Cheap Cars Rule: 2012 Accent, Rio, Versa, 3 SkyActiv

[The Vanishing Boy]

-> ...

I think calling the Mini Clubman a hatchback is stretching the definition a bit far...

Agreed. It's not technically a hatchback, but it's hard to define as anything else either. The only other vehicles that have rear doors like that are vans.

I know MINI is trying to cultivate a classless image but I still think they should turn the Clubman into an actual van. For people running posh little shops and boutiques around this country the potential market would be huge. Literally every boutique owner in the UK would buy one.

^ So its classified as a odd ball Wagon!?

^ Doesn't matter, I kinda like the Clubman.

NEWS -> Autoblog just test drove the New Versa Sedan:

Click the pic!

 

[disinfected]

It looks like a shoe mated with an Accord Crosstour. The old one looked better.

 

[Dan_]

The Versa is extremely good value and it really is a very nice and cheerful car, but does it really have to look that dull?

Just look at the Rio and the Accent, styling alone doesn't grant sales per se, but if the competition is as good and is almost as cheap, why would you have such ugly little car when you can have the very same package in a much prettier wrapping? I'd have the Rio.

 

[disinfected]

The Versa is extremely good value and it really is a very nice and cheerful car, but does it really have to look that dull?

Just look at the Rio and the Accent, styling alone doesn't grant sales per se, but if the competition is as good and is almost as cheap, why would you have such ugly little car when you can have the very same package in a much prettier wrapping? I'd have the Rio.

The Versa isn't that great of a deal in my opinion. Sure, you can get one really cheap, but cheap is what you get. Crank windows, power nothing...if you actually get one decently equipped, it falls into Honda Civic price range. When you can get a moderately well equipped and better looking new Hyndai or Kia for around the same price.

 

[homeforsummer]

^ So its classified as a odd ball Wagon!?

I suppose you could say that. "Shooting brake" might be appropriate too, though 'Brakes are usually based on coupes rather than hatchbacks.

As for that Versa, it looks bloody awful. If Kia, Hyundai and Chevy can make a great looking small car then Nissan has no excuse.

 

[NissanSkylineN1]

Is it me or does it remind you of a VW GTi?

 

[Keef]

Who the hell came up with the idea of calling a hatch a door? That person is an idiot, and anyone who follows the convention is also. Nobody fumbles their way into a car (or a house) through a hatch. That'd be silly. You step in through a door.

If it has two doors and a hatch it's a two door hatchback. Two. Door. Hatchback.

If it has 3 doors and a hatchback, it's a 3 door hatchback (Veloster). Three. Door. Hatchback.

Etc.

I absolutely refuse to argue this point because I am right, so don't bother trying.

EDIT: I'm still going to use the 3-door, 5-door convention out of habit though so I guess I'm an idiot. We're all idiots.

 

[homeforsummer]

I absolutely refuse to argue this point because I am right, so don't bother trying.

You're wrong, but feel free to still refuse to argue

EDIT: I'm still going to use the 3-door, 5-door convention out of habit though so I guess I'm an idiot. We're all idiots.

Speak for yourself.

It wouldn't be so bad if American convention didn't need to state the bleeding obvious all the time. In the UK it's pretty simple. 2 door, 3 door, 4 door, 5 door, estate etc. Everyone knows what they mean. Over in the States you insist on adding the word "hatch" or "sedan" or "wagon" or whatever after the number of doors, even though it's already implied.

 

[Zenith]

Is it me or does it remind you of a VW GTi?

Of course it does. That's been the Korean school of design for two decades now. Copy the Germans. Same thing some of the Japanese companies were doing with their cheaper sedans in the 90's and early 00's.

 

[Dan_]

Who the hell came up with the idea of calling a hatch a door? That person is an idiot, and anyone who follows the convention is also. Nobody fumbles their way into a car (or a house) through a hatch. That'd be silly. You step in through a door.

Unless you're a dog. 💡

 

[eSZee]

Who the hell came up with the idea of calling a hatch a door? That person is an idiot....You step in through a door.

Idiot would be the person who hasn't actually looked up the definition of a door before making stupid posts. Now that is an idiot.

 

[YSSMAN]

The interior is what I'm worried about. The Cobalt, Cruze and now the Sonic all look good on the outside but the interior quality is lacking in each of the previous aforementioned models. I just hope GM puts a good quality interior in the Sonic--but history says they won't.

I'd put the Sonic's interior on-par with the Cruze, at the very least. Both featured a good amount of GM's updated soft-touch plastics that were well-grained, the switches and knobs were typical GM running gear of this current generation, so all of that was pretty nice as well.

I think what is going to bother people most about the Sonic, based on what I experienced seeing and touching the car at the Chicago Auto Show was that "Motorcycle-Inspired" digital gauge pack. While I think it was fine, and certainly an interesting departure compared to your average Mazda 2 or Fiesta... It may not catch on with everyone else.

For the $14K or so that you end up spending on an entry-level Sonic, hopefully things turn out alright. GM hasn't said anything, anywhere about what kind of kit comes standard with the LS. I'm hoping it doesn't take too many cues from the Cruze by having the price increase exponentially as the trim levels go up. A decent, middle-ground LT1 with a couple options shouldn't ring up for more than $17K, and I'd say that would come with a good bit of kit (and performance) compared to the competition.







What has me surprisingly frustrated is the 2012 Scion iQ...

Now, it is nothing personal, but for $15,995... I can get a lot more car for a lot less money. Granted, nothing will be quite as unique as the iQ. Furthermore, nothing will be quite as "city-ready" as the little Toyota Scion. Still, the 36 MPG figure is pretty decent for in/out of town driving, and I imagine the reliability scores will be rather high. If I didn't have friends, I'd consider buying one just for the novelty. But, considering I can get a well-equipped and arguably more functional Fiat 500 for less than $1000 more... Yeah, I'd go that route. Reliability be damned.

 

[Tornado]

Scion iQ is the thing people would buy in America only if the Fiat 500 didn't exist.

 

[Zenith]

Scion iQ is the thing people would buy in America only if the Fiat 500 didn't exist.

Disagree. The Fiat is more in line to compete with the MINI for buyers who want a retro, ditzy little car with lots of simple shapes and bright colors. I think the Scion appeals more to the girlfriends of the spikey hair crowd that buy tC's and xB's with their angular cuts and aggressive lines.

I believe that just the general attitude of the car and the brand will make a huge difference, practicality and value for money be damned.

EDIT: and I love the gauge setup on the Sonic.

 

[homeforsummer]

Now, it is nothing personal, but for $15,995... I can get a lot more car for a lot less money. Granted, nothing will be quite as unique as the iQ. Furthermore, nothing will be quite as "city-ready" as the little Toyota Scion. Still, the 36 MPG figure is pretty decent for in/out of town driving, and I imagine the reliability scores will be rather high. If I didn't have friends, I'd consider buying one just for the novelty. But, considering I can get a well-equipped and arguably more functional Fiat 500 for less than $1000 more... Yeah, I'd go that route. Reliability be damned.

It's not bad for an Aston Martin without the badge though

Nah, I agree with you. It's expensive here in the UK too, too expensive IMO. It's why, if I was in the market for such a thing, I wouldn't buy it over the smart.

Yes, the smart has an odd gearbox and it's no sports car, and yes, it's got two fewer seats, but I can count on one hand the number of times I've had more than one passenger in the Panda since I bought it in November, so I really don't need four seats.

And to be honest, even if I did need 4 seats, the iQ is still useless because nobody can fit behind the driver unless they have no legs. So really it's a 3 seater, and a 3-seater without a trunk. Unless you drop the rear seats you can barely fit a road atlas behind them - whereas the smart has a pretty decent trunk. And over here it costs a few thousand less, and performs equally well.

So yeah, the iQ still doesn't make much sense to me. But then maybe, you need more money than sense to buy it.

EDIT: and I love the gauge setup on the Sonic.

Ditto. It's nice to see a small car with a few unique design features rather than just looking like a pared-down version of a bigger car.

 

[Tornado]

Disagree. The Fiat is more in line to compete with the MINI for buyers who want a retro, ditzy little car with lots of simple shapes and bright colors. I think the Scion appeals more to the girlfriends of the spikey hair crowd that buy tC's and xB's with their angular cuts and aggressive lines.

The girlfriends of the spiky hair crowd wouldn't buy an iQ because they would instead just buy a tC.

 

[Zenith]

The girlfriends of the spiky hair crowd wouldn't buy an iQ because they would instead just buy a tC.

Good point, but the new one is much more masculine than the older model. The iQ scores points for cuteness and cost.

 

[YSSMAN]

So yeah, the iQ still doesn't make much sense to me. But then maybe, you need more money than sense to buy it.

That's the long and short of it, basically. The whole idea works. My understanding is that it is an absolutely fantastic car. But in real world situations, and when I actually have to put my money towards it, it just doesn't work as well...

Although, now that I look at the standard equipment on the car, I guess I can't be too upset. A similarly equipped Yaris is going to ring up for about the same price, perhaps a shade less, but ultimately get slightly worse fuel economy. Granted, it will carry more and have functional rear seats, but the novelty certainly isn't there.

I dunno. It is a weird car that absolutely fascinates me, but at the same time drives me bonkers. Worse yet... The weird roll-out that Scion is pulling on this one. We won't see the car until late next year here in the Mid-West. Screw that.

 

[homeforsummer]

That's the long and short of it, basically. The whole idea works. My understanding is that it is an absolutely fantastic car. But in real world situations, and when I actually have to put my money towards it, it just doesn't work as well...

I don't even think it works well in Europe, where it really should work. I see a lot more smarts than I do iQs, and I'm betting that's for a few reasons. Price mainly, as you can get so much more for the same money, and cars that are less compromised like a basic MINI First or Fiat 500 Pop, and more suited as fashionable city cars. Then you have the smart which may not be objectively as good, but has a whole lot more character and is a fair bit cheaper.

And then there's the fact that Toyota itself sells something called the Aygo, which is about £3-4k cheaper, has four proper seats, and similar MPG and performance. And I see a lot more Aygos than I do iQs as well.

 

[Tornado]

The Aygo was that one that they even loved on Top Gear, isn't it?

 

[Mike0105]

The point of the IQ is more about clever packaging, it really is very small but is more 'car like' than it should be, because it is so clever. As a city runabout, the smaller the better. Park anywhere, get through small gaps etc. Most cars have only 1 occupant at any given time so having 2 useable passenger seats is ok.

The thing with the IQ is that it is bought because it is 'fashionable' and seen as modern. Like an iPod (has anyone seen an IQ that isn't white?), it doesn't do anything better for the end user per se, but is believed to be very modern and 'cool' so they can and do charge a price reflecting the image. I've seen a few about and I live in Lincolnshire, a very large rural county. Obviously not the intended user market and round here it doesn't make much sense, but people still buy them.

Personally, if I really wanted a very small car I would take the Aygo over the IQ for the reasons others have given above. If I lived in London/Paris/Tokyo etc I would consider one, but I don't, so it wouldn't benefit me.

 

[homeforsummer]

The point of the IQ is more about clever packaging, it really is very small but is more 'car like' than it should be, because it is so clever. As a city runabout, the smaller the better. Park anywhere, get through small gaps etc. Most cars have only 1 occupant at any given time so having 2 useable passenger seats is ok.

Even considering that I have a few problems with the way it's packaged. One is the fact that it's not really significantly more usable than if it had only two seats, and in some ways less usable. It's really only a 3 seater maximum and if you want to carry luggage then you can pop the seat behind the driver down, in which case the rear passenger has to sit with the shopping, or a 2 seater with a half decent but awkwardly shaped boot.

And you'd think it's good for getting through small gaps, but it's as wide as a Yaris.

And if you're using it as a 2 seater, it's then more expensive, larger and slower than the equivalent smart.

The only genuinely clever thing about the iQ is the turning circle, which is tiny - far smaller than the smart, and smaller even than a London taxi.

The Aygo was that one that they even loved on Top Gear, isn't it?

Apparently so:

​

I'd forgotten they even tested it. It's also one of the ones they used for car football along with the VW Fox.

 

[Mike0105]

Agreed it's not exactly spacious, but there is only so much you can do with a small amount of space. The fact is that they did fit enough space in the car for 3 when before they would have only fitted 2. Thy did this through a clever fuel tank, very small aircon unit, very thin seats and some other ideas.

If they apply these new ideas to a Yaris or even an Auris, they could really make a difference to the interior space of mainstream cars.

I'm not an advocate of small per se, but I am of clever and inventive.

 

[YSSMAN]

The only genuinely clever thing about the iQ is the turning circle, which is tiny - far smaller than the smart, and smaller even than a London taxi.

I thought that I read somewhere that it was something like 13 ft. That is incredible. I'd hate to know how my Celica stacks up compared to that.

I just want to drive one the more I think about it, frankly. I don't get the feeling it would be a very practical option for me, but in the end, it might not be a bad buy when used a year or so down the road.

 

[eSZee]

I thought that I read somewhere that it was something like 13 ft. That is incredible. I'd hate to know how my Celica stacks up compared to that.

Almost 3x that.

 

[homeforsummer]

I thought that I read somewhere that it was something like 13 ft. That is incredible. I'd hate to know how my Celica stacks up compared to that.

It's pretty impressive. Skip to about 3:49 in the vid below to see it versus the smart, or just watch the whole thing for a general comparison.

​

The smart still makes more sense to me, not least because in the UK you can have it as a diesel which currently (until the Chevy Volt came along and muddied the waters with large combined economy figures) has the best official MPG of any car on sale anywhere in the world, around 86mpg imperial, or about 72mpg US combined.

Both get free road tax, congestion charge exemption etc though. Well, the 1.0 litre iQ does, not the 1.3.

 

[Jondot]

I really, really dislike the iQ. I think it looks like a clown car, costs too much and after all of Toyota's effort to shove 2 back seats in, rear occupants are going to feel like they're in a POW camp. I haven't driven one, but I'm willing to bet it's not noticeably easier to park than something like a Fiesta either. And certainly not compared to a 500. And the boot is hilarious, there's no other word for it.

 

[Keef]

​

Holy turning circle Batman!

I would probably stick with the Toyota. Nicer car. Plus I've heard some god awful things about the Smart's transmission. The diesel thing would be great - hopefully Toyota offers one in the future.

 

[homeforsummer]

I would probably stick with the Toyota. Nicer car. Plus I've heard some god awful things about the Smart's transmission. The diesel thing would be great - hopefully Toyota offers one in the future.

Meh, the smart's transmission isn't brilliant but I maintain it's nowhere near as bad as people make out. When I borrowed one back when I had my MX5 I found myself adapting my driving style anyway - relaxing a bit, taking it easier, possibly planning ahead more - and when you chill out a bit then a long-ish gearchange time doesn't seem as bad. It's definitely not a sports car so driving it as one will obviously frustrate.

I think it's a mental thing too. When you pull a little paddle you expect an instant change, but really all that paddle is doing is exactly what you would with a normal gearbox - back off the gas, depress the clutch, engage a new gear, get back off the clutch and onto the gas. It feels slow because all you're actually doing is flicking a little switch.

With regards the Toyota diesel, it won't happen unfortunately. Diesels in small cars are really expensive for manufacturers to produce (I recall reading somewhere that if a gasoline engine costs $700 to put in a small car, an equivalent turbodiesel costs nearer $1200 - and consumers don't want to pay the extra $1000 this invariably ends up as on the purchase price) so they're staying clear of the market now. The push is towards ultra-economical gasoline engines, hybrids, EVs etc for city cars now.

 

[Keef]

Very interesting. I've never been under the impression that diesel engines are expensive for anything, except that their gas is higher. This is America, the land of the thundering diesel locomotive/bus/tractor/semi/giant thing. They seem cheap to me, and last for decades before their first oil change.

Anyways, I am reconsidering taking the iQ over the Smart. You mentioned how to changed your driving style - I tried to remember if I change my style in mom's Corolla, when I realize that I can't remember how I drive the Corolla. The driving experience is that dreadfully unmemorable. It may be different in Europe's tight city centers, but that environment simply doesn't exist in the States. Those Crown Vics and Suburbans get along just fine in the busiest parts of New York. Here, even my mom's Corolla just feels like a slow, boring car with good gas mileage, and nothing more.

Then again, it is a Toyota.