Cote D'Azur track scale

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DrTrouserPlank

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DrTrouserPlank
Other than in name is there something keeping PD from modeling the track correctly?

I just gave it a spin and it's quite disappointing.

The pit straight is too short.
The entry into sainte devote seems a bit off.
The bump between Casino square and Mirabeau isn't even there.

I'm sure there's more.
 
Yeah, the track seems to be wider than it really is, though I'm guessing cuz I've never been. And yeah the Casino bump isn't there, but for some reason I "avoid it" anyway... :lol:

I remember playing an arcade game that had Monaco in it with the bump. If you ran over it, it made your car bottom-out and lose speed, hence avoiding it was necessary.
 
DrTrouserPlank
Other than in name is there something keeping PD from modeling the track correctly?

I just gave it a spin and it's quite disappointing.

The pit straight is too short.
The entry into sainte devote seems a bit off.
The bump between Casino square and Mirabeau isn't even there.

I'm sure there's more.
Click to expand...

"The Ring" also appears to me to be significantly less bumpy than in any other game I have played or in real life.
 
Yeah, i hate the multiple hairpin turns before the tunnel and i get stuck on the curbstones going down the hill.
sinner
Yeah, the track seems to be wider than it really is, though I'm guessing cuz I've never been. And yeah the Casino bump isn't there, but for some reason I "avoid it" anyway... :lol:

I remember playing an arcade game that had Monaco in it with the bump. If you ran over it, it made your car bottom-out and lose speed, hence avoiding it was necessary.
Click to expand...

THANK YOU! FINALLY, someone who knows the track is in Monaco, NOT France.
 
I really couldn't say, the only thing i could compare it to, is the footage from F1 races. And from that, i really can't tell the difference.
 
I think that pavement coming out of the hairpins before the tunnel is too small and that the scenery isn't accurate. I mean there are way more trees down the pit straight then what is shown and the fencing that makes up the tight clustered street feel isn't even there.
The pit exits all stuffed up, the last corners aren't accurate.
The chicanes don't have kerbs.
The pit lane isn't like the F1 circuit.
It isn't the Actual Monaco circuit.

GT5 : http://youtu.be/Y_OTcWURVy0
Real Life : http://youtu.be/-19NeqCwgxA
 
The swimming pool section is terribly inaccurate. Too wide, and the corners are of different radii than the actual ones on the real track.
 
stega
"The Ring" also appears to me to be significantly less bumpy than in any other game I have played or in real life.
Click to expand...

First time I've heard this particular opinion, with almost all people who've ever visited the Ring agreeing that GT5's is closer to the reality than in any other game...

otakukid96
THANK YOU! FINALLY, someone who knows the track is in Monaco, NOT France.
Click to expand...

It isn't.

The Monaco GP track is in Monaco. Cote d'Azur is just a City Course which is "in" France - notice how it's in "City" along with the wholly fictional SSR7, SSR5 and CSR5 and the Rome, Tokyo, London and Madrid tracks which are inspired by real locations, rather than "World Circuits" alongside all the other real tracks (even the Nordschleife, which isn't a track but a one-way, largely speed-derestricted toll road and La Sarthe which is located primarily on public roads).

The two tracks aren't the same, despite looking remarkably similar. For licencing reasons.
 
Famine
First time I've heard this particular opinion, with almost all people who've ever visited the Ring agreeing that GT5's is closer to the reality than in any other game...



It isn't.

The Monaco GP track is in Monaco. Cote d'Azur is just a City Course which is "in" France - notice how it's in "City" along with the wholly fictional SSR7, SSR5 and CSR5 and the Rome, Tokyo, London and Madrid tracks which are inspired by real locations, rather than "World Circuits" alongside all the other real tracks (even the Nordschleife, which isn't a track but a one-way, largely speed-derestricted toll road and La Sarthe which is located primarily on public roads).

The two tracks aren't the same, despite looking remarkably similar. For licencing reasons.
Click to expand...
I believe the ACM - Automobile Club de Monaco controls the rights to depictions of the actual Monte Carlo street circuit in works such as video games.

Gran Turismo probably did not acquire the appropriate license from the ACO, hence the "fictional" Cote d'Azur track that has been in the GT series up to this point.

If you remember, Ubisoft actually came out with a F1 video game called "Monaco Grand Prix" which featured the official Monte Carlo track, but all the other F1 tracks were using fictional names due to the lack of an FIA license.
 
MikeTheHockeyFan
I believe the ACM - Automobile Club de Monaco controls the rights to depictions of the actual Monte Carlo street circuit in works such as video games.

Gran Turismo probably did not acquire the appropriate license from the ACO, hence the "fictional" Cote d'Azur track that has been in the GT series up to this point.
Click to expand...

Which is the case - and that's why we have "Cote d'Azur", a "City" track rather than a "World" track (to indicate one based on real streets or locations [the SS tracks being generic Japanese expressways] but laid out by PD rather than being existing circuits) which is "in" France. And that's why every corner is subtlely different and why every "straight" is subtlely different from the Monaco street circuit.

But it's just close enough to make us all think it's Monaco. Despite not being Monaco:

Austin Powers 3
"RUN! IT'S GODZILLA!"
"Actually, it looks like Godzilla, but due to international copyright laws - it's not."
"STILL! WE SHOULD RUN LIKE IT IS GODZILLA!"
"Though it isn't."
Click to expand...
 
Famine's absolutely right. It's monagesque rather than Monagasque.

The track is less like the F1 track now, the F1 layout has changed considerably over the years whereas the fictional Cote d'Azur layout hasn't.

I've driven around Monaco and actually I think it feels quite accurate in terms of overall width, look and feel... but the scales of certain parts definitely differ.
 
Are you trying to tell me Cote d'Azur is not Monaco GP and is no located in Monaco but in fictional France because hence the differences in layout ?
 
Almost exactly that, but a bit arse-about-face.

  • They can't recreate the Monaco GP track for licensing reasons and they can't use the name - they don't have the licence for the real Monaco and they can't pretend it's the real one. So they've made a track that looks quite like it and called it something else.
  • If they put it in with the real circuits when it isn't one, they get sued - they don't have the licence for the real Monaco and they can't pretend it's the real one. So they've put it in City courses with the other "inspired by real locations" tracks.
  • If they put the location of track as being within the Principality of Monaco, they get sued - Monaco's not very big and the chances of there being two almost identical tracks within it are quite slim. They don't have the licence for the real Monaco and they can't pretend it's the real one. So they've put it as being "in" France - France is much bigger.

Austin Powers 3
"RUN! IT'S GODZILLA!"
"Actually, it looks like Godzilla, but due to international copyright laws - it's not."
"STILL! WE SHOULD RUN LIKE IT IS GODZILLA!"
"Though it isn't."
Click to expand...
 
GeneralJesh
Are you trying to tell me Cote d'Azur is not Monaco GP and is no located in Monaco but in fictional France because hence the differences in layout ?
Click to expand...

Spot on. Has PD said it is the well known track in Monaco? I don't think so. It isn't PDs fault that you, I and a few tens of millions of other people have jumped to that conclusion. Occasionally bizarre coincidences happen, this is one case where the fictional Cote d'Azur track happens to be vaguely familiar to a real track. I guess there must a limit to the number of ways a track can twist and turn. :)
 
Yeah, I thought everyone knew this track was different from Monaco on purpose. It's still a good feel for it, but if you look for something specific, you're not going to find a match.

The nurburgring in GT5 is a very good representation of the real deal. Very good. The trees suck, but otherwise, it's an amazing job. IF you can find a better one, play it, because it must be awesome.
 
That's why they don't use laser scanners, but just take photos? Maybe it's easer to acquire the license and make 1:1 track much faster?
 
georgiebest
...Cote d'Azur is the French Riviera. Although there is no official borders, it is known to include a large section of French coastline, and the sovereign state of Monaco.

So no it is not "in France" it is clearly meaning to be Monaco without actually calling itself that.
Click to expand...

Got to wonder why they put a little "France" flagblob next to it then, really.
 
I think I've worked out what the differences are. I originally thought PD modelled an old version of the track, but after the Monaco GP I went for a spin on GT5. It seems that for most of the course the GT version uses the pavements (sidewalks) as part of the track, hence it's marginally wider appearance.
 
bass264
Laser scanning tracks = crappy looking tracks
Click to expand...

I take it you haven't played iRacing then. Although the tracks are quite barren, they are incredibly accurate, very bumpy and tough to race on.
 
I think the track in the game is wider than in real life so people like me have a chance of getting round it while barely scraping the barriers.

I can understand why they don't call it Monaco in the game, because "avoiding legal action" is usually cheaper than "risking legal action" - often even if you win - but I don't really see how you can copyright topography. These are streets that were built with no intention of being a racing circuit, they just had the fortune to be used as that. Where is the licensing line drawn? Do we have to get permission for putting a photo of the Monaco circuit on Flickr, or a video of us driving the Isle of Man TT course? Computer games are just another form of art.
 
Famine
Got to wonder why they put a little "France" flagblob next to it then, really.
Click to expand...

My guess is that they didn't want to add one more country to the list,
and because Monaco is really not a country... it's a principauty (a land rule by a Prince)... so to defined it/categorize it as a country would not be entire correct.

At least they speak French and they are socially closer to France, and therefore the association to the French flag...








anyways, have you seen the latest video of the Z06 on the Ring?
when i look at it, would you agree with me that the ring seem shorter than in GT5?

The distances between turns seem much shorter than when i play the game,
and the curves/turns seem to be much more pronounced?

Is it because of the mounted camera and a different perspective?
or is it that GT5's Ring is not as real as it claim to be?

The scale seem a bit off when i watch this video and compare it with what i know about the track on the game.

http://www.youtube.com/v/Ok1WUO3p1oQ?


<object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ok1WUO3p1oQ?version=3"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ok1WUO3p1oQ?version=3" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="390"></object>

any comments guys?
 
I have seen the new ZR1 on the Ring. It ran a 7:19 completely stock. What did the Z06 do?
 
DG_Silva
I take it you haven't played iRacing then. Although the tracks are quite barren, they are incredibly accurate, very bumpy and tough to race on.
Click to expand...

I take it you haven't read the comment you are replying to then. He notes they look crappy, which is consistent with your description of a barren track that happens to be tough to race on.

I'd love to see GT5's great experience when driving combined with some kind of perfect track model, but as we see in this case, licensing is an issue.
 
Off the Bit
Where is the licensing line drawn? Do we have to get permission for putting a photo of the Monaco circuit on Flickr, or a video of us driving the Isle of Man TT course? Computer games are just another form of art.
Click to expand...

The line is drawn at the point where money is involved. The big difference between uploading a picture of the Monaco circuit to FlickR (I have a load of them on my Photobucket account from my trip there a couple of years back - it's a lovely place to visit) and including the circuit in a comercial game is that there's no profit to be had in the first instance, but there is in the second.
 

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