Does Turn 10 have a bias about American Fords?

[SuperShouden]

It's Ford and Alpha, actually. They've had a new car in every pack. Although, Dodge and Chevy both have had the same amount of new cars added. Dodge I know is even as it had the two Coronets added in the Muscle Car Pack. But, I don't mind that they like American muscle cars and Alfas.

Plus, as I've said before, T10 is an American game company. Most of their cars are gonna be from America. Just like Gran Turismo has a lot of Japanese Cars and Dirt, Grid and other Ubisoft racing games have a lot of European cars.

 

[Luminis]

how much of a crowd are you having to push through to see this car? Is it harder to see a Pinto or a 66 Shelby GT 350? Why is this car in the game when more significant or desirable cars are not?

What kind of crowd is going to gather around a CRX Del Sol? Around a Prelude SiR? Around a Mercedes A-Class? Are those cars that attract many people? Many enthusiasts? See, that's the whole point. T10 doesn't seem to dislike American Fords any more than it does dislike, say, Mercedes. I could also get mad at them for adding a Prius over a N2 Spec Toyota AE86, but that doesn't mean that T10 is biased against TRD Toyotas.

If there were any indication those more desirable Fords would make it into the game I wouldn't begrudge these vehicles being in the DLC, but if, and I hope not, but if T10 doesn't like US Fords, then it'll only get worse, somehow.

You know, if T10 was adding even more Fords to the game, American or otherwise, I'd actually say that that would indeed be a bit biased towards Ford in general. There are other manufacturers that aren't as well represented as Ford. I think that setttling that score is far more important than equalizing a perceived difference in representation of European and American Fords.

Plus, as I've said before, T10 is an American game company. Most of their cars are gonna be from America.

Europe: 267
Asia: 112
America: 143 (including Acura, Infiniti, Lexus and Scion).
Australia: 8

That doesn't include the March DLC, though. Anyways, the only thing that is keeping America ahead of Japan in terms of car counts is that those four brands aren't listed as Japanese companies. So, your point seems to be entirely invalid.

Didn't we have that conversation already, somewhen? I think I remember calling you out on that one once already. Not sure, though

 

[SlipZtrEm]

That top pic is a Chevy Nova (also called the Chevy II) station wagon of the 66 Nova in the game, not a Ford Country Squire - even if you found a pic of the CS racing in some manner it still misses the point. I should have put the word substantial in there somewhere. I'm using the test where you imagine you're at a classic car show or motorsport event; how much of a crowd are you having to push through to see this car? Is it harder to see a Pinto or a 66 Shelby GT 350? Why is this car in the game when more significant or desirable cars are not?

If there were any indication those more desirable Fords would make it into the game I wouldn't begrudge these vehicles being in the DLC, but if, and I hope not, but if T10 doesn't like US Fords, then it'll only get worse, somehow.

If the game added nothing but the most desirable cars (for the average person), the lineup would be lacking in any sort of originality, and well, would look sort of like a Need For Speed title - the default cars most people could name when you ask about a specific make, but not much else.

An example of this - I was at the Toronto International Autoshow last month, and three incredibly rare cars were there. The Veyron (looked like a Sang Bleu, but probably just a "stock" one), the Aston Martin One-77, and the Zonda R. The overgrown jelly bean got far and away the most attention - the One-77, a bit, mostly due to it's price and rarity (though most people were more interested in the Virage or Vantage S Roadster). The Zonda R was relatively ignored.

I imagine part of the draw to games like FM and GT is the fact they include the humdrum and the idols, together. I can drive plenty of sports cars and supercars, and enjoy them, but there's also fun in taking something like an old Civic or Pinto and having it take down giants. Especially without the risk of random explosions in the latter.

Is Ford missing some classics? Sure, it definitely is. And so is every other moderately old marque.

 

[VXR]

Having the relatively hum drum in the game makes you appreciate the better cars even more. I love cars of all types; supercars interest me the least, but after driving the lower end cars for a while, the odd blast in a top-end vehicle with their acceleration and required respect makes them more fun.

There is a corner of car culture - myself included - who like wagons and the CS is the archetypal American wagon and to be honest I don't think it would make a difference if it was Buick's version, Chevy's version et al, it would still be a big American wagon. It could just be Ford are happier to license their more eclectic past and not just advertise their current models.

 

[CWR63]

Something else that needs to be taken into consideration is the length of history different car cultures: Europe and the US, 100 years in many cases; Japan and Asia, 50 years or so. With most countries fielding 3 -4 major manufacturers, the numbers game becomes clearer (just to be clear, my point isn't about the ratio of European Fords to US Fords, rather which US models have been recently released in DLC) with Germany, Italy, France, Sweden, and the UK alone representing 15 to 20 makes easily, some with centennial histories, versus the US with 109 year old FoMoCo represented by many Fords one Mercury and no Lincolns (which helps explain the seeming overabundance of Fords); 100 year old GM with Chevy, Pontiac, Cadillac, acouple of Buicks, Oldsmobiles, GMCs and Saturns plus one Hummer; the comparatively young 87 year old Chrysler group comprised of Dodge, Chrysler, Plymouth plus a couple of Jeep and Eagle products; a smattering of single model makes which includes one AMC model plus the Japanese US only brands, and, when taken altogether might make up one additional major manufacturer that makes the big 3 the big 4. That Japan, with it's shorter history and 6 major marques of Toyota, Nissan, Mazda, Honda, Mitsubishi and Subaru has as many cars in the game as it does says that T10 is being pretty even-handed.
I should also point out that in addition to there being no Lincolns and only one Mercury, all European, Australian, and UK Fords are contained in the Ford category whereas GM, in addition to it's many domestic subsidiaries gets Holden, Opel and Vauxhall to belie its monolithic presence in the game - of course it looks like there're too many Fords when arranged in this manner. I haven't gone through and added everybody's cars up, but FoMoCo may actually be underrepresented in Forza.

 

[Luminis]

I think you're trying too hard to make up a scenario in which Ford would seem under-represented.

The history of a manufacturer is hardly an indication of how many of its cars should be in the game, really. A manufacturer can have a rather long history without ever making a large number of very different cars. Volkswagen has been around for seven more years than Lotus, but there are far more different VW models than there are different Loti.

 

[CWR63]

I think you're trying too hard to make up a scenario in which Ford would seem under-represented.

The history of a manufacturer is hardly an indication of how many of its cars should be in the game, really. A manufacturer can have a rather long history without ever making a large number of very different cars. Volkswagen has been around for seven more years than Lotus, but there are far more different VW models than there are different Loti.

I haven't actually been trying that hard, but by comparing a boutique marque like Lotus to an automotive group that has stated aims on being the top volume manufacturer worldwide (which may not happen, but it is hardly a laughable notion) kinda makes that point - because Ford has a long history and has made a large number of very different vehicles, not just cars. I have made a mistake in that I wrote about Ford being possibly under-represented in the game when I meant that I don't think it's over-represented, as some have stated.
Ignoring all the tangential issues to the main point that you've raised, can it be assumed that you do not feel that Turn 10 is biased against US Fords? That would place you in the majority of the respondents, the winning side. I accept that, having lost, no part of my viewpoint, however small, has any validity whatsoever.

 

[buickgnx88]

How many times are you going to change what you're trying to say? I see no issues with the vehicles they are including, especially Ford. They've included numerous performance oriented as well as historically significant vehicles. I see no bias against them, and just figure they wanted to add in a few oddities.

As far as how they are arranged, that's just how it is. They are all part of Ford whereas Holden and Opel are separate brands, even though they are under the GM hat.

For the sake of argument though, could you please, in one sentence, say why you think T10 has a bias against Ford?

 

[UKMikey]

Perhaps they should make twenty or thirty Fords available as a DLC for anyone who felt the marque was underrepresented to buy, LOL.

 

[CWR63]

I thought that, because the last four Fords released in the DLC packs were strange choices considering the classics that remain unrepresented, that perhaps T10 or some people at T10, didn't care for Fords. That's the sentence. I posed the question of whether anyone agreed with this idea on this board and discovered that most disagree with me - question answered.
In the process there were many statements made that were related, but not central to the original question and I found myself defending positions that I hadn't put forth. I remembered why it's not a great idea for me to express an opinion on the internet - once it's figured out that I take this stuff seriously, the chain yanking begins.

I certainly don't think there are 20 or 30 classic Fords left out of the game, and I don't think Ford is underrepresented in Forza 4. There's one Ford I really, really want to see in the game, another model that I'd really like to see in the game, and maybe 3 others that would be neat to see in the game, and that about covers it.

 

[Luminis]

Well, the idea was to discuss a topic. You opened a thread, initiated a debate - what did you expect?

If you just want a yes/no answer, a poll might be usefull. Just some general advice, really. Might come in handy in the future.