Cars stockpiling around the world

[Tornado]

The Ram is a truck

Doh!

 

[Jim Prower]

Now all I have to do is convince you all that a Viper is a spaceship and then I'll be on my way.

Isn't that the name of the fighter on Battlestar Galacitica? [/geek]

 

[Sting]

Lot of wasted metal, plastics and rubber there. lol

 

[niky]

On the topic of needs versus wants, the people who need a car go to the used car market. Those who want a car with a little extra will go new. That's why you don't see Joe Blow who has no money putting around in a 1980s Japanese oil refinery on wheels that's missing three body panels instead of a nice new Fit or something.

Promoting "the car" as a need would only end up driving people to the used car market and away from the new car market because going new is a luxury that nobody needs, no matter the car.

And it gets even better when you consider a well-cared for secondhand car with simpler technology can cost a lot less to service than a complicated new vehicle with lots of electronics and features.

 

[Tornado]

And get better mileage when it comes to most of the smaller cars.

 

[Keef]

I think that if these companies ran their businesses somewhat conservatively they might not have found themselves in this sort of situation. I think demand should always be just a little bit higher than supply. Yes, people would be upset, and yes, if there was a delay they'd be even more pissed, but at least you're not wasting money. I'd rather not make as much money as possible in the short term than waste half of what I made in the long term. Being smaller would help, too. They'd be able to constantly manage production numbers and be able to fine tune it to demand, maybe at a week's notice. Or a month's. But anything is better than the half a year delays these companies are dealing with.

 

[Omnis]

Here's an idea: stop making so many cars. I mean, I'd love for them to make that many, but don't expect me to pay 30 grand with that much supply. Just think: one of those Kas is going to make a poor man in India very happy.

 

[Sniffs]

+1 Phantom to Philly. he put everything just right.

Niky: those "well cared for used cars" your talking about are selling at Barrett-Jackson auctions for a minimum of 60 thousand dollars apiece...cause the "simple ones" are now Muscle Cars over here. there are very few 70's and 80's suvivors in the states, because they are the first thing to disintegrate. the 90's I see floating around are so badly beaten, now, they need to be junked as well. everything older than than the muscle era is worth a bloody fortune for it's collector's value, and nobody wants to turn something with less than 40k/60k on it into a daily driver and destroy their funeral cost payment.

 

[Wolfe]

Niky: those "well cared for used cars" your talking about are selling at Barrett-Jackson auctions for a minimum of 60 thousand dollars apiece...cause the "simple ones" are now Muscle Cars over here. there are very few 70's and 80's suvivors in the states, because they are the first thing to disintegrate. the 90's I see floating around are so badly beaten, now, they need to be junked as well. everything older than than the muscle era is worth a bloody fortune for it's collector's value, and nobody wants to turn something with less than 40k/60k on it into a daily driver and destroy their funeral cost payment.

Huh? As an american that, along with his friends, lives and breathes used '80s cars, I'm confused by this. There's a wealth of fine cheap cars out there if you know where and how to look. When niky said "well-cared for," I don't believe he was talking about aesthetics, which is really the only thing separating a Barrett-Jackson type car from an "ordinary" one. I also don't think he was limiting his statement of "simple" to 40 year old carbureted engines (though I may be wrong on both of those).

Armed with Craigslist and in-depth knowledge of the model you're looking for (and its common problems), you can find a <$1000 daily driver from the '80s. Raise your budget to $2000, and you're almost guaranteed to find something dependable.

I also 👍 Philly's post.

 

[Nicksfix]

need going new is a luxury that nobody needs, no matter the car.

Unless your one of those type of people that has to " keep up with the Jones's " . See this a lot , average house , average income , 2-3 kids ,( average Americans ) but they own a new BMW 5 series and a Lexus suv. These are the suckers of the new car market. It'a all about prestige to these type of people.

 

[YSSMAN]

...but don't expect me to pay 30 grand with that much supply...

Must be why Chrysler will sell me a fully-loaded Sebring for $15K.

 

[niky]

Wolfe got me right.

For all our bellyaching about how computers take this or that away from us, a 90's era fuel-injected car is a great compromise between simplicity and convenience.

See, yesterday's newfangled, expensive high-tech is today's backyard fixer-upper.

ECUs last a hell of a long time unless you flood the car, and replacements don't cost that much. And if they blow, it's sometimes just a matter of finding the right capacitor (if you have the time and patience) to replace the one that fizzed out on the board.

I used to take stuff off the engine just to give it an OCD spray-down and brushing, all the tiime. Spark problem? You can still change a 90's dizzy cap, ignition coil or whatever in your garage. Fuel problem? Some electrical contact cleaner and a few minutes taking apart your Mass Airflow Sensor will do the trick. Doesn't work? Replacement MAFs are cheap.

Still have fuel issues? You don't need specialized equipment to dismantle a low-pressure fuel rail or to pull injectors to inspect them.

90's cars, with OBDI, distributor-driven ignition and fuel-injection... gives you some of the same simplicity as carbureted cars, without the complication of tuning, retuning and cursing at the carburetor itself. But that just might be my background, I grew up fiddling with OBDI cars.

There are advantages to even newer, OBDII direct-ignition cars, no dizzy cap to wear out, for one thing, making the ignition system easier to work on... just a matter of checking spark-plugs and ignition coils, and timing fixes are just a matter of replacing a faulty O2 sensor or cam position sensor, but the increase in automation is giving manufacturers an excuse to exclude the owners more and more from the process of maintenance... when, with a few simple electronic tools, 99% of what the dealership does can be done at home... cheaper... and better. I dread the day when even mass market manufacturers feel the need to eliminate such "useless" items as the dipstick. Then we will truly be in automotive hell...

Of course, this is talking about cars we "need"... older cars we want... sportscars... often have a ton of other stuff to worry about... turbos, tons of oil lines, pressure gauges and coolers (even non-turbo sportscars will have more heat exchangers than your regular car)... high-revvers will have extra sensors, solenoids and etcetera...

But at least a 90's Sportscar won't go into limp-home mode if you change the driver's seat...

 

[Philly]

Unless your one of those type of people that has to " keep up with the Jones's " . See this a lot , average house , average income , 2-3 kids ,( average Americans ) but they own a new BMW 5 series and a Lexus suv. These are the suckers of the new car market. It'a all about prestige to these type of people.

Even still, those people still just want to keep up, which isn't a need at all. I'm sure all of them are snobs and say they would never drive anything else, but take that 2009 M3 out of their driveway and replace it with an 88 Tercel and I'm sure they would drive it when they had to get somewhere.

 

[Sniffs]

Huh? As an american that, along with his friends, lives and breathes used '80s cars, I'm confused by this. There's a wealth of fine cheap cars out there if you know where and how to look. When niky said "well-cared for," I don't believe he was talking about aesthetics, which is really the only thing separating a Barrett-Jackson type car from an "ordinary" one. I also don't think he was limiting his statement of "simple" to 40 year old carbureted engines (though I may be wrong on both of those).

Armed with Craigslist and in-depth knowledge of the model you're looking for (and its common problems), you can find a <$1000 daily driver from the '80s. Raise your budget to $2000, and you're almost guaranteed to find something dependable.

I also 👍 Philly's post.

Wolfe, I threw AWAY at least 4 early eighties cars because the first thing they told me around here was that "whadaya looking around here fer? we ain't got nothin older than 95"...by the Junkyards!! And I want that little hotrod I had for a first car back, too. but, around here, the oldest vehicle on the road right now is the one sitting in my parking space at home. and that's a 90. other than an occasionall "granny" car, the oldest I see on a regular basis happens to be a 98(?) Metro 3door. there's guys running around in brand new 08 and 09 Priuses, camrys, Silverados, corollas. hell, I've even seen two bleedin SMARTS around here. the oldies are 80's style C/K's, 94 body Rams, 99 body Silerados/Sierras, etc. (this is a dirt road/logging/gas well/farm area)

another thing, in this area, the average age around here is at LEAST 60...not 40 or 50, 60. when people refer to "easy to work on" they generally mean a sigle barrell carb, no emissions crap whatsoever, and spark plugs you can actually GET to. I had assumed that was what people were talking about when they said "easy to work on"

and if there'd been net and cheap computers 10 tears ago even for rural folk, you can bet one of you guys right now would have a hot rodded eighties sedan to play with!

and a little FYI. this addy has our local throw-away eighties and 90's. anything under a grand around here has been beat to death by some kid with six freinds that all roll in the car at once, and has all his money sunk into his amp and subwoofers.

http://www.johnsonauto.com/VehicleS...maxPrice=4999&sortDir=asc&sortCol=retailPrice

 

[stumpydino]

i dont think id ever buy a new one, no matter how much i had.
at the dock the new land rovers and fords have always been parked up in the hundreds, on open ground and in the multi storey parks. the import area seems pretty busy too

 

[Wolfe]

...around here, the oldest vehicle on the road right now is the one sitting in my parking space at home. and that's a 90...

Well, it only makes sense that there are regional differences. Though our discrepancies are more likely due to the fact that I live smack dab in the center of one of the largest cities in the state, which is also the state capital and principal college town, while you live in a rural area. More imports, more cheap cars that students keep driving long after older folks have given up on them.

I own an '85 and an '87 as my sig shows, and spent a brief but intensive week in an '84 that served me well (the Renault on the rally). My friends have owned everything from an '85 to a '92, Germany, Japan, and america all represented. In terms of dependability, there have been better cars and worse cars, of course, but in general, the Germans are plagued by annoyances but keep driving, the Japanese rust to crap but keep driving, and the americans keep breaking but are easy to fix. We've come to some conclusions on what models aren't worth buying again, but we haven't yet given up on '80s cars.

Neither has the town's community at large. I see other '80s BMWs on an almost daily basis, certainly '80s Japanese economy cars on a daily basis, and plenty of '70s and '80s american coupes/sedans. There are also nicely-kept sporty cars, obviously owned by enthusiasts, from as old as the '60s. On the local Craigslist, I had plenty of options when poking around for a BABE Rally contender, even before I learned the minimum price had been raised from $250 to $500. Of course, there are more '90s cars for cheap and less '80s ones (particularly early '80s) than there were several years ago, but that's just the way things go. I know I'll have to upgrade to something newer sooner or later.

when people refer to "easy to work on" they generally mean a sigle barrell carb, no emissions crap whatsoever, and spark plugs you can actually GET to. I had assumed that was what people were talking about when they said "easy to work on"

As long as the job takes a reasonably short amount of time and can be done without putting the car on a lift, having to do a little research to figure out what the hell is wrong in the first place isn't so bad. But as niky mentioned, what's considered "easy to work on" often has to do with what you grew up with.

 

[Omnis]

Must be why Chrysler will sell me a fully-loaded Sebring for $15K.

Yeah. I look forward to corrected prices.

 

[Sniffs]

As long as the job takes a reasonably short amount of time and can be done without putting the car on a lift, having to do a little research to figure out what the hell is wrong in the first place isn't so bad. But as niky mentioned, what's considered "easy to work on" often has to do with what you grew up with.

this is why I mentioned the average age around here. these guys want "no brains" level repairs. that means a wrench, a screwdriver, and duct tape. i think they don't even want to changes fuses or bulbs half the time.

and, FYI...i've seen so many beamer 3's around here, it's ridiculus. a friggin lawn and garden shop 8 miles from my house sells friggin BEAMERS and PORSCHES...and they still want 10 grand for a pile of crap *coughCavaliercough*.

no, the bargins around here are regular cab long bed pickus...cause guys know how to work on em with literally spit and bailing wire holding them together. *rolls eyes*

I got rid of four early eighties, and I wish I still had that celeb. 31 MPG, 16 gallon tank, a zippy automatic, and friggin ROOM.