drift versus grip: an online challenge

  • Thread starter Thread starter bengee
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OPEN... NO DUE DATE

i will present all data at a later time...

results:
name.................time...........out........avg..........in........technique
Driftster.............7.9570.......89........107..........147......g/d1
TruenoAE86.......10.078........110......103.5.......95........Trueno please tell
Bengee..............8.0020.......115......110..........114......g(using rumble strip)
Driftster.............6.0100.......76.........85...........134......d2
Driftster.............7.8370.......113.......97...........76........g
Thio...................4.024.........101.......102.........117......d1
Thio...................4.469.........88..........93...........101.....d1/d2
Driftster.............7.0700.......111.......98...........82........g

Information:
Graded corner combined times:

Theorectical=55.447

Driftster=58.429
Bengee=58.92
Trueno=59.978
Thio=62.324
Tailo=62.496
wanna b drifter=63.421

With the theoretical time comes a theoretical...
avg speed of 100.375
avg out of 99.4375
avg in of 108.25

if you would like your particular results please pm me...


These are not final results. Due date and challenge end is listed below.


Well, over in the drifting forum, the gt3 forum, and the rumor and speculation board there have been several fights in which people argue about the best overall driving style. Now, i myself find this arguement quite pointless, becuase it is not a overall style we should be worried about but the absolute fastest way through a corner (specific ones at that). In order to determine the fastest way through certain types of corners, a couple of us "drifters" who have been arguing the point decided that it would be fun and informative to have a series of challenges.

I have decided to run a light mr vehicle because of its neutral platform that lends itself to car control at the limit (whether drifting or gripping).

For this first challenge that car will be a lotus elise 190. you may only use this car modded as you like with T8 tires (super softs). Later the same challenge will be for super slicks, since at times slower lap times will be favored for less tire wear.

The track will be Apricot Hill I. Later other tracks will be analyzed.

What you must submit.

1. lap time
2. sector times
3. entrance speed (what is listed as speed in analyzer mode)
4. average speed
5. driving style (for sector ONLY)
6. hp

The driving style will be categorized in the following ways...

A) employing the use of no slip angles. grip
B) employing the use of slight slip angles with little or no smoke or tire squeel. For the sake of no arguements we will call this drift 1
C) employing the use of slip angles with lots of smoke and tire squeel. drift 2

apricot hill sector key
1 = straight from finish line
2 = first turn (high speed)
3 = second turn (medium speed)
4 = first third of consecutive s-turns
5 = last two s-turns
6 = short straight
7 = high speed u turn
8 = long straight
9 = low speed hairpin
10 = slight uphill with high speed curve
11 = medium speed turn to chicane
12 = chicane
13 = high speed uphill turn
14 = straight to finish

While you must submit the required information for each sector, these are the corners that will be "graded" corners (corners this challenge was created to analyze).

graded corners
A) sectors 2 and 3 combined
B) secotrs 4 and 5 combined
C) sector 7
D) sector 9
E) sector 10
F) sector 11
G) sector 12
H) sector 13

Now for the last aspect that must be explained, how the corners will be graded.

- First Place will be yeilded to the fastest corner time.
- However, if anyone is within the same tenth of a second for that corner, the exit speed will determine the winner.
- If however there is a tie here, the average speed will determine the winner.
- If however there is another tie here, the entrance speed will determine the winner.

For complete laps, the winning style will be determined by fastest time through the graded corners... Ties will be broken with highest average speed through the graded corners combined. (This is to prevent differences in top striaght away speed from playing a big roll). Ties will be broken with the actual lap times.

IMPORTANT:
Please refrain from cheating, because you are only going to cheat yourself. This means no running on the grass and two wheels on the tarmac/rummble strip at all times. Please refrain from an unnecessary arguement (that is not this threads purpose).

DUE DATE:
august 31st, 2003

Videos or screen shots of the analyzer page will not be asked for unless you are unsubstantiatedly fast...

You can either post or pm me your times...
 
Its up to you guys when you decide to post your times... You can either post them and encourage others to post as well, in order to increase competition and really push for the fastest possible times... or you can decide to hold back... i think raising the level of competition would be more beneficial...

Dont waste your time typing sector times out tho lol...
 
Alright
lap time 1'18.119 with stock suspension
T8's and maxed UG's (Forced induction)

section

1 Speed 137mph ; Sector time 4.487; avg Speed 143mph
Straightaway-^
2 Speed 147; sec time 3.613; avg speed 127
Grip-^
3 speed 89; sec time 4.344; avg mph 87
Drift 1-^
4 93 mph; 4.122; 96 mph
Grip-^
5 98; 6.289; 94
Grip-^
6 98 mph; 3.826; 105mph
Grip-^
7 112; 8.793; 105
Grip-^
8 109; 5.416; 124
Grip-^
9 134; 6.010 85mph
Drift 2-^
10 76mph, 7.837; 97mph
Grip-^
11 113; 4.782; 92mph
Drift 1-^
12 81; 5.669; 75
Grip-^
13 82; 7.070; 98
Grip-^
14 111mph; 5.861; 126
Straightaway-^

I WILL Waste my time posting sections.
 
lol... that is not a waste... slower than that will now be a waste...

lets post hp so we know whats up lol... i should add that above
 
I'll not join in the fray, but I will post this little Excel spreadsheet that was developed by Quattro_bro and modified by me.

It should help each of you analyze and develop a closer conclusion. If you have questions, please feel free to PM me.

Good luck,

AO
 

Attachments

Are the rumble strips pulling anyone else in? I guess it's just been a while since I really raced. So far the best time i could muster is 1:20.735 with 276hp wtih every thing. The car is strange though, very twitchy, but i guess that's cus im not so used to sticky tires. I think i'll have to try it out with the wheel.
 
Originally posted by Der Alta
I'll not join in the fray, but I will post this little Excel spreadsheet that was developed by Quattro_bro and modified by me.

It should help each of you analyze and develop a closer conclusion. If you have questions, please feel free to PM me.

Good luck,

AO

this is great! good idea.

somehow im losing 1.8 seconds on the hair pin. I have no Idea why.
 
What you can do is load your replays (you are saving them right?) into the analyzer. Compare braking points and throttle control through the corners between the two replays where you loose time.

This helps figure out how to gain those precious extra moments.

AO
 
i am also loosing a second in the hair... i am not used to the car yet... it skids a bit much... a little easier than the speedster... i am sure that its just that we have to get used to it trueno...

Thanks der alta
 
Originally posted by Der Alta
What you can do is load your replays (you are saving them right?) into the analyzer. Compare braking points and throttle control through the corners between the two replays where you loose time.

This helps figure out how to gain those precious extra moments.

AO

Well I cant really do that cus I don't have driftster's replay. I'm losing time compared to his lap.

Well now I'm down to 1:19.567. Still losing 1.4 seconds on the hair pin and 1.4 seconds on sector 3. The rest of the lap I pretty much gain about 1.5 seconds.
 
You all seem to still be doing better than I am. I'm still only at 1'21.836 for my best lap.

i am also loosing a second in the hair

I seem to be finding that the car is really bouncy at the end of sector 9 (hairpin) right next the the rumble strips on the left. I'm off by about 1.4 seconds in that sector from Driftster, too, even though my entrance to that sector is a little bit faster (by 7mph). Maybe it's because Driftster used Drift 2 technique and I'm still using Grip. I'm still trying to figure it out. :confused:
 
I might as well post it, this is not my cleanest/best run yet; I know I'm slow.

Lap Time: 1'21.806
Horsepower: 289 (almost needs oil change)

1. 143.3 mph || 4.299 seconds || 151 mph || Grip Technique
2. 156.9 || 3.619 || 127 || G
3. 86.3 || 5.542 || 84 || D1
4. 89.8 || 4.393 || 89 || G
5. 93.8 || 6.686 || 100 || D2 & G (two parts of S turn)
6. 106.9 || 3.579 || 113 || G
7. 117.8 || 8.341 || 110 || G
8. 116.6 || 5.171 || 130 || G
9. 141.6 || 7.934 || 84 || G
10. 81.5 || 8.310 || 101 || G
11. 117.1 || 4.650 || 92 || D1
12. 98.0 || 5.813 || 73 || G
13. 85.6 || 7.838 || 102 || G
14. 115.0 || 5.701 || 129 || G

I know this isn't the fastest run ever, nor is it even faster than any of you. It's just for comparison. Note for sector 3: sometimes when I take it at Drift 2 (slows to avg speed of about 80 mph), it gives a better sector time for sector 4 and 5. Anyone want to share suspension sets?
 
i will post mine up to because it is faster than driftster in some places... i am running close to driftster at 1'19.xxx its in hte high 19's... i havent run today yet tho... i think its loosing grip a lot easier than say a speedster would... just becuase its light... and its less forgiving because its low hp...
 
I also find that the wheels lose grip easily, especially in the first few sectors where elevation changes more than once. Even with T8s. Lift-throttle and brake-entry drifts are induced in transition from 2-3 and 3-4. I just tried again, and sector 9 hairpin gives me equal times whether grip or drift. But that's just me...slow. Can we get more participants now?
 
New participants would be nice. Ressurect the posts with the links, or start your own to get some more people in this thing. There is still alot of time for this one, but i was hoping for some more immediate results. Dam driftster you were too fast for a first post.
 
Sadly i am not at my apt this weekend, and i am away from gt3. Its so sad... :(...Come on all of yall have to beat driftster i am sure it can be done.
 
Well im getting closer. 1:18.512 and i still lost 1.8 seconds on the pin. I guess i'll post the times.

Sector, Time, Speed, Avg speed
1 4.238 143 151
2 3.610 156 126
3 5.545 91 84
4 3.894 95 101
5 6.184 107 106
6 3.562 110 116
7 8.390 123 111
8 5.195 116 129
9 7.792 140 86
10 8.128 82 103
11 4.298 122 98
12 4.772 98 88
13 7.365 93 107
14 5.539 119 133
 
:lol: true

That was for you statement on people trying.

Anyways... I should have posted my times before i left my apt. But being the lazy person i am that will have to wait. The hair is killing us becuase we are treating it as a heavier car, which would regain grip faster...
 
140||4.3370||147||
150||3.3240||137|| d2
90 ||5.0020|| 87 || d1
95 ||4.0540|| 96 || d1/g
100||6.3320||104|| d1
102||3.6750||109|| d1
114||8.0020||110|| g
115||5.2640||127|| g
137||7.7710|| 82 || d1
77 ||8.5470|| 98 || g
116||4.1500|| 97 || d1
95 ||4.5890|| 89 || g
87 ||7.2330||104|| g
117||5.8190||127||

1'18.099----bengee
 
Originally posted by bengee
140 4.337 147
150 3.324 137 d2
90 5.002 87 d1
95 4.054 96 d1
100 6.332 104 g
102 3.675 109 d1
114 8.002 110 g
115 5.264 127 g
137 7.771 82 d1
77 8.547 98 g
116 4.15 97 d1
95 4.589 93 g
95 7.233 107 g
117 5.819 127
78.099 bengee


woohoo
 
That hairpin is still ridiculous. I think it has to be a mistake. We can go so much faster on the rest of the track but lose more that 1.5 seconds on a single turn. I don't know; it just doesn't make sense.
 
lol

I had some wrong info up there.:O Sorry. I had copied it down wrong from the tv, because i was comparing my speedster to my elise and went to the wrong side for the sector 12 and 13 for speed. I rechecked everything and the info up there is correct now.

If you look at the hair, i d1'd it, while driftster d2's (i believe he does so with the e brake in this case), which makes his style much different from ours and his time also very different from ours.

I dont know if the way i devised to grade an individual on the entire course was so great... looking back it makes no sense really. It would however put me and trueno in a tie :D ...

I think i have come up with a better way to grade this and future challenges. Basically first gets 1 point... second gets .75... third .5 and fourth .25 and everyone after that gets 0 points... now these points are awarded for highest time on all turns... highest speed in.... highest speed out... highest avg speed... and any ties will be broken by actual lap times. A tie here will be broken by how many actual graded corners an individual was found to be fastest in... tell me if you think this is a more accurate way to judge an entire course...

I could also just use combined and averaged info and judge the whole course just as we judged every corner... first fastest combined corner time... then for a tie, highest avg speed out... then in case of another tie highest avg speed.... and finally highest avg speed out.... i guess .1 will be a tie for time... and within 1 mph is a tie for speed (since there is no lower division for speed)
 
Yeah, it sounds good

Oh yeah I think I petty much tried to grip every corner but sometimes on the entrance I’d get a little D2 action and sometimes on the exits I would D1, but I can't put one style for some of the corners. I'll look at the replay 2moro and see what I can put down.

On a separate note, I tried the car with sim tires and I think it would be much more interesting to run the second part of this comp on them instead of super slicks. I don't know about you guys but I found this car incredibly boring to drive on supper softs; way too much grip and not enough power. I think with Sims it will give use more control as to what technique we want to use. I found that on super soft I didn’t really get the choice to drift a corner, it kind of just happened if I made a mistake. Anyways I Just think it would be more fun with sims.
 
holy crap man... your setup must be giving you this stability... I found that is i setup how i drift on sims or slicks and put the t8's on the car would drift even if i let of the gas and turned... and it felt like it was on slicks at times... anyways... sims and slicks would be cool next... either or...
 

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