drivetrains brief summary?

  • Thread starter Thread starter koy682
  • 23 comments
  • 1,194 views
Messages
42
Messages
tulaiz
I tried to find a thread which has brief summary for all drivetrains, but there was not or i couldnt find one.. it will b. rly helpful for beginners if there is one.

so far, i have mostly driven fr.

FR felt like nice escape after cornering. it felt like it produces oversteer in the corner if it was floored. so i would control throttle proportional to wheel: if turned little bit, throttle 80%(im just stating examples and estimates, so correct me if im wrong plz :)) if turned more, 50% throttle and so on. for ff, it was opposite and produces understeer when it was floored, and thats all i know bc i rly havent driven one that much.

im still new with awd and mr. i thought mr would behave similar to fr, but it wasnt. in the top track event in the special event, i drove lotus and it was creating massive slide, or oversteer (actually that was first time playing with abs off. i usually play all off except abs 1) may b abs off was the cause for sliding too much, but it totally behaved different from fr.

if u guys can give me some tips about any drivetrains, i will rly appteciate :)
 
It all depends on the specific car... That Lotus special event makes them seem like the worst handling car in the game, but with just a bit of tuning, they're among the best. Some AWD cars handle terrific, like the FTO Touring Car, while others feel like you have the cornering of the Titanic (Veyron is one). A lot of people dislike FF cars, because usually that drivetrain is associated with lower HP and speed, but those cars can also be fun to drive. It does seem a universal truth, though, that RR cars require a special talent to drive... I don't yet have that talent.

My recommendation: try 'em all, experiment, and have fun. Some cars will be horrible stock, but with a bit of tuning, become awesome. Others may never suit your driving taste, regardless of work done to them.
 
One thing is certainly true on GT5 compared to real life..
Kick the back end out on a RR or MR, and you will NOT recover easily unless you are a driving God. Of course, the back comes out less with the added grip over the rear wheels...

FR cars tend to handle the "Best", as the weight of the engine rests on the front axle (Or near it), making sure the front wheels are touching the ground as much as possible. This is preferred, as more contact=more grip. The disadvantage usually comes when you mash the throttle in the footwell as hard as possible, and because there is less weight over the back, your rear slips out (Oversteer). This is typically the "Easiest" way to drift.

FF cars understeer slightly, for reasons which in my head contradict themselves. I'll report back when I've solved why. Im sure it has something to do with the differential.

MR Cars tend to be quite "Stable", in terms of front and rear grip. The thing is, however, that most MR cars are quite powerful, so the tail will still get a bit wayward. It's more difficult to correct, because there is more weight at the part that is swinging. For instance, if you try to spin a piece of string with nothing on the end, it's easy to stop. If you spin a string with a weight at the end (Key, rock, ball) its harder to stop, because the momentum is greater. Usually, if a MR car gets bent out of shape, the tail is swinging so hard that even with your best efforts, your car will spin with it, and you will be backwards, or in a wall. Additionally, a small side-effect with having an MR car is less weight over the front wheels, causing much less front-end grip, and thus, less actual turning power. This is why MR Racing cars (Formula 1, Ferrari's, Zonda's, LMP's, etc) have front wings, meaning the grip is regained through downforce. For instance, the Ferrari F10 handles quite nicely, it has a big front wing, and is MR. Meanwhile, the Ferrari Enzo has no front aero grip, and is also MR. The lack of any type of front grip results in hideous cornering capability, which is only solved by braking VERY early, or setting up the suspension so stiff at the rear, and so low at the front and high at the rear that it 1. Looks stupid and 2. Really becomes stupidly unstable.

RR Cars are like MR, only worse. Even less rear grip, and theres even more weight over the part that has no lateral control- the rear. The advantage to this is- Assume there are 2 cars

Porsche 911 (RR)
BMW M3 (FR)
Assuming they have the same power, and weight, the Porsche will murder the BMW in a drag race because it has so much more rear grip, and more rear grip means more tyre contact, and more rear tyre contact means more of the horsepower is being put to the road, which helps aid in Straight-line speed. Additionally, with a good differential set-up, the Porsche will be less likely to oversteer, because the rear tyres are glued to the track. But, because the Rear tyres are so grippy, this results in a loss of front end grip which means either
A. You will understeer into a wall, causing you to crash, curse, get back on track, get slammed by the careless AI, and then hit another wall, curse more, and eventually restart the race.
-OR-
B. You will get so fed up with the lack of turning, that you will nail the throttle to the floor, and you will eventually spin the rear wheels, resulting in an "uncontrollable" oversteer, which will also cause you to hit a wall. Again, with a good Diff and Suspension set up, this can be avoided, but not totally prevented.

AWD cars are somewhat interesting...
Because all 4 wheels are being powered, this results in monumental amounts of grip off the line, virtually eliminating wheels spin. But, when you come to a turn, in a FR car, the front wheels spin at different speeds because they are traveling different distances around the corner. But, in a AWD car, both front wheels are traveling at the same speed, and this will usually result in some kind of understeer. IF the AWD in GT5 was fully independent, these cars would rock, but sadly, they arent. With a good diff set-up, you can help this to some extent, but then you risk spinning one of the front wheels, resulting in an overall loss in front grip. But AWD cars live and die based on the type of car they are, and how they are tuned... The Audi R8 is a wonderful AWD car to drive, it's secure, and still quite good in the corners. But, you'll find you can take corners much faster if you coast through them, but that will reduce your grip under braking... its very complex. In most situations it's more "Safe", but a bit slower than a MR or FR.

In all honesty, it depends on your driving style... If you like to get perfect lines in a corner, and use all the rear grip for maximum power, then a MR or RR or AWD would be good for ya. But, if you want security in your ability to correct a drift, at risk of drifing more than in the other types, a FR is good.
 
in the top track event in the special event, i drove lotus and it was creating massive slide, or oversteer (actually that was first time playing with abs off. i usually play all off except abs 1) may b abs off was the cause for sliding too much, but it totally behaved different from fr.

if u guys can give me some tips about any drivetrains, i will rly appteciate :)

First off, the Top Gear special events are supposed to be funny JOKES. Because you know, the guys on Top Gear are funny, it's a very comic show!

That Lotus handles perfectly well when on sports tires and the tuning isn't mucked up.

For that special event, they deliberately put it on comfort hard tires and the tuning is definitely OFF. I think they hopped up the hp, & set the suspension & the LSD funny, and then put it on commuter tires...
That's why it is so hard to handle.

Second, not all cars of the same drivetrain are created equal!

I really like some FF cars. Not all of them have massive understeer. And many that can be helped out a bit with tuning.

I think 4wd is the only drivetrain I would make any general statement that they're easier to drive. But I haven't driven every one of them in the game. And the Daihatsu Move is a 4wd, but who wants to drive that boxy low power thing? I love kei cars, and I don't even like that one.

In fact a lot of things about handling can be stabilized or minimized a bit with upgraded tuning parts.
A perfect example is that last week I was driving my Mercury Cougar in a race, with my bf watching (bumper view), and when I was done he was surprised to find I was driving the Cougar!! Because I tuned it to a point where it didn't lurch & wallow so much, and I could actually steer it! (IMO, one should endeavour never to steer an unmodified antique muscle car! At all. LOL)

Dear Lord... i didnt realise how long that was...

HAHA. Welcome to my world. :D
 
Last edited:
But try the TVR Tuscan RM on Racing Softs. Despite being an FR, unless you're accelerating out of second gear at 50-100km/h, the car has an intense love affair with the grass on the outside of the corners:ouch:
 
i really dont get why people had problems with the top gear challenges, i literally did them second try, one to get my eye in for the way the car handled finishing 2nd or 3rd the second go winning by a few seconds
 
i really dont get why people had problems with the top gear challenges, i literally did them second try, one to get my eye in for the way the car handled finishing 2nd or 3rd the second go winning by a few seconds

hehe maybe you did them sometime in the last two months or so? xDD
 
RR: Painful

So then, a Kubelwagen is supposed to be painful to drive. Yup.

I think FF is under steery, FR is a bit over steery, 4WD is all grip, MR is more over steery and powerful RR cars are very over steery. Case in point, the CTR Yellow Bird. Apparently that thing is impossible to drive stock.
 
Another thing to watch out for on MR cars (Lotus Elise Top Gear Track) is lift-throttle oversteer. Without proper tuning you can only brake in a straight line. If there is any lateral forces on the car when lifting off the throttle or braking the car will want to swap ends. Some people have the reflexes to handle it, and others may have other tuning tricks. For me the only thing that seems to help is to give the rear more toe-in. It will decrease top speed a little but thats better than entering every corner backwards.
 
peterjford
Another thing to watch out for on MR cars (Lotus Elise Top Gear Track) is lift-throttle oversteer. Without proper tuning you can only brake in a straight line. If there is any lateral forces on the car when lifting off the throttle or braking the car will want to swap end.

THAT IS EXCTLT WHY THE CAR WAS SLIDING LIKE A B.....!!! Thank you for such information. I didnt know lifting throttle off while handle being turned can create oversteer. Can you or someone explain why it does that?

hawkeye122
Hopefully you'll soon learn to read the Acceptable Use Policy, that way you don't catch the attention of the moderators...

I totally did not realize that. Thank you, and I will be careful :p
 
THAT IS EXCTLT WHY THE CAR WAS SLIDING LIKE A B.....!!! Thank you for such information. I didnt know lifting throttle off while handle being turned can create oversteer. Can you or someone explain why it does that?

Weight transfer. You can (and should) google for more details, but the short, short story is:

When you hit the gas, the weight of the car shifts to the rear wheels, when you brake or let off the gas the weight hits the front tires, giving them more grip and lightens the rear. Too much grip at the front will give you too much steering input, causing oversteer.

This should happen to FWD cars as well, but sadly GT doesn't do a great job with it.

edit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lift-off_oversteer that should have some extra info.
 
^This is exactly your problem, summed up rather well.^

Front Wheel Drive (FF): Have the engine, transmission, and drive wheels up front, this makes for a very unbalanced weight distrobution. All will give you various amounts of understeer because you are asking your front wheels to do both, propelling the car and steering it. This tends to eat your front tires very quickly. For good FFs look to Honda. They generally aren't any good, but with a good set up, they can be alright.

Rear Wheel Drive (RWD): Engine in the front, drive wheels in the back, and depending on the car the transmission can be in the front or the back. Some of these cars can have perfect weight balance (Honda S2000), and others are front bias. These cars will tend to oversteer coming out of corners because if your rear tires (your drive wheels) brake traction, your rear end will try to follow the front of your car, or swap ends on you. Some of them might understeer entering corners because all the weight in the front of the car. Generally handle well, and with decent can handle great to terrific.

Mid Engine (MR): These cars have the engine right behind the drivers seat, along with the transmission, and the drive wheels are at the back. In some cars this causes a perfect weight distribution, in others it causes a rearward weight bias. The oversteer exiting corners in MRs can be worse than in RWDs because everything is in the back-ish end of the car. Entering corners can get you some understeer, because again your engine and transmission is in the rear causing less front wheel grip. Generally these cars handle very well, and with a setup can be terrific.

All Wheel Drive (AWD): These cars have the engine, and transmission in the front, and as the name says, all four of the wheels propel the car. You will experience some amount of understeer with these cars both entering, and exiting, corners because of the extra traction you gain from the AWD systems, and because of the front heavy weight distribution. Generally handle ok, need a proper set up in GT5 to handle well.

Mid Engine All Wheel Drive (MAWD): Generally only seen only really seen on European supercars, it has the engine, and transmission in the middle, with power going to all four wheels. I find that these cars will understeer going into a corner, because of the extra traction given to them from the AWD system, and oversteer during exit, because of the rear weight bias. These cars can be very wild to drive, but with a good tune can drive with the best.

Rear Engine, Rear Wheel Drive (RR): In these cars the engine is mounted behind the rear axle, and the transmission just over the rear axle, with your drive wheels at the rear. These cars can understeer into a corner because of lack of front grip, and will always oversteer coming out because the car is so unbalanced to the rear (think exact opposite of FF). These cars are very hard to control, but with a proper set up can be decent.

Hope this helps.
 
Last edited:
In FR I finish breaking right before the turn and then throttle the whole way through the corner. I see a lot of people just letting off the gas or breaking and they can't corner as fast. It is kind of counter intuitive but you need throttle through the corner for optimal traction. This will be a true test of your ability when you are driving the big boys as it's easy to give it too much throttle and accomplish exactly the opposite of what you want. Throttle control separates the men from the boys.
 
freedomweasel
Weight transfer. You can (and should) google for more details, but the short, short story is:

When you hit the gas, the weight of the car shifts to the rear wheels, when you brake or let off the gas the weight hits the front tires, giving them more grip and lightens the rear. Too much grip at the front will give you too much steering input, causing oversteer.

This should happen to FWD cars as well, but sadly GT doesn't do a great job with it.

edit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lift-off_oversteer that should have some extra info.

I already knew about weight trasnfer, but i am still confused. when braking, rear loses grip. MR has its weight more at rear then FR, so it should be more stable, right? But i drove FR, a chromeline M3 and it does not produce oversteer like the lotus I mentioned did. Is it because it is stock?
 
Go hit up the license tests. They will give you a balanced array of drivetrains to learn on. That's really the best way. Different types of corners with different power levels and drivetrains.
 
I already knew about weight trasnfer, but i am still confused. when braking, rear loses grip. MR has its weight more at rear then FR, so it should be more stable, right? But i drove FR, a chromeline M3 and it does not produce oversteer like the lotus I mentioned did. Is it because it is stock?

Some of it is because of the physics engine not always working properly, see my mention of not being able to get oversteer on a FWD car compared to me being able to induce oversteer in my GTI on actual asphalt.

Some of it is also that mid-engined cars rotate easier because the weight is more centralized. There's a fancy word for that, gimmie a minute to go google a bit. :)

http://www.drivingfast.net/track/engine-driveline.htm Check that out, it looks like it has some useful information for you. The fancy term is "moment of inertia".
 
Last edited:
FF cars understeer slightly, for reasons which in my head contradict themselves. I'll report back when I've solved why. Im sure it has something to do with the differential.

It has to do with two things. 1) All the weight is over the fronts and thats a lot for two tires to handle. 2)The fact that the front is responsible for steering input, acceleration and breaking they typically don't have much left for cornering. Trail breaking is huge for FF and if you start to lose it ease off the throttle.
 
I already knew about weight trasnfer, but i am still confused. when braking, rear loses grip. MR has its weight more at rear then FR, so it should be more stable, right? But i drove FR, a chromeline M3 and it does not produce oversteer like the lotus I mentioned did. Is it because it is stock?

You can induce weight transfer by letting off the throttle as well and it's a lot less drastic. Like the guy said above the lotus doesn't behave like I bet it would in real life. But the lotus is very tough to get balanced for the turn so the smoother you can be with that the better.
 
Back