Car for the snow of Oklahoma/Montana

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hawkeye122

hawkeye122

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gdwest1
So I'm currently applying to a handful of universities in Montana and Oklahoma. In this part of California we don't get snow very often, so I'm not sure how important an AWD car would be in such areas.

My current selection of vehicles includes only a 1992 Geo Tracker (Suzuki Vitara/Samurai) 4x4 convertible, and my trusty manual Camry CE.

I've heard rumblings about manuals being tricky to get going on slippery hills. Is that a thing?

The Geo really isnt reliable, so I wouldn't consider that as an option. It also gets about 19 MPG in town, which is frankly stupid.

There is a possibility of me getting a new/better car, costing less than $3500. It's really easy to say "Oh yeah, WRX yo.", but I'm thinking that's out of my price range. A 90's Audi A4 may not be too bad either, but I fear that would be unreliable. A cheap Blazer or similar vehicle would be solid, but I like fuel economy, and, well, I'm not a huge fan of driving SUV's. Obviously one complaint is legitimate, the other is nit-picky.

Is the Camry good enough if I drive carefully with good tires?

I post here knowing that the wealth of knowledge is deep, so hopefully you guys can point me in the proper direction.
 
Snow tires. Get some.

Vredestein makes a very nice set of studless snow tires, and a mediocre set of studded tires. Choose wisely.

As for the car... I wouldn't know, other than that 4x4 SUVs are a decent choice (I mean real 4x4, no experience with "AWD") have the ability to pull themselves out of snowy ditches better than most other cars, even on not-so-good tires.
 
Snow tires are more important than drivetrain in my experience, which ranges from driving Outbacks to MR2s all over the Pacific Northwest. A Camry with some decent snow tires (without studs, I can not stand the things) will do just fine in all but the most extreme situations. Hills can be a bit tricky to start with a manual, but honestly, automatics don't do much better in those situations simply because grip isn't that available in a FWD car on an incline... so you try to avoid situations where a stop would be needed.

As a student, I suspect you won't be driving that much as you'll typically live fairly close to campus. If you want to practice, just find a big parking lot at night after a fresh snow and practice how the car feels stopping and turning. Keep in mind AWD doesn't help with either, only with getting going... though most people seem to think having a Subaru means they are immune to snow conditions :rolleyes:

Most of the campuses out in Montana aren't really that hilly, at least from what I've seen. Where are you looking at up there?
 
As others have mentioned snow tires are far more important than what you're driving. My MINI managed to tackle the snow with zero issue with snow tires and it was a low, light, FWD car.

Depending on how much snow falls though ground clearance could become and issue, but if you stick to main roads the likelihood of that being an issue is slim.
 
Yup, just put some quality winter tires on whatever you have and off you go. If anything a manual transmission is just an upside in slippery conditions aswell.
 
I say keep the Camry and throw some snow tyres on it. Good snow tyres are far better than AWD, and should keep you pretty safe.
 
@Azuremen MSU in Bozeman

Alright, snow tires it is.

While I shouldn't be driving much, I do have to drive home. I live in an area of California where it's impossible to leave/enter the state unless you want to brave the snowy passes, or drive about 300 miles south to cut east.(This isn't a problem if I go to Oklahoma, but very much an issue if I go to Montana) Cal Trans requires chains on all vehicles EXCEPT AWD or 4WD when there's snow on the passes (I5, CA44, CA299). I've heard chains are obnoxious, are there different types?
Same with tires, who makes "The best" snow tire, and who makes the best value-for money snow tire.
Lastly, could I safely get away with leaving 2 AS tires on the car, and only having to purchase 2 snow tires? Or is it worth the investment to just go for all 4?

Thanks guys, much appreciated.
 
Where you at in California? I've actually driven from Bozeman (my brother graduated from MSU) to San Diego, taking 395 down from Tahoe around New Years time, along with coming down I-5 from Washington another year at the same time.

If you are worried about the chain up bit, just get some cheap chains and toss them on at the pass if they are enforcing the policy.

As for snow tires, get four if you want to live. Having them on the front so the back end will just slide out is asking to die, and having two on the back is asking to never get anywhere because you'll just spin tires and understeer for days.

Finally, Bozeman is flat so you'll have no issues. Getting up to Big Sky if you ski/snowboard might be a bit tricky on snow days, but otherwise that shouldn't be much of an issue either.
 
For snow tires get four of them, if you only have two it gives your vehicle some odd handling characteristics and could possibly cause you more of a problem.

As for brands, I've had Hankook Winter iPikes and they were excellent, so much so that I use them on my rally car too. Currently I use Michelin Aplin PA3's, which are a "performance" winter tires, but they aren't cheap. Another, often overlooked, suggestion is the cheap Kelly Snowtrakkers, which seem to be a favorite among the guys I rallycross with. I think probably the most commonly bought winter tires though are Blizzaks.
 
Azuremen
Where you at in California? I've actually driven from Bozeman (my brother graduated from MSU) to San Diego, taking 395 down from Tahoe around New Years time, along with coming down I-5 from Washington another year at the same time.

If you are worried about the chain up bit, just get some cheap chains and toss them on at the pass if they are enforcing the policy.

As for snow tires, get four if you want to live. Having them on the front so the back end will just slide out is asking to die, and having two on the back is asking to never get anywhere because you'll just spin tires and understeer for days.

Finally, Bozeman is flat so you'll have no issues. Getting up to Big Sky if you ski/snowboard might be a bit tricky on snow days, but otherwise that shouldn't be much of an issue either.
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I live in Redding, which is in actual Northern California. I have a friend who goes out to Reno and then heads northeast to get there when he has to drive to MSU, but they have a nice new 4Runner.

4 it is. Any other recommendation on brand?
 
hawkeye122
I live in Redding, which is in actual Northern California. I have a friend who goes out to Reno and then heads northeast to get there when he has to drive to MSU, but they have a nice new 4Runner.

4 it is. Any other recommendation on brand?
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I have family out there lmao.
 
hawkeye122
Any other recommendation on brand?
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It's easiest to narrow it down to the options that will even fit. According to TireRack.com your options in 205/65R15 (you may want to double check on your sidewalls) are Bridgestone Blizzak WS70 ($93), Dunlop Winter Maxx ($85), Michelin X-Ice Xi3 ($111), Firestone Winterforce ($76), or Goodyear Ultra Grip Ice+ ($102). They've got user reviews that could help you make a decision if you can sort out the whiners from legitimate complaints.

I swear by Pirellis, but the specific product probably matters more than the brand that made it.
 
Cooper tires have always been good to us. Bit expensive though, the last good set of winter tires we got from them were $180 a piece.
 
Oklahoma in the winter? Yikes I spent a winter there in BCT that was a hellish cold experience but it wasnt deep snow just constant storms and lots of ice. Snow chains and something FWD or AWD you would be fine.
 
hawkeye122
I live in Redding, which is in actual Northern California. I have a friend who goes out to Reno and then heads northeast to get there when he has to drive to MSU, but they have a nice new 4Runner.

4 it is. Any other recommendation on brand?
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Vredestein. The ones I've got work pretty good.
 
Whatever you do, avoid anything made by Michelin. Pricey, and incredibly not impressive in both snow and ice. But then again, considering they're made in a country where it doesn't snow, it's not surprising.

I've equipped Blizzaks on my cars for as long as I can remember, and if they can survive Eastern Canada, they'll be fine in OK. :lol:
 
-Fred-
...considering they're made in a country where it doesn't snow, it's not surprising.
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Yeah, no snow in the Alps...
Also
snow-paris_1781673i.jpg


The selection of models for the North American market may differ from Europe, but I will state that Continental make excellent winter tyres, though a bit pricey.

Do you have Nokian in the US?
 
You can grab a used Subaru of some sort for two grand. You can get a nice one for 3500.
 
hawkeye122
@Azuremen MSU in Bozeman

Alright, snow tires it is.

While I shouldn't be driving much, I do have to drive home. I live in an area of California where it's impossible to leave/enter the state unless you want to brave the snowy passes, or drive about 300 miles south to cut east.(This isn't a problem if I go to Oklahoma, but very much an issue if I go to Montana) Cal Trans requires chains on all vehicles EXCEPT AWD or 4WD when there's snow on the passes (I5, CA44, CA299). I've heard chains are obnoxious, are there different types?
Same with tires, who makes "The best" snow tire, and who makes the best value-for money snow tire.
Lastly, could I safely get away with leaving 2 AS tires on the car, and only having to purchase 2 snow tires? Or is it worth the investment to just go for all 4?

Thanks guys, much appreciated.
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I would stick with your FWD Camry. As long as you don't bottom out in deep snow you should be fine with just having snow tires on a FWD car. If you have a FWD car you really only need snow tires on the front. Manual or automatic really doesn't matter much. If anything the manual might be better since you can control the RPMS and the gear you are in. If traction was an issue you could take off in 2nd gear. Not sure of the best snow tire. A tire dealer would be most helpful with that.
High-Test
You can grab a used Subaru of some sort for two grand. You can get a nice one for 3500.
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You wont find a reliable Subaru for $3,500.
 
Vegard
Yeah, no snow in the Alps...
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:dunce: Um yeah, I forgot about the Alps.

If you have a FWD car you really only need snow tires on the front.
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The back tires do more than just dragging the rear end around. If there's slush on the road (which happens regularly when the snow starts to melt) it's effectively just like you're hydroplaning. Your front tires are going to be fine, assuming you don't drive like an idiot, but your rears, with their hotter weather design, will fait at having any control, and you'll most likely spin out or wreck. Not to mention all-seasons and summer tires are designed to "work" at a very different temperature range. Much like having snow tires during the summer is the equivalent of dragging cheese on a grater.
 
CAMAROBOY69
You wont find a reliable Subaru for $3,500.
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Or a 40,000 dollar new one for that matter :)

Just a joke, my neighbour had incredibly bad luck with an WRX- STI, it spent almost as much time in the shop than his driveway. There are similar stories from every manufacturer.
 
CAMAROBOY69
I would stick with your FWD Camry. As long as you don't bottom out in deep snow you should be fine with just having snow tires on a FWD car. If you have a FWD car you really only need snow tires on the front. Manual or automatic really doesn't matter much. If anything the manual might be better since you can control the RPMS and the gear you are in. If traction was an issue you could take off in 2nd gear. Not sure of the best snow tire. A tire dealer would be most helpful with that.

You wont find a reliable Subaru for $3,500.
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WRX, no, but an Outback or base Impreza can absolutely be had for $3500 in very good mechanical condition. You may have to travel a bit to find one (they are pretty plentiful out here, maybe not so much where the OP is located) but they are certainly out there and not really that rare. I've actually been looking for Foresters for my wife and we've come across plenty late '90's models in that price range.

To the OP, I'd also stick with the Camry. My Scooby is fantastic in the snow but you really don't need to buy another car just to make it a little easier to drive a few months out of the year. As the others have said, a good set of snow tires will make a huge difference and should be all you really need.
 
Keep the Camry, get a set of cheap steelies with snow tires (I've had pretty good luck with Firestone Winterforces on my old Escort, and the Bridgestone Blizzaks I have now on my Sonic seem to work well too), and swap them over yourself at the beginning and end of winter.
 
Keep Camry, Get good snow tires and you'll be fine. Drivetrain doesn't matter in snow. Its about the tires. And STI's only get a Average of 24-26mpg sure its Rally Bread, but if you don't have Snow Tires AWD is useless.
 
Picking a special car for snow driving? What a strange idea. :sly:
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It would be reasonable if your main car was some kind of sportcar, when my family had an Audi TT, we were locking it in the garage for winter.
However, I still see some Mustangs, Skylines and Silvias being driven on snow (let alone Evos and STi's).
 

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