American Muscle Nostalgia Drags

  • Thread starter MEJ1990TM
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MEJ1990TM

MEJ1990TM

132
United States
"Hidden Valley", CA
MEJ1990TM1
I was just wondering if there might be any interest in setting up a vintage style drag racing deal. For the purposes of this I'd say '74 and back American cars only. I know there are other "muscle" cars, but the vintage stuff is more what is of interest to me. The goal is to have the cars similar to what would have been terrorizing the streets/drag strips of the '60's, and into the '70s. Don't have too many regulations in mind, but here are the couple that come to mind after playing online a little bit:

- No power adders (Nitrous, superchargers, etc....)
- Realistic Gearing

The no power adders is pretty self explanatory. I never have liked nitrous. Can't tell you why, but whether it's in a real hot rod, or a video game I just don't like it. I was brought up with the old school mentality of making power through high compression, big cams, and lots of cubes. Nitrous feels a little too much like cheating.

On to the realistic gearing. For example, in the Nova I have as the drag car of the bunch I run the ratios like that of a Ford Toploader wide ratio. The gears are 2.78 1st, 1.93 2nd, 1.36 3rd, and 1:1 4th along with a 4.56 rear end. Perhaps I'm too anal, but I like making it half way realistic. The idea of using the automatic settings, or using a generic "flipped" setting like you read about doesn't make much sense to me. The other thing that has stood out since playing online is this habit of putting it in second gear, and matting the throttle wide open. No one attempts to really launch the car. When I launch the car I roll into the throttle gradually and try to minimize wheel spin. It takes work, but it works better than spinning them half way down the track.

If anyone is interested I can post up some of the gear ratios that were common in the transmissions from GM, Ford, and Mopar, and what the common rear end ratios were. The rear end ratio would be in the game as the final ratio.

Anyway, just curious if anyone would be interested in setting up a realistic old school drag race at some point in the future.
 
Me and Slash used to do this the first few months of GT6 but it never became popular. I've still got a few of my old setups floating around for this if I see one of your rooms up. My favorite was the 454 '69 Vette Convertible with the M22 4-speed.
 
im all in if it has to do with American Muscle modified or not,
with that being said im working on a OEM classic American Muscle class.👍
 
chris12008
count me in.........MOPAR FTW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I can't tell by your profile picture, is that a '70, or a '71-'72?

The '70 in my profile picture is actually my old mans (He bought it new), but I've got a '71 that's going to someday end up a quazi race car. The LS7 I built is actually in my dads car since his was already set up for a big block, but I've got a Toploader wide ratio, and a 4.56 12 bolt with a spool, 33 spline axles, and c clip eliminators that are just waiting to go in the '71. Still need to get the big block alternator bracket, as well as the big block pulleys.

Charlloots
im all in if it has to do with American Muscle modified or not,
with that being said im working on a OEM classic American Muscle class.👍
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Just saw your thread, sounds like a good deal. There are definitely faster cars out there, but none of them have the feel of the old V8's coming alive. Perhaps I'm a little biased.

Nice Olds you have there. How long you had it?

Oh, and good choice on the Mr. Horsepower sticker. The LS7 that's in the Chevelle has a Clay Smith cam in it. The old 454 LS7, not to be confused with the new small block.
 
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MEJ1990TM
I can't tell by your profile picture, is that a '70, or a '71-'72?

The '70 in my profile picture is actually my old mans (He bought it new), but I've got a '71 that's going to someday end up a quazi race car. The LS7 I built is actually in my dads car since his was already set up for a big block, but I've got a Toploader wide ratio, and a 4.56 12 bolt with a spool, 33 spline axles, and c clip eliminators that are just waiting to go in the '71. Still need to get the big block alternator bracket, as well as the big block pulleys.



Just saw your thread, sounds like a good deal. There are definitely faster cars out there, but none of them have the feel of the old V8's coming alive. Perhaps I'm a little biased.

Nice Olds you have there. How long you had it?

Oh, and good choice on the Mr. Horsepower sticker. The LS7 that's in the Chevelle has a Clay Smith cam in it. The old 454 LS7, not to be confused with the new small block.
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sweet and its a 1971 original 396 SS it has a 400ci bored +.60 over fully ported Camel Heads with 2.08 in INT valve :sly: with a TCI TH400 tranny, 12-bolt rear end with 4.10 gears, she runs high 10's with 10.5 slicks :D.......street legal too :cool:
 
Sounds like a fun setup. I'm looking for tens out of my car once everything is in, and I can get it to hook. Not so easy getting these stick shift cars to hook up. Going to have to get several little safety equipment things too. The fun never ends.
 
MEJ1990TM
I can't tell by your profile picture, is that a '70, or a '71-'72?

The '70 in my profile picture is actually my old mans (He bought it new), but I've got a '71 that's going to someday end up a quazi race car. The LS7 I built is actually in my dads car since his was already set up for a big block, but I've got a Toploader wide ratio, and a 4.56 12 bolt with a spool, 33 spline axles, and c clip eliminators that are just waiting to go in the '71. Still need to get the big block alternator bracket, as well as the big block pulleys.



Just saw your thread, sounds like a good deal. There are definitely faster cars out there, but none of them have the feel of the old V8's coming alive. Perhaps I'm a little biased.

Nice Olds you have there. How long you had it?

Oh, and good choice on the Mr. Horsepower sticker. The LS7 that's in the Chevelle has a Clay Smith cam in it. The old 454 LS7, not to be confused with the new small block.
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I thought the old BBC 454 was an LS6, is there a special block that went into some of the Chevelle?
 
Master__Shake_
I thought the old BBC 454 was an LS6, is there a special block that went into some of the Chevelle?
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LS7 was never put into full production by GM. They just offered it as a crate motor. A little more power than the LS6. But there are 3 common 454's made in that time frame. LS5, LS6, and LS7. So to answer your question yes it was a "Special Block".
 
MEJ1990TM
Just saw your thread, sounds like a good deal. There are definitely faster cars out there, but none of them have the feel of the old V8's coming alive. Perhaps I'm a little biased.

Nice Olds you have there. How long you had it?

Oh, and good choice on the Mr. Horsepower sticker. The LS7 that's in the Chevelle has a Clay Smith cam in it. The old 454 LS7, not to be confused with the new small block.
Click to expand...

if you wanna run American Muscle you should stop into a lobby sometime.
Thanks the oldzzz been in the family since new ,was passed down from my grandfather.
very nice ride im a big fan of the BB Chevelle and Mr Horse Power.
 
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the LS6 was rated at 450hp the LS7 was rated at 500hp........also the 454 installed in passenger cars had a deck height of 9.8xx while the 454 truck blocks had a deck height of 10.200 so you can fit a bigger stroke :D
 
I believe the official rating GM gave the LS7 was 465, but the old time drag racers figured it made about 560 in tuned factory condition with an 850 carb. That was based on weight, and the mph the cars they were in pulled. I've got a factory 163 casting intake, and used to have an L88 carburetor, but I opted for the C454 and Dominator. With a cam change that engine could probably be making in the neighborhood of 600 horsepower. Kind of useless at this point since the car isn't set up to take advantage of all that power. All it would do is roast the back tires.

Chris, are you running a spool, or posi in your 12 bolt?
 
we should start a bench racing thread,
my olds has the factory olds 12bolt 3.90 gears really a 10 bolt extra 2 bolts act like c-clips.

im on now have 60/70's American muscle drags lobby open
 
MEJ1990TM
I believe the official rating GM gave the LS7 was 465, but the old time drag racers figured it made about 560 in tuned factory condition with an 850 carb. That was based on weight, and the mph the cars they were in pulled. I've got a factory 163 casting intake, and used to have an L88 carburetor, but I opted for the C454 and Dominator. With a cam change that engine could probably be making in the neighborhood of 600 horsepower. Kind of useless at this point since the car isn't set up to take advantage of all that power. All it would do is roast the back tires.

Chris, are you running a spool, or posi in your 12 bolt?
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yea it has posi i was gonna get a spool but since it see's alot of street driving i decided to go posi, with moser axl
es.
 
Charlloots
we should start a bench racing thread,
my olds has the factory olds 12bolt 3.90 gears really a 10 bolt extra 2 bolts act like c-clips.

im on now have 60/70's American muscle drags lobby open
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It's funny how many people think those BOP 12 bolt are 10 bolts. They often don't realize the rear ends don't get their names from the number of bolts on the ring gear, not the back cover.

Wish I would have seen this sooner. Will be heading online in a few minutes.

chris12008
yea it has posi i was gonna get a spool but since it see's alot of street driving i decided to go posi, with moser axl
es.
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My original goal was posi as well. I had everything to build a 4.10 posi, but I got a deal I couldn't pass up on the 4.56 rear end I have now. The guy wanted a stock rear end, so we traded straight across for my stock 4.10 setup with Moser axles.

What are you running for springs and shocks? The '70 was set up more to handle a little better so the front end is probably way too stiff to get enough weight transfer to induce traction. Don't really want to mess with that car too much since we rebuilt the front end a few years ago, but the '71 on the other hand is going to get setup purely for the drags.
 
MEJ1990TM
It's funny how many people think those BOP 12 bolt are 10 bolts. They often don't realize the rear ends don't get their names from the number of bolts on the ring gear, not the back cover.

Wish I would have seen this sooner. Will be heading online in a few minutes.



My original goal was posi as well. I had everything to build a 4.10 posi, but I got a deal I couldn't pass up on the 4.56 rear end I have now. The guy wanted a stock rear end, so we traded straight across for my stock 4.10 setup with Moser axles.

What are you running for springs and shocks? The '70 was set up more to handle a little better so the front end is probably way too stiff to get enough weight transfer to induce traction. Don't really want to mess with that car too much since we rebuilt the front end a few years ago, but the '71 on the other hand is going to get setup purely for the drags.
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well here are some more specs of the car for the front the only modifications are lakewood 90/10 shocks and moroso trick springs the rear has lakewood 50/50 shocks with lakewood traction bars. it has a full interior but no sound padding, the battery in the trunk(you know why) :sly: as far as body goes it's all OEM steel except for the hood, the hood is a 4 1/2 fiberglass from Unlimited. I don't know what to do with the car really it's a street car and does get driven (but the freeway kill's :lol: only 3 speed and 4.10) and i can't race it at the track anymore, got kicked out for running 10's and no type of safety belts or roll-bar. i dont want to put a roll cage in it because it's an original SS 396(by the way i still have the original 396 it came with) and don't want to hack the car up :indiff:
 
I know what you mean about not wanting to cut the car up. Being the '70 is an original LS5/M22 car I'm not about to start hacking it up to make a race car. The original engine is in need of a complete overhaul, so I figure until that happens we can put the engine I built in the car and have a little fun. Once the LS5 goes back in so will the original transmission. At that point the cars days of being hot rodded will probably be done with. May take it to the drags every now and again, but if we do we are going to put one of my transmissions in there. Don't want to risk hurting that original M22. It's already been through hell with the way my dad used to drive the car.

My goal is to stick my drive train in the car and be able to pull off a ten second ET before getting told not to run. I do have most of the safety equipment needed. Drive shaft loop, scatter shield, billet steel flywheel, and a few of the other things they would look for. Just don't have a roll bar, and am not going to put one in this car. The '71 on the other hand, that car will eventually end up the racer.
 
MEJ1990TM
I know what you mean about not wanting to cut the car up. Being the '70 is an original LS5/M22 car I'm not about to start hacking it up to make a race car. The original engine is in need of a complete overhaul, so I figure until that happens we can put the engine I built in the car and have a little fun. Once the LS5 goes back in so will the original transmission. At that point the cars days of being hot rodded will probably be done with. May take it to the drags every now and again, but if we do we are going to put one of my transmissions in there. Don't want to risk hurting that original M22. It's already been through hell with the way my dad used to drive the car.

My goal is to stick my drive train in the car and be able to pull off a ten second ET before getting told not to run. I do have most of the safety equipment needed. Drive shaft loop, scatter shield, billet steel flywheel, and a few of the other things they would look for. Just don't have a roll bar, and am not going to put one in this car. The '71 on the other hand, that car will eventually end up the racer.
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what are the spec on the other engine?
 
chris12008
what are the spec on the other engine?
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The LS5? It's pretty basic. Compression should be about 10:1, 3/8" dimple rods, steel crank, 290 casting heads, factory LS6 cam, and going to run a 163 intake. It won't be a rocket, but it will run ok. Should have the potential to hit high 12's I'd think. Way back in the day he ran 13.20's at 105 with that setup. Never had good tires on it though.

Sounds like we got a few of us here, when do you guys want to try this out?

Here are a few of the more common transmission ratios that I can think of off hand if you guys want to play with a realistic setup.

Muncie- M20 Early (2.56, 1.91, 1.48, 1:1)
M20 (2.52, 1.88, 1.46, 1:1)
M21/M22 (2.20, 1.64, 1.28, 1:1)

Toploader- Close Ratio (2.32, 1.69, 1.29, 1:1)
Wide Ratio (2.78, 1.93, 1.36, 1:1)

Super T10- 2.43, 1.61, 1.23, 1:1
2.64, 1.75, 1.34, 1:1
2.64, 1.60, 1.23, 1:1
2.88, 1.91, 1.33, 1:1
3.42, 2.28, 1.46, 1:1

A833- 2.47, 1.77, 1.34, 1:1
2.66, 1.91, 1.39,1:1
3.09, 1.92, 1.40, 1:1

The Muncie, and T10s were used in GM vehicles, Toploaders were Ford, and A833's were Mopar. That is just a small sampling of different four speed ratios, there are many other four speed variations out there. I would simply ask that you choose a real three ,or four, speed ratio with a 1:1 top gear. No overdrives. I would also ask that you use a realistic rear end (final) ratio. Something like 3.31, 3.42, 3.55, 3.73, 4.10, 4.30, 4.56, 4.88 so on and so forth. Those are mostly GM numbers, but all of the big three had gear ratios that were similar.

Admittedly there is no way to regulate this, so I'd hope anyone who shows up would be honest enough with their setup. The Nova I have tuned to 701 horsepower, Toploader wide ratio, and 4.10's runs an estimated low to mid 10 at around 137. Those numbers like that should be pretty achievable with the other cars. Remember, no nitrous, or turbochargers. Naturally aspirated only.

Should be fun.
 
MEJ1990TM
The LS5? It's pretty basic. Compression should be about 10:1, 3/8" dimple rods, steel crank, 290 casting heads, factory LS6 cam, and going to run a 163 intake. It won't be a rocket, but it will run ok. Should have the potential to hit high 12's I'd think. Way back in the day he ran 13.20's at 105 with that setup. Never had good tires on it though.

Sounds like we got a few of us here, when do you guys want to try this out?

Here are a few of the more common transmission ratios that I can think of off hand if you guys want to play with a realistic setup.

Muncie- M20 Early (2.56, 1.91, 1.48, 1:1)
M20 (2.52, 1.88, 1.46, 1:1)
M21/M22 (2.20, 1.64, 1.28, 1:1)

Toploader- Close Ratio (2.32, 1.69, 1.29, 1:1)
Wide Ratio (2.78, 1.93, 1.36, 1:1)

Super T10- 2.43, 1.61, 1.23, 1:1
2.64, 1.75, 1.34, 1:1
2.64, 1.60, 1.23, 1:1
2.88, 1.91, 1.33, 1:1
3.42, 2.28, 1.46, 1:1

A833- 2.47, 1.77, 1.34, 1:1
2.66, 1.91, 1.39,1:1
3.09, 1.92, 1.40, 1:1

The Muncie, and T10s were used in GM vehicles, Toploaders were Ford, and A833's were Mopar. That is just a small sampling of different four speed ratios, there are many other four speed variations out there. I would simply ask that you choose a real three ,or four, speed ratio with a 1:1 top gear. No overdrives. I would also ask that you use a realistic rear end (final) ratio. Something like 3.31, 3.42, 3.55, 3.73, 4.10, 4.30, 4.56, 4.88 so on and so forth. Those are mostly GM numbers, but all of the big three had gear ratios that were similar.

Admittedly there is no way to regulate this, so I'd hope anyone who shows up would be honest enough with their setup. The Nova I have tuned to 701 horsepower, Toploader wide ratio, and 4.10's runs an estimated low to mid 10 at around 137. Those numbers like that should be pretty achievable with the other cars. Remember, no nitrous, or turbochargers. Naturally aspirated only.

Should be fun.
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Today if ur up for it it sounds fun
 
To each his own, that's cool. I'm more an A833 guy myself. The '66 Charger we have has the original 727 in it right now, but we've talked about converting it to a four speed.
 
I'd be game for some realistic Classic Muscle Drag Racing. I've been busy lately, but I'll see if I can free up some time. Who is setting these lobbys up anyways? I'd like to send a friend request to them on PSN.

For those who don't know what transmission to put in their cars, do what I always say to do: When in doubt, drop a Muncie in it. :cool:
 
The car in my avatar is my 75 nova, w/406ci small block, 12.5:1 pistons, h-beam rods, scat crank, AFR heads, comp cams solid roller, Victor junior intake, 750 mighty demon carb, 3500 stall in a turbo 350 tranny, spooled 10bolt rear with 3.90 gears. Would love to replicate this in the game...it went a 10.35 on motor. It also has a 8 point cage and 10.5 my slicks.
 
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FASSTRUK
The car in my avatar is my 75 nova, w/406ci small block, 12.5:1 pistons, h-beam rods, scat crank, AFR heads, comp cams solid roller, Victor junior intake, 750 mighty demon carb, 3500 stall in a turbo 350 tranny, spooled 10bolt rear with 3.90 gears. Would love to replicate this in the game...it went a 10.35 on motor. It also has a 8 point cage and 10.5 my slicks.
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Nice. How have you managed to keep the 10 bolt alive? Then again it's probably the 8.5, isn't it? Being a pre '72 Chevelle guy I always think of the 8.2, which is pretty notorious for busting up under abuse.


Camaro69427
I'd be game for some realistic Classic Muscle Drag Racing. I've been busy lately, but I'll see if I can free up some time. Who is setting these lobbys up anyways? I'd like to send a friend request to them on PSN.

For those who don't know what transmission to put in their cars, do what I always say to do: When in doubt, drop a Muncie in it. :cool:
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I suppose anyone could just so long as they follow the guidelines. My PSN is MEJ1990TM1 if you want to add me.
 

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