Changes / Suggestions

[Blackbird.]

Bizarre...yeah we'll do the one on the save file, because that's the one that will have to be verified.

Frankly, Jordan, I don't want to take up space on my mem. card just to see a time. But I guess I'll do it since it's the rules...

 

[TheWizard]

Well if everyone went off the same number the one shown up on the screen after running that lap it wouldn't be a problem then. Everyone would run off the same time: .1-0.2 faster then there real time. Unless some people use the replay file one I can see the problem.

Yes, in theory there wouldn't be a problem if everybody used that time.

But, and I insist (nothing personal against you), that time is not correct. It's a bug with GT3. When you watch the Replay, the Replay itself always stops about a car lenght away from the Finish line, hence the 0.1-0.2 faster lap time shown on the screen.

When you go to the Replay Theater, instead, and you are about to load the Replay, at the bottom of the screen there are some specs and stats shown, and one of them is the current, actual, true lap time. The one that takes into consideration the whole lap. The one that you actually see, while you are doing the race, as the current best lap time.

The one shown at the end of the Replay is erroneous, due to a bug present in GT3.

This does not happen in GT4 (I tested it many times) - the time written in the Replay File itself and the time shown at the end of it, when you play it, are the same.

In the GT3 WRS, online races hosted by GTPlanet itself, when we were to submit a time, it was required for it to be the one written in the specs of the Replay File, not the 'bugged' one shown at the end of the Replay.

The Wizard.

 

[Small_Fryz]

thanks so much Jordan 👍.

Yes i agree with The Wizard, keep it the same, use the replay file name.

 

[Nasadus]

I read the rules and noticed that the only way you can post your times is if you have an X-Port or something similar.Will this always stay this way or will additional methods be accepted in the future.I'm pretty sure that more than 80% of the people on this board don't have such a device.I don't see a problems with why i couldn't submit a photo of my time.

 

[daan]

I don't see a problems with why i couldn't submit a photo of my time.

Because a photo doesn't prove that you stayed on track all the time. It also doesn't show if you used a hybrid.

Suggestion

Instead of the user being required to input what drivetrain the car has, should that information not be stored with the car. The drivetrain for each car cannot be changed so an M3 is always FR and so on. If you leave it up the user, you are bound to get wrong information submitted.

 

[Kent]

I agree with daan on that...

Drivetrain might be best if it is stored with the car.

Also, I have mentioned this before but...
I would really like to see a distinction between game modes.

Arcade vs GT

In GT you can use any car with maxed out hp and any settings you want.
In arcade you can only use arcade cars with limited changes (such as the quick tune-up).

I really feel that it would add to the quality of this leaderboard if we were to distinguish between the two game play modes.

It could make the db way more popular since all forms of races would be acceptable.
Plus, it would take away any advantages the other sites might have.

Check out the .de site...
http://db.granturismo.de/gt4_arcade_cars.php

Now check out the gt3times site...
http://gt3.gttimes.com/view/
(not sure if they have gt4 yet)

point is, notice that those databases are totally different in theme?
One arcade, one sim.

With that being the case, look closely at gt3times.
Their database is full of cars at the max hp level.

That is fine with me, but one thing comes to mind...

Not everyone is going to want to run laps for 5 Cr. at the tracks in GT mode.

I don't mean to complain, but that's just what I'm feeling in this.

There is no doubt in my mind that I will race in both modes so I can remain competitive on our board.
However, I would really love to be able to setup WRS events in arcade mode that will be submit-able on our database.

It would be a shame if all the arcade WRS events got pushed over to the .de site like what has happend in the past.

So I ask this jordan,
Will you please consider coming up with a way to distinquish between arcade time trial runs and GT mode practice runs?

Thanks for hearing me out.

 

[Kolyana]

Check out the .de site...
http://db.granturismo.de/gt4_arcade_cars.php

I liked the usability of this quite a bit ... it was very easy to burrow down to the relevant information ... car class, track, times and so forth.

 

[Famine]

10) "UNK" is what drivetrain? I assume it means "unknown"? If so, why? If you are submitting laps to a OLR database and don't know the drivetrain of your choosen car...ummm, I would think one needs to go back and learn some more. Imagine asking a F1 driver what layout their car is and that driver shrugging and going 'I don'know..."

Good question. I'll have it removed.

There are several cars in GT4 (not to mention GTC) which have no drivetrain information - the Nissan CUBEs being cases in point.

 

[TheWizard]

Kent makes some good points 👍

We really need a distinction between Arcade Mode and Gran Turismo Mode.
That would give the best of the two worlds.

I have a few suggestions myself:

1) An introduction page with descriptions and rules is needed, either on the leaderboars themselves, or here in this Forum.

Rules such as these (taken from the WRS) need to be stated:

Clean OLR Standards
2 wheels on track at all times
No wall riding
No wall touching
No short cutting
No hybrids
No Cheating of any kind
Save your best lap replay

2) It should also be stated, in the scenario that the Arcade Mode database will be considered, whether the figures of Power, Weight and Top speed in the Qucik tune screen can be adjusted or not (along with the Driving Aids, as well).

In my opinion they should, since they can be adjusted at db.granturismo.de.

3) In case it's decided for the possibility of adjustment, it should be made a requirement for the submitter to enter, along with the time submission, such values. This way the database would be more complete. The database would not be much meaningful if all that was available were the track, the car, and the times. Power and Weight of the vehicles that were used to obtain such times are needed, in order to make some meaning out of those times.

4) Another great addition would be the possibility to sort the times, for a given vehicle and track, by Power and by Weight. This way it can be quickly determined, for a given Track, Vehicle, and Power or for a given Track, Vehicle, and Weight, which time is the current best for that particular combination.

This is something that is missing from the db.granturismo.de Arcade database.

A collection of times for a given Track and Vehicle is of not much use, if it cannot be determined what part of a particular time was due to the driver's skills and what part of it was due to Power, or Weight, or both.

This is all I can think of, for now.

The Wizard.

 

[Kent]

In my opinion the quick tune option is left to the driver simply because it limits the chances of "kinda-cheating."

If the quick tune were outlawed only outlaws would use quick tune.

I would like to see everyone use it so we know that "outlaws" will not have an advantage lol.

... last thing...
Check my post before this if you haven't seen it.
I do like the idea of an arcade/GT mode distinction.

 

[Iceman]

I think Aracade/Gt Mode separation is a definite must. Also, is there any chance of a points leaderboard for those who submit times?

 

[Jordan]

I've just deleted dozens of posts here. 👎 If anyone takes this thread for Leaderboard suggestions off-topic like that again, expect a strike. If you want to debate Verification methods or anything else, start a thread for the topic. That's why I created this whole forum - so you don't have to keep your thougts in one thread. It's a good thing to talk about - but not in here.

Anyway, this "trial run" of the Leaderboard was only a small part of what I have planned for the final product. It will include Arcade mode, and I'd like to throw in some license tests, etc. in due time so please do not continue to suggest this. Thanks.

 

[Famine]

Is there a checkbox when entering times for "Nitrous"?

It'd be useful to sort out laptimes set with laughing gas from those that aren't.

 

[Jordan]

Already suggested, this will be included in the next release.

 

[Kent]

Hey Jordan!

Mr P and I were chatting and started talking about the Verified vs Unverified replays and racers.

Exactly how does the system work now?
Are verifications going to be for individual laps or will drivers carry a status?

Well Ron and I started thinking about a list of drivers being created.

Specifically I would like to see 2 lists.

List A: Unverified Racers.
Everyone starts on this list.

List B: Verified Racers.
This list would start empty and as racers submitted times to be verified we could add them to the list.

Having this list could make it much easier to keep the leaderboard clean.

Once a driver is known to have a replay device verification request can not be ignored.

Also, having a public list of verfied racers will may it easier to evaluate newly submitted times since checking the same clean driver over and over can be a challenging task (some people can pump out laps fast enough to file 20 or 30 submissions in one month).

What do you all think of this list idea?

This might make verification faster, more flexible and more efficient.

 

[Jordan]

Probably would be best for a new thread to discuss this, but I personally think there is way too much room for abuse with that system. If one user does have a very high reputation, then it will be up to the Committee member handling their verification submission to decide whether or not to force them to prove their time before verifying it.

 

[Jordan]

I'd also like to point out that pretty much everything that was suggested here has been included in the revamped Leaderboard. What's left is organizing the separate car lists for each game and I still have to write out a clear set of rules for time posting. There are also a few more formatting issues which need to be tinkered with. Then, we'll be back online.

 

[Zero]

I have a few questions: 1. How will one know if a person has chosen to do the quick tune-up and therefore attempted to cheat the system?
2. Looking at racing-line's website and their points system a person is only allowed to enter one car that is worth points. Say that I use one of the Mid Rear race cars (Group C or R8, Bentley, etc) but then enter a time with a slower car like the Zonda Racecar will one be able to get points for each car or just one car?
3. Are we not allowing the use of nitrous or like what was said earlier is there going to be a distinction between the use of N20 and those who do not choose to use N20?

 

[Jordan]

I'm afraid I don't completely understand your questions, Zero. How could a quick tune up cheat the system? Also, I am unclear about the points system - we don't have any type of points system here. Nitrous will be a field in the time entry so that you will be able to tell if it was used or not.

 

[Famine]

Zero is referring to the comparison of Arcade Mode cars.

One can effect certain changes in the "Quick Tune" menu for Arcade Cars. You can bump power up by up to 20%, drop weight by as much as 10% and, with race cars, adjust the top speed.

However, I suspect that the Arcade Mode time entry on the Leaderboard will require power and weight to be entered. In this case, no, Quick Tune will not affect the board - you can always tell what you're racing against.

 

[Jordan]

However, I suspect that the Arcade Mode time entry on the Leaderboard will require power and weight to be entered. In this case, no, Quick Tune will not affect the board - you can always tell what you're racing against.

That is correct - the leaderboard will require those fields on all entries, arcade or not, so it will not be an issue.

 

[Zero]

That is correct - the leaderboard will require those fields on all entries, arcade or not, so it will not be an issue.

Sweet, cannot wait to enter my F1 at Laguna

 

[Impreza04]

Im asked to enter the weight of the car in lbs, the PAL version or my version the car weight is given in kilograms..?
Any chance you could get a convertor or something?

 

[Jordan]

Impreza, thanks - I seem to have overlooked that. I'll add a converter soon.

 

[pt1]

Why is need to enter the Vehicle Model,HP,Transmission, etc, in GT4 License Tests if is the same for all people?
Does not make sence!!!

 

[Jordan]

The Leaderboards were designed for fastest laps in simulation mode, where the vehicle model, power, etc. is all required. When used for License Tests, it's a bit cumbersome, yes. Don't worry about the accuracy of the values as it doesn't really matter in the License Test section.

 

[Iceman]

Just thought of something that might make new time easier to view. How about have a page that shows recent submissions? That way we could see what tracks are getting the most action .

 

[cardude2004]

^That sounds like a good idea, but people who don't submit often would like this because their entry would always end up at the bottom.

 

[Thirdeye]

oops, i already entered my times in kgs, i didn't know the conversion to pounds.

 

[Flerbizky]

Sort order is fubared... How hard would it be to rename all the single digit test from eg. "1" to "01" so that they'd be sorted correct ?....

Now it's :

• 1
• 10
• 11
• 12
• 13
• 14
• 15
• 16
• 2
• 3
• 4
• 5
• etc.

Instead of the easier to read :

• 01
• 02
• 03
• 04
• 05
• 06
• 07
• 08
• 09
• 10
• 11
• 12
• etc.

Otherwise - Awesome job Jordan - as usual