Am I the only one offended? (PSM Magazine)

[darkblade986]

Preword: I know I'm new. I learned of this site via GameFAQ's message boards of this place, and I figured I'd look around. Like what I see so I plan to stay. Now then, to what I have to say.


I am a subscriber to PlayStation: The Official Magazine (formerly PSM). Today I received my July issue of the magazine, and included was an article entitled "Gran Turismo 5: Online Survival Guide." This caught my attention immediately, and I must say that I have lost some respect for them now.

The guide covered several strategies that I saw, understood and use myself now and learned through observation. For example, it talks about using the Corvette Z06 and the Lancer Evo X/Tuned. However, towards the end of the article, they crossed a boundary which prompted me to write an angry letter of scorn to them. The part in question (from the article) read the following:

"[talk about cutting down on collisions in S-Class events due to penalties]. This cuts down on the destruction derby attitude of beginner level races, but that doesn't mean a little hard nose racing can't be advantageous. In fact, if you're going to tag someone, make sure it's the most skilled racer and take him out hard. If you're lucky, you'll spin him so far off the tract that your eight-second penalty will be a mere fraction of his recovery time.... Yes, it's super dirty, but you won't care when you're collecting your credits in the winners circle."

The final paragraph also talks about using the Brake Check to give your opponent a penalty for hitting you. I can't believe what I read from these guys. These guys openly advocated dirty tricks that any self respecting racer would never make.

Is the offense I took to this article justified? Does anyone else feel like these guys, as an "official" magazine, should've taken a less aggressive and a more realistic approach to this article?

 

[91hondawagon]

Is the offense I took to this article justified? Does anyone else feel like these guys, as an "official" magazine, should've taken a less aggressive and a more realistic approach to this article?

Who cares? Punters will be punters, and we will avoid them as best we can. We aren't "real" racers. We're gamers. All (or at least most) of us here don't punt and won't be motivated to change our tactics just because an "official" article recommends we race dirty. You can write them a letter, but in the end, it's irrelevant. Good racers will race well, bad racers won't. An "official" article will do absolutely nothing to change that.

Sorry if I seem a bit angry and bitter, but I got punted a lot tonight, and it looks like the Red Wings are going to blow it again. Welcome to GTP, and we're all happy to race (cleanly, of course) with you.

 

[angelx]

I think PD should be enraged by this article because it doesnt promote real racing, which is what GT is all about. PSN is Hurting the GT reputation with this article and might even decrease future sales in my opinion. I i read an article about a game and it says this is what people are and should do then i would more than likely stay away from that said game.

 

[Earth]

"[talk about cutting down on collisions in S-Class events due to penalties]. This cuts down on the destruction derby attitude of beginner level races, but that doesn't mean a little hard nose racing can't be advantageous. In fact, if you're going to tag someone, make sure it's the most skilled racer and take him out hard. If you're lucky, you'll spin him so far off the tract that your eight-second penalty will be a mere fraction of his recovery time.... Yes, it's super dirty, but you won't care when you're collecting your credits in the winners circle."

Sounds like a decent strategy that GT5P online allows you to carry out and win with

The real racecar drivers in GT5P don't use this strategy and end up losing to those who do

They're not glitching or hacking so I say the strategy is fine until PD decides it's not and fixes online to show that it's not

 

[NLxAROSA]

Don't blame PSM magazine, blame PD for introducing a crappy penalty system. These are the rules set out by the game itself, it's only logical people will play by them. Is it nice? No. Does it work? Oh, hell yeah!

 

[Parnelli Bone]

Preword: I know I'm new. I learned of this site via GameFAQ's message boards of this place, and I figured I'd look around. Like what I see so I plan to stay. Now then, to what I have to say.


I am a subscriber to PlayStation: The Official Magazine (formerly PSM). Today I received my July issue of the magazine, and included was an article entitled "Gran Turismo 5: Online Survival Guide." This caught my attention immediately, and I must say that I have lost some respect for them now.

The guide covered several strategies that I saw, understood and use myself now and learned through observation. For example, it talks about using the Corvette Z06 and the Lancer Evo X/Tuned. However, towards the end of the article, they crossed a boundary which prompted me to write an angry letter of scorn to them. The part in question (from the article) read the following:

"[talk about cutting down on collisions in S-Class events due to penalties]. This cuts down on the destruction derby attitude of beginner level races, but that doesn't mean a little hard nose racing can't be advantageous. In fact, if you're going to tag someone, make sure it's the most skilled racer and take him out hard. If you're lucky, you'll spin him so far off the tract that your eight-second penalty will be a mere fraction of his recovery time.... Yes, it's super dirty, but you won't care when you're collecting your credits in the winners circle."

The final paragraph also talks about using the Brake Check to give your opponent a penalty for hitting you. I can't believe what I read from these guys. These guys openly advocated dirty tricks that any self respecting racer would never make.

Is the offense I took to this article justified? Does anyone else feel like these guys, as an "official" magazine, should've taken a less aggressive and a more realistic approach to this article?

Wow.

Is this article in regards to online racing with other players, or is it in regards to sim racing against the Ai? If the first is true (racing against human players online) that would offend me. It teaches an entire new generation of players that it's "okay" to be dirty...as if GT is some sort of arcade game.

If the second is true (race dirty against the Ai) it doesn't offend me but it does shock me that someone would write it, totally oblivious to how the racing world actually works.

I get the feeling that whoever wrote that article is a lunkhead who managed to squeeze his GT5 tips in between a review of Madden and a game of Red Faction. In other words, he's or she's not really serious about racing games and misses the entire point of GT.

 

[Poncha]

Wow.

Is this article in regards to online racing with other players, or is it in regards to sim racing against the Ai? If the first is true (racing against human players online) that would offend me. It teaches an entire new generation of players that it's "okay" to be dirty...as if GT is some sort of arcade game.

If the second is true (race dirty against the Ai) it doesn't offend me but it does shock me that someone would write it, totally oblivious to how the racing world actually works.

I get the feeling that whoever wrote that article is a lunkhead who managed to squeeze his GT5 tips in between a review of Madden and a game of Red Faction. In other words, he's or she's not really serious about racing games and misses the entire point of GT.

Amen to that! I'm offended too, but if anything I feel sorry for the person/people who wrote that, as they're not realising the potential and fun that is derived from clean, wheel to wheel racing.

Sure, they may have fun earning credits and buying cars, but if their method of enjoyment impedes upon that of the group (i.e. GTP members and other clean racers) that the game is predominantly designed for, that's just not cricket in my books.

But in the end, my online experiences have been top-notch due to racing with clean guys (most of which are from GTP), so i doubt one article will dramatically change this 👍

 

[angelx]

Sure, they may have fun earning credits and buying cars, but if their method of enjoyment impedes upon that of the group (i.e. GTP members and other clean racers) that the game is predominantly designed for, that's just not cricket in my books.

I agree 100%

honestly, i never even played against the AI in this game. Not even once have i attempted and offline race against the AI, i have been doing it since GT1 - 4 and am tired of racing the AI. If someone wants credits so badly that they need to ruin someone else's race then they should just download a save and learn how to drive clean.

I downloaded a save and all i do is tune, test, and race cars online.

 

[Parnelli Bone]

Amen to that! I'm offended too, but if anything I feel sorry for the person/people who wrote that, as they're not realising the potential and fun that is derived from clean, wheel to wheel racing.

Sure, they may have fun earning credits and buying cars, but if their method of enjoyment impedes upon that of the group (i.e. GTP members and other clean racers) that the game is predominantly designed for, that's just not cricket in my books.

But in the end, my online experiences have been top-notch due to racing with clean guys (most of which are from GTP), so i doubt one article will dramatically change this 👍

No, one article won't change things, but it adds to the issue. I would think.

I mean, if it's sim racing, fine...go ahead and knock other cars out. The writer is only cheating himself in the long run cuz he won't have the skillz necessary to race anyone cleanly. But if it's online/human racing, it's really bad--akin to a poker player double-decking or a linebacker tripping a quarterback on purpose (rather than tackling him the way football is supposed to be played).

 

[chris0]

Don't blame PSM magazine, blame PD for introducing a crappy penalty system. These are the rules set out by the game itself, it's only logical people will play by them. Is it nice? No. Does it work? Oh, hell yeah!

It may be PD's fault for allowing and rewarding that type of driving but that doesn't mean it needs to be encouraged by any reviewer. I would hope that there's an editor's note in there somewhere stating that the magazine doesn't officially encourage that type of behavior. Certainly the article is online somewhere, how about a link darkblade986?

 

[thegide]

Preword: I know I'm new. I learned of this site via GameFAQ's message boards of this place, and I figured I'd look around. Like what I see so I plan to stay. Now then, to what I have to say.


I am a subscriber to PlayStation: The Official Magazine (formerly PSM). Today I received my July issue of the magazine, and included was an article entitled "Gran Turismo 5: Online Survival Guide." This caught my attention immediately, and I must say that I have lost some respect for them now.

The guide covered several strategies that I saw, understood and use myself now and learned through observation. For example, it talks about using the Corvette Z06 and the Lancer Evo X/Tuned. However, towards the end of the article, they crossed a boundary which prompted me to write an angry letter of scorn to them. The part in question (from the article) read the following:

"[talk about cutting down on collisions in S-Class events due to penalties]. This cuts down on the destruction derby attitude of beginner level races, but that doesn't mean a little hard nose racing can't be advantageous. In fact, if you're going to tag someone, make sure it's the most skilled racer and take him out hard. If you're lucky, you'll spin him so far off the tract that your eight-second penalty will be a mere fraction of his recovery time.... Yes, it's super dirty, but you won't care when you're collecting your credits in the winners circle."

The final paragraph also talks about using the Brake Check to give your opponent a penalty for hitting you. I can't believe what I read from these guys. These guys openly advocated dirty tricks that any self respecting racer would never make.

Is the offense I took to this article justified? Does anyone else feel like these guys, as an "official" magazine, should've taken a less aggressive and a more realistic approach to this article?

I would suggest writing a letter to the editor. While the mag may be packed with hints and cheats, crossing beyond ethical online gaming behavior is going too far, and they shouldn't be advertising or encouraging it. Plain and simple it destroys online gaming components.

The message is loud and clear: "If you can't win, cheat". Fine for offline gameplay if that suits your style, but when it can ruin another's gaming experience it's definitely not ok.

 

[P3nT4gR4m]

You do realise the 'official' mags aren't worth the paper they're printed on? Unbiased is not a word in these guys vocabulary.

That said the reviewer was a complete asshat and I doubt if PD, SCEE and, subsequently, his employers would be too happy about this. If you want to stir up some brown stuff I'd say email PD rather than PSM - more chance for epic lulz

 

[DustDriver]

Maybe this writer was fed up with the punters too and this article is completely sarcastic?

 

[Famine]

It's a strategy guide. It tells you how to win.

I can't even act shocked that a strategy guide tells you to use loopholes to win.

 

[AERO_HDT]

I have never found decent information in gaming reviews lately. The standard of journalism has fallen to such incredible lows that it doesn't surprise me that rubbish like that is printed and dirty racing advocated because it just goes to show how much the chaps who write about this stuff really know about games. One night playing a game is probably all they'll get and that generally qualifies them to write in-depth articles about the game and publish it to the masses.

Maybe all the punters should add PSM_ as a prefix to their name?

LOL!

 

[Vagabond]

It's a strategy guide. It tells you how to win.

I can't even act shocked that a strategy guide tells you to use loopholes to win.

Loophole: Turn right after Spoon on Suzuka and your car will teleport to the chicane.

A**hole: Win by annoying just about everyone else on the track and continue to drive more nails in the coffin of online GT5P.

It won't encourage new drivers to join in and enjoy online racing, it will create more frustration as the new punter constantly gets punted by someone more experienced in punting. The number of quitters will increase and thanks to Agnes (see PD Server thread) many of them will also be race hosts. Stress levels increase as do prescriptions for anti-depressants... GT sales drop and we have also contributed to the drug-dependant modern way of life as sales of citalopram go through the roof.

"Careless talk costs lives" - Douglas Adams

This reckless journalism may well have doomed the entire human race.

Drink up, the world's about to end.

 

[darkblade986]

I guess I should have clarified (although I thought it was obvious). The guide is in reference to online racing against other people.

@chris0: Unfortunately, the guide isn't online (or if it is, I don't know of it). I actually typed those portions straight out of the magazine to here.

@thegide: I already sent off that letter and basically what I said is this - if you're going to support wrecking, either go where it's supposed to happen (Burnout) or do it where no one will care in 3 months (like a NASCAR game).

@AERO_HOT: "One night playing a game is probably all they'll get..." The guide even went so far as to give tips on something the writer has no experience with. Case in point, the writer writes the following: "...aim to pick up an Amuse S2000 GTI Turbo and a Concept by Gran Turismo Ford GT LM Spec II Test Car. I'm using empirical rather than personal data... as neither of these are in my garage yet." Isn't this like the golden rule of reviewing to back up your information with experience rather than observation?

 

[Famine]

Loophole: Turn right after Spoon on Suzuka and your car will teleport to the chicane.

That'd be a glitch, or possibly even a cheat.

A**hole: Win by annoying just about everyone else on the track and continue to drive more nails in the coffin of online GT5P.

You can win races by driving like an arse. This isn't exactly news and, for those who just care about winning, it classes as a strategy. Why the surprise? Games magazines have been printing guides on how to douche your way to 100% in every game ever made since the first one was published. People want shortcuts and cheats.

 

[P3nT4gR4m]

The bit I find really pathetic is that this wasn't a half arsed review of a game, based on little or no experience which we'd expect from the likes of PSM.

"EA/SONY/SEGA have paid a lot of money for us to say the following about this great/wonderful/breathtaking game...."

No this is a "guide" written by someone who admits they have very little experience with the game. What's it they say about the blind reading the blind?

 

[Parnelli Bone]

It's a strategy guide. It tells you how to win.

I can't even act shocked that a strategy guide tells you to use loopholes to win.

Well, it tells you how to cheat. Winning can be achieved by cheating or by not cheating. All this guide does is explain how to exploit a situation if you're not good enough to do it the right way.

 

[Poncha]

No, one article won't change things, but it adds to the issue. I would think.

Absolutely. Not the kind of propaganda that should be spread.

I also agree that it's hardly surprising that such a "guide" has been produced for people to "advance" (i.e. credits and cars) in the game. Some gamers will always strive to find the easiest route for such advancement.
But IMHO, i've had a great online experience (bar the punters of course), and I believe I will continue to do so despite such articles, due to people (i.e. clean, fast racers) on forums such at this

 

[muffolini]

I'm guessing the average age of the OPSM reader is quite young (no disrespect meant, but I only read OPSM when I was around 9 or 10). I therefore believe that this article is aimed at these younger drivers (both from sentence structure, and language used) who perhaps aren't very skilled and who have very little idea about the general etiquette of racing. To them, this rough and tumble racing appeals more, and results in wins.

Obviously, I may be completely wrong, and OPSM should be ashamed of advocating poor driving. It ruins it for the rest of us

 

[Kryz11]

Preword: I know I'm new. I learned of this site via GameFAQ's message boards of this place, and I figured I'd look around. Like what I see so I plan to stay. Now then, to what I have to say.


I am a subscriber to PlayStation: The Official Magazine (formerly PSM). Today I received my July issue of the magazine, and included was an article entitled "Gran Turismo 5: Online Survival Guide." This caught my attention immediately, and I must say that I have lost some respect for them now.

The guide covered several strategies that I saw, understood and use myself now and learned through observation. For example, it talks about using the Corvette Z06 and the Lancer Evo X/Tuned. However, towards the end of the article, they crossed a boundary which prompted me to write an angry letter of scorn to them. The part in question (from the article) read the following:

"[talk about cutting down on collisions in S-Class events due to penalties]. This cuts down on the destruction derby attitude of beginner level races, but that doesn't mean a little hard nose racing can't be advantageous. In fact, if you're going to tag someone, make sure it's the most skilled racer and take him out hard. If you're lucky, you'll spin him so far off the tract that your eight-second penalty will be a mere fraction of his recovery time.... Yes, it's super dirty, but you won't care when you're collecting your credits in the winners circle."

The final paragraph also talks about using the Brake Check to give your opponent a penalty for hitting you. I can't believe what I read from these guys. These guys openly advocated dirty tricks that any self respecting racer would never make.

Is the offense I took to this article justified? Does anyone else feel like these guys, as an "official" magazine, should've taken a less aggressive and a more realistic approach to this article?

I they were talking about Motorstorm, then its ok in my book, but this is not MotorStorm!
THIS IS GRAN TURISO! (sparta style)

 

[Biggles]

Loophole: Turn right after Spoon on Suzuka and your car will teleport to the chicane.

A**hole: Win by annoying just about everyone else on the track and continue to drive more nails in the coffin of online GT5P.

It won't encourage new drivers to join in and enjoy online racing, it will create more frustration as the new punter constantly gets punted by someone more experienced in punting. The number of quitters will increase and thanks to Agnes (see PD Server thread) many of them will also be race hosts. Stress levels increase as do prescriptions for anti-depressants... GT sales drop and we have also contributed to the drug-dependant modern way of life as sales of citalopram go through the roof.

"Careless talk costs lives" - Douglas Adams

This reckless journalism may well have doomed the entire human race.

Drink up, the world's about to end.

💡 Wots the company that manufactures citalopram? Sign me up for a big chunk of their stock! Now, get out of my way, I'm going online!


Seriously, an idiotic thing for this "magazine" to say. Smashing & bashing isn't much fun in GT5 anyway - they should look at Burnout or GRID - & it's easy to collect a lot of credits online even if you don't "win".

 

[scabbyhorse2]

it's a games magazine...not a race sim mag
most people that play gran turismo play it as a game
wasn't one of the gt's the best selling game ever on the ps2 oe ps1 ? how many of these millions of people do think care about race etiquette etc ?
there's no point even thinking that not putting guides like that in magazines will help !

 

[Sa!!yz~Rage]

We aren't "real" racers. We're gamers

I think this is the key point. Gamers. Gamers for the most part just want to win, doesn't matter how. There have been cheat codes and such since the beginning, in fact that's the first thing a lot of people do when a new game comes out, they look for the exploits. Don't blame the gamers or the publications that write this stuff. It's the developers that write this stuff into the game, or refuse to fix it when there is a genuine coding bug.

I think there's a big difference between being able to see through buildings by hacking BF 1942 and exploiting a faulty penalty system in GT5P. In racing knocking opponents off the track is and has been a tactic that again has been around since people first started racing. The fault lies with PD for not implementing 'real racing' rules into the game, ie 'black flagging' bad drivers or stop and go penalties. There is no reason for not doing so. That would have a pretty decent affect on the bad racing I think, if instead of some stupid timer counting down, you car automatically goes on auto pilot into the pits for a stop and go, or your automatically DNF from the race and parked.

The one thing that sticks out in my mind is the fact that what this article adds light to is that that GT5P in it's 'racing' mode as opposed to simply 'driving' the cars is a little more 'arcade' than people want admit. So in the arcade spirit, use the tactics you have to in order to get the cash. 👍

Of course that doesn't mean that in online play in private or team races you can't run clean races, just because you can knock other racers off the track doesn't mean you should, it's better racing when that doesn't go on that's for sure.

"Scabbyhorse2" Great name...... We own Thoroughbreds so it caught my eye..

 

[Pupik]

It's a strategy guide. It tells you how to win.

I can't even act shocked that a strategy guide tells you to use loopholes to win.

A video game strategy guide usually tells you how turn a game into as disposable a commodity as a prophylactic.

 

[SARSeternal]

not to worried about the wantabe racers that will try all that crap for a while, the real racers will just continue to race properly like the real driving simulator was ment to be raced for years to come. Those others will dwindle down.

Infecting the streets.

 

[thegide]

The fault lies with PD for not implementing 'real racing' rules into the game, ie 'black flagging' bad drivers or stop and go penalties. There is no reason for not doing so. That would have a pretty decent affect on the bad racing I think, if instead of some stupid timer counting down, you car automatically goes on auto pilot into the pits for a stop and go, or your automatically DNF from the race and parked.

Given how badly the penalty system is currently implemented, this is an excellent suggestion.

 

[magburner]

...And this is why I don't race online anymore... Gran Turismo is a great franchise prostituted to the casual gamer.