Col. National Championship ('05-'06 Season)

[Danoff]

You would think that a coach/defensive coordinator like Pete Carroll would be able to make an adjustment to contain him. I don't think he figured out that everytime Vince Young took more than 3 steps out of the pocket, he was going to keep the ball and run. Yet on every single run, even in the second half, USC seemed to be surprised and way out of position. Furthermore, USC wouldn't have been able to tackle Pop Warner kids last night. Shameful defensive display.

What were they supposed to do? The guy is 6' 5", 230 lbs. He passes to the receivers they leave open when they rush him. He rushes when they cover the receivers. There are just too many places the ball can go.

I was happy to see him do at least one of his patented pass-with-a-guy-holding-your-leg move. He doesn't shy away from contact. He rushes straight at guys and stiff-arms them to the ground. It's absurd from a QB.

Back when he started at Texas I thought he was the worst thing that could have happened to our team. I begged Mack Brown through the TV to start him at Wide Receiver or Running Back and let Chance Mock do the passing. That was back when Young was a horrible horrible passer. His lack of passing made our team 1 dimensional. Defenses crowded the line expecting a run every time, and were able to stop us from moving the ball. This season he's shown that he can be very accurate... more accurate than Leinart.

All that being said, I've never seen Young click on all aspects of his game like he did last night. It was the best I've ever seen him play, and he's played pretty well in the past. He was super accurate on passing, no picks... and he ran when the opportunity was there. He passed on 3rd down, he ran on 3rd down... what's a defense to do?

 

[FoolKiller]

What were they supposed to do? The guy is 6' 5", 230 lbs. He passes to the receivers they leave open when they rush him. He rushes when they cover the receivers. There are just too many places the ball can go.

That just sounds like properly executed offense there.

But in all reality you have to admit that there were times when he ran with the ball and USC defenders were there to make the tackle and when they went for him they just completely missed without him even needing to dodge. It was as if they threw themselves in his general direction and missed by six inches every time.

On that last score I could swear I saw three guys lunge at him, one from straight ahead, and not one even touched him. I could run the ball in if that was how the entire defense played.

I'm not trying to take away from Young at all because he had to be doing something to confuse the defense like that. A QB with a deadly aim who is a great rusher to boot can throw a defense completely off their game and Young did a wonderful job last night.

 

[Kylehnat]

what's a defense to do?

1)Intercept balls foolishly thrown into triple-coverage
2)Recover fumbles
3)Watch tape on how NFL defenses contain running quarterbacks, and try to do likewise (college defenses are crap, so no point in watching how other teams have tried, obviously unsuccessfully, to contain Vince Young)
4)Tackle

USC did none of those things last night. The line did a poor job of rushing, the linebackers did a poor job of containment, and the secondary did a poor job of covering the receivers.

Vince Young's size won't do him a lick of good in the NFL, as there are many QB's his size and athletic ability, but that doesn't stop defenses from taking them down. It's a harder game than in college. Make a list of all of the standout college QB's who flopped in the NFL. It's pretty long.

 

[Danoff]

1)Intercept balls foolishly thrown into triple-coverage

You might have said ball singular rather than plural.

2)Recover fumbles

They recovered at least one. I think we only recovered one (of ours) as well.

3)Watch tape on how NFL defenses contain running quarterbacks, and try to do likewise (college defenses are crap, so no point in watching how other teams have tried, obviously unsuccessfully, to contain Vince Young)

They just didn't have the talent on defense to pull it off.

4)Tackle

Easier said than done. A guy that big and fast is tough to bring down. Which is why you'll find him passing accurately with a defender hanging on his legs.

Vince Young's size won't do him a lick of good in the NFL, as there are many QB's his size and athletic ability, but that doesn't stop defenses from taking them down. It's a harder game than in college. Make a list of all of the standout college QB's who flopped in the NFL. It's pretty long.

Young's size will be a major advantage in the NFL. He's bigger and faster than some NFL running backs (I imagine) let alone QB's. We'll see how he does in the NFL, but I think any team that goes against him will have some serious adjustments to make. My personal suggestion (after having watched him for a while) is to overload the line, make him pass - and wait for a big mistake. He throws picks when he throws enough. He still makes bad decisions. So if you can contain the run and make him throw, eventually he'll probably hand you something.

 

[Danoff]

That just sounds like properly executed offense there.

Most football offenses can't do what I was describing. I'm talking about after the ball is in play. The offense has called a play. The ball is in the QB's hands, he's analyzing the feild. At that moment, a running QB has the option to pass or run. If the defense is ready for the run, he can pass. If the defense is ready for the pass, he can run.

Basically I'm just saying that all the options (besides a handoff) are available to an offense with a running QB up until the last millisecond before the decision to throw or run. That kind of flexibility on every play is tough to defend against, because the offense adjusts midstride to everything the defense throws at them.

I'm not saying Young couldn't be stopped, or that it isn't possible to defend against a running QB in general. I'm just pointing out that it's hard... it takes a lot of talent and preparation. USC just didn't have the talent.

 

[Zardoz]

...USC did none of those things last night. The line did a poor job of rushing, the linebackers did a poor job of containment, and the secondary did a poor job of covering the receivers.

True, but the fact that they were playing the 2005 Longhorns might have been a factor in that, dontcha think?

...Vince Young's size won't do him a lick of good in the NFL, as there are many QB's his size and athletic ability, but that doesn't stop defenses from taking them down. It's a harder game than in college. Make a list of all of the standout college QB's who flopped in the NFL. It's pretty long.

So Randall Cunningham, Donovan McNabb, and Michael Vick have all flopped?

Still, as great as Vince has been in college, Matt Leinart actually conforms to the NFL QB profile better, so we'll see who has the better career.

 

[Kylehnat]

True, but the fact that they were playing the 2005 Longhorns might have been a factor in that, dontcha think?

Yes, but I didn't see USC make any defensive adjustments. That's just stupid. It's hard to defend against a QB like Vince Young, but think about it: did ANY of his passes really matter that much? No. It was his runs on that won the game for them. USC should have been more concerned about stopping him late in the game, especially after he'd already scored 2 touchdowns. They should have made VY beat them in the air, where he is at less of an advantage.

So Randall Cunningham, Donovan McNabb, and Michael Vick have all flopped?

No, but in the case of McNabb and Vick, their running has been minimized in the NFL, and both have been criticized for not throwing enough.

Think also of all of the big-hype QB's that have gone to the NFL. In the last few years: Alex Smith, David Carr, Marques Tuiasosopo (he's from my hometown of Woodinville ), Joey Harrington, Eli Manning (be honest--he gets way more credit than he deserves), Cade McNown, Kyle Boller, Tim Couch and Ryan Leaf to name a few. All were highly rated "men against boys" in college. Of course there are good college QB's who go on to be excellent quarterbacks in the NFL (how far down was Tom Brady chosen?), but it's rather hit-and-miss. There are no guarantees either way.

 

[JohnBM01]

Here's my contribution to this:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=2069397&postcount=24

But with a topic like this, let me sound off. I thought Penn State vs. Florida State wasn't going to be close... and I wrong! But this game, nothing like the atmosphere. Being a Texan, I wanted Texas to do their best. I usually have what I call the "ESPN/ABC virus," in which whatever team I pick to win usually loses. This means anything from a Bowl Game, to any NBA matchup, the Indy 500, or whatever. I picked Texas because I think they really deserved to cap off their season in a great way. Think about it, GTP. Texas has been written off as "can't win the Big One," or "the Big XII is weak." And I agree with the 'Horns. Underappreciated Texas was. As good as Texas has played in the past, they haven't seen paydirt since 1970. They whipped Oklahoma's ass, they played a hell of a game against Ohio State, and they defeat USC with good defense and some nice offense. I suggest for next year that they limit their fumbles, even if they don't get the ball back. GTPlanet, that 4th and 5 with 29 seconds left really scared me. I didn't think Vince Young would (1) get the touchdown, much less (2) get the First Down. I tell you, it may get old to hear people say this, but let me type it again. The dude is unreal. Some even say that he did what Michael Vick couldn't do as VT quarterback. And what city is Vince Young from? HOUSTON, TEXAS. So for us H-Town folks, that's some extra love for one of our own.

As far as USC goes, I was watching ESPN show, "Pardon the Interruption," and one of the topics about the Rose Bowl was... did USC play with a bit of arrogance. If you ask me, I didn't agree until I thought about it a bit more. I think what USC wanted to do was try to throw Texas off guard with trick plays or have great confidence in their offense. I don't know... maybe USC thought Texas was Oklahoma. Unlike the overrated Oklahoma, Texas can kick plenty ass. They failed not one, but two 4th Down conversions. Was it overconfidence? Or was it good defense by the Longhorns? I liked both Texas and USC, but I think at times, USC could have made some better decisions. I will say that USC did a great job, and it isn't easy to win game after game, especially for 34 games.

Other than that, I still imagine I was still watching the game everytime I see highlights of the game. Vince Young's a product of Houston's Madison High (I believe), went to Austin to go to the University of Texas, and he is completely dynamic. But when Vince Young does decide to go to the NFL, I would like to see Vince Young vs. Michael Vick. It's a dynamic QB battle. And if you ask me, this may have some college sports fans feel like they've seen the Super Bowl and don't care too much for who makes it to Detroit for Super Bowl 40. You know why? Though there's no playoff in Division 1-A football, this was about the best matchup you can ask for. Just a great game. It still gives me shivers just thinking about the game even preparing some of my college sports scores. Also, credit the rest of Texas. After all, football isn't a one-man team game. Texas beat TWO Heisman winners on the field at the same time. And finally, after so long, Mack Brown finally gets what he wanted. Is he going to quit at that? Hell no! He wants another title, and another title, and more titles! All until he retires. Great game. No questions asked. I can go all day about this thing.

 

[Max Powers]

I don't think Vince Young will be a QB if he goes pro, they'll try to turn him into a Wide Receiver. He's too athletic to play QB.

 

[Omnis]

He'd be useless as a WR. What makes him so good is his dynamics.

The Texas WRs were WIDE OPEN ALL NIGHT. Like, open wider than Jenna Jameson. This is partly due to Mr. Young. The secondary kept having to second guess whether to bring the safeties foward or deep for extra pass coverage. Whichever they chose, Vince countered it easily, throwing long when they opted for run coverage and rushing it when they covered the deep ball.

 

[Zardoz]

...The secondary kept having to second guess whether to bring the safeties foward or deep for extra pass coverage. Whichever they chose, Vince countered it easily, throwing long when they opted for run coverage and rushing it when they covered the deep ball.

Nobody has done this better than Vince. The only question is whether or not he'll paralyze NFL defenses like he's done to college squads. The conventional wisdom is that he won't be able to, but there really hasn't been anybody like him before, so we'll see.

I hope he can. He's so much fun to watch!

 

[Danoff]

Michael Vick - 6' 0", 215 lbs, 40-yard sprint - 4.2s
Donnovan McNabb - 6' 2", 240 lbs
Steve McNair - 6' 2", 230 lbs
Daunte Culpepper - 6' 4", 265 lbs, 40-yard sprint 4.6s
Vince Young - 6' 5", 233 lbs, 40-yard sprint 4.4s

He's got NFL stats. But what the stats don't show are how his moves break him for big plays. I think he'll do fine in the NFL. Maybe not immediately, he still has quite a few things to learn about passing and ball protection, but he's got the raw materials to be a major player.

 

[Omnis]

Haha, you know who needs Vince Young?

The Dolphins. Hahaha.



(psyche! We have Sage Rosenfels. pwn.)

 

[JohnBM01]

This leads me to asking this:
Why didn't the media give Texas a chance? I'm not trying to say that USC is overrated, but why do you think Texas weren't as favored by some sports media?

 

[Omnis]

Because Reggie bush is Mr. Highlight reel.

Texas won because their defense played like the '72 Dolphins' did. Nobody made the highlight reel, but USC never went anywhere.