Early Look: 2007 Ford Falcon

[YSSMAN]

Ford could easily rip the S-197 chassis out from beneath the Mustang to build a new sedan, and it is just one more thing to add to the "I can't belive that company is so stupid" list. Even if it isn't much larger than the Fusion I belive they could sell quite a few, and even then I think they could do without an IRS just as they did with the Mustang.

The most important thing is that Ford needs to give the people, in particular the Ford fans, what they want in order to be successful as a company. Unfortunately dumbass Bill Ford Jr. is too worried about his Hybrid and crossover projects (added to that playing catch-up to GM on E85 capability) to do what people want him to do, and he is slowly killing Ford (IMO).

We'll see what happens, as Ford has said they have a new RWD platform in the works for the US market... I'm sure they don't want to miss out on the RWD craze going on with DCX and GM, as technology has finially caught up, and there really isn't any reason not to go RWD these days.

 

[Jay]

this is YOUR hot ford we're talking about.

Our hot Ford? Whats 'hot' about it? Its just a our large segement family car, that they happen to make nicer faster versions of it. Much like an Impala, but I wouldn't call a general Impala a "Hot chevy".

 

[Jim Prower]

THis car = a bit conservative, especially from Front. however....let's see the GT and other high-performance models, first.

 

[Sniffs]

Viper: dude, up here, falcon was the pre mustang hottie (correct me on this, Yss). the local Supermarket chain owner has a customized drag race mercury version (Comet), and it's been covered in a car mag that I intend to have the fizelles sign if i ever get a chance

heh. impala's WERE a "hot Chevy"...the rear drive yaght versions, anyway.

Yss: remember, he's about the only american brain that isn't thinking either power or style right now, but about keeping his ass out of the frying pan by going for the logical scroogemobile route. we gotta have someone in the US that thinks of saving the american car lines from extinction. after all, pretty soon, with the way oil's going...there's gonna be nothing BUT a to B transportation . it's gonna suck, but...

Viper: have a look at the hot NON muscle car segments, too. which includes our one shot boxer engine small coupe, etc. from the General in the early 60's

 

[~Sp33~]

.... we gotta have someone in the US that thinks of saving the american car lines from extinction...

American cars have lines now? .. And here i was thinking that they where designed using the rectangle tool


haha just jokin'

 

[YSSMAN]

Yes, the Falcon gave way to the Mustang in the mid-'60s, the Falcon donating many of it's mechanical bits and pieces to the new "compact" coupe. The Falcon generally isn't considered a success by most Ford fans here in the US, but from what I understand, it is still one of the most legendary models in Australia for Ford.

On my talks about Billy Ford: He may be taking the conservative route here, but Ford still bases far too many of it's sales on trucks, not cars, unlike GM. Could it be a reason why Ford was so easily overtaken by Toyota last month? Ford's problem is that they only have two icons in their entire lineup (Ford, Mercury, Lincoln) that still sell well... The Mustang and the F-150.

Billy Ford needs to realise that people want cars, AMERICAN cars that project AMERICAN ideas both inside and out. Thankfully the Aussies show many of the same ideas as we do when it comes to cars, so why not tap their development efforts? Large RWD cars still get similar MPG ratings compared to their FWD compeditors, so why not go RWD like the public demands?

If anything, Billy Ford is going to be the one that kills an American company. GM and DCX have both gone into "survival mode" unlike Ford, as they are still playing around with stupid cross-developed ideas from Mazda and Volvo. Not changing their business plan quickly enough is going to cause problems at Ford, they are going to need to get to it before they drop further behind GM and Toyota.

 

[~Sp33~]

Could it be a reason why Ford was so easily overtaken by Toyota last month?

Toyotas has been ahead of ford for well over a year here. Toyota last year also outsold GM holden. Corollas are the equivelent of hotcakes, as are the ugly ass camry. Last month our top ten car sales consisted of:

1) Toyota corolla with 5912 units sold
2) Holden Commodore with 5014 units sold
3) Ford Falcon with 4358 units sold
4) Toyota Yaris with 2609 units sold
5) Toyota Camry with 2392 units sold
6) Ford territory with 2225 units sold
7) Mazda 3 with 2121 units sold
8) Holden Astra with 1996 units sold
9) Hyundai Getz with 1964 units sold
10) Honda civic with 1717 units sold

As you can see, toyota is tottaly creaming the market, and with a great ( tho dull) product, great price, great features... Why shouldnt they be? Ford realy need to get their act together, but over here its not nearly as much of a problem as Mitusbishi Australia. Who sold the same magna ( your galant? or diamonte or something like that) for 12 years. Pretty poor idea considering it was expected to be the strongest seller, it was recently replaced by the 380, which looks great and drives good but their reputation for building old outdated cars is starting to be a joke.

 

[Jay]

Viper: dude, up here, falcon was the pre mustang hottie (correct me on this, Yss). the local Supermarket chain owner has a customized drag race mercury version (Comet), and it's been covered in a car mag that I intend to have the fizelles sign if i ever get a chance

heh. impala's WERE a "hot Chevy"...the rear drive yaght versions, anyway.

I doesn't matter what the Falcon was to you, it's not your car, its our family car, in our family car market. You remembering fond memory's of a fast hot Falcon is irrelevant. There is so many High performance cars on the Market these days turning the Australian Falcon just into some retro hot machine would be bad for Ford Australia which the Family car Falcon sells well and makes good profit. Back in the 60's especially in Australia there was not all that many fast models available so when Ford made the Falcon GT is was rememberable and left an impression, which people still rave on about now.


What was hot about Impala's? Like you said they were "yaght"'s, They were a nice Family car of the time and yes they made some hot versions but thats like saying the Lancer is hot because of the Evolution.


BTW here is one of the last American Falcons,

I certainly wouldn't call that a 'hottie', our Australian models of the same cars were hotter. Whats the 'hottest' factory Falcon model the US produced?

Viper: have a look at the hot NON muscle car segments, too. which includes our one shot boxer engine small coupe, etc. from the General in the early 60's

What has Corvair got to do with Falcon?

The first Falcons were smaller and sportier but then Ford US turned in into a larger 4 door car like the wagon above and we continued from there. When you think of Falcon you need to forget the small Falcons from the early 60's, they are history. If Ford US wants to revive the Falcon as a small sportier car then fine, but they wont be getting it from Australia.

Ford realy need to get their act together, but over here its not nearly as much of a problem as Mitusbishi Australia. Who sold the same magna ( your galant? or diamonte or something like that) for 12 years.

12 years? They sold the same platform Magna since late 1996 and replaced it 2005, thats 9 years.

Ford sold its current platformed Falcon since 1998 and wont have a replacement until roughly 2008 thats 10 years.

Holden started selling the just replaced Omega platformed Commodore in 1998 and has just replaced it now in 2006, 8 years. They are/were all getting old, Ford is leaving it the longest.

 

[YSSMAN]

The last "hot" Ford Falcon came by in 1970 as a Torino rip-off, the only good thing about her was the fact you could order the 429 Cobra-Jet V8. It was replaced by the Maverick, and never seen again.

As for the Impala, it was quite the car for quite a long time at Chevrolet. Although the origional 1958 model was just an upscale model from the classic Bel Air, it was the Impala SS of the '60s and '90s that made the car the legend that it is today. The Impala SS was the reason why my family made a full comitment to Chevrolet in 1962 and have yet to go back to Chrysler or Ford since. Of course the greatest Impala SS was argueably the SS 427 models of the later '60s, but it was the '94-'96 Impala SS that has kept the fans begging for GM to return the car back to RWD.

^ Thats the reason why so many GM fanboys are obsessed with the return of the RWD Impala. It is still argueably one of the best cars GM has built in the past 20 years, easily one of the top three here in North America. Thats also the reason why there was so much interest from Americans in the old VZ Commodore SS, it was like seeing what you want, but knowing you can't have it.

---

So yes, I think you and I (Viper) can agree that the Falcon isn't quite what hes looking for. As long as we get a nice RWD sedan that has the capability of becoming a midsize coupe I would think Ford is doing the right thing... Although I'd choose to call it the Galaxie here long before the Falcon, but thats just me...

 

[~Sp33~]

12 years? They sold the same platform Magna since late 1996 and replaced it 2005, thats 9 years.

Ford sold its current platformed Falcon since 1998 and wont have a replacement until roughly 2008 thats 10 years.

Holden started selling the just replaced Omega platformed Commodore in 1998 and has just replaced it now in 2006, 8 years. They are/were all getting old, Ford is leaving it the longest.

I was sure it was late 95 we started getting that model, i also thought that it was still getting sold as that model elsewhere.. hmm.

Ford released the AU in 98, and i would definately call the BA a replacement, it had a completely refurbished interior, new engines, heavily revised front and rear, and stronger internals which boosted crash-safety ratings.
before:

after:

So really, ford havent been using the 'same' model for very long at all. Which cant be said for the magna, which got new headlights which looked hideous, and retained the same interior. It was virtually the same car. Holden on the other hand, definately have kept their model out for too long, but like ford have progressed it so thoroughly that they can easily get away with it. Their engines are always upgrading, styling seems to be tweaked every year or two and although this tottaly smashes its resale ratings, atleast it keeps its image fresh.

 

[Jay]

I was sure it was late 95 we started getting that model, i also thought that it was still getting sold as that model elsewhere.. hmm.

Ford released the AU in 98, and i would definately call the BA a replacement, it had a completely refurbished interior, new engines, heavily revised front and rear, and stronger internals which boosted crash-safety ratings.
before:

after:

So really, ford havent been using the 'same' model for very long at all. Which cant be said for the magna, which got new headlights which looked hideous, and retained the same interior. It was virtually the same car. Holden on the other hand, definately have kept their model out for too long, but like ford have progressed it so thoroughly that they can easily get away with it. Their engines are always upgrading, styling seems to be tweaked every year or two and although this tottaly smashes its resale ratings, atleast it keeps its image fresh.

Don't let the Ford facelift fool you

It's the same car, which they had to make look better because the AU was a bit of a flop. check the doors, roofline, windows, floorpan etc if you want to see the AU in BA. I do admit they did ovehaul the car but my point is it is stll the same platform with new wrapping, probably fools most people but not me.

Anyway Ford hardly tweak any styling unless they have to, just look at AU series I,II,III, very very similar while Holden only does two series per restyle.

Look at the difference between BA, BA MkII, BF, BF MkII, once again they look very very similar, thats four series of the same crap.

 

[~Sp33~]

i know that they kept the same shell, but i reckon that the restyle was more then substantial enough to call it a new model. even the doors and roofline where re-tapered, i dont think any running components where kept in the change from AU - BA. engine, suspension, transmission, full interior haul... I think the ford focus with its 5 cylindar has more in common with volvo then the AU does to the BA.

 

[JCE]

I don't care what anyone says, I am loving the Falcon. I wish it would get over here in the states with the range of engine choices the Aussies get. Keep the Crown vic for Police and Fire depts but give the public this Falcon.

I just can't see how anyone says this is "boring" or "ugly":

 

[Jay]

i know that they kept the same shell, but i reckon that the restyle was more then substantial enough to call it a new model. even the doors and roofline where re-tapered, i dont think any running components where kept in the change from AU - BA. engine, suspension, transmission, full interior haul... I think the ford focus with its 5 cylindar has more in common with volvo then the AU does to the BA.

The BF 6 cylinder engines roots goes back to the 1950's (I even read somewhere the blocks still have some of the same castings), the AU I6 and the BA I6 is pretty much the same engine except the BA has been developed further with DOHC, it's not an all new engine (yes I know the V8 is new for Falcon). and All the changes have been in the same platform/chassis.

AU series I-II-III, BA Mk I-II, BF Mk I-II all have the same doors, roofline and other 'unseen' parts, they are not changed. As far as I know the rest of the drive train (Gearbox, diff) are the same or very similar, except recently I know Ford have offered some new transmissions like the 6 speed auto.

Do you have a link of your sources on the changes that you say? I am genuinely interested in the technical differences with suspension and drivetrain.

What Ford did with the BA is spent bundles on improving on what they had instead of making a new model from scratch (which the government helped finance) this is the point I am getting at. I haven't done a lot of traveling in a AU series II XR8 (220kw) and everytime I see a BA-BF I see the same AU in there, and thats why I never think of the BA-BF being a all new model.

Holden spent 1 billion dollars developing the Zeta platform and VE Commodore, Ford spend 500million on the BA, they saved a lot of money using the same platform.



Anywho a wiki quote

The AU — actually developed under the code name "EA169" — had Ford's New Edge design style

substantial improvements were made to allow the BA — also officially part of the "EA169" platform — to compete well against the Commodore.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Falcon


Whatever the case its opinion, you think of it as a all new model, I do not.

 

[~Sp33~]

I subscribe to WHEELS magazine, has alot of great info in there. I know that the BA was sitting on the same platform as well, but considering ford australia was starting to lose money i think overhauling the car was a wise move, considering the huge difference it made. All australian magazines went from hating it to loving it. But sales where already hurt by the AU.

I realy cant be bothered searchin through my archives of magazines (ive been subscribed since '97) to look for quotes, but if you find an archive online it would be a great read 👍 . I remember them going on and on about the differences between au and BA. Mostly what they hated in the AU and how it had been replaced in the BA lol. MOTOR magazine also hailed the improvements which included the base model XT getting a V8.

Was just havin a look at wikipedia too, it also says that the ford territory was based on the EA169 platform too. Which i gather was a very flexible chassis to produce an AWD SUV.

Also another quote from wiki

BA brought the new Barra engines to the Falcon range

The only engines that where carried over where the DOHC engines, which was given a new DOHC variable valve timed head.

 

[Jay]

Was just havin a look at wikipedia too, it also says that the ford territory was based on the EA169 platform too. Which i gather was a very flexible chassis to produce an AWD SUV.

Yeah I knew the Territory was based on the EA169 platform aswell, so much more cost effective that way, when it was first released I sat in one at a Motorshow and I looked forward and with the interior it was like I was sitting in a BA. I'm just glad it doesn't look at all like the Falcon EA169's. I am suprised it took Ford so long to make the Turbo model as it was so easily transfered from the Falcon.

Also another quote from wiki
Quote:
Originally Posted by wikipedia
BA brought the new Barra engines to the Falcon range

The only engines that where carried over where the DOHC engines, which was given a new DOHC variable valve timed head.

Yeah thats why I said above in my post

BA has been developed further with DOHC, it's not an all new engine (yes I know the V8 is new for Falcon).

'the V8' referring to the Barra and Boss.

 

[~Sp33~]

i was emphasising the "only". also i found when you look @ the mitsubishi diamonte it started in 1995 not 1996.

Also, i cant remember what we where debating about the falcon lol.

 

[JohnBM01]

I used to dislike the newer designs of the Falcon lineup in Australia compared to some of the early 2000-spec Falcons. I've grown a fondness of recent Falcons. It does look a bit chubby up front. I like this car. I've always said that these Australian cars are pretty modest in design and actually quite appealing. Only thing is, most of them have some great horsepower. It's why I think the "Australian V8 Supercar" namesake actually applies since they look fairly modest until you talk about their horsepower.

Time to give this thing some love. And out of 100%, I'll present the newer Falcon with 90% love. Its chances in America are only if people don't think of the forthcoming Australian-spec Falcon as something similar to the Pontiac GTO in regards to the Holden Monaro. People said the newer GTO lacked spirit and looked plain. Hell, looks better than most of the other crap at the time. I've always said that Australian cars can look very modest until you consider that many of the cars can be quite powerful. Some bigtime spunk will be in Ford's lineup if brought over to the States. I'm just not sure if people here will have the same respect for the Aussie Falcons as I do. It's usually been "if everyone hates it, then I probably love it," or "if everyone loves it, then I'll probably hate it." I'd give this car a BIG chance in the States in a few years. But will it be as much of a hit in America and as respected as they are in Australia?

 

[Sniffs]

Viper: i meant, actually, the Corvair Monza. there's more to US cool than muscle is what i meant *shrugs*
thanks for the info on the bodies
as far as I'm concerned, an american facelift is considered a model change even if the platform and crap is the same underneath (unless it's REALLY obvious...like the difference between the US's 83 and 88 ranger...which was a nose job, and, I believe, when the fox body mustang was given composite lamps for a nose)

it just...looks like a blinkin Lincoln...from the eighties (the new ver)

oh, to all the aussies...my apologies. just talk mr ford into the Ute without slapping a "ranchero" label on it

 

[SkylineObsession]

The 2007 Falcon isn't 'new' it is just a facelift. And i still love the look of the BA and BF Falcons, especially the ones in the first post with the new lower lip bit on the front headlights.