Affordable Ferrari California

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exigeracer

exigeracer

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I could've sworn there was a thread on this, but I couldn't find it. Looks like we'll be seeing a new Ferrari model in the next few months. I gotta admit, with Ferrari recently toying around with the Millechili (sp?) concept and mentioning other simplistic lightweight options, I am actually interested in this car. Here's some general info:

www.carfever.com
Ferraris were always the sign of the millionaires, especially the Enzo, and the magnificent P 4/5. Porsches like the 911 seem to be on the wish lists of many aspiring enthusiasts who don’t have that much money as the Ferrari owners, but the Maranello based company is just about to smash those budget line options of Porsches and Mercedes …. The first Ferrari for the average rich guy and not just ultra rich dudes is called the “F149′. At least that’s the project name.

So far, there are four segements of Ferrari’s: There’s the rear mid engine based F430, being the cheapest at $170K. The there’s the front engined 599 GTB Fiorano, the 612 Scagletti and the untouchable Enzo-FXX.

The new Ferrari F149 would be cheaper than the F430 — simpy to compete with the 911 and Mercedes SL — and will be fitted with a new 4.7 Liter engine, with somewhere around 480 Hp. Which should give the F149 a 0-60mph under 4.0 seconds. And for sure, the easiest achievable Ferrari will feature a bunch more gadgets and toys like an iPod charger.

The F149 will be revealed at Paris Motor Show later this year.
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http://www.carfever.net/?p=237

2450828300_dec45cfd32_m.jpg


Thoughts? Does offering a cheap model tarnish Ferrari's exclusive image? Will they go the quasi-rebranding route of naming it the Dino, like in the past?
 
I wouldn't mind the Dino name coming back. Or they could call it by a D prefix instead of F and such.
 
They (Ferrari) keep saying that the Dino name won't come back, but it nevertheless is a good idea if you ask me. If Ferrari wishes to remain profitable and have an easier time meeting all of these new fuel regulations, they're going to need one of these little guys running around to make ends meet. Granted, using the Alfa engine may minimize the "special" nature of the car, but after all, its still a Ferrari.... And nothing will change that.

Makes you wonder though, how "cheap" is cheap when it comes to the Ferrari name? My guess is that a $120K area seems like a reasonable starting place, particularly against the SL, but what exactly that means altogether is still a bit "iffy."
 
A nice competitor to all those low level 2 door GTs would be nice from Ferrari. I think if they don't do this they're tarnishing their image, like saying "they're for rich boys only- get lost".
 
YSSMAN
Granted, using the Alfa engine may minimize the "special" nature of the car<SNIP>
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According to C&D, this car is based on the Maserati GranTurismo.

If this ends up being true, the V8 was originally a Ferrari unit anyway.


M
 
Hmmm, interesting. So it may be cheaper than I had thought?

Hey, as long as I can row my own gears and they manage to skip the dreadful F1-style setup they put in the Maseratis, they'll do just fine.
 
Gotta love spy tape! Uglifies ANY car.

Well, I don't necessarily think offering a lower-priced model hurts Ferrari's image in any such way. In fact, it helps it a bit. More people would be able to buy a Ferrari (loosely speaking) without having to have almost $200K for a new Ferrari. Think about Porsche for a moment. Most people know them for some of their really fast and capable six-figure cars. However, they've also been known to be a sports car maker you can drive daily. You could enjoy a new Porsche for more than $50K. That's a good deal when you begin to talk about higher-end sports cars. The Boxster is still a very capable car even in its base form. There's also the Cayenne lineup that means Porsche performance... while letting a few other occupants enjoy Porsche power. Having a great sports car for lower prices can be exceptional if you want to experience a car from a high-end make.

It looks like Ferrari's going for some kind of fastback to be their new Ferrari. The proportions of this car suggest some kind of fastback. Perhaps they're going for either a baby F430 (which I wouldn't mind) or a smaller 612 Scaglietti. I wouldn't even mind if Ferrari shrunk down the 599 to make a great front/RWD car for those who don't have too much money. Maybe whatever Ferrari is envisioning could be a cross of an F430 front with a 599 GTB Fiorano rear. Pricing for this car will probably be in the range of $80K to $150K depending on how much Ferrari wants to make this affordable to people. A 4.8 liter V8 at 480hp doesn't seem like what a very cheaply-priced car could have. The adding of iPod chargers and such would mean that this car probably has to be priced fairly low so that you're not noting that only rich people with iPods drive Ferraris. It's very unlikely a high school Senior or a college Freshman would have the money to buy this F149 or pay car notes to get this car.

The absolute longshot to this would be Ferrari making a car to rival an entry-level Porsche Boxster and be in the price range of that. It would mean that even more people could enjoy Ferraris without having to spend too much for a new model or be relegated to purchasing older and cheaply-priced Ferraris. Once again, this does not tarnish Ferrari's image in my view. What would tarnish Ferrari's image is if they do the following:

* make a FWD station wagon (or estate car) With 300hp
* make a pickup truck with 4WD and towing capacity of 5,000 lbs.
* design a supermini (even with RWD)
* make a luxury SUV to rival the classic Lamborghini LM002 ( http://www.lamborghiniregistry.com/LM002 )
* make their own commercial van or big rig

This will only make Ferrari easier for people who don't have enough to get even an F430. Sports cars cost sports car money (unless you're the MX-5 or the Solstice). I just read this F149 is based on the Maserati GranTurismo. Here's a picture for comparison (courtesy of a photo gallery on motortrend.com):

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/112_0710_2008_maserati_granturismo/photo_01.html (gallery begins with this link)

112_0710_04z+2008_maserati_granturismo+front_three_quarter_view.jpg


I'm not a real fan of Maserati. Just never liked the looks of Maseratis. Ferrari may be able to crank out a wicked design that will make people want it. Those spy shots are just those- spy shots. Whose to say that Ferrari won't be able to design a beautiful and capable car? Even if the new design is a throwback to the Dino 246, I'm happy with it. The last front/RWD Ferrari I've loved in terms of style and performance was the 599 series. Maybe with the success of this F149, we may start seeing the more hardcore versions. Stuff like a Stradale, Scuderia, and that sort of thing. I'm hopeful for this car.
 
nissan tuner
their own creation says so

*snip*

capable? yes

beautiful? yeah right..
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Don't make me post a Micra, or even the side profile of a 350Z soft-top.


I felt it was always inevitable that Ferrari would bring out a "cheaper" model, it's not getting any cheaper to make cars but the sports car market is still quite buoyant in the middle ground.

It'll be interesting if they can make a car on such a budget and keep the spirit of ferrari alive in it, something which some manufacturers have been critisized for when dropping into lower price brackets (Bentley Conti GT, AM V8 though that seems less so now, spring to mind.)
 
Are you kidding me? I LOVE the F430. I think it's a beautiful car (to each their own). Love this as well as the model it replaced- the 360 Modena. As far as front/RWD Ferraris go, I never really liked the 550 Maranello or the 575 lookswise. Just never caught on to me to where I'd love it as much as the 360 Modena (at the time).

I won't get too far off-topic, so I'll just end it there. It's still too early to judge this car. Wait until the Paris Auto Show. Maybe the new design may reverse your criticism (that is, if it doesn't look like Chris Bangle secretly worked on this car's design).
 
Ferraris are just beautiful, even if in a bluntly utilitarian way. One must understand the past glories of Ferrari to comprehend their designs, apparently. I like the F430, and I cannot stop thinking of the 156 model from 1961 that took Phil Hill to the World Championship whenever I see the modern car.

They have clearly departed from their old route, though, but that's not necessarily hideous.

On top of that, an entry-level Ferrari would have been a sensible idea before the savage onslaught of marketing tools came (like the Segway and rocking horse). Now the promise is negated and thus appears cheap.
 
Affordable? By whose standards? :p

No, seriously, I would expect this car to still be $135-$145K base, and around $180K when you finally get your options.
 
This is usually rare... any car I deem beautiful is ugly to 50+ percent of other people. Conversely, most cars I've disliked stylewise are works of genius to most others.
=
On the topic of a cheaply-priced Ferrari, do you think what makes Ferraris cool can be crammed into a small package? I usually think exclusivity and complete enjoyment of driving are what I associate Ferrari with. Maybe someone in Ferrari management thinks that Ferraris are still amazing cars. Only thing is, they may want to get a bit away from the exclusivity deal to give buyers a chance to buy a Ferrari that's under the current entry level car. Even if the newer entry-level model is one cent less than the current entry level car, it's still a great deal to have an entry-level Ferrari. The best case would be Ferrari cramming in as much as possible without going over, say... $75K. There could be MORE Ferraris on the road if Ferrari's entry-level sports car is in the range of $50K to $75K. That's actually a favorable price range for a company like Ferrari. Most of you would die to have a five-figure new Ferrari. Question for Ferrari is, how low can you go (prices, that is)?
 
To my taste ferrari has been making nicer cars last couple of year with the f430 and the 599. I hated the looks of the enzo, 550 & 575

Ontopic: Its good for ferrari to make such a car company wise, maybe it will damage the reputation but still its a ferrari and its still not really cheap! 175.000euro would be a nice starting point :) it will be cheaper as the f430 and sl 65 amg, even the sl 55 amg, and would cost about the same as the top range 911.
 
JohnBM01
This is usually rare... any car I deem beautiful is ugly to 50+ percent of other people. Conversely, most cars I've disliked stylewise are works of genius to most others.
=
On the topic of a cheaply-priced Ferrari, do you think what makes Ferraris cool can be crammed into a small package? I usually think exclusivity and complete enjoyment of driving are what I associate Ferrari with. Maybe someone in Ferrari management thinks that Ferraris are still amazing cars. Only thing is, they may want to get a bit away from the exclusivity deal to give buyers a chance to buy a Ferrari that's under the current entry level car. Even if the newer entry-level model is one cent less than the current entry level car, it's still a great deal to have an entry-level Ferrari. The best case would be Ferrari cramming in as much as possible without going over, say... $75K. There could be MORE Ferraris on the road if Ferrari's entry-level sports car is in the range of $50K to $75K. That's actually a favorable price range for a company like Ferrari. Most of you would die to have a five-figure new Ferrari. Question for Ferrari is, how low can you go (prices, that is)?
Click to expand...

You're dreaming if you think there'll ever be a 5 figure Ferrari. Dealer markup is a bitch.

edit: Hey guys, I got an exclusive leak of the final car design.

ferraricheaprw7.png


Only took me 10 minutes to draw. :D
 
Actually I think it looks alot like....

smart-roadster-coupe.jpg


Maybe Ferrari are releasing a 480hp V8 Smart Roadster?
 
Casio
Actually I think it looks alot like....

smart-roadster-coupe.jpg


Maybe Ferrari are releasing a 480hp V8 Smart Roadster?
Click to expand...

Wow, it does. ... And I've never seen that car.

Anyway, I find it hard to believe that the final model will be as ridiculously long-looking as that mule. So, I made it real short. :)

It also kind of looks like an SLK mixed with a Cayman.
 
*McLaren*
Affordable? By whose standards? :p

No, seriously, I would expect this car to still be $135-$145K base, and around $180K when you finally get your options.
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Porsche style.

So basically it'll be just that cheap enough so that when by the time you add an F1 gearbox and Ceramic breaks you may aswell go for the next model up with more horse power but fewer options.
 
If it will have some sort of resemblance to the Maserati Granturismo, then I don't think it's going to be extremely expensive. Base price for a 2007 Ferrari F430 (according to edmunds.com) is $173,079 MSRP. So one has to imagine just how much can Ferrari can put into a small and cheaply-priced super sports car and for how much?

I still predict the longshot being in the range of $50K to $75K. Ferrari may be able to go down to about an $80K car, which would put it up with the Dodge Viper and the Cadillac XLR-V. They could realistically make a car down to about $115K to just under $130K. "Affordable" has to be defined better. How affordable would Ferrari plan to make this car? Seems like I'd have to go to Modena and ask this question myself. Only thing is, it would be a case of "I'll tell you, but I'd have to kill you." So I'd rather not take my chances... damn!



[UPDATE] Since we're talking Porsche standards, let me offer up some estimated Porsche prices according to the Porsche website ( http://www.porsche.com ) for comparison:

base Boxster: $45,800 USD
high-end Boxster (Limited Edition Boxster S): $59,900 USD

base Cayman: $49,400 USD
high-end Cayman (Cayman S): $59,100

base 911 (911 Carerra): $73,500 USD
high-end 911 (911 GT2): $191,700 USD

base Cayenne: $43,000 USD (no wonder why I see these occassionally)
high-end Cayenne (Cayenne Turbo): $93,700 USD



I chose the 911 GT2 over the 911 GT3 since it was the most powerful and most capable of them. Thing is, you don't hear much about the Porsche 911 GT2 as much as you hear about the 911 GT3 series. I offered these Porsches for comparison as far as pricing goes. You may do your own research as to what you're getting for the money. The 911 GT3 RS costs about $124,900; which is cheaper than the $134K-ish Ferrari F430. A high-end version of this F149 would be in the range of the 911 GT2. As far as a really high-end affordable Ferrari, that is. What do you all think?
 
GT2 doesn't count because it doesn't have A/C.
 

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