Do you have to own an Alfa Romeo to truly be a car enthusiast?

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  • 116 comments
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Do you have to own an Alfa Romeo to truly be a car enthusiast?

  • Yes, because no-one puts so much passion into making cars.

    Votes: 10 10.1%
  • No, because of other great enthusiasts' cars

    Votes: 54 54.5%
  • No, because Alfa Romeo always get something wrong in making their cars: build quality

    Votes: 16 16.2%
  • Who cares?!

    Votes: 29 29.3%
  • I can't decide!

    Votes: 4 4.0%

  • Total voters
    99
  • Poll closed .
I wouldn't take anything Clarkson says too seriously if I'm honest.
 
A car enthusiast's world does not revolve around Alfa Romeo ... so the answer is NO.
 
To quote Autocar... 'the Z struggled to keep up with the Scirocco and couldn't see which way the Focus RS went'.
Were they drunk, or was the road icy?
 
I voted no.

That has to be one of the stupidest things I ever heard.
 
It was probably a tight track.
 
As the Great James May once said, Not to long ago,

"We prefer them to bmws because an alfas Beautiful Look's and Gorges engine note*pause* Fill it with soul and passion"
 
Have you sat in any alfa's that have come out within last 10-15 years? I have, and they're plain nasty inside. I couldn't tell the difference in quality between Alfa interior and Opel interior. also, doing maintenance on Alfa is a major pain in the backside.

Yes, probably sat in an example of every Alfa in the last 10-15 years, and I think you're talking out of your bottom.

Were they drunk, or was the road icy?

The road was damp, and it's just one of the many examples where a genuinely good FWD will leave a genuinely good RWD far behind.

I'd scan the article for all but I don't want to infringe copyright and I wouldn't want to upset anyone's outmoded sensibilities.

It was probably a tight track.

Nope. Open moorland roads if the photos are anything to go by.
 
The road was damp, and it's just one of the many examples where a genuinely good FWD will leave a genuinely good RWD far behind.
Then surely Ferrari will be introducing a FWD version of the F430 Scuderia soon? I can't wait!
 
Then surely Ferrari will be introducing a FWD version of the F430 Scuderia soon? I can't wait!

I should have added "at a comparative level". Obviously a Koenigsegg would probably be a bit quicker than, say, a Peugeot 205 GTI, even though both are "good" cars. But it's not within the realms of possibility that something like a Focus RS, which is rather handy on most roads, would be able to easily eclipse something like the 370Z.

And anyway, this is veering off-topic a little. The main point is that it's not necessarily a bad thing that Alfas are front-drive at the moment. Truth be told, even most BMWs don't really need to be RWD. They still understeer in normal driving and only a very small percentage of drivers will really make useage of a RWD chassis. In all but high-performance road cars, the driven wheels are moot in all but pretty adverse conditions. And even then, most drivers would be best off with AWD > FWD > RWD.
 
Actually, to be a car enthusiast you pretty much have to have a Harley-Davidson.
[/sarcasm]

In seriousness YOU have to have a car. A car that stirs your blood. A car that you HAVE to turn around a take one more look at when you park it and walk away from it.
A car that if you sit at an outdoor table at a bistro or cafe, you choose a table that lets you look at the car.
Alfa's are pretty, but if you'll glance to the left, you'll see what stirs MY blood.

Hint: If someone has written a song about it, it's likely an enthusiast car.
"Little Duece Coupe"
"409"
"ol' 55"
"Silver Thunderbird"
etc.
 
No offense, but what kind of stupid poll is this!? Alfa Romeo, an enthusiast's car? Joke of the century...

Justin is right. I've been a car enthusiast as long as i can remember, but I've been a car owner for only 3 years.
 
Again, I'm thinking someone takes Top Gear too seriously.
 
No, you don't even have to have a car to be a car enthusiast.

I agree, I'm pretty certain most people would consider me a car enthusiast and I have a motorbike at the moment and I wouldn't know my way around the mechanics of a car either. I mention the second part because some people think you must know automatically how to fix things if you're a car enthusiast and I just don't, I like looking at them, I love driving them but I don't particularly enjoy working on them. To put it another way, I could tell someone how I want a car set up, but I couldn't set it up.

In the end, not every car enthusiast can even afford a car, let alone an unreliable Alfa.
 
NB: Why does unreliability (which is becoming less of an issue anyway) have any bearing on whether something is an enthusiasts car?
 
Why not the 147?

Because, to me, if you are going to do the whole Alfa thing right, you need a proper Alfa - which the 147 to me isn't.
Its a normal hatchback - much like the Mini. Apart from some zazzy styling, its pretty reliable, and it isn't something you think of at work to drive on the weekends (after the compulsory fettle first) - but rather something you don't think of while you're driving it, on the way back from work.

I admit - I'd have one over most other Alfa's because of this - but if I wanted something special, something truly Alfa, I sir, want to look somewhere else.

I always think of Alfa drivers as amazingly optomistic, and yes, you have to be if you have the selespeed, but other than that, the Alfa Romeo experience, as it were, is lost. The 147 isn't a driver's car, not like the VW GTIs (well except the Mk IV) or (yes I keep on harping on about it) the 205GTI - and a proper Alfa has to give you that feel and the pasison carried with having an Alfa - that saving it for a day when all the starts align and the car and weather are both in tune. These things (sans weather - hopefully) would be much more apparent in the 60's and 70's GTs and sporty numbers surely.

A proper Alfa should warrant ownership of overalls and a good toolbox to me - maybe my opinion, but there we are.

NB: Why does unreliability (which is becoming less of an issue anyway) have any bearing on whether something is an enthusiasts car?

Because it shows stickability. That you are blinded by the love of the car that having it on the side of the road for 99% of the time and chwing your money and social life is alright.

'Coarse that's bollocks, but its a reason I suppose.
 
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Because, to me, if you are going to do the whole Alfa thing right, you need a proper Alfa - which the 147 to me isn't.
Its a normal hatchback - much like the Mini. Apart from some zazzy styling, its pretty reliable, and it isn't something you think of at work to drive on the weekends (after the compulsory fettle first) - but rather something you don't think of while you're driving it, on the way back from work.

I admit - I'd have one over most other Alfa's because of this - but if I wanted something special, something truly Alfa, I sir, want to look somewhere else.

I always think of Alfa drivers as amazingly optomistic, and yes, you have to be if you have the selespeed, but other than that, the Alfa Romeo experience, as it were, is lost. The 147 isn't a driver's car, not like the VW GTIs (well except the Mk IV) or (yes I keep on harping on about it) the 205GTI - and a proper Alfa has to give you that feel and the pasison carried with having an Alfa - that saving it for a day when all the starts align and the car and weather are both in tune. These things (sans weather - hopefully) would be much more apparent in the 60's and 70's GTs and sporty numbers surely.

I'd disagree on the "drivers car" comment. It's by no means the best in it's class of course, but it still has so much more character and they feel special to drive. As I mentioned before, a USP of current Alfas is their steering - very quick (usually around 2 turns lock-to-lock, and as little as 1.7 turns in GTA models - my MX-5 is somewhere between 2.5 and 3.0 I think, my Fiesta was over 4!). Even to the casual driver who might never push their car (like my mum, for example) this feels sporty, it feels more fun because steering the car just needs a flick of the wrist.

A Focus might (well, does) have a better chassis, better tuned suspension etc... but to drive it doesn't feel appreciably more sporty than a mid-nineties Escort did unless you go for an overtly sporty model.

Add to that things like the smell of Italian leather, hooded instruments, gorgeous red paint and an Alfa badge on the steering wheel and even a fairly useable Alfa like the 147 is still a car you choose with your heart first and head second - and therefore is a proper Alfa, and a car for those who want an Alfa, rather than just wanting "a car". It might not be the most special Alfa, but it's certainly more special in relation to the bland masses.

Or that's how I see it anyway.

Because it shows stickability. That you are blinded by the love of the car that having it on the side of the road for 99% of the time and chwing your money and social life is alright.

'Coarse that's bollocks, but its a reason I suppose.

Sorry, I misunderstood. The impression I got from a few people was that if you choose an unreliable car it somehow makes you not a car enthusiast. Which of course is tosh, as it would rule out the owner of virtually every British sports car ever...
 
I'd disagree on the "drivers car" comment. It's by no means the best in it's class of course, but it still has so much more character and they feel special to drive. As I mentioned before, a USP of current Alfas is their steering - very quick (usually around 2 turns lock-to-lock, and as little as 1.7 turns in GTA models - my MX-5 is somewhere between 2.5 and 3.0 I think, my Fiesta was over 4!). Even to the casual driver who might never push their car (like my mum, for example) this feels sporty, it feels more fun because steering the car just needs a flick of the wrist.

A Focus might (well, does) have a better chassis, better tuned suspension etc... but to drive it doesn't feel appreciably more sporty than a mid-nineties Escort did unless you go for an overtly sporty model.

Add to that things like the smell of Italian leather, hooded instruments, gorgeous red paint and an Alfa badge on the steering wheel and even a fairly useable Alfa like the 147 is still a car you choose with your heart first and head second - and therefore is a proper Alfa, and a car for those who want an Alfa, rather than just wanting "a car". It might not be the most special Alfa, but it's certainly more special in relation to the bland masses.

Or that's how I see it anyway.

Each to their own I guess. It's probably because I see the 147 is a city runabout with some pizzaz - which isn't what I see as a proper Alfa (like the 1750GT or the SZ). Even the 4 door supers back in the day weren't about runaboutism, but more the event of driving the Alfa. My view of course.


Sorry, I misunderstood. The impression I got from a few people was that if you choose an unreliable car it somehow makes you not a car enthusiast. Which of course is tosh, as it would rule out the owner of virtually every British sports car ever...

Ahh the TR6 - what style. If I was garenteed that it wouldn't break down, I'd definatly take one for a week or two in the countryside somewhere....

EDIT: I REALLY want a Giulia Super right now - theres one in Sydney for 7.8k...hmmmm - I defs. need to get a job.
 
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Each to their own I guess. It's probably because I see the 147 is a city runabout with some pizzaz - which isn't what I see as a proper Alfa (like the 1750GT or the SZ). Even the 4 door supers back in the day weren't about runaboutism, but more the event of driving the Alfa. My view of course.

Of course 👍 Though bear in mind that some of Alfa's most revered classics (such as the Junior versions of Giulia models and cars like the original Alfasud) were designed to be inexpensive and basic and to introduce the marque to a wider audience. Kind of like the 147...

In fact, the 'Sud is probably the most humble Alfa yet, given that it was designed simply as a cheap car to produce that gave workers in the impoverished South of Italy jobs. As the 147 was designed as a sporty hatch to replace the 145/146 and compete with the BMW Compact, it was clearly designed with a more sporting intent.
 
Of course 👍 Though bear in mind that some of Alfa's most revered classics (such as the Junior versions of Giulia models and cars like the original Alfasud) were designed to be inexpensive and basic and to introduce the marque to a wider audience. Kind of like the 147...

In fact, the 'Sud is probably the most humble Alfa yet, given that it was designed simply as a cheap car to produce that gave workers in the impoverished South of Italy jobs. As the 147 was designed as a sporty hatch to replace the 145/146 and compete with the BMW Compact, it was clearly designed with a more sporting intent.

This is true - but I just seem to find the older (up to....I dunno....80s? - oh and the Cloverleaf 75) Alfas....more pure in a way. Its that purity that adds to the character, and brings out more passion. Sure, the 147 is full of the fundamentals that Alfas designed by, but I guess its the imperfections that give the older ones more character in a way. Maybe I'm talking nonsense with that last bit though - but there is something different in the new cars like the 147 that don't ultimatly seal the deal for me.

Sort of like the (new) Abarth 500 against the older creations.

Of course - Alfa can't help it - its the way of the motor trend and if they made cars like the 60s and 70s today, they'd go bankrupt very soon - so props to them for trying....
 
This is true - but I just seem to find the older (up to....I dunno....80s? - oh and the Cloverleaf 75) Alfas....more pure in a way. Its that purity that adds to the character, and brings out more passion. Sure, the 147 is full of the fundamentals that Alfas designed by, but I guess its the imperfections that give the older ones more character in a way. Maybe I'm talking nonsense with that last bit though - but there is something different in the new cars like the 147 that don't ultimatly seal the deal for me.

Sort of like the (new) Abarth 500 against the older creations.

Of course - Alfa can't help it - its the way of the motor trend and if they made cars like the 60s and 70s today, they'd go bankrupt very soon - so props to them for trying....

Well, quite.

I do urge you to try, or even just have a ride in some modern Alfas though. They still feel a bit special, whether it's the result of a quirky driving position, the interior smell which you only seem to get in Italian cars (Alfas smell Italian, it's hard to describe - the 146 I've driven brought back memories of the old Fiat Unos we used to have) and of course the rasp to the exahust note that all Alfas seem to have whether they're a poverty spec model or a GTA.
 
Gil
In seriousness YOU have to have a car. A car that stirs your blood. A car that you HAVE to turn around a take one more look at when you park it and walk away from it.
This man has it. If you have to turn around as you leave, there has to be a grin on your face. The car must feel as an extension of your body, must be what you are all about. The car has to stir such feelings that you lose all your friends in conversation expressing how you feel (Or confuse them you're speaking of a lover. :lol:.) Could an Alfa be this? Sure, no doubt in my mind. Does it have to be the Alfa? No.

Edit: I raise the MX-5 and the Lotus Elise to my defense.


Cheers,
Jetboy
 
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stupidest thread in history of GTP.
 
stupidest thread in history of GTP.

Wow - awesome constructive post there mate.

As you can see by the discussion, it isn't the case.
 
Well, it seems to be based entirely upon the opinions of three...THREE...automotive journalists, which, more or less, has become a catchphrase for them rather than anything else, which Is why I went with "Who Cares."

Sure, you can get to Petrolhead heaven in an Alfa. You can also go in a number of other cars. Even an old Corolla.
 
To me, i think that it does, and quite simply, my favourite quote summs up why to be a true enthusiast;

"Alfa Romeo is something special. It occupies a place apart. It is a kind of diease, this passion for a means of transport. It is a way of life, a very special way of thinking about a powered vehicle. It's hard to define. It is one of those irrational human traits that defy logical definintion.

It's to do with feelings and passions, things that have more to do with the heart than the brain. It's a way of thinking that derives from racing, where excellence is indispensible and pressure to perform is constant... We have always believed that these concepts find thier true expression in the cars we sell - thier drivability, the way the driver 'feels' the car in his hands."

Orazio Satta, technical director for Alfa Romeo from 1962

this is my faveorite quote, and i truely believe that to own an Alfa Romeo is what makes people a car enthusiast. It's attention to detail like for example, ebossed logo's on the seats, make it stand out from any other car in it's class; like for the same money you can buy an Alfa 147 rather than a Diesel Focus. Another is thier design, which is simply what i think the pinnacle of what an everyday car should be. Another reason is driving an Alfa Romeo is not just about how fast it can get from 0 to 60, but it is the expierience that separates this particular make from any other in the world. If your going to buy an Alfa like the GTV6 for example, which has one of the best engine noises, it is this passion from the car that makes people loyal to Alfa's like the GTV6, because of the expieriences of passion one would endure owning an Alfa.

This is what i think driving should be all about, it should be about the expieriences you have wth the car, and how the true driving expierience should be what makes an enthusiast. I feel that Alfa Romeo explores these endeavours in every car they make.

I'd say it depends what alfa you are talking about. If its a 147, no. If its a 1750 GT or an SZ I'd say so.


how so exactly?? you can't say a 147 is the same as a Ford Focus.......it just isn't. It embosses the Alfa tradition of a statement of indiviuality compared to mainstream Hatchbacks......it is the predecessor of the Alfasud, one of the best selling and one of the most legendary Alfas of all time and it still embosses it's legacy. A 147 is not like any other car in its class, it may function the same yes, but it is a completely different ballpark when you compare it to say an Astra or a Focus......if i had a choice, i'd know what i would be buying


Well, quite.

I do urge you to try, or even just have a ride in some modern Alfas though. They still feel a bit special, whether it's the result of a quirky driving position, the interior smell which you only seem to get in Italian cars (Alfas smell Italian, it's hard to describe - the 146 I've driven brought back memories of the old Fiat Unos we used to have) and of course the rasp to the exahust note that all Alfas seem to have whether they're a poverty spec model or a GTA.

i agree completely, like the Alfa MiTo is a Brilliant car, it reminds me of the Alfa Sprint's (awesome cars), and it still has that Alfa Legacy of the driving expierience.....i'd much rather the MiTo over a mainsream hatch like a Fiesta or something.

As the 147 was designed as a sporty hatch to replace the 145/146 and compete with the BMW Compact, it was clearly designed with a more sporting intent.

I have a BMW Compact, it's a great car, love it to death. i would have to say the 145/146 and 147 are pretty much on par with the Compact. I was looking at buying a 147 when i was looking for my car, but i got the Bimmer. It kind of reminds me of the Alfa Sprint's from the 80's (awesome) which is what i like about it so much
 
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Any car that's old enough is a "classic car". That's not the point of the statement...............................................................................................................................
You only get that with Alfa Romeo. Fast. Fun, Drop-dead gorgeous. And sometimes you can drive it too.
I've found an Italian. Not as affordable as an Alfa, but fit's the bill in every other way.
TVR-Griffith.jpg
 
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