Book's vehicles thread: Now with Two Different Wheels-Post 339

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Apparently, Tire Rack is "overpriced" and "takes too long to get there" (according to my parents), so I'm pretty much being forced to order from somewhere local. They're pushing me to go to Discount Tire, because that's where Dad bought the last two sets of his tires from.

Although they do have the Azenis, and they are the same price as the Yokohamas... I'll probably ask Keef how they work for him.
 
Be sure and haggle at Discount, they will knock a few bucks off the price for you.
 
You won't get much off but it's worth a try. Also right now they are offering a $100 back if you put it on a Discount charge card, you could just get it, charge the tires and wheels, and cancel it after you pay it off. Goodyears tires have a $20 mail in rebate and as far as I know Continental tires are offering a deal that if you buy 4 you get a TomTom sat nav.
 
Joey D
You won't get much off but it's worth a try.
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Didn't think so, but it'd be worth a shot.

Also right now they are offering a $100 back if you put it on a Discount charge card, you could just get it, charge the tires and wheels, and cancel it after you pay it off.
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Dad's already got one, and I doubt they'd let a 16-year-old sign up for a card by himself. Someone would have to co-sign, I'm guessing. Actually... 💡 I could get everything right now under Dad's name and pay it off like that...

Goodyears tires have a $20 mail in rebate and as far as I know Continental tires are offering a deal that if you buy 4 you get a TomTom sat nav.
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I know the Yokohamas I was looking at had a $40 instant rebate on them; that was part of the reason why I was looking at them. And I suppose I could sell the sat nav, as I really don't need one right now.
 
Azuremen
Wow, those are way too much for way too little tire. Also, what is the OEM size, because honestly, you'll find way more selection in 205/50/15. Which, seeing as Tire rack recommends 195/55/15, the 205/50 makes much more sense.
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The 205/55R15 size has more offerings, since it is popular as standard-equipment on lots of models, compared to 50-series. Making the jump to 16" rims is trickier, since you'll have to go with a 45-series, and that means going to a smaller range of tires in that width: 205/45R16 might be doable, but it's more expensive.

205/55R16 is a popular size; can find those in many varieties all day long (10 pages on Tire Rack). The one problem with ordering tires is finding a place to mount and balance them later on. Some shops will do it, others won't. Usually if you keep the stickers and invoice, it's not a big deal, but you pay more for installation.

On the other hand, if you buy the new wheels and tires in one go, you'll save yourself the hassle of finding a shop to do it. Get a jack and stand and install 'em yourself.
 
Pupik
The 205/55R15 size has more offerings, since it is popular as standard-equipment on lots of models, compared to 50-series. Making the jump to 16" rims is trickier, since you'll have to go with a 45-series, and that means going to a smaller range of tires in that width: 205/45R16 might be doable, but it's more expensive.
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I've been looking at 205/50/15 tires; was that a bit of a mistake, or could I run fine with that size?

205/55R16 is a popular size; can find those in many varieties all day long (10 pages on Tire Rack). The one problem with ordering tires is finding a place to mount and balance them later on. Some shops will do it, others won't. Usually if you keep the stickers and invoice, it's not a big deal, but you pay more for installation.
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See below on installation.

On the other hand, if you buy the new wheels and tires in one go, you'll save yourself the hassle of finding a shop to do it. Get a jack and stand and install 'em yourself.
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Which is what I plan to do. Maybe, if I can find the tires/wheels I want at a local shop, I can save some money by just having them mounted/balanced and just install them myself. It's not that hard... haha.
 
Either one; the tire companies know you want more performance with you step into a 50-series as opposed to a 55-series tire, and you will pay for it.

If you make the circumference of the tire & wheel combo too big or too small, it will sometimes mess up the speedometer calibration. Wheel speed sensors can go batty, et cetera. Nothing too dangerous, unless you have an extremely high-end, over-computerized, lots-of-robo-nannies type of car that shouldn't have those kind of sensors modified in any way.

The rule of thumb to keep the total circumference is to decrease by a series of 10 for every first inch of increase to the rim diameter. Another words: a 205/60R15 can be swapped for a 205/50R16 or 205/40R17 for a 17" rim (+2 sizing).

The problem you have is that your car has 185 section-width tires; on the same wheels you can usually fit another 10mm, up to 195/xxR14. Unfortunately, that limits your choices within the same narrow width and small tire diameter, and sometimes there is no exact tire size (or a really limited range) when you're applying that formula (I don't even think a 195...R14 exists). You can't make the tread's width too wide without new wheels and you'll also have to install wheel spacers do that they don't rub the fender liner when cornering.

Of course, the standard size means you can buy tires all day long on the cheap. If it's a first car, I wouldn't go all-out on a performance tire, although you live somewhere where you need a set of winter tires anyhow. Since getting another set of wheels makes more sense, get the best you can afford. Or just find some steelies at a junkyard.
 
Pupik
Either one; the tire companies know you want more performance with you step into a 50-series as opposed to a 55-series tire, and you will pay for it.
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Understandable.

If you make the circumference of the tire & wheel combo too big or too small, it will sometimes mess up the speedometer calibration. Wheel speed sensors can go batty, et cetera. Nothing too dangerous, unless you have an extremely high-end, over-computerized, lots-of-robo-nannies type of car that shouldn't have those kind of sensors modified in any way.
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Which I don't, and going from a 185/65R14 to a 205/50R15 puts my speedometer over by a whopping 1.7 percent. I think I can deal with that.

The rule of thumb to keep the total circumference is to decrease by a series of 10 for every first inch of increase to the rim diameter. Another words: a 205/60R15 can be swapped for a 205/50R16 or 205/40R17 for a 17" rim (+2 sizing).
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By doing this, a 55-series puts me 1.7 percent under on the speedo, but a 50-series puts me 1.7 percent over. For speeding tickets' sake, too, I might want to use the 50-series. (Just in case a cop decides to screw with me, which they like to do around here.)

You can't make the tread's width too wide without new wheels and you'll also have to install wheel spacers do that they don't rub the fender liner when cornering.
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By going to a 15" wheel, anyway, I don't think I will have a problem with the tire being too wide for the wheel. However, will the tire (from a 185 to a 205) be too wide for the fender?

Of course, the standard size means you can buy tires all day long on the cheap. If it's a first car, I wouldn't go all-out on a performance tire, although you live somewhere where you need a set of winter tires anyhow. Since getting another set of wheels makes more sense, get the best you can afford. Or just find some steelies at a junkyard.
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I've already got a set of steelies on the car that I plan on using for snow tires, and I'm getting a new set of wheels for it anyway.
 
ty00123
Apparently, Tire Rack is "overpriced" and "takes too long to get there" (according to my parents), so I'm pretty much being forced to order from somewhere local. They're pushing me to go to Discount Tire, because that's where Dad bought the last two sets of his tires from.

Although they do have the Azenis, and they are the same price as the Yokohamas... I'll probably ask Keef how they work for him.
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Your parents are poorly informed. The tires I ordered from took 4 business days to get here or so. To my door. Pricing is pretty much comparable with small differences being in shipping more often.

As for teh 55 versus 50 sidewall, you find more performance orientated tires in the 50 profile, since 205/50/15 is a very popular size for auto-cross on smaller cars such as Civics, VWs, Toyotas, and so on. You'll also have better transitional response on the slightly shorter sidewalls :p
 
Azuremen
Your parents are poorly informed. The tires I ordered from took 4 business days to get here or so. To my door. Pricing is pretty much comparable with small differences being in shipping more often.
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Yeah, I know they're poorly informed. But I'm not in a position to argue a point, and I'm pretty meh over where I get a set of tires from.

As for teh 55 versus 50 sidewall, you find more performance orientated tires in the 50 profile, since 205/50/15 is a very popular size for auto-cross on smaller cars such as Civics, VWs, Toyotas, and so on. You'll also have better transitional response on the slightly shorter sidewalls :p
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I.e. the Azenis and Toyos? And help me out; what is transitional response?
 
Yes, the Azenis and Toyos.

Transitional response, at least how I think of it, is the response time it takes from a steering input to the actually changing direction. Things that impact this are - tread squirm, sidewall flex/roll, suspension loading, and bushing deformation. The smaller the sidewall relative to the tire width, the less flex and deformation will occur, yielding faster turn in and response. Same goes for tread design - all seasons with smaller tread block and deeper treads have, at least to me, a distinctly "slower" feel and response to them compared to tires such as the RT-615 and XS.

Another element to the response is how the breaks away when losing traction. Softer, taller sidewalls will roll more, leading to a very snappy break away when traction is lost. This aspect is not much of an issue in a FWD car, but when I was drifting my older MR2, I had more trouble predicting the break away on all seasons compared to older Azenis due to the sidewall stiffness.

On a different note, lower performance tires tend to squeal more at the limits, making any aggressive driving a bit more noticeable.
 
Well, the appointment's made. Saturday morning, I'm heading to the tire shop for a new set of Falken Azenis tires (205/50/150) on Drag DR-17 wheels. (my car's black, BTW.) $950.38 out the door. IcantwaitIcantwaitIcantwaitIcantwait!!!! :lol:

Pictures to come when they go on. Before/After, anyone?

P.S. Forgot to post about it/take pictures, but I got new front brake pads/rotors for it. $120 and 9 hours for my first ever brake job... and the car actually stops better, too!
 
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Cool, you should be pretty happy with that I would imagine, you got some serious rubber.

And now that your car has something aftermarket you can meet up with the Michigan crew whenever we finally get off our lazy asses and have a meet up somewhere :lol:.
 
I definitely hope so; Keef helped me out from talking about his Azenis in his car thread.

And we need to get something together for that before too long... or not, wait until Philly gets back to Holland. (I volunteer we use Battle Creek as a meeting spot... :lol:)
 
And they're on her. A bit late, as the wheels weren't in on Saturday, but yesterday afternoon I went up and got them installed.

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I'm pretty pleased by my decision. I need an alignment though before I can really enjoy my new purchases. :lol:
 
Joey D
Looks good 👍! So what's next?
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I'm thinking one of two ways to go: either 1) a halfway decent sound system (the stock speakers sound like crap, and all I have is a cassette player... it kind of needs one) or 2) a new coat of paint (spiderweb cracks on the front bumper, badly scratched hood, and peeling clearcoat on the roof). I know the paintwork will be more expensive, but I'm not sure which needs to be done sooner.

I see an opportunity for a poll arising...
 
Looks great 👍 Would be perfect with a roughly 3" drop :D

EDIT: Though yes, a re-spray would tidy the car up that little more.
 
ty00123
I'm thinking one of two ways to go: either 1) a halfway decent sound system (the stock speakers sound like crap, and all I have is a cassette player... it kind of needs one) or 2) a new coat of paint (spiderweb cracks on the front bumper, badly scratched hood, and peeling clearcoat on the roof). I know the paintwork will be more expensive, but I'm not sure which needs to be done sooner.

I see an opportunity for a poll arising...
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You live in Michigan, getting the car resprayed would mean it would look good for about a year and then just be destroyed. The MINI has a ton of chips and scratches all over it from the broken bits of road that get kicked up from the tires.

You might as well get a sound system, it'll be cheaper and you spend you time in the car, not outside looking at it. The only issue is I assume you have that stupid oval thing that contains your HVAC controls and radio. I have no idea how you'd fit a head unit in there, although if you ask on a Escort forum someone will know.

**Actually never mind, apparently they sell adapter plates:
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_120995720/Ford-Mercury-Factory-Integration-Adapter.html?tp=3486
 
Joey D
You live in Michigan, getting the car resprayed would mean it would look good for about a year and then just be destroyed. The MINI has a ton of chips and scratches all over it from the broken bits of road that get kicked up from the tires.
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You do have a point, although I'm afraid the body will start rusting though the scratches and whatnot eventually. Here's what I'm talking about:

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You might as well get a sound system, it'll be cheaper and you spend you time in the car, not outside looking at it. The only issue is I assume you have that stupid oval thing that contains your HVAC controls and radio. I have no idea how you'd fit a head unit in there, although if you ask on a Escort forum someone will know.

**Actually never mind, apparently they sell adapter plates:
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_120995720/Ford-Mercury-Factory-Integration-Adapter.html?tp=3486
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I was just going to mention that, actually.

By the way, does anyone know how to get this stuff off?

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P.S. hfs, 3 inches would be a bit excessive. Maybe one or 1.5 inches.
 
Wow that paint is in pretty rough shape, maybe you should get a quote or something to see how much it would cost to repaint the car. I'd avoid a place like Macco though as I've heard horror stories. One idea though is to check the local community college, I know at the one by my house if you buy the paint they do the work for free as part of a class. It's not going to be professional quality and it might take a little longer but it's cheap.

And that tire goo should come off with a brush and some water, or if it rains just drive the car around. Mine wasn't on there very long as all.
 
Joey D
Wow that paint is in pretty rough shape, maybe you should get a quote or something to see how much it would cost to repaint the car. I'd avoid a place like Macco though as I've heard horror stories. One idea though is to check the local community college, I know at the one by my house if you buy the paint they do the work for free as part of a class. It's not going to be professional quality and it might take a little longer but it's cheap.
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I'll check with the local body shop at some point. And I'm taking automotive tech classes from the local community college, so maybe I can get it in there at some point.

And that tire goo should come off with a brush and some water, or if it rains just drive the car around. Mine wasn't on there very long as all.
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Thanks for the tip. 👍
 
ty00123
P.S. hfs, 3 inches would be a bit excessive. Maybe one or 1.5 inches.
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Perhaps. It's hard to judge size from pictures. Though it does look like it's riding particularly high. I was going to suggest two inches originally and then thought "nah, won't be enough" :p I'm not one for big drops normally but you've got loads of space to the arches on that.
 
ty00123
By the way, does anyone know how to get this stuff off?

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That's wax that the installer rubbed on the tire's bead to make it slip on easier. It'll come off after a wash or two, rain, and stuff like that. Nothing to worry about.
 
homeforsummer
Perhaps. It's hard to judge size from pictures. Though it does look like it's riding particularly high. I was going to suggest two inches originally and then thought "nah, won't be enough" :p I'm not one for big drops normally but you've got loads of space to the arches on that.
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Let's go with two inches; I took a picture of the amount of space I do have.

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Keef
That's wax that the installer rubbed on the tire's bead to make it slip on easier. It'll come off after a wash or two, rain, and stuff like that. Nothing to worry about.
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That's what I thought it was; I just didn't like it on my new tires. :lol:
 
Be careful with lowering or you'll run into the problem I had with the Blazer (and subsequently with the Cooper). When it snows and the the plough trucks go by and pack ice and snow either at the end of a neighbourhood street or your driveway you are going to get a bit high centred. That's really the only place I can see where you'd have any issue with though.

This was a fun couple of hours:
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Winter tires won't do you any good if the car is high centred.

You could probably get away with a 1.5" drop without much of an issue since I know Escort/ZX2's sit up a bit. I don't think I would go much more than 2" though
 

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