Best Tires advise

[moaibob]

Soon I'll have to change tires to my dear old silver VW Bora 1.9 TDI (85 Kw/285 torque). Sized with 205/55 R16 W-speed.
Til now, I had Michelin and Dunlop.
Michelin, good tires but with 0 consumption. they get harder and harder to crystal, and loose grip very quick. But last for lifetime (did 90.000 Km, driving carefully after the first 30.000).
Dunlop average consumption (40-60.000 km with a set) but have not enough grip from the beginning: ASR winks on the cockpit in several occasions already after 10.000 km.

What is your tire set and what do u advise (consider that i am not going to sell my mother's family jewels to buy 4 Pirelli P0 rosso )?

Price range around 400-500 € (600-750 $)

Shoot!

 

[Famine]

Soon I'll have to change tires to my dear old silver VW Bora 1.9 TDI (85 Kw/285 torque). Sized with 205/55 R16 W-speed.
Til now, I had Michelin and Dunlop.
Michelin, good tires but with 0 consumption. they get harder and harder to crystal, and loose grip very quick. But last for lifetime (did 90.000 Km, driving carefully after the first 30.000).
Dunlop average consumption (40-60.000 km with a set) but have not enough grip from the beginning: ASR winks on the cockpit in several occasions already after 10.000 km.

What is your tire set and what do u advise (consider that i am not going to sell my mother's family jewels to buy 4 Pirelli P0 rosso )?

Price range around 400-500 € (600-750 $)

Shoot!

Toyo Proxes T1-Rs and Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3 are the budget-performance-tyre of choice. For slightly heavier cars - like yours - I'd suggest Pirelli P6000s.

 

[Azuremen]

I run either Falken Ziex or Azenis pretty exclusively now. The are cheap and all around do well in most things. And when you are me, the cheap is a big deal.

Of course, you wouldn't want the Azenis, so Ziex, unless you need something that sits in between those. If that is the case, I cannot help you much.

 

[toyomatt84]

Ziex 512's are notoriously well known for rigid sidewalls that fail constantly. They're a horrible tire. What type of climate/driving will the tires be seeing?

 

[moaibob]

What type of climate/driving will the tires be seeing?

Temperate; hot summer, mild winter; temp average range +2°-+35° Celsius, usually dry, rainy on autumn-winter, rare snow, rare freezed tarmac.

Bendy roads, speed range 90-130 Kph, smooth driving, few braking, no red zone reaching

Enough data?

 

[toyomatt84]

Temperate; hot summer, mild winter; temp average range +2°-+35° Celsius, usually dry, rainy on autumn-winter, rare snow, rare freezed tarmac.

Bendy roads, speed range 90-130 Kph, smooth driving, few braking, no red zone reaching

Enough data?

Better. I'd say Kumho ASX's or if you want to go more sporty, Dunlop Direzza DZ101's.

 

[Thirdeye]

I liked my old Hankook Mileage Plus GT All-Seasons, they lasted a long time even with my hard driving. The only downside was I felt they weren't that great in the snow, when they were advertised as being All-Season, but that probably has a lot to do with the nature of my old car as well (a front-wheel-drive Nissan Altima [Bluebird in Japan/Europe] with no ABS) I'm currently using some cheapie no-name tires (Lemans Touring?) and they actually seem pretty decent as well, but that's probably because they're still new with most of the tread remaining. But if I were you, I'd try some Toyo tires.

 

[moaibob]

so far, i would exclude the dunlop.
I am afraid that Kumho doesn't sell this ASX in Italy... I've only found the Kumho Solus gamma. nice surface but i had kumho (can't recall the version) on my old crappy Daewoo, not so good.
Oriented on the goodyear, even though that i heard somewhere that tires with rotation sense (not simmetrical surface) are a little too noisy.
Always been curious about toyo (is that the official JGTC brand?)... will investigate.
Goodyear ranked 1st so far.
Keep on shooting 👍

 

[YSSMAN]

You're looking for a performance tire I'd assume? I'd probably check and see what was OEM stock first, Volkswagen normally does a good job putting good tires even on their standard models.

I've been looking into BFGoodrich Traction T/As for my car (a 1996 VW Jetta/Vento, precursor to the Jetta/Bora), as I need a good all-season tire with good grip in the summer and good performance in the winter (we get snow, had over 2.5 cm today). They're cheap, perform well, and last a long time. I'd call that a bonus, if anything.

Do they sell Continentals in Italy? I seem to recall those being standard fare on some of the newer pre-MKV models, but I've got no idea which version of the tire they were using.

 

[Slick6]

I've got the exact same size tire on my car. Anyways, stock they come with Bridgestone Potenza RE92's. I have 35k miles on my car and they still have some tread left. They're great in the rain/dry times, but winter leaves something to be desired. For that I've got Winterforce M&S. These tires are amazing in the snow, but are not too great at high speeds with their 13/32" tread depth and extreme siping. I would recommend the Bridgestones though for what you need to do, although reviews seem to say otherwise.

Bridgestone Potenza RE92

Winterforce M&S

 

[Perfect Balance]

Bf Goodrich G-force sport. Cheap, very progressive. (skip barber racing uses them)

Just great tires for the money, I can't praise them enough, I love them.

 

[moaibob]

I've got the exact same size tire on my car. Anyways, stock they come with Bridgestone Potenza RE92's. I have 35k miles on my car and they still have some tread left. They're great in the rain/dry times, but winter leaves something to be desired. For that I've got Winterforce M&S. These tires are amazing in the snow, but are not too great at high speeds with their 13/32" tread depth and extreme siping. I would recommend the Bridgestones though for what you need to do, although reviews seem to say otherwise.

Bridgestone Potenza RE92

Winterforce M&S

My father works at the italian Bridgestone plant (and i worked there as well for about 3 months in 1997). But, weird, i never tried them... I will enquire. Anyway, a 4-season tire set is enough for me. as i wrote, we have not so much rain/snow, so winter tires are nearly useless.

You're looking for a performance tire I'd assume? I'd probably check and see what was OEM stock first, Volkswagen normally does a good job putting good tires even on their standard models.

I've been looking into BFGoodrich Traction T/As for my car (a 1996 VW Jetta/Vento, precursor to the Jetta/Bora), as I need a good all-season tire with good grip in the summer and good performance in the winter (we get snow, had over 2.5 cm today). They're cheap, perform well, and last a long time. I'd call that a bonus, if anything.

Do they sell Continentals in Italy? I seem to recall those being standard fare on some of the newer pre-MKV models, but I've got no idea which version of the tire they were using.

My VW had Michelin as 1st equipment. We have Continentals here, but some friends in the past had something to blame about. If they improved the compound, maybe...

I'll send my dealer nuts, asking for:
1-Goodyear Eagle F1
2-Bridgestone Potenza
3-BF Goodrich Traction T / G-Force
4-Toyo Proxes

so, at this time, Goodyear and Bridgestone aligned, BF-G getting closer, Toyo always on my mind.... prices not considered, so far.

Thank you guys! 👍

 

[Slicks]

Check out Kumho tires for your car...
Either the Ecsta SPT or the Ecsta ASX.

I've heard nothing but good things about Kumho - Though I have no firsthand experience - And they are a bit less money than the other brands.

 

[Famine]

Anyway, a 4-season tire set is enough for me. as i wrote, we have not so much rain/snow, so winter tires are nearly useless.

Then forget the Toyos and Eagle F1s and head straight for the Pirelli P6000s. I can't abide them on my cars, but I've never owned anything heavier than 2,400lb, and P6000s are notoriously useless on light cars and in the wet. T1-Rs and GS-D3s have excellent water dispersal, but that's nearly useless for you and they wear quite quickly.

Heavier car + no real bad weather = Pirelli P6000s. They'll last you 30,000 miles or more and give decent dry grip.

 

[Wolfe]

I bought a set of Yokohama AVID H4S's after TireRack.com told me it was the best high-performance all-season in my car's size. I only have a set of Pirelli P6s to compare to, but so far I'd agree with the TireRack.com reviews. Great tires.

Here are some potential options for your size, moaibob. It's a u.s.-based site, but at least you could get some ideas.

 

[moaibob]

Then forget the Toyos and Eagle F1s and head straight for the Pirelli P6000s. I can't abide them on my cars, but I've never owned anything heavier than 2,400lb, and P6000s are notoriously useless on light cars and in the wet. T1-Rs and GS-D3s have excellent water dispersal, but that's nearly useless for you and they wear quite quickly.

Heavier car + no real bad weather = Pirelli P6000s. They'll last you 30,000 miles or more and give decent dry grip.

I bought a set of Yokohama AVID H4S's after TireRack.com told me it was the best high-performance all-season in my car's size. I only have a set of Pirelli P6s to compare to, but so far I'd agree with the TireRack.com reviews. Great tires.

Here are some potential options for your size, moaibob. It's a u.s.-based site, but at least you could get some ideas.

Well, watching Tire Rack ranking, it seems that michelin Pilot Exalto are the best in all conditions, and i have to consider that my old michelin set was quite good (even thought the hardening of the wear). But My Pilot were "Energy" instead of Exalto. probably just a difference in the wear design. If it is about a new compound too, they could greatly fit.
Pirelli not so good rated. But searching the web for other opinions about...

Kumho.... my old crappy Daewoo Lanos had kumho as 1st equipment... I left the car hugged to a tree in 2001..... after slipping on wet road @ 40mph.... I have more than some prejudices

 

[Famine]

Well, watching Tire Rack ranking, it seems that michelin Pilot Exalto are the best in all conditions

They're very good in the wet. But if you don't get much wet, what's the point?

Pirelli not so good rated. But searching the web for other opinions about...

I had P6000s fitted to my car when I bought it. In the dry they sucked. In the wet they were appalling - she became white-line-a-phobic. Put on T1-Rs and it transformed the car. On the MX-5 there were P6000s (and P6s!) fitted to it. In the dry they sucked. In the wet the car was sideways everywhere. Put on T1-Rs and it transformed the car, to the point of being unable to slip the rear in anything but snow...

P6000s are no good at all on light cars (MX-3 - 1,100kg/2,420lb; MX-5 - 1,040kg/2,300lb) or in the wet. But on heavier cars - like the Jaguar S-Type R (standard fit) and your 1,440kg/3,175lb Bora - and in the dry, you won't get much better, more durable tyres for your money.

 

[moaibob]

They're very good in the wet. But if you don't get much wet, what's the point?

I don't get much wet, but this doesn't mean that i live in the Sahel Desert.
We have rain (not that much but it happens) and morning humidity/occasional white frost (is this the right definition in english???) on the road too.

And the ranking on Tire Rack states that Michelin is the best on dry too. (P6000 not ranked probably since they are summer tires).

4 season pirelli P6 are a 28% below Michelin, there must be a reason.

Anyway, all of this doesn't mean that I surely exclude Pirelli as an option. 👍

 

[Famine]

I don't get much wet, but this doesn't mean that i live in the Sahel Desert.
We have rain (not that much but it happens) and morning humidity/occasional white frost (is this the right definition in english???) on the road too.

And the ranking on Tire Rack states that Michelin is the best on dry too. (P6000 not ranked probably since they are summer tires).

4 season pirelli P6 are a 28% below Michelin, there must be a reason.

P6s are crap though. P600s too.

Say you expect to get 30,000 miles out of a set of tyres. How much of that is in the wet? do you really push the car hard enough on public roads to explore the limits of your tyres - would you really see any benefit from "fast road" tyres like the Exaltos, T1-Rs and Eagle F1 GS-D3s?

 

[moaibob]

P6s are crap though. P600s too.

Say you expect to get 30,000 miles out of a set of tyres. How much of that is in the wet? do you really push the car hard enough on public roads to explore the limits of your tyres - would you really see any benefit from "fast road" tyres like the Exaltos, T1-Rs and Eagle F1 GS-D3s?

Well, probably about 20% in the wet. And i am not going to do any road racing, but 80% of my weekly driving is on secondary roads, one lane x direction, continuous bends, several passing accelerations, and i usually have a safe sporty driving at average 110-120 kph.
What's the big deal if I take a (maybe) over-performing tires? Probably they are more useful on the roads i usually ride than on a 1000 miles straight 4 lanes highway.
I ususally equip my car with W-speed tires (240+ kph) but this doesn't mean that i necessarily need to reach that speed to justify that choice

 

[Famine]

Well, probably about 20% in the wet. And i am not going to do any road racing, but 80% of my weekly driving is on secondary roads, one lane x direction, continuous bends, several passing accelerations, and i usually have a safe sporty driving at average 110-120 kph.
What's the big deal if I take a (maybe) over-performing tires? Probably they are more useful on the roads i usually ride than on a 1000 miles straight 4 lanes highway.
I ususally equip my car with W-speed tires (240+ kph) but this doesn't mean that i necessarily need to reach that speed to justify that choice

Quite so - but EU law states that a car must be fitted with tyres whose maximum speed rating exceeds the maximum speed rating of the vehicle.


I was just trying to establish if there was much point in paying over the odds for tyres which perform better and wear faster when you could buy slightly less performance-rated tyres with a better wear rate for significantly less money.

 

[moaibob]

Quite so - but EU law states that a car must be fitted with tyres whose maximum speed rating exceeds the maximum speed rating of the vehicle.


I was just trying to establish if there was much point in paying over the odds for tyres which perform better and wear faster when you could buy slightly less performance-rated tyres with a better wear rate for significantly less money.

As a matter of fact, the registration document states that i should use H-speed tires but no claims from officers are usually issued (W is "better" than H). the main thing is that wheel dimensions are respected (205/55 R16).

And for the pricing, P6000 fly @ about 95 €, Michelin @ 105 €. If you put in the usual discount, 25%, you have 71 € vs. 76 €. Not that difference.
If i'll choose Pirelli, Famine's invited for a pizza to be paid with the 20 € saved from tires

 

[Famine]

As a matter of fact, the registration document states that i should use H-speed tires but no claims from officers are usually issued (W is "better" than H). the main thing is that wheel dimensions are respected (205/55 R16).

As you state, W-rated tyres exceed the speed rating of your car, so there would be no issues fitting them. The minimum you must fit are H-rated tyres.

And for the pricing, P6000 fly @ about 95 €, Michelin @ 105 €. If you put in the usual discount, 25%, you have 71 € vs. 76 €. Not that difference.

Great googa-mooga!

95 Euro for a P6000? That's TWICE as much as I pay for T1-Rs, in 205/55 R15!

If i'll choose Pirelli, Famine's invited for a pizza to be paid with the 20 € saved from tires

Deal.

 

[moaibob]

Great googa-mooga!

95 Euro for a P6000? That's TWICE as much as I pay for T1-Rs, in 205/55 R15!

Ok, i am going all-in. These prices are taken from the web and they are full ( www.gommadiretto.it, sorry, it is in italian ) ... i don't think it is the best dealer but a good benchmark.
My usual dealer has lower prices and usually gets far beyond the 25% discount (40-45%). I never spent more than 280-300 euros for a complete set, including Michelin Pilot.

If Uk prices are still lower, well, lucky you! It should be you to invite me for a pizza .....

 

[Famine]

Ok, i am going all-in. These prices are taken from the web and they are full ( www.gommadiretto.it, sorry, it is in italian ) ... i don't think it is the best dealer but a good benchmark.
My usual dealer has lower prices and usually gets far beyond the 25% discount (40-45%). I never spent more than 280-300 euros for a complete set, including Michelin Pilot.

If Uk prices are still lower, well, lucky you! It should be you to invite me for a pizza .....

Heh - that's the same site as http://www.mytyres.co.uk, from whom I get my tyres!

 

[moaibob]

lolling so much!!!!

By the way, prices on your website are slightly higher... want me to arrange a shipment from my dealer for your next tires set? 👍

 

[Famine]

lolling so much!!!!

By the way, prices on your website are slightly higher... want me to arrange a shipment from my dealer for your next tires set? 👍

Nah, my tyres are still only £54 a corner... Mind you, that's £9 more than I paid last time...


For £67 (95 Euro) a corner I could get Toyo 888s... Mmmmm...

 

[moaibob]

Hey, what about these Falken Ziex ZE 512 (tho they are summer tires?) @ 64.70 Euros?

At the beginning of the thread, not so good quoted.... but....

 

[Perfect Balance]

Ziex 512's are notoriously well known for rigid sidewalls that fail constantly. They're a horrible tire. What type of climate/driving will the tires be seeing?

Hey, what about these Falken Ziex ZE 512 (tho they are summer tires?) @ 64.70 Euros?

At the beginning of the thread, not so good quoted.... but....

The Falken Ziex 512 sucks, don't buy it.

 

[Race Idiot]

Hey, what about these Falken Ziex ZE 512 (tho they are summer tires?) @ 64.70 Euros?

At the beginning of the thread, not so good quoted.... but....

Theres a one make mr2 race series here that ran Ziex 512's as a standard tyre. The amount of tyre failures they had over the previous season when running yoko a022's was staggering.

Falken do make a much better tyre though called the FK452 which infact comes in 205/55/16.