Concept cars you'd like to see in production

[Motominded]

That's why the Gallardo is around, to compete with those cars. Lamborghini hasn't made a front-engined car since 1978, excluding the LM002. As for Ferruccio, he could say what he wanted, but the Lamborghini he ran is far different from the Lamborghini Winkelmann runs today.

Lamborghini also doesn't need a GT car. Too many enthusiasts already feel the over-production of the Gallardo hurts the image.

Gallardos are popular, as long as everyone that leaves the factory is at a high quality level, there is no problem with over production. Besides, a car company needs to make money so selling more cars is doing the job. Plus Lamborghini is profitable.

Why doesn't it need a GT car? This isn't like a Porsche suv or 4 door.

Just like the other GT cars i wrote scream sporty, a front engined car is never gonna go away. Just like the RR setup on a 911. I feel Lambo is really losing out if they fail to make front engined car.

The first Lambos before the Miura were front engined GT cars. And the Espada is one of the best looking Lambos ever.

If anything, they could price it between the Gallardo and Murcielago.
Again i say it is a good idea and they will NOT be selling out if they make it. Making a good car is never selling out.

 

[McLaren]

Why doesn't it need a GT car? This isn't like a Porsche suv or 4 door.

And one could ask why do they need a GT car?

Just like the other GT cars i wrote scream sporty, a front engined car is never gonna go away. Just like the RR setup on a 911. I feel Lambo is really losing out if they fail to make front engined car.

What exactly is it they are losing out on? Sales? Don't need another car for that with the Gallardo practically supporting half the Murcielago production line.

There isn't an actual point to build one. The Gallardo already competes next to the GT-R, M6, 911 Turbo, and F430. If you want a Lamborghini competing next 599 GTB or SLR, that's what the Murcielago is for since it produces similar performance. Lamborghini, though, doesn't need a car like the DB9 or Continental. Lamborghini isn't a company who builds sports cars that focus more on the luxury than the performance. Ferrari just tried to enter that market again with the California, and so far, there are mixed reviews about that, with even Ferrari owners that were complaining it would taint the brand's exclusiveness.

The first Lambos before the Miura were front engined GT cars. And the Espada is one of the best looking Lambos ever.

That's true, but they're also incredibly unknown to the masses. The rear-engine V12s are the ones that still continue to sell for high prices due to popularity. The front-engine cars are not quite as high, bar the early GTs. Then again, their used prices are hard to average. They don't enter the market too often.

If anything, they could price it between the Gallardo and Murcielago.
Again i say it is a good idea and they will NOT be selling out if they make it. Making a good car is never selling out.

But what would it be competing against, and would anyone actually buy it? Being that the last front-engine Lamborghini was in 1978, the past 30 years have now convinced people that all Lamborghini does is build rear-engine, stupidly-fast cars that have no remorse for the driver.

I'm not saying your idea is wrong or flawed, but why build it now when the Gallardo is doing so well against the others in sells?

 

[homeforsummer]

I like that Mitsu too, far better than the Galant/380, and I think it has AWD capability too. But it's only a 4cyl I think.

That Honda doesn't come close to a Holden or Ford Ute in my books.

I knew you'd pop up if I mentioned the word Ute I have to say, being uninitiated to proper Utes being as I am from the UK, the first time I saw Holden's one based on the Commodore I was like

...but I still prefer the Honda

 

[The Vanishing Boy]

-> Here are my list:

Dodge Demon

Honda/Acura HSC

Holden Coupe 60

Prodrive P2

Mitsubishi Eclipse Ralliart

Honda Element D

Toyota Tundra Dually Diesel

Ford SVT Lightning

Maybach Exelero

Audi R8 TDI Le Mans (no word for production, yet)

Lamborghini Miura

Shelby Cobra roadster

Shelby GR-1 (Daytona)

Ruf R50

VW Microbus

VW 1 Liter

BMW Coupe Mille Miglia

Lancia Stratos

^ Thats it for now.

 

[Robin]

Can only think of 1 at the moment... The VW Microbus Concept

It was a concept in 2002 and it looks the business, its like what they did with the new beetle but with the VW van, God knows why they didn't produce this as the first was uber popular and it could have replaced there bland transporter (or whatever its called) range.

Robin.

 

[homeforsummer]

Honda/Acura HSC

I agree on this one, it was in GT4 and sounded gorgeous! Looks pretty nice too.

VW 1 Liter

Again, couldn't agree more. If they produced this and I had the money I'd get one without a shadow of a doubt. It's a brilliant concept. Definitely needs more power if it were to go into production (my memory tells me it has about 4bhp!) but with the aerodynamics and lack of weight it has even 20bhp would be enough for reasonable acceleration and a very good top speed (20bhp in a motorcycle brings over 80mph - and this is much, much more aerodynamic).

 

[McLaren]

The Ruf R50 is already in production, just in the form of the CTR3.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

Definitely needs more power if it were to go into production (my memory tells me it has about 4bhp!) but with the aerodynamics and lack of weight it has even 20bhp would be enough for reasonable acceleration and a very good top speed (20bhp in a motorcycle brings over 80mph - and this is much, much more aerodynamic).

More aerodynamic? The frontal area of this thing is way bigger than a motorcycle.

 

[GNX]

While I'd still favor a modern V6 turbo, or better yet a V6 twin turbo, Grand National in very much the same style as th 1987 model year with improved handling, aerodynamics, and drive train characteristics, I'd like to see some of these concepts:

http://www.popularhotrodding.com/features/0510phr_2008_buick_gnx_concept/index.html
http://www.v6performance.net/forums/showthread.php?t=22281

 

[3-Wheel Drive]

More aerodynamic? The frontal area of this thing is way bigger than a motorcycle.

The human body isn't very aerodynamic, though

 

[homeforsummer]

More aerodynamic? The frontal area of this thing is way bigger than a motorcycle.

It doesn't matter. The airflow over a motorcycle and rider is very turbulent. Even a small motorcycle has a co-efficient of drag of over 0.4 (about the same as that of a rough-bodied spherical object). Most normal road cars are 0.3-0.4 despite the greater frontal area. That VW has a Cd of only 0.159. A recent test in Performance Bikes magazine managed to reduce a motorcycle's Cd to 0.184 by slipstreaming a high-roof van - so even in a slipstream a faired motorcycle has higher drag than the VW.

You're right in assuming that frontal area has an impact, but the airflow over the object needs to be taken into account too.

The human body isn't very aerodynamic, though

Amusingly, the human body on it's own has a Cd of 1.0-1.5 - presumably this depends on how many pies you've eaten

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

I knew you'd pop up if I mentioned the word Ute I have to say, being uninitiated to proper Utes being as I am from the UK, the first time I saw Holden's one based on the Commodore I was like

...but I still prefer the Honda

What can I say? I'm mad about Utes. Your taste is your taste, I can understand that.

-> Here are my list:



Honda/Acura HSC

Holden Coupe 60

Prodrive P2

Mitsubishi Eclipse Ralliart

Audi R8 TDI Le Mans (no word for production, yet)

Lamborghini Miura

Shelby Cobra roadster

Shelby GR-1 (Daytona)

^ Thats it for now.

+1 on the ones I left in.

 

[stumpydino]

lamboghini cala

honda argento vivo

peugeot oxia

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

lamboghini cala

honda argento vivo

peugeot oxia

I don't know what any of them are ('cept the first one which looks like a Gallardo all dressed up). What engines/drivtrains do the Honda and Peugeot have?

 

[homeforsummer]

The Lambo Cala was Lamborghini's proposition for a smaller car way back in about 1995 I think.

 

[superberkut]

The Argento looks like a rear-driver with a front-set engine, and the Oxia is a mid-engine, rear-wheel drive car. The latter is absolutelly sensational, with a top speed of 205mph from 680hp, and the prototype is fully functional.

Lancia Stratos

I am not criticizing your pick, but it looks oddly like:

Edit: Forgot that the Oxia was in fact four-wheel drive. All the better.

 

[stumpydino]

oxia was 4wd apparently, with a v6. the argento vivo was a pininfarina design done about same time as the honda SSM which later developed the S2000. ital design did the cala with a 400hp v10

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

It doesn't matter. The airflow over a motorcycle and rider is very turbulent. Even a small motorcycle has a co-efficient of drag of over 0.4 (about the same as that of a rough-bodied spherical object). Most normal road cars are 0.3-0.4 despite the greater frontal area. That VW has a Cd of only 0.159. A recent test in Performance Bikes magazine managed to reduce a motorcycle's Cd to 0.184 by slipstreaming a high-roof van - so even in a slipstream a faired motorcycle has higher drag than the VW.

You're right in assuming that frontal area has an impact, but the airflow over the object needs to be taken into account too.

But the coefficient of drag does not take the difference in frontal area into account.

 

[McLaren]

The Lambo Cala was Lamborghini's proposition for a smaller car way back in about 1995 I think.

Yep. It, like the Gallardo, was going to sport a V10, though it would only have 400Bhp. The car would have been made had Megatech not sold Lamborghini to the Volkswagen Group.

 

[Jim Prower]

It doesn't matter. The airflow over a motorcycle and rider is very turbulent. Even a small motorcycle has a co-efficient of drag of over 0.4 (about the same as that of a rough-bodied spherical object). Most normal road cars are 0.3-0.4 despite the greater frontal area. That VW has a Cd of only 0.159. A recent test in Performance Bikes magazine managed to reduce a motorcycle's Cd to 0.184 by slipstreaming a high-roof van - so even in a slipstream a faired motorcycle has higher drag than the VW.

You're right in assuming that frontal area has an impact, but the airflow over the object needs to be taken into account too.

To help illustrate this...

That has a lower Cd. than...

That.

This is despite the fact that both locomotives have the EXACT SAME frontal area, being of the same type. The extra drag caused by the wheels being exposed (like on Union of South Africa, Below,) means that Mallard's speed record would've been...slightly...slower.

 

[Duke]

It doesn't matter. The airflow over a motorcycle and rider is very turbulent. Even a small motorcycle has a co-efficient of drag of over 0.4 (about the same as that of a rough-bodied spherical object). Most normal road cars are 0.3-0.4 despite the greater frontal area. That VW has a Cd of only 0.159. A recent test in Performance Bikes magazine managed to reduce a motorcycle's Cd to 0.184 by slipstreaming a high-roof van - so even in a slipstream a faired motorcycle has higher drag than the VW.

You're right in assuming that frontal area has an impact, but the airflow over the object needs to be taken into account too.

You're failing to understand exactly what the coefficient of drag tells you.

The Cd is only a measure of how EFFICIENT the shape is for a given frontal area. You cannot directly compare two objects of different size by Cd and have that comparison mean anything. You need to account for frontal area AND Cd.

A large vehicle with a low Cd may be massively efficient for its size, but it may still displace massively more air than a small vehicle with a higher Cd (and therefore lose massively more power/economy to drag than the small vehicle does).

 

[homeforsummer]

True, but there's such a vast difference between the aerodynamic profile of the teardrop VW than there is between an aerodynamically inefficient motorcycle that even with the greater frontal area (and it isn't that great on the VW, it's a tiny vehicle) the VW still cuts through the air more efficiently.

Of course, this only applies at speeds over which drag takes effect. I'm sure around town if you had a 250cc motorcycle and a 250cc engine of the same type in that VW the motorcycle would have better fuel economy, because it's much lighter and hence has lower inertia when accelerating (not to mention that it wouldn't have to wait in traffic).

Regardless, if anyone had actually read my closing line, "You're right in assuming that frontal area has an impact, but the airflow over the object needs to be taken into account too", this implies that I was suggesting both the Cd and the frontal area needed to be taken into consideration.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

True, but there's such a vast difference between the aerodynamic profile of the teardrop VW than there is between an aerodynamically inefficient motorcycle that even with the greater frontal area (and it isn't that great on the VW, it's a tiny vehicle) the VW still cuts through the air more efficiently.

The frontal area looks like it's at least 4 times greater than a motorcycle. I can't really estimate which one would be faster, but I don't think you can dismiss frontal area that easily. Plus the VW would have the added friction of the tires working against it. It would probably be closer than you think, since the biggest factor affecting drag is speed at least when you are not traveling at low speeds.

Regardless, if anyone had actually read my closing line, "You're right in assuming that frontal area has an impact, but the airflow over the object needs to be taken into account too", this implies that I was suggesting both the Cd and the frontal area needed to be taken into consideration.

I read your whole post and it suggested otherwise, especially the first paragraph where you stated this

Most normal road cars are 0.3-0.4 despite the greater frontal area.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

oxia was 4wd apparently, with a v6. the argento vivo was a pininfarina design done about same time as the honda SSM which later developed the S2000. ital design did the cala with a 400hp v10

I see, thanks. For the Oxia though, it better have been a powerful V6 for sporty looks like that. I hate cars that make out to be what they aren't.

 

[Alex.]

[/thread]


ok it's a render but

 

[mcsqueegy]

What...the...HELL...is...that? It reminds me of the Caparo T1, but that one's a bit closer to the ground...

 

[Arppa83]

peugeot oxia

That's the best looking Pug I've seen
If it was designed a couple years earlier, it had been an awesome group-B rally car, i think...
Shame it didn't make it into production

I'd like to see that in GT5

 

[Duke]

Regardless, if anyone had actually read my closing line, "You're right in assuming that frontal area has an impact, but the airflow over the object needs to be taken into account too", this implies that I was suggesting both the Cd and the frontal area needed to be taken into consideration.

I did read your closing line, but you're acting as if Cd is the most important criteria, when in fact frontal area plays a much larger role in how much wind resistance a given object has.

That's the best looking Pug I've seen
If it was designed a couple years earlier, it had been an awesome group-B rally car, i think...

Yeah, except for that whole "minimal ground clearance and zero suspension travel" thing...

 

[Speedster502]

Lancia Stratos

^ Thats it for now.

It isn't called a Lancia. Lancia denied all association with the Australian company which built it. It's called a Fenomenon Stratos, they are planned to be built in small numbers, so technically they are being produced...Just not alot of them.

 

[homeforsummer]

I did read your closing line, but you're acting as if Cd is the most important criteria, when in fact frontal area plays a much larger role in how much wind resistance a given object has.

Apologies if my comment was a bit muddy, and I stand corrected on the relative relevance of each. However, I still believe that the VW is probably more aerodynamic than the majority of motorcycles, because it has been designed specifically to slip through the air with minimal resistance, and by the standard of most cars has a very small frontal area.

Anyway, back on topic.

The Daihatsu HVS - if this had some classic round rear lights it'd be a lovely little summer car

Oh, and a GT4 favourite: The Toyota MTRC