BMW Mercedes Face-off (3series V's C class)

  • Thread starter Thread starter GT4 genius
  • 67 comments
  • 3,602 views

Which is better, OVERALL?

  • BMW 3 series

    Votes: 27 57.4%
  • Mercedes C class

    Votes: 20 42.6%

  • Total voters
    47
You forgot a car:
I'm sorry. That's not the right Caddy to compete with the 3er and C-class. I think you meant this:
250px-Cadillac_BLS_front_20070819.jpg

:p
 
You know what was kind of depressing YSS?


Today I saw my first new CTS (:D) that was good. It looked awesome in white IMO. One problem: It was BILLOWING smoke out the pipes.... I almost cried. The test driver was completely oblivious to it apparently and continued to drive along as if nothing has happened.


:indiff:

But I still think the rankings go as such:

1.BMW 335i
2.Cadillac CTS 3.6 DI
3.Mercedes Benz C350 Sport
4.Infiniti G35 Sport
5.Lexus IS350
6.Audi A4 3.2 Quattro
7.Lincoln MKZ


But I really do like the MKZ.... Its just not as good.
 
Yep. Because the IS350 is...

1.RWD
2.Has a better back seat (IMO)
3.Looks better IMO.
4.Is a fair bit cheaper than the 3.2
5.Is about as reliable as a Camry
 
Here in ireland the top 3 are BMW, Merc and Audi, then maybe saab and lexus. I've never seen a Cadillac near where i live, but there is some, and have definitly never seen an infinite anywhere in ireland. Do they not make right hand drive cars?

As for the passat all the ones available here are front wheel drive, which kind of puts them in a different class, although i know they are the same size.

Cadillac's efforts in the European market have been laughable to say the least. Leaving it to a private firm to manage their European efforts was a major mistake, and furthermore, it isn't as though they're really even trying with too many of their vehicles. The BLS is too much like the 9-3 to really make a difference, the MKI CTS really isn't much of a competitor in Europe as it is in America, and lastly, there really isn't a market for the SRX either. No wonder why they haven't sold many cars...

The CTS is a looker, and I think the European press will be quite impressed with the MKII CTS...

On the Infiniti brand: I think Infiniti is just about ready to "officially" launch in the UK, so you may start seeing more sometime soon. They're pretty good cars, and while they do match the performance of most BMW and Mercedes products, they have yet to come anywhere close in civility and quality.

=====

Tophaticant
You know what was kind of depressing YSS?


Today I saw my first new CTS that was good. It looked awesome in white IMO. One problem: It was BILLOWING smoke out the pipes.... I almost cried. The test driver was completely oblivious to it apparently and continued to drive along as if nothing has happened.




But I still think the rankings go as such:

1.BMW 335i
2.Cadillac CTS 3.6 DI
3.Mercedes Benz C350 Sport
4.Infiniti G35 Sport
5.Lexus IS350
6.Audi A4 3.2 Quattro
7.Lincoln MKZ


But I really do like the MKZ.... Its just not as good.

1) I have no idea why there would be smoke coming out of the pipes, so thats a bit odd.

2) Its a great car, and it looks good in almost every color EXCEPT silver. The big chrome grille just looks silly then... The first I saw was in white, the second was in that awesome pearl Champagne color.

3) Good list, by which I find it most agreeable. However, I do agree with Toronado that the A4 and IS350 need to switch places... At the very least, Audi lets you turn off the computer aids, and furthermore, is fun to drive.

===

Toronado
I'm sorry. That's not the right Caddy to compete with the 3er and C-class. I think you meant this:
250px-Cadillac_BLS_front_20070819.jpg

Technically you're right, but we don't have the BLS in the US market... The good news is that the BLS is going RWD for 2010, which should make it a much better competitor to the 3er in the very near future...
 
Yep. Because the IS350 is...

1.RWD
2.Has a better back seat (IMO)
3.Looks better IMO.
4.Is a fair bit cheaper than the 3.2
5.Is about as reliable as a Camry
The IS350 also has:
1. Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
2. A slushbox only.
3. Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
4. An interior of lesser quality.
5. Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
6. Lesser driving ability than the Audi before you're met with the Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
7. Poor driving manners; with a poorly damped suspension, slow-to-react paddle shifters, poor ride and numb steering.
8. The Audi is as reliable as an Audi. Which trumps "reliable as a Camry."
9. Oh, and Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
 
Yep. Because the IS350 is...

1.RWD
2.Has a better back seat (IMO)
3.Looks better IMO.
4.Is a fair bit cheaper than the 3.2
5.Is about as reliable as a Camry

I presume you are talking about the old A4?
 
The IS350 also has:
1. Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
2. A slushbox only.
3. Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
4. An interior of lesser quality.
5. Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
6. Lesser driving ability than the Audi before you're met with the Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
7. Poor driving manners; with a poorly damped suspension, slow-to-react paddle shifters, poor ride and numb steering.
8. The Audi is as reliable as an Audi. Which trumps "reliable as a Camry."
9. Oh, and Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).

Toyota fan:

But, but, but you CAN defeat it! You just have to do a gazillion things that are a pain in the ass and then it will maybe work...
 
But I still think the rankings go as such:

1.BMW 335i
2.Cadillac CTS 3.6 DI
3.Mercedes Benz C350 Sport
4.Infiniti G35 Sport
5.Lexus IS350
6.Audi A4 3.2 Quattro
7.Lincoln MKZ


But I really do like the MKZ.... Its just not as good.

Hm, by comparison here's my list based on using those you choose as a basis...

1) Infiniti G35 sport
2) Audi A4 3.2 Quattro
3) Merc C350 sport
4) BMW 335i
5) Lincoln MKZ
6) Cadillac something-or-other
7) Lexus IS-whocares-50

Yep. Because the IS350 is...

1.RWD
2.Has a better back seat (IMO)
3.Looks better IMO.
4.Is a fair bit cheaper than the 3.2
5.Is about as reliable as a Camry

1. All the other cars have this
2. Your opinion
3. Your opinion
4. Who cares, I'll take the superior Audi
5. On what planet?

The IS350 also has:
1. Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
2. A slushbox only.
3. Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
4. An interior of lesser quality.
5. Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
6. Lesser driving ability than the Audi before you're met with the Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).
7. Poor driving manners; with a poorly damped suspension, slow-to-react paddle shifters, poor ride and numb steering.
8. The Audi is as reliable as an Audi. Which trumps "reliable as a Camry."
9. Oh, and Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).

Toyota fan:

But, but, but you CAN defeat it! You just have to do a gazillion things that are a pain in the ass and then it will maybe work...

You guys are awsome. Thanks for my daily laugh. Tor, that was a brilliant post. :D
 
Hm, by comparison here's my list based on using those you choose as a basis...

1) Infiniti G35 sport
2) Audi A4 3.2 Quattro
3) Merc C350 sport
4) BMW 335i
5) Lincoln MKZ
6) Cadillac something-or-other
7) Lexus IS-whocares-50

Eh? The Lincoln MKZ above the quite excellent '08 CTS? No matter how wonderful the new 3.5L V6 is, it by no means makes a "Fusion in a tuxedo" MKZ better than a purpose-built sports sedan...

My picks:

- BMW 335i
- Cadillac CTS 3.6 DIG
- Mercedes-Benz C350 Sport
- Infiniti G35S
- Audi A4 3.2
- Saab 9-3 AeroX (based on hype alone!)
- Lexus IS350
- Lincoln MKZ (afterall, its still a Fusion)

I suspect that list will change greatly when the new A4 debuts, probably bumping the CTS down a bit, and should Lexus ever build one for the folks like us, I'd suspect it would shift upward as well. The G35 is still a shade too crude to make it in the top three, and while I probably should have the Mercedes in second, the Cadillac just makes so much more sense there.

You guys are awsome. Thanks for my daily laugh. Tor, that was a brilliant post. :D

I'm happy to help when I'm given the material...

(waits for Toyota fan to read that post, flames begin!)
 
Fine. I'll do a list:

- Mercedes-Benz C350 Sport
- Saab 9-3 AeroX (based on awesomeness that it now has)
- BMW 335i (make it the coupe and it gets bumped up to 2nd)
- Cadillac CTS 3.6 DIG (put the previous CTS front end on it and it gets bumped up to 3rd, ahead of the Aero X but behind 335 due to engine)
- Audi A4 3.2 (a little underpowered as of late)
- Infiniti G35S (Needs refinement. Needs refinement.)
- Lexus IS350 (
Undefeatable and highly sensitive stability control (VDIM).)
- Lincoln MKZ (By far the best car on the chassis. But it is still on the chassis.)
 
Again, for the most part I find the list agreeable. The good news is that so many of the cars in the class are quite good, so its really finite details and truly personal preferences that decide which car goes where. Although, we seem to all agree that the Lexus and the Lincoln bring "teh sux" for the most part.

My guess is that if the Lincoln ran on the updated Mondeo chassis, it would be a superbly excellent car.
 
Although, we seem to all agree that the Lexus and the Lincoln bring "teh sux" for the most part.
Well, I dunno about that. Lexus has proven, if the previous generation GS was any indication, that they can make a marvelous handling and riding sport sedan and then proceed completely murder it with electronic nannies like Mercedes used to do.
For all we know, the IS350 is the best drive in the entire class. Its just that without being able to get close to figuring that out, the Lexus isn't good enough to be top three based solely on everything other than driving experience.
 
Eh? The Lincoln MKZ above the quite excellent '08 CTS? No matter how wonderful the new 3.5L V6 is, it by no means makes a "Fusion in a tuxedo" MKZ better than a purpose-built sports sedan...

Thats my preference.

My picks:

- BMW 335i
- Cadillac CTS 3.6 DIG
- Mercedes-Benz C350 Sport
- Infiniti G35S
- Audi A4 3.2
- Saab 9-3 AeroX (based on hype alone!)
- Lexus IS350
- Lincoln MKZ (afterall, its still a Fusion)

There's nothing wrong with the Fusion...
 
No, there isn't anything wrong with the Fusion itself, but when the Lincoln really is a Fusion in a black tie tux, it really isn't enough to make it stand out in an already crowded room.

With the move to the Mondeo chassis by the Mazda6, I assume the same for the Fusion and the MKZ in the semi-near future, although, Ford is really good at screwing things up, so you never know for certain...
 
With the move to the Mondeo chassis by the Mazda6, I assume the same for the Fusion and the MKZ in the semi-near future, although, Ford is really good at screwing things up, so you never know for certain...
Again, the Mazda 6 will not be on the Mondeo platform when it is redesigned, according to both Auto, Motor und Sport and a few websites. At the very least it is no longer the sure thing we thought it was.
 
Ah, I see that now. The Wiki is saying its on an evolved D3 chassis, not the EUCD chassis. Hmmm. It seemed as though most reports had said it was on the same platform as the Mondeo...
 
Its actually a surprisingly nice, but dreadfully average, car from FoMoCo:

2008.lincoln.mkz.20133026-E.jpg


2008.lincoln.mkz.20133024-E.jpg


2007.lincoln.mkz.20100139-E.jpg


They start around $30K USD with AWD and a 263 BHP 3.5L V6, which is actually pretty cheap for the class. Considering that it is based on the current Mazda6, there is only so much that they can do to make it a good car... And "good" isn't good enough anymore.
 
Sorry for the double post but this deserves to be said:
During this weekends episode of top gear the BMW M3 beat the Mercedes C63 AMG by over 5 seconds, around a track in spain, all three of them agreed that the M3 was by far the best car but Jeremy decided that he would rather buy the C63 AMG because it was more "insane"!!
 
Mulling over this a little bit. Generally, my gut says to take the C-Class. I dont' know why, but the 3-series just doesn't appeal to me, even though it's faster in most ways, and has that Twin Turbo I6, even though it probably won't tune like the JZ, MZ, or RB. If I wanted a 1000+ HP Turbo Six, anyway, I'd get a Supra or a GNX.

(And, before you all jump down my throat, I know the GNX is a V6, it just can make much power. ^^)

Perhaps it's the Bangle styling. Bangle seems to fail every time he puts a front bumper on his car, anyway: His better designs, the 5-series, 6-series, and Z4 all have a not-so-obvious front bumper. Perhaps It's that I never seem to like the industry standard...that too many other people like it.

The 3-series, of these two, is the better car...but that makes me want the C-Class. It's close, damn close, nothing would go wrong, and I'd probably be just as happy, as I'm a mediocre driver. And the C63 has what might as well be an SRT engine. A little Mopar similarity never hurts. I find myself agreeing with Clarkson: It is crazier.
 
Its damn-crazy, and thats what makes it so interesting. But the level of involvement that the M3 offers over the Mercedes is a bonus at the very least. Then again, you can't fault the "new-age-muscle" that the three-pointer has to offer.

...Either way, I'm skipping the Audi booth in that race...
 
Sorry for the double post but this deserves to be said:
During this weekends episode of top gear the BMW M3 beat the Mercedes C63 AMG by over 5 seconds, around a track in spain, all three of them agreed that the M3 was by far the best car but Jeremy decided that he would rather buy the C63 AMG because it was more "insane"!!

Thanks for ruining it 👍

And +1 for C-Class.
 
Lexus IS350, Infiniti G35, Cadillac CTS (not in that order).

No sense looking at either of the overpriced, bloated vehicles named in the title of the thread.
 
You know the Lexus ISF in GT5P (the demo) seems to be alot like the C63, its too powerful and heavy. Is it out yet in real life? If you dont know what i mean try it in the game, switch off traction and asm and put on a set of normal tyres, if you dont want to crash dont touch the trottle!!
My point is although the Lexus is great fun its too uncontrollable for a race unless you let the traction computer drive it!! Whereas the M3 is far more user friendly, and who said 420bhp wasn't enough!
 
Having watched the last episode of TopGear my love for new C-class is endless. It just is brilliant. The C63 AMG model speaks to my pants in a very special way. The noise alone is worth the price of admission.

My only complaint with the new C-class is the lack of a 4cyl. model. They removed the 4cyl engine and put the 3.0L V6 as the base engine. And it only has 228bhp...the 4cyl supercharged model could of eclipsed that if they had wanted.

My god is loooks brilliant in silver. This is the only AMG Merc that I'd get in silver.

112_0709_02z+2008_mercedes_benz_c63_AMG+front_three_quarter_view.jpg

2008-mercedes-benz-c63-amg-3.jpg
 
Lexus IS350, Infiniti G35, Cadillac CTS (not in that order).

No sense looking at either of the overpriced, bloated vehicles named in the title of the thread.

CTS? w00t!

Has one seen the light?

(Kidding...)
 

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