Ballast and Aerodynamics question

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steliosthem

steliosthem

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I have a Xanavi Nismo Z '06 and I often play with the ballast and aerodynamics settings, usually to get certain Performance Point (PP) number when participating in online races.

I was wondering

1) If and how the ballast position affects the handling of the car

2) How exactly the aerodynamics settings affect the car, I mean I can see that by increasing the downforce to the maximum I get more performance points, but shouldn't that make the car slower!? Specially in fast tracks with few corners.
 
I'm not sure about the weight distribution,
But, I've noticed that with more down force,the X2010 accelerates slower and goes to a lower speed.
So I'm pretty sure it'll be the same for yours.
The aerodynamics can also affect the handling so be careful with over and under steer.
 
When weight is moved to a certain place in the car, such as the rear, middle or the front, These areas will be affected the most. Put most the ballast to the rear and the rear end will be planted to help reduce any chance of the back end coming out but at the same time making the front o light can cause unexpected understeer. Finding a good "inbetween" is crucial.

Also with Aero settings, When aero set to full the car is so much slower in acceleration and top speed but alot better around the corners. Also like weight ballast, an "inbetween" is crucial.
 
steliosthem
I have a Xanavi Nismo Z '06 and I often play with the ballast and aerodynamics settings, usually to get certain Performance Point (PP) number when participating in online races.

I was wondering

1) If and how the ballast position affects the handling of the car
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It's to do with balance. Compare the handling of an FF shopping car to a Mazda MX-5 (first generation) (known for a perfect 50:50 weight distribution), and also to any Ruf except the 3400S. The FF is front heavy, the MX-5 is balanced and the Ruf is rear heavy, so you can use ballast to adjust the balance of cars that are just off-balance to improve the handling a bit.


steliosthem
2) How exactly the aerodynamics settings affect the car, I mean I can see that by increasing the downforce to the maximum I get more performance points, but shouldn't that make the car slower!? Specially in fast tracks with few corners.
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It will reduce top speed and acceleration, but what you lose there you gain in cornering speed. Imagine if you have a 200mph top speed but can only take corners at 100mph, you'd probably lose to a car with a 150mph top speed but with cornering speeds close to 150mph, as they wouldn't have to slow down as much or accelerate as much for turns.

I can't even think what circuits qualify as low downforce right now... Daytona and Indy should really be high downforce because you can take the turns very, very quickly. Monza might be an example of low; it's traditionally a low downforce circuit when raced in F1 (in real life), because of the long straights and fairly wide turns. Cote d'Azur and Tsukuba are good examples of high downforce circuits, as you'll never hit a particularly high top speed anyway and the corners are quite tight.
 
But in GT5 the more downforce, the better, as there is little trade off cornering speed vs top speed.

While high downforce affects greatly in cornering ability, it doesn't affect top speed as much as it should. The only car to be affected by this is the Red Bull X1, but that's a 400Kmh+ car, and at those speeds, wind becomes a real factor.

For example, when I was doing the FGT champ in Monza for the first time, my "tuning mind" would tell me to lower the downforce, I lowered to reach higher speeds only to find that it wast best to carry more speed out of the corners than reaching a higher top speed, since the gain in top speed was barely noticeable to call it an advantage. Compared to say in real life, where a car with higher top speed and lower cornering ability can fight equally with a car with a completely different set up (Remember Alonso vs Petrov?)

The same with Super GTs, even with the downforce lowered, you would barely notice the gain in speed, but you will surely regret the the lose in cornering speed, and you will also lose braking capacity.
 
If you are adding ballast to a car to get it into a race (sole reason) then put the ballast in the middle, or slightly back, maybe 5 or 10. This will help you keep the same balance through accelerating, braking and turning.

If you are running without ABS, and your rear wheels lock up easily (Mazda Roadster being a good example) whack a bit of weight over the back wheels to give the rear more grip in braking (body weight shifts forward during braking)

In an FF, as you accelerate the body weight shifts to the rear, so whack some weight over the front wheels to give you more grip off the line & when accelerating in the corners.

An FR can be trickier ... You have to drive the car and feel how it drives, if it understeers try to tune it out first, if you still have understeer then try a little bit of ballast up front, if you have bad oversteer then try a bit of weight on the rear but be careful, extra weight on the rear can just cause a pendulum effect when you do get oversteer.

MR cars again, you just have to try it, I'd go for a bit of weight up front, but it depends on your driving style.

Mine for example, is different as my Supra for example has ballast in the front bumper (being an FR) but my Mazda Roadster (also an FR) has ballast over the rear wheels to reduce the amount the rear wheels lock up.

As for the downforce ... Higher downforce will give you higher grip as your car is pushed into the ground more ... However, to get the downforce the aero parts on your car have to manipulate the air, thus causing drag, thus making it harder for your car to achieve its top speed, but the grip it gives you can make a huge difference to cornering speeds.

Lower downforce will give you a higher top speed as your aero parts aren't manipulating the air, therefore there is much less drag but because there is less drag & less grip, your cornering speeds are hugely reduced.
 
Also, if you're adding weight for tuning, use low amounts. You spend a lot of money making a car lighter for a reason -- carrying around the bulk slows you down. I know the ballast goes up to 200 kilograms (440 pounds), but that much weight is used for handicapping cars, not tuning them.
 
As said above, I mentioned having ballast in the front of my Supra, I literally only have 5Kg at -50.
 
I might add something for downforce

the top speed gain ARE important BUT... since you're exiting the corner slower, it'll take more time to get to highest speed. Let's say you test the straights on SS7, you'll see much difference, but on most circuits, it won't matter because you are starting slower for those long stretches.

On daytona, balance is crucial, since you'll always be at close to top speed, you need to raise it as much as possible, without having to slow down because of a lack of downforce
 
maSonn09
When weight is moved to a certain place in the car, such as the rear, middle or the front, These areas will be affected the most. Put most the ballast to the rear and the rear end will be planted to help reduce any chance of the back end coming out but at the same time making the front o light can cause unexpected understeer.
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More weight at the back will produce more oversteer, not less. (see early porsches)

Adding more weight towards the front, or shifting the bias towards the front of the car will increase understeer/reduce oversteer.

For downforce, yes, more downforce will make you slower on straights, but it should make you quicker in corners. Depending on the track you should adjust as needed.
You can also fiddle with the F:R balance of downforce to create more or less oversteer/understeer in highspeed corners.
 
freedomweasel
More weight at the back will produce more oversteer, not less. (see early porsches)

Adding more weight towards the front, or shifting the bias towards the front of the car will increase understeer/reduce oversteer.
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Like you said and like I said, I think it is all hypothetical, we can never say for definate what ballast here or there would do because it depends on mods & set up, its all just general.
 
Hig-GT
Like you said and like I said, I think it is all hypothetical, we can never say for definate what ballast here or there would do because it depends on mods & set up, its all just general.
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True, but all else being equal, one can say what weight distribution should do.

Sure cars can be tuned to do the opposite of expected, but the OP asked what ballast did, and in general (unless tuned out) a ton of weight in the rear will increase oversteer, not understeer as the poster I quoted claimed.
 

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