Australian Cars

[Cap'n Jack]

Oops. never mind this post.

 

[MacGillaZ]

From mates inside both HSV and FPV, they both have engines on dynos with a lot more power and do comply to ADRs, but, marketing them is next to impossible due to safety or worry bodies like the Pedestrian Safety Comission.

I thought somebody would have mentioned the monaro GTS-R, the suido race car HSV got a bunch on engineering students to work on.... Ie no money, long hours, no glory... A bit of joke really, much like the TT Torana....

Really I hope GT just has some classic Aussie cars thats all, whether they be new or old classics, we know whats going to be called a classic in the years to come, and what will be regarded as a joke (remember the power crystal debarcle!)

 

[brett0505]

I thought somebody would have mentioned the monaro GTS-R, the suido race car HSV got a bunch on engineering students to work on.... Ie no money, long hours, no glory... A bit of joke really, much like the TT Torana....

Actually it's not a joke, it's gone overseas to guage interest in a one make racing series. As for the Torana, it's a styling/design exercise to test reaction. If you dont like the pink, get over it.

.....we know whats going to be called a classic in the years to come, and what will be regarded as a joke (remember the power crystal debarcle!)

I take it your taking about the polarizer. Those cars are worth a fair bit more now than those that were not fitted with the polarizer.

 

[///M]

I thought somebody would have mentioned the monaro GTS-R, the suido race car HSV got a bunch on engineering students to work on.... Ie no money, long hours, no glory... A bit of joke really, much like the TT Torana....

A joke?
HSV have over 5 orders for the already. It's a similar concept to the Porsche GT3s, would be interesting to see them go against each other.
And i would think HSV are hoping the TT36 'Torana' doesn't make production anytime soon, cause I'll bet that we'll see HSV sales turn to ****, as they have already said they aren't interested in a turbo 6, just V8s.

But I reckon the Torana would have made a better appearance in the new blue or a bright red, but if you look at the HQs and LJs, they have the same colour scheme.

 

[JohnBM01]

So you all want to bring back a discussion on Australian cars? Fine with me.

I've noticed Radicool02's CV8. At first, I thought it was either a beefed-up Mitsu Lancer. Of course, this is Aussie muscle we're talking here, folks. Anyone want to share stats of the CV8? It would be a nice fit into GT4. Who wouldn't want something that's slick and powerful like a... Australian car? Remember. The focus here is on Australian cars. And I actually can't help but be amazed by Australian cars. Your cars carry a mean stance and very clean lines. I'd say the V8 Supercars are a prime example of where I'm getting at here. I would love to have a Ford Australia vs. Holden battle in GT4. Maybe the machines can pack a mean growl like in "Pro Race Driver." I thought the Ford Falcon sported the better growl in my view. Holden's still solid, though.

Maybe the winning Holdens from the Bathurst 24 Hour races would also be a good fit.

 

[MikeStarion]

Me being a person thats thinks that holden and ford are not as good as the general opinion, would like to see some of the small turbo cars that get most of their recognition in oz like Pulsar EXA Turbo (proper one not the non turbo hatch) and its counterpart the Pulsar ET, also what would really be a highlight is the Mitsubishi Starion (aussie made/design) '87-'91 models with the 2.6 ltr (not the rally edition on the list) which in its day was a champion race car with it being virtually stock.

 

[Schrodes]

Anyone want to share stats of the CV8?

http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/frame.php?file=list.php&brand=Holden

VZ Monaro CV8

Drivetrain

Engine GM Gen III 90º V 8
Engine Location Front , longitudinally mounted
Displacement 5.665 liter / 345.7 cu in
Valvetrain 2 valves / cylinder, OHV
Fuel feed Sequential Fuel injection
Aspiration Naturally Aspirated
Gearbox 6 speed Manual
Drive Rear wheel drive

Performance figures

Power 349 bhp / 260 KW @ 5600 rpm
Torque 500 Nm / 369 ft lbs @ 4000 rpm
BHP/Liter 62 bhp / liter
Power to weight ratio 0.21 bhp / kg
Top Speed N/A
0-60 mph Acceleration N/A

HRT 427

Drivetrain

Engine Chevrolet C5R 90º V 8
Engine Location Front , longitudinally mounted
Displacement 6.980 liter / 425.9 cu in
Valvetrain 2 valves / cylinder, OHV
Fuel feed Fuel injection
Aspiration Naturally Aspirated
Gearbox Tremec T56 M12 6 speed Manual
Drive Rear wheel drive

Performance figures

Power 560 bhp / 418 KW @ 6000 rpm
Torque 780 Nm / 575 ft lbs @ 4800 rpm
BHP/Liter 80 bhp / liter
Power to weight ratio 0.36 bhp / kg
Top Speed 300 km/h / 186 mph
0-60 mph Acceleration 3.8 s

 

[JohnBM01]

One word: Damn!

 

[Zarkoff500]

One word: Damn!

That was 3 words. I apologize, I can not help being a smart ass.

 

[///M]

Me being a person thats thinks that holden and ford are not as good as the general opinion, would like to see some of the small turbo cars that get most of their recognition in oz like Pulsar EXA Turbo (proper one not the non turbo hatch) and its counterpart the Pulsar ET, also what would really be a highlight is the Mitsubishi Starion (aussie made/design) '87-'91 models with the 2.6 ltr (not the rally edition on the list) which in its day was a champion race car with it being virtually stock.

Yes, if GT4 has an engine transplant option, an AWD Magna with (or without) the Ralliart engine in would be better than any NA 6 from Ford or Holden.
Datsun 120Y too

And I'm pretty sure the Monaro did 270 or 280 kmh in Motors performance car of the year a couple of years back.

 

[PhatFat]

That was 3 words. I apologize, I can not help being a smart ass.

No it was only one.

 

[MacGillaZ]

GTS-R similar to a GT3, tell me your dreaming! The GT3 is acutally a road car, built into a race car. The GTS-R much like the HRT427 was a race-car come road car. Theres a big difference between them. If your gonna do that sort of comparo, then you should be running the GTS-R against a Supercup or the old GT2-EVO, that way the chassis tweaks are about even. For a game such as GT4, a car must be available to photograph, record sounds, and test dynamics (remember the DVD with Prologue), the fact that HSV were so tight arsed about this car (GTS-R) that the student who did all the aero development for the car wasn't allowed to present even a closed presentation of his thesis, becuase they were afraid it might give away the surprise, typical Aussie ego!

If you think I'm bull****ing, the fact that other students presented sessions on future headlights (ie giving away the design of the next 2 gen of commodores), the development of AC modelling and temp testing of Ford vehicles really shows how big a pole HSV has up its backside!

260-280kw out of a 'high performance' twin turbo 3.6L V6, you've got to be kidding! Thats how much power some people are getting out of 3.5L nissan engines, NA! For crying out loud, its not high performance, its marketable performance! You hit the 300KW barrier as a major manufacturer based in AUS and prepare to be labelled a Social Menace! You see 300KW+ is too much power for everyday people to drive, the fact that how many '$$$$$' cars have more power than that and dont even have to pass ADR's is tantamount to the fact that if you've got money, you really can register anything!

Getting back to the important thing at hand, aussie cars in GT4, I again push for the inclusion of 'historically significant' cars from our past and present be thoughtfully considered for presentation in this Jewel of console driving games.

 

[flamefreeze34]

one of those cool go-karts or a motobike, or an fpv

 

[cubits]

What a weird collection of vehicles flame... none are really significant...

We're talking Phase 3 GTHO, 1972 monaro, a9x, and the 265 v6 valiant charger (still the fastest 1/4 mile australian built car, i believe...). Ooh, and maybe an elfin or two, and the goggomobile dart (that was an aussie car btw!).

The newer holdens/fords are a bit disappointing. Sure the FPV GT-P is pretty, and would be nice in photo-mode, but it tips the scales at nearly 1800kg, and despite its 300kw, my car could out-accelerate/brake/corner it.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

The GT-P is a ford, what'd you expect?

 

[cubits]

The holden is in the same boat, most of them are over 1600, and their engines are way more archaic than the ford v8 (single cam pushrod 16v vs dohc vvti 32v). Oh, and 18% of all XR series cars (xr6, turbo, and 8) are manual. Says a thing or two about the buyers of australian performance cars... eww.

 

[///M]

GTS-R similar to a GT3, tell me your dreaming! The GT3 is acutally a road car, built into a race car. The GTS-R much like the HRT427 was a race-car come road car. Theres a big difference between them. If your gonna do that sort of comparo, then you should be running the GTS-R against a Supercup or the old GT2-EVO, that way the chassis tweaks are about even. For a game such as GT4, a car must be available to photograph, record sounds, and test dynamics (remember the DVD with Prologue), the fact that HSV were so tight arsed about this car (GTS-R) that the student who did all the aero development for the car wasn't allowed to present even a closed presentation of his thesis, becuase they were afraid it might give away the surprise, typical Aussie ego!

I said it was a similar idea (for racing). I haven't read much on this GTS R, about a page, but thats from where I got the thought. Didn't know it was actually closer to the 427, anyway, it will provide a good race series.

the 265 v6 valiant charger (still the fastest 1/4 mile australian built car, i believe...).

Don't wanna be a smart arse, but the Charger was not a V6, and I'm pretty sure the latest range of the HSVs are the fastest Aussie car down the 1/4 mile. I think Motor or Wheels got 13.3 secs for a Clubsport, and since they can't record times to save themselves, a good driver with more practise might even get into the 12s.

 

[cubits]

You're right, it isnt a v6, its a straight 6. But it still stands as the fastest australian made car:

"The June 1997 issue of Australia's Motor magazine did a comparison between Australia's greatest muscle cars from 1971 on, including the GTS-R and E49. Despite being the only six in the group, the 25 year old Valiant Charger E49 was still the fastest and marginally quicker than the GTS-R to 100 kph and through the quarter. The figures used for the E49 were based on 1972 road tests, 0-100 kph 6.1 seconds and 14.4 seconds for the quarter. The GTS-R was quoted as 0-100 kph 6.2 seconds and 14.45 for the quarter.

To add salt into GM and Ford's wounds, stock standard E49s on modern rubber have quite easily broken the 14 second barrier for the quarter. Jim Little has done a 13.8 quarter in his and another of our club cars won a production prize at a major drag meeting with a 13.9 quarter. A previous owner took my E49 to a sprint meeting and was doing 14.1 quarters on old wide oval tires, limiting the car to 5000 rpm (redline 6500) and in a howling headwind! A Ferrari owner who couldn't match those times was absolutely horrified when he discovered that the Charger had a Valiant 6 under the bonnet! An unmodified standard production Valiant 6 at that."

 

[///M]

The HSV GTS (low 13s) and FPV GT both beat 14.4 for the quarter mile. Maybe you are thinking the Charger is the fastest 6 cyl from Aussie, if the XR6T isn't faster, the new FPV Typhoon definately will be.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

I thought the Joss would of beaten it. Must be a bloody good car, that valiant!

 

[HR186S]

Ok ive been reading this thread and i love Australian cars, i think i have to clear some things up. Here goes.

The holden is in the same boat, most of them are over 1600, and their engines are way more archaic than the ford v8 (single cam pushrod 16v vs dohc vvti 32v). Oh, and 18% of all XR series cars (xr6, turbo, and 8) are manual. Says a thing or two about the buyers of australian performance cars... eww.

Whats your point on the weight issue? These cars are not sports cars they are performance full size sedans. The pushrod Vs DOHC debate is utter rubbish also. The Chevrolet V8 has over 50 years of development in its pushrod engine, this quite easily is the most advanced push rod V8 engine in the world.... If it isnt broken why fix it? Manual vs Auto, its really a personal preference.

What is the most powerful car made in Australia.... that would be the FPV Typhoon....

Ok so your talking about stock cars in the first part... thats fine

once you add tuning, nod towards APS or NIZPRO or CAPA in the real world, nothing comes close to the Typhoon in regards to Aussie made sedans..... period..

But now your talking about moddifiying the car. Your saying adding a supercharger / turbocharger to a V8 GTS, GT, XR8, SS etc wouldnt actually come close? I think your greatly mistaken. You can throw that comment out.

Toyota and Mitsubishi are the only other manufacturers eligible as they are the only other ones who make four door sedans in Australia. They both decided this year that it was too expensive to enter the series.

The fact is neither mitsubishi or toyota produce a V8 engine of no more than 5.0 litres and of pushrod design. This is the major reason for them not competing. The rules favor Ford and Holden. Even though none of the engine blocks they use are produced in Australia. The Holden uses a 5.0 litre chevrolet, while ford uses a simular american sourced Ford product.

id say that the engines are capable of easily more than that. and are the falcon supercars still using the pushrod engines?

The rules state a rev limit of 7500rpm. Increase the revs and the power will rise. The set limit makes it hard to squeeze more power out. But they will continue to do so as they find other ways rather then rev.

NASCARs are dinosaurs with their carbys and complete lack of engine management systems.

I dont think this is true. I dont know how they do it but they are getting these to spin close to 10,000 rpm now for 400+ mile races on circuits that require 100% throttle for anywhere between 80 to 100% of the lap. Not bad for a carby fed dinosaur. Just because it uses a carburettor and not injection doesnt mean other areas arent developed.

 

[Schrodes]

The fact is neither mitsubishi or toyota produce a V8 engine of no more than 5.0 litres and of pushrod design. This is the major reason for them not competing. The rules favor Ford and Holden. Even though none of the engine blocks they use are produced in Australia. The Holden uses a 5.0 litre chevrolet, while ford uses a simular american sourced Ford product.

I am aware that Toyota and Mitsubishi don't have an engine that fits the 5 litre pushrod rule, but they are permitted to source a suitable engine from another arm of the group of companies they are a part of. Eg. Toyata can use an engine from Lexus or Mitsibishi can use an engine from Chrysler. Both Toyota and Mitsibishi have had a long hard look at getting into the V8 Supercars and they wouldn't have even considered it if they couldn't get a suitable engine from somewhere.

 

[Killa_KB]

How can we forget such wonders as the Ford laser.......lol (in fact in TX3 guise these little buggers had a fair bit of get up and go) (i know they are a mazda and therefore a jappper but geez they own also how can we ignore the mighty HQ kingswood thrashing one of them around "the ring" would be bucket loads of fun

 

[Jay]

mighty HQ kingswood thrashing one of them around "the ring" would be bucket loads of fun

Rumour has it that the Mazda Roadpacer might be included, so you might pretty much be able to drive a Kingswood.

BTW If you dont know what that Mazda Roadpacer is google it

 

[XPLOSV]

Rumour has it that the Mazda Roadpacer might be included, so you might pretty much be able to drive a Kingswood.

BTW If you dont know what that Mazda Roadpacer is google it

IMO that would be the ultimate waste of game CD space!

 

[JohnBM01]

To update this thread, it looks like from the Japanese version that Holden, Ford Australia, and FPV are in the house. It looks like Holden and FPV will debut in GT4 based on information from "the big thread." I just wanted to make that note to update this thread with relevant information.

I think I did some looking around, and there's about 10 or 11 Aussie machines. Even you must admit it's better than having just one Tickford in GT3.

 

[Schrodes]

I've had a quiet night with the family, bar-b-que and my best friend Beer Fridge. Happy New Year everyone.
I picked up hte Australian Playstation 2 Magazine the other day and now that we know what Aussie cars are in GT4, I thought I'd share with you what cars they thought should be in GT4.

From Ford:
1965 XP Falcon
1971 XY Falcon GT-HO Phase III
1978 XC Falcon Cobra 5.8
1981 XD Falcon V8
2003 BA Falcon XR8

And Holden:
1968 HK Monaro GTS323 (I think they mean 327)
1969 HK Monaro GTS350
1970 LC Torana GTR XU-1
1977 LX Torana A9X Sedan (Why on earth would you have the sedan when you could have the Bathurst Special hatchback?)
1992 Commodore VP SS