Does 'steering sensitivity' only apply to the pad?

[Shaggy Alonso]

Or does it change the sensitivity with a wheel too? I use a G27.

Thanks.

 

[ConRollins]

Not real sure, but it seems to me when I was doing one of the TT, I turned the sensitivity to 3 or 4 and it felt a lot different than my usual setting of 7. I use a wheel so I would say it affects both.

 

[Shaggy Alonso]

Not real sure, but it seems to me when I was doing one of the TT, I turned the sensitivity to 3 or 4 and it felt a lot different than my usual setting of 7. I use a wheel so I would say it affects both.

I only briefly tried it earlier, and I did go faster when I tried it with more sensitivity and it felt better, although I ran with medium tyres on the second run compared to hards on the first run. The steering input still felt very sluggish though at 7 - but I haven't done a proper back to back test. In any case, if there is a difference it's a pretty subtle one.

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

It only applies to the controller, does not affect the steering wheels.

 

[Shaggy Alonso]

It only applies to the controller, does not affect the steering wheels.

Does anyone know if it's been mooted at all whether or not steering sensitivity will be changable in any update to come? The basic physics of GT5 are clearly very good, but i'm a bit nonplussed at how unrealistic the steering inputs are, which is of fundamental importance, and is surely (relatively) simple to include as a feature.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

Does anyone know if it's been mooted at all whether or not steering sensitivity will be changable in any update to come? The basic physics of GT5 are clearly very good, but i'm a bit nonplussed at how unrealistic the steering inputs are, which is of fundamental importance, and is surely (relatively) simple to include as a feature.

I guess you are interested in mainly the Formula cars. You want to be able to change the steering rotation in degrees, not the sensitivity. Only Fanatec wheels and the Driving Force Pro can do it by hardware settings. Hopefully PD add the ability to change steering rotation in an update or just force the wheel rotation to what it is in real life without the ability to change it for most of the wheel users. There is an update coming out soon, no plans I heard of adding this function but PD might add it, you never know.

 

[Shaggy Alonso]

I guess you are interested in mainly the Formula cars. You want to be able to change the steering rotation in degrees, not the sensitivity. Only Fanatec wheels and the Driving Force Pro can do it by hardware settings. Hopefully PD add the ability to change steering rotation in an update or just force the wheel rotation to what it is in real life without the ability to change it for most of the wheel users. There is an update coming out soon, no plans I heard of adding this function but PD might add it, you never know.

Yeah, or steering 'saturation' as they like to call it in F1. Obviously GT5 has a much more complex and realistic physics engine than f1 2011's 'interpretation' of oversteer , but F1's steering inputs are better simulated - cars feel like an extension of your body, they do what you command them to (at least in a good grip scenario) - and in this way at least, F1 2011 feels more realistic a driving experience. For example if I understeer wide in f1, I know it's because I haven't got enough front end or I've simply overcooked the corner, whereas in GT5 it's harder for me to find the limits of adhesion as I don't know how much of the understeer is physically real, and how much of it is simply down to me not cranking enough lock on the steering wheel.

It makes for a highly unnatural driving experience. I came across this issue when taking the Schumacher S in an m5 (i think) on one of the licence tests; I couldn't figure out how to get the gold after about 30 attempts and I was really stumped, then on my next attempt I got fed up and just cranked the wheel full lock left in frustration, only to find it took the corner sweet without having to lift.

It doesn't matter how good the physics are if you're not given the tools to adequately exploit them. Why is the physics engine being wasted by such a needless detraction?

Incidentally, I didn't have the f1 cars in mind when bringing this up, it really bugs me with every single vehicle in the game.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

Yeah, or steering 'saturation' as they like to call it in F1. Obviously GT5 has a much more complex and realistic physics engine than f1 2011's 'interpretation' of oversteer , but F1's steering inputs are better simulated - cars feel like an extension of your body, they do what you command them to (at least in a good grip scenario) - and in this way at least, F1 2011 feels more realistic a driving experience. For example if I understeer wide in f1, I know it's because I haven't got enough front end or I've simply overcooked the corner, whereas in GT5 it's harder for me to find the limits of adhesion as I don't know how much of the understeer is physically real, and how much of it is simply down to me not cranking enough lock on the steering wheel.

It makes for a highly unnatural driving experience. I came across this issue when taking the Schumacher S in an m5 (i think) on one of the licence tests; I couldn't figure out how to get the gold after about 30 attempts and I was really stumped, then on my next attempt I got fed up and just cranked the wheel full lock left in frustration, only to find it took the corner sweet without having to lift.

It doesn't matter how good the physics are if you're not given the tools to adequately exploit them. Why is the physics engine being wasted by such a needless detraction?

Incidentally, I didn't have the f1 cars in mind when bringing this up, it really bugs me with every single vehicle in the game.

Steering saturation is like steering sensitivity that is linear.
I feel the opposite regards to GT5 and F1 2011 in terms of wheel input and feel. If the cars feel like an extension of your body in F1 2011, no wonder why you are are so good at it. I find GT5 for me more like that but F1 2011 is not that bad in that regards, you can really attack the tracks on that game with loads of downforce, Hungarian GP is awesome.

Regards to understeer, you can usually tell by three things, sound of the tyres, through force feedback or through the visuals regards to tyre indicator and seeing you are going wide. I can normally instantly tell I am understeering. I have my wheel settings to Simulation and to force feedback level to 3, no PAS..

I find it the most natural driving experience on consoles. Ferrari Virtual Academy on PC is the best I’ve experienced, that is similar to GT5 but better in certain aspects in terms of feel for me. Licence tests should have been easy for you to Gold because I usually got Gold straightaway for most of them and you are miles better than me at F1 2010 and 2011. Maybe you not in tune with the force feedback yet, you should be able to feel the limit well. Here is a video of me driving after only driving a few laps with the F10 on Comfort Hards, it has lots of understeer but you can feel the limit quite well (The laps are not very good but I only spent a few laps doing each but you can see the Schumacher S and 130R, I manage to drive within the understeer limit). The problem with the Formula cars is you have to use more steering lock than normal because of 900 degrees but I’m used to it since driving the F2007 in GT5P.



I think the tools are there to be exploited if you can get the feel for what the FFB is trying to say to you.

I mentioned Formula cars as you like racing F1 cars in the virtual world and also the fact that GT5 makes you use all the degrees of the steering wheel you have for every car. Soon as it is with every car you have this problem with, try different wheel settings and try and build up a feel with the FFB and also the sound of the tyres and the visuals is trying to tell you.

 

[ConRollins]

Only Fanatec wheels and the Driving Force Pro can do it by hardware settings.

Please elaborate. Are these hardware settings in the game, or a combination of button pushing on the wheel? And are you refering to the degrees of turn for wheel lock.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

Please elaborate. Are these hardware settings in the game, or a combination of button pushing on the wheel? And are you refering to the degrees of turn for wheel lock.

Hardware settings on the wheel. Yes.

 

[berty1979]

Shaggy Alonso
Yeah, or steering 'saturation' as they like to call it in F1. Obviously GT5 has a much more complex and realistic physics engine than f1 2011's 'interpretation' of oversteer , but F1's steering inputs are better simulated - cars feel like an extension of your body, they do what you command them to (at least in a good grip scenario) - and in this way at least, F1 2011 feels more realistic a driving experience. For example if I understeer wide in f1, I know it's because I haven't got enough front end or I've simply overcooked the corner, whereas in GT5 it's harder for me to find the limits of adhesion as I don't know how much of the understeer is physically real, and how much of it is simply down to me not cranking enough lock on the steering wheel.

Exactly my problem too, I am thinking I should try different wheel settings.

 

[nb123]

I am wanting more direct steering and less turning circle than my current Driving Force Pro. I was going to get a G27, Should I be better getting a DFGT or Fanatic wheel so I can dial that in myself? I have been used to wheels for PC gaming where you can adjust multiple settings for the wheel and I am wanting that freedom in a PS3 compatible wheel.

 

[toymdngn]

A DFGT can not be adjusted.

 

[Shaggy Alonso]

I am wanting more direct steering and less turning circle than my current Driving Force Pro. I was going to get a G27, Should I be better getting a DFGT or Fanatic wheel so I can dial that in myself? I have been used to wheels for PC gaming where you can adjust multiple settings for the wheel and I am wanting that freedom in a PS3 compatible wheel.

If that is your main gripe with your current wheel then I would advise against the G27. It's great at everything else, but the steering ratio is all wrong in GT5. I realised I was actually able to shake the wheel side to side in little 20 degree turns left and right quickly and it made no noticeable change to the handling of the car - just kept dead straight. Even my Vauxhall Corsa is more responsive than that - and it's designed for 98% comfort/aesthetics/affordability vs about 2% performance.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

If that is your main gripe with your current wheel then I would advise against the G27. It's great at everything else, but the steering ratio is all wrong in GT5. I realised I was actually able to shake the wheel side to side in little 20 degree turns left and right quickly and it made no noticeable change to the handling of the car - just kept dead straight. Even my Vauxhall Corsa is more responsive than that - and it's designed for 98% comfort/aesthetics/affordability vs about 2% performance.

Maybe something is wrong with your wheel? If you install Logitech software for your PC, and then plug your wheel in, see if it registers the 20 degrees. The steering ratio is 1:1 with 900 degrees. My DFGT even though it is loose in the centre still feels very direct with minimal steering movement. Could be also because you are used to driving something like 200/400 degrees in F1 2011. I'm thinking of upgrading to G27 and heard good things about it from one of the fastest GT5 players in the world (Video of him driving with G27 below). I think pipeslice also said he prefers GT5 feel over the Codemaster F1 games or something like that.

 

[GTP_Monkey]

It only applies to the controller, does not affect the steering wheels.

Sorry but your wrong there, it does affect the wheel, well the DFGT at least cant say about others.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

Sorry but your wrong there, it does affect the wheel, well the DFGT at least cant say about otheres.

I have the DFGT and as far as I know it does not affect wheel users.

 

[Shaggy Alonso]

Maybe something is wrong with your wheel? If you install Logitech software for your PC, and then plug your wheel in, see if it registers the 20 degrees. The steering ratio is 1:1 with 900 degrees. My DFGT even though it is loose in the centre still feels very direct with minimal steering movement. Could be also because you are used to driving something like 200/400 degrees in F1 2011. I'm thinking of upgrading to G27 and heard good things about it from one of the fastest GT5 players in the world (Video of him driving with G27 below). I think pipeslice also said he prefers GT5 feel over the Codemaster F1 games or something like that.

It's amazing how some guys make it look so easy, he was amazing. In any case, my point about the 20 degree changes (rough guestimation) isn't that there's a deadzone - it picks up the movement all right but doesn't apply the correct ratio of steering movement. So for example if I turn the wheel by 90 degrees, it might in reality only register as something like 70 in the game - my inputs are not being correctly simulated. Perhaps I only notice this because I'm still relatively new to Gran Turismo compared to most of the seasoned veterans who are completely used to this steering and are very at home with it - but I know i'm losing absolutely heaps of time because the mechanics of the steering aren't the same as in real life. Interestingly, F1:CE had a similar issue (although not as pronounced) and I wasn't as good at that as I am the Codemasters' F1games. Your problem with F1 might be what allows me to be fast at it, and is paradoxically my problem with GT5 which allows you to be fast at it - just a theory.

EDIT: Just noticed in the options menu, it gives the ability to switch power steering ON and notes that this is only available for 900 degree rotational wheels - sounds vaguely promising.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

It's amazing how some guys make it look so easy, he was amazing. In any case, my point about the 20 degree changes (rough guestimation) isn't that there's a deadzone - it picks up the movement all right but doesn't apply the correct ratio of steering movement. So for example if I turn the wheel by 90 degrees, it might in reality only register as something like 70 in the game - my inputs are not being correctly simulated. Perhaps I only notice this because I'm still relatively new to Gran Turismo compared to most of the seasoned veterans who are completely used to this steering and are very at home with it - but I know i'm losing absolutely heaps of time because the mechanics of the steering aren't the same as in real life. Interestingly, F1:CE had a similar issue (although not as pronounced) and I wasn't as good at that as I am the Codemasters' F1games. Your problem with F1 might be what allows me to be fast at it, and is paradoxically my problem with GT5 which allows you to be fast at it - just a theory.

If you see the video from 1:40 onwards, you can see changes of direction with minimal steering. F1:CE is very different to GT5 in regards to steering though, it didn't feel very direct from what I remember. pipeslice is fast at both, maybe he holds more answers as to why? I found F1 2010 strange with no assists, and amazingly changing the wheel weight to 100% made it easier to stop without locking up even pushing the brake pedal down the same amount. I have got the PC version also now and find it easier to drive with no assists (Could be due to better drivers for wheel). I think the game was developed with a G25 or G27 which might be a reason but until I get one I won't know if it is just me or the wheel and pedals or combination of both.

GT5 does equalise wheel users and pedal sets it seems. Remember to push all the way down on the brake and accelerator when you are in-game each time you start the game up.

Power steering I would not recommend, what wheel settings are you using for force feedback level and do you have it on simulation?

 

[Shaggy Alonso]

If you see the video from 1:40 onwards, you can see changes of direction with minimal steering. F1:CE is very different to GT5 in regards to steering though, it didn't feel very direct from what I remember. pipeslice is fast at both, maybe he holds more answers as to why? I found F1 2010 strange with no assists, and amazingly changing the wheel weight to 100% made it easier to stop without locking up even pushing the brake pedal down the same amount. I have got the PC version also now and find it easier to drive with no assists (Could be due to better drivers for wheel). I think the game was developed with a G25 or G27 which might be a reason but until I get one I won't know if it is just me or the wheel and pedals or combination of both.

GT5 does equalise wheel users and pedal sets it seems. Remember to push all the way down on the brake and accelerator when you are in-game each time you start the game up.

Power steering I would not recommend, what wheel settings are you using for force feedback level and do you have it on simulation?

My settings = FFB at 10, simulation mode, (it was the same with or without power steering for my problem)

I just did some testing and the problem is even worse than i thought - at a stand still, if I rotate the wheel 90 degrees IRL, it only turns it 45 in the game - if I rotate it 180 degrees IRL it only turns about 85 in the game. Does the sensitivity dull exponentially with my steering input? WTF is this all about? 👎

If this is the case, then no wonder i'm struggling - I need to make DOUBLE the steering input.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

My settings = FFB at 10, simulation mode, (it was the same with or without power steering for my problem)

I just did some testing and the problem is even worse than i thought - at a stand still, if I rotate the wheel 90 degrees IRL, it only turns it 45 in the game - if I rotate it 180 degrees IRL it only turns about 85 in the game. Does the sensitivity dull exponentially with my steering input? WTF is this all about? 👎

If this is the case, then no wonder i'm struggling - I need to make DOUBLE the steering input.

Are you talking about the cockpit view? That does not show 1:1 with your steering input.

 

[Shaggy Alonso]

Are you talking about the cockpit view? That does not show 1:1 with your steering input.

Yeah the cockpit view. Is it because my wheel has 900 degrees, and the game actually simulates these 900 degrees, even though no car in the game would handle anything like that? Are you online? Could you experiment with the same thing on your wheel? For my money, the cockpit view seems to be replicating exactly what's happening with the front wheels (terminal understeer everywhere, huge amounts of lock to navigate average corners) but just not what's happening with my steering wheel?!

 

[Saidur_Ali]

Yeah the cockpit view. Is it because my wheel has 900 degrees, and the game actually simulates these 900 degrees, even though no car in the game would handle anything like that? Are you online? Could you experiment with the same thing on your wheel? For my money, the cockpit view seems to be replicating exactly what's happening with the front wheels (terminal understeer everywhere, huge amounts of lock to navigate average corners) but just not what's happening with my steering wheel?!

The cockpit view does not represent your actual steering 1:1. It is due to the fact they couldn't get hand animations correct for 900 degrees. Smooth and minimal steering is the fastest way in GT5. I barely move the steering wheel most of the time. You will get understeer if you put too much lock in. You can drive that way but it is not the fastest way. You can feel the understeer building up, best thing is to steer back to straight and turn back in fast again to defeat the understeer. It is easier to drive with the rear of the car: Here is an example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1MV_bH8QEk

 

[Zuel]

The cockpit view does not represent your actual steering 1:1. It is due to the fact they couldn't get hand animations correct for 900 degrees. Smooth and minimal steering is the fastest way in GT5. I barely move the steering wheel most of the time. You will get understeer if you put too much lock in. You can drive that way but it is not the fastest way. You can feel the understeer building up, best thing is to steer back to straight and turn back in fast again to defeat the understeer. It is easier to drive with the rear of the car: Here is an example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1MV_bH8QEk

It seems you have the rear in a slight drift.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

It seems you have the rear in a slight drift.

It is not me driving, it is Daniel Holland.

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

Sorry but your wrong there, it does affect the wheel, well the DFGT at least cant say about others.

No, hate to break it to you, but you are dead wrong. That setting is for the controller only. It was not designed to be used for wheel users, regardless of what wheel your using. I know this to be fact. Don't believe, email Sony/PD yourself. Know your facts before you come on here trying to be a bigshot and telling someone they're wrong buddy.

 

[GTP_Monkey]

No, hate to break it to you, but you are dead wrong. That setting is for the controller only. It was not designed to be used for wheel users, regardless of what wheel your using. I know this to be fact. Don't believe, email Sony/PD yourself. Know your facts before you come on here trying to be a bigshot and telling someone they're wrong buddy.

Your a bit Stroppy arnt you, got out the wrong side of the bed today did we, or is that the way you generally talk to people. Anyway the setting DOES make a difference on my DFGT and ive just double checked, may I suggest you do with the X2010 as that really does show the difference. 👍👍

 

[Johnnypenso]

Your a bit Stroppy arnt you, got out the wrong side of the bed today did we, or is that the way you generally talk to people. Anyway the setting DOES make a difference on my DFGT and ive just double checked, may I suggest you do with the X2010 as that really does show the difference. 👍👍

Careful man or he'll start yelling at you in capital letters and telling you that you're trying to start a fight but he's not here to argue...lol...

I have always had mine set to 1 with my DFGT...just assumed it never made a difference. Have to give that a try tonight and see what it does.

 

[Zuel]

It is not me driving, it is Daniel Holland.

Daniel Holland? Who might that be?

 

[GTP_CargoRatt]

Careful man or he'll start yelling at you in capital letters and telling you that you're trying to start a fight but he's not here to argue...lol...

I have always had mine set to 1 with my DFGT...just assumed it never made a difference. Have to give that a try tonight and see what it does.

Get over yourself bro, really. Like I said before, it DOES NOT apply to steering wheels, at all. That comes from Sony/PD themselves, not me. And just fy, the capital letters are just to get my point accross because some people are just too thick headed to get it otherwise.