miss driving that car on a regular basis, but I've moved on and committed to my Celica for now. The main thing is not getting screwed over on price. I still think some of those Jettas hold their value a little too well, so shop around if you're interested.

 

[ND4SPD]

A Police Interceptor Crown Vic can be had for real cheap as well. They're built like tanks and were heavy duty everything so you can accidentally hit a curb and not have to worry. Yes they may be 18ft long, but after owning mine for a few months now, I'm surprised everyday at the maneuverability of this thing. The 4.6L may seem a little thirsty but for a 4000lb+ car I get around 21-24mpg in the city if you're light on the pedal. They're also incredibly comfortable. Very cushioned soft ride but when it comes to cornering, it even surprises me with its great handling. Thanks in part to the Police Interceptor's suspension which has Ford's "Severe Duty" suspension that has higher rate coil springs. So a way stiffer ride than a normal crown vic, keep in mind the normal crown vic doesn't even have rear anti roll bars and the P.I.'s do. It's the perfect car to just cruise along in. No one passes you. You also get respect on the road, no more tailgaters or people cutting you off. People stare and turns their heads when you drive by like you're driving some sort of rare sports car. It's great fun. I know you'd prefer something without a slushbox, but don't forget that the Mustang's 5spd is a popular swap into these things. Definitely something I'll be doing down the road. The auto in Police Interceptor is pretty decent as well. As the Police Interceptor's transmission is programed to shift harder and firmer than a standard crown victoria, hell it'll even chirp the tires going into 2nd. Pretty much a great bang for buck combo you get with these cars. Hell I only paid $2500 for mine.

Now I know beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Some people may think it's an ugly big 4 door american car, but she's a real looker in my eyes.

 

[McLaren]

The thing is bro, you have to realize you got a pretty amazing de-commisioned Interceptor. As I've told you, most have a lot of the equipment on your's removed before they're sold. The fact you still have your cage, bull guard, and electrical equipment still working is amazing.

 

[Azuremen]

The thing is bro, you have to realize you got a pretty amazing de-commisioned Interceptor. As I've told you, most have a lot of the equipment on your's removed before they're sold. The fact you still have your cage, bull guard, and electrical equipment still working is amazing.

Truth.

Back on the topic, I still can't stress how great a Tercel is for a first car. The only real complaint I can toss at the car, at this point in time, is the lack of rear disc brakes. Drums are just fail, but that is only an issue if you drive like a jack ass on some twisty road. And even then, you could import what you need to convert to rear discs from Japan.

Also consider the Paseo... the same chassis, engine, and all that, just a slightly different looking package all around.

 

[Max_DC]

A Police Interceptor Crown Vic can be had for real cheap as well. They're built like tanks and were heavy duty everything so you can accidentally hit a curb and not have to worry. Yes they may be 18ft long, but after owning mine for a few months now, I'm surprised everyday at the maneuverability of this thing. The 4.6L may seem a little thirsty but for a 4000lb+ car I get around 21-24mpg in the city if you're light on the pedal. They're also incredibly comfortable. Very cushioned soft ride but when it comes to cornering, it even surprises me with its great handling. Thanks in part to the Police Interceptor's suspension which has Ford's "Severe Duty" suspension that has higher rate coil springs. So a way stiffer ride than a normal crown vic, keep in mind the normal crown vic doesn't even have rear anti roll bars and the P.I.'s do. It's the perfect car to just cruise along in. No one passes you. You also get respect on the road, no more tailgaters or people cutting you off. People stare and turns their heads when you drive by like you're driving some sort of rare sports car. It's great fun. I know you'd prefer something without a slushbox, but don't forget that the Mustang's 5spd is a popular swap into these things. Definitely something I'll be doing down the road. The auto in Police Interceptor is pretty decent as well. As the Police Interceptor's transmission is programed to shift harder and firmer than a standard crown victoria, hell it'll even chirp the tires going into 2nd. Pretty much a great bang for buck combo you get with these cars. Hell I only paid $2500 for mine.

Now I know beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Some people may think it's an ugly big 4 door american car, but she's a real looker in my eyes.

Absolutely awesome !👍

 

[EA11R]

Wow, quite a lot of responses here. I apologize in advance for the absurdly long reply list, but I prefer to be thorough.

beauty is in the eye of the beholder. as soon as you get YOUR car, you will love it, regardless of what it is. just get something reliable...

I never said cooolness was a good thing. When I see drivers of the coolest cars (Mustang GTs, anything German that's still under warranty, et cetera), I just see annoying people. There are reasons to choose a cool car, but people choose cool cars, unfortunately, because they are cool. I don't worry about impressing others with my car; I worry about whether or not I like it. And since my parents drive such hateful cars, I view almost anything as totally wonderful. I guaruntee, I will have an unhealthy affection for my first car.

Interesting to see that someone sees the old brick as cool... I just see it as what it was back then, something of a high class car with style that is hard to put a finger on. It just has that style, even after 20 years. I don't even know the words to describe it but it used to be the car of choice for the rich estate owners and the spirit still lives in the sturdy and (in its own odd way) expensive feel of the car.

It's just absolutely well-proportioned as a car, it's got this stately fashion to it. Form following function, if you will. It's not a popular view, certainly, but I do like it rather a lot.

Well, slowness is a relative thing but you're not going to do 0-60 in less than ten seconds with a stock non-turbo model. I haven't tried with mine but 12 seconds is probably a quite safe bet. About the safety, I know a guy who crashed his 240 into a wooden lamp post at 50 mph (fell asleep at the wheel) and walked away. The car was fully repairable. It has crumple zones both at the front and the rear and is built like a tank all round.

That sounds very close to what I seek, noticably yet not shamefully below average acceleration (10.8sec). Also, excellent safety.

*Plethora of helpful detail*

I kinda figured the seat would be smallish, but I wanted to make sure it wasn't actually the size of a studio apartment. That would be a bit embarassing... Cool that the ratios are intact in GT4, I'll check those out. I'll be able to tell my dad, "The drivetrain is strong enough for the power of Mustang V8 in rally racing, it'll do here." He's American, so that's much better than "300hp" to him, especially since his 2-car garage collectively has 620hp; he's used to high numbers. Trust, I won't be allowed to buy earlier than '86, so no worries there. But, excellent knowledge! And my dad will surely love the "bigger is better" engine policy. Faster, more efficient, bigger! Everybody wins. Thanks for the huge amount of detail there, I'll definitely note that when searching! 👍 Of course, I'll want to act like I've known all that for years.

Isn't a Austin Se7en basically a classic Mini? Be prepared to spend stupid amounts of money for one that is in pretty poor condition.

That's precisely what it is, which is why I took care to label it as unattainable and perfect. Or did I leave that out?

I would go with a Toyota Tercel, a buddy back in high school had one although I don't remember the year. The thing just wouldn't break and he drove it like it was a Ferrari. It was decently fast and fun too, not to mention cheap on insurance and easy on fuel consumption.

It seems many extol the virtues of lightweight Toyotas. That's totally a possibility.

IMO the best first car is a Mercedes 240D. You wont get anywhere fast, it's heavy and slow, and safe. You definitely want a stick as the auto redefines and emphasises slow.

Seats are flat though.

You can also get cheap Mercedes 300Es in that price range.
But beware the old adage "there is no car more expensive than a cheap Mercedes."

I absolutely love old Mercs, but they're collectively a big no-no, because my family knows how expensive they can be. Well, kinda. They were horrified that the engine for a 300SL was $12K. Is that a lot? I don't exactly buy engines often, and I only know that an RB26DETT is $18K and an LS7 is $12K.

You don't sound like the type to tune a car. Civics can be the most anonymous cars on the road and they can also be some of the most individualized and recognizable, but of course not without some money and work. So, no Civic for you then.

I have the utmost respect for a car in the exact condition in which it leaves the factory. Even products like Armorall shiny-wipe thingies anger the engineers who dull selective surfaces in the car to avoid sunlight-dazzle. I will only alter any car in 3 ways: "OEM Plus," basically using parts from the manufacturer that perhaps were never put in the specific model; Exquisite, thorough, and high-quality tuning, perhaps like Mine's or Spoon; and obnoxiously, hilariously bad tuning, like bosozoku-style (google it, you won't be disappointed.).

I guarantee you that just about any car with no more than two front airbags, a mechanical throttle linkage, proper hydraulic brakes and steering, and no stability/traction control of any sort will bring back the feeling of "movement". I know exactly what you're saying, thus I bought a Civic that's 10 years old now. Even something a new as a Mazda Protege is relatively uncommon and unassumingly sporty. And if you man up you can make it much more sporty, noisy, rattly, and generally more "mechanical" feeling than even it's 5+ year old structure should feel.

Wow, I totally forgot Mazda existed! Odd...

Not crappy enough for you? There comes a time to trade the unrefined-machine-like qualities--basically, crappiness--you're looking for for some reliability and livability, as many of my friends' swapped and tuned Civics have taught me. Mine might be a little heavier and not slammed and not tuned, but hey, at least it starts every time and I don't have to screw with it. Busted-ass vehicles don't impress girls either, unless you find a big burly man-woman who works at the local Jiffy Lube.

I don't necesarily want the falling-apart sort of crappy as much as the utterly unimpressive sort of crappy. In my opinion, a car can be both utterly unimpressive and still quite handsome, though. I'm definitely looking for reliability, hence I don't dive to the Jettasphere. And I'm looking to impress noone at all, as I said a bit earlier. If I want to impress, I try to do it personally, not have my belongings do it for me. And if I fail to impress, then I am unimpressive. I'm okay with that.

Having owned an MKIII Jetta (1996 Wolfsburg), I'm usually one to recommend the cars with caution. Overall, the're pretty decent cars. I like the way they ride-out and drive, the fuel mileage isn't half bad, and depending on if you're in a VW-friendly area, parts and service can be had for cheap.

VW... Friendly? I had no idea words could be used like that!

I personally would try to avoid the earlier cars, as there were a lot of production problems down at the Mexico plant. The 1996+ models are usually a fair bit more reliable, but keeping in mind that it is a VW, thats never an exact science. If you can, check for 98 and 99 models, they seem to fair quite a bit better overall. The power windows, as I recall, seem to have a lot of problems. As do the distributors and plug wires on the 2.0L 8V. Other than that, look out for transmission issues as well. My Jetta died because of some stupid thing that a lot of MKIII cars go out on, one of my dealer friends had at least three Jettas and Golf suffering from the same problem that I had on his lot.

BUT! A good Jetta or Golf in decent condition can be an incredibly enjoyable experience. I still miss driving that car on a regular basis, but I've moved on and committed to my Celica for now. The main thing is not getting screwed over on price. I still think some of those Jettas hold their value a little too well, so shop around if you're interested.

Yeah, I absolutely love the Mk3 Jetta I rode in, despite the fact that nearly nothing was working as it should have been. I probably would get one if I find an absurdly good deal, but I'm a bit wary of VAG products. Especially from Mexico. But, anyway: What sort of transmission issues? Kinda left me hanging there. My brother lost his A4 to a transmission problem, so I can't really convince my parents to let me get one unless I know a way around that. My sister has is female, so they patronizingly plopped her in a Beetle, but it's a bit more difficult for me.

A Police Interceptor Crown Vic can be had for real cheap as well. They're built like tanks and were heavy duty everything so you can accidentally hit a curb and not have to worry.

*snip*

I'd considered that idea for a very long time indeed! Actually, I haven't checked to see whether my dad accepts it. My mom definitely doesn't, but she rejects everything and assumes it'll be brimmed with bodily fluids. People ignore her, as is wise to do. This is the exception to my rule denouncing cool cars. Technically, it's enormously cool and not particularly good-looking, but I love the effect regardless. Not to mention, it's very unique. It's a shame it's fast; that means that exciting driving is very, very illegal, so I'll never get to do it. That's why I want slow, clumsy, old cars. I wonder how old I could find a car like this, without a novelty-based price markup?

Back on the topic, I still can't stress how great a Tercel is for a first car. The only real complaint I can toss at the car, at this point in time, is the lack of rear disc brakes. Drums are just fail, but that is only an issue if you drive like a jack ass on some twisty road. And even then, you could import what you need to convert to rear discs from Japan.

Also consider the Paseo... the same chassis, engine, and all that, just a slightly different looking package all around.

Hmmmm... I have no response, really, but those are good things to know.

It seems like my list, in order of preference, will be: Volvo, Tercel/Paseo, Jetta, Interceptor.

My god, that last one sounds cool. That alone is worth $900, minimum.

 

[Azuremen]

If you want, I can talk to my house mate regarding Mazda. He has owned a couple of early '90's Proteges, one or two 323's from the 80's, and his girlfriend has an NA Miata with 1.6 Liter. Oh, and he has an Escort GT that is more or less an MX-3 with the Miata 1.8 Liter.

His Escort. I've taken it for a spin and it is quite fun to drive. With the intake and exhaust, pulls a little harder than my MR-S.

 

[eiriksmil]

Gotta say Mk3 is the way to go. A million parts for them, they are good to drive and look great.

 

[EA11R]

Darn. I can't show you the place where good Volkswagen pictures lie because it's in GTPremium Section. Basically: Those are sinful.

Also: Mk3 Jolfs look oddly harmonious. Jetta nose + Golf = something truly hot.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

FB-chassis RX-7.

1979-1985.

The 12A won't get you into too much trouble, they're reasonably good handling, reasonably efficient, and reasonably reliable.

 

[eiriksmil]

Darn. I can't show you the place where good Volkswagen pictures lie because it's in GTPremium Section. Basically: Those are sinful.

Also: Mk3 Jolfs look oddly harmonious. Jetta nose + Golf = something truly hot.

VWVortex, Edition38, plus some at Cleaned.be.

 

[Keef]

"OEM Plus,"

You're in luck! It just so happens that about 90% of Honda tuning is "OEM Plus" as you call it. See, because we all strive to make our Civics and Integras perform like one of these:

If your Civic doesn't have rear brakes, it's okay. Steal the hubs off your neighbor's Si or Integra. Need a bigger engine? Steal it from your neighbor's Integra. New wheels? The Integras are an inch taller and at least a half-inch wider. Too much understeer? The rear sway bar from an Integra or preferably a Civic Type R will fix you right up. And you've got a very extensive list of the best aftermarket manufacturers around providing parts you didn't even know you needed, like Cusco's brake master cylinder brace.

Civics are pretty baller.