FM4- One for the casuals?

[Gallinho]

So, I've been playing fm4 since release and have to say it's a whole lot of fun. I've really enjoyed moving up the leaderboards in rivals and buying setups from the storefront ect
But as I'm working my way through the event list I'm finding that as far as the racing goes there's not a great deal of depth, I mean most of the manufacturer events are run on club circuits or test tracks and the events feel 'throw away' at best.
Also as I look through the event list as a whole there's not really too much to get excited about, I mean, by the time I've completed all events I will have never:

A) made 1 pitstop
B) raced more than 9 laps in any race
C) done 1 full lap of nordschliefe
D) raced one series or championship

On that last point, I don't understand why you can't run championships as a series with a leaderboard with driver standings ect. I think the international tour (7 events) and world championship (12 events) would have been perfect for this, you could do all events as an overall series or do them individually if u wanted to gold each event, like in gt5.

I can understand them not including night racing and weather but to not have enduro's or the ability to choose the amount of laps is pretty weak. I find that the shortness of races ,especially when racing club circuits, means that the tracks seem to repeat themselves quickly.
Why couldn't they give us the option to choose the amount of laps we want to run in the difficulty settings?
I know people say 'set up a lobby with only Ai, blah blah blah" but the physics are horrible online, the Ai cars oscilate all over the track and what If my connection drops out after 45 laps?

The game just seems to pander to the casual gamer far too much and has a 'quick race here, quick race there' mentality, world tour and top gear bowling sums this up for me.
I just wish they gave us the option to run longer races, make pitstops and do proper championships instead of the stupid 2 heat things in world champ events.Bcoz if they did allow us to do that this would be one of my favourite racers of all time!

 

[StoneyNUFC]

I completely agree, Sure i remember reading a statement from them or could of just been by someone guessing on the fm.net forums lol that they left out endurance races because not many people on FM3 did them and just hired a driver to do it. I don't see the problem with having that choice again.

 

[omgitsbees]

You can do this stuff in online races, but having it omitted from single player is a bit disappointing.

 

[UKMikey]

I set up a forty lap private race to get one of the achievements. It's tough driving a virtual car for half an hour with no way to scratch your nose. Offline endurance races would help with this.

 

[ShylockHolmes]

All the gamepad players complained too much in emails to T10 about hurting their dainty hands in the FM3 endurance races. The same people that laughed at those who could afford a good wheel like how a sim should be played.

 

[Gallinho]

All the gamepad players complained too much in emails to T10 about hurting their dainty hands in the FM3 endurance races. The same people that laughed at those who could afford a good wheel like how a sim should be played.

Thats another thing, i have the fanatec csr which is supposed to be the 'official wheel' for forza and cant use it on anything above 270 deg of sensitivity, which is apparently bcoz turn 10 was more focused on pad users and coded the steering sen for pads.
As for their hands hurting, why not just give us the option? The kids and pad users could do a 15 lap event and then in the difficulty settings have the option to increase the number of laps. that wouldnt be too hard to implement would it?

I set up a forty lap private race to get one of the achievements. It's tough driving a virtual car for half an hour with no way to scratch your nose. Offline endurance races would help with this.

lol, i didnt even think about that, it does make it a little bit more hardcore though!

 

[t.o.]

I set up a forty lap private race to get one of the achievements. It's tough driving a virtual car for half an hour with no way to scratch your nose. Offline endurance races would help with this.

lol, i didnt even think about that, it does make it a little bit more hardcore though!

That's the way I see it. You want sim well there it is. I've yet to see a race where around lap 20 the guy in 2nd pulls over, scratches their nose, walks next to a trackside fridge, grab some soda and chips, get backs in car, presses some magic "start" button and everyone carries on like they were frozen in time. lol

 

[ShylockHolmes]

Thats another thing, i have the fanatec csr which is supposed to be the 'official wheel' for forza and cant use it on anything above 270 deg of sensitivity, which is apparently bcoz turn 10 was more focused on pad users and coded the steering sen for pads.
As for their hands hurting, why not just give us the option? The kids and pad users could do a 15 lap event and then in the difficulty settings have the option to increase the number of laps. that wouldnt be too hard to implement would it?

That's because you're using your wheel to turn on the console. Turn on the console, then load FM4 then turn on the Fanatec wheel and 900° will work just fine. My wheel has been on 900° since FM4 came out.

 

[UKMikey]

That's the way I see it. You want sim well there it is. I've yet to see a race where around lap 20 the guy in 2nd pulls over, scratches their nose, walks next to a trackside fridge, grab some soda and chips, get backs in car, presses some magic "start" button and everyone carries on like they were frozen in time. lol

For an extra level of hardcore simulation, why not superglue the on button and the plug in the wall so you can't yank it out midway through a hundred lap race.

I can understand people complaining about something that's in previous versions of the game but has been removed for this one.

 

[t.o.]

For an extra level of hardcore simulation, why not superglue the on button and the plug in the wall so you can't yank it out midway through a hundred lap race.

I can understand people complaining about something that's in previous versions of the game but has been removed for this one.

I can too BUT if you're running a 40 lap race then run a 40 lap race. Not a 10, take a break watch your favorite sitcom, then 20 more, take another break get a snack and then 10 more. You didn't run a 40 lap race. You ran a 10 lap race. Stopped. Ran 20 lap race. Stopped. And then ran a 10 lap race. Which, to be honest, I couldn't back up that complaint in GT5 either. My only caveat is the game shouldn't have you racing any longer than is allowed by the governing bodies in real life racing AND in accordance to recommended gaming standards and EVEN THEN the cpu should take over your cars as if you switched drivers, or get a buddy to take the wheel for a while.

 

[UKMikey]

I also suggest unplugging the phone, smoke alarm and doorbell. You never know when that pesky real life is going to butt in.

There was a great feature in the original Geoff Crammond F1GP game whereby multiple players could control multiple cars by taking turns with the same joystick and the CPU took up the slack.

 

[Zoom!Zoom!]

I can too BUT if you're running a 40 lap race then run a 40 lap race. Not a 10, take a break watch your favorite sitcom, then 20 more, take another break get a snack and then 10 more. You didn't run a 40 lap race. You ran a 10 lap race. Stopped. Ran 20 lap race. Stopped. And then ran a 10 lap race. Which, to be honest, I couldn't back up that complaint in GT5 either. My only caveat is the game shouldn't have you racing any longer than is allowed by the governing bodies in real life racing AND in accordance to recommended gaming standards and EVEN THEN the cpu should take over your cars as if you switched drivers, or get a buddy to take the wheel for a while.

I don't follow your logic. If I run a 40 lap race and take a break at lap 10 then my car remains at the exact same location with the same tire wear and fuel. The main point of endurance races is not to sit on your bottom for 24 hours straight but it adds role playing/strategy element to the race. (a game is nothing like driving a real car anyways)

Ex: If I make a mistake at lap 10 it will have a long term effect on the rest of the race. Do I take risk of pushing my tires to make up position loss from that mistake or do I play it safe and try to hold my position?

 

[Gallinho]

if your playing forza 4 offline there is no lap 10 :-)

 

[hennessey86]

Pit stops and longer races do need to be added but without these feature it still doesnt make the game casual

 

[Zoom!Zoom!]

Pit stops and longer races do need to be added but without these feature it still doesnt make the game casual

The aim toward more casual gamers is the very reason they are missing. 2-5 lap races are mini-races which are very common in consoles titles like Shift, Gt5, Forza4, Dirt, etc. What did we get instead ... bowling?!
What's the point of Multi-class races with only 5-6 laps?

 

[bleurabbit7]

I myself would love to do a 2 hour race versus a 2 lap race. A 2-3 lap race on a very small track forces one to alter their driving (bump and cut) just to win the race. Now I don't have a steering wheel for my system yet, but I will deal with bruised thumbs for some endurance racing. That's how I roll.

 

[ShylockHolmes]

You'd have to be a casual to not notice you can set the laps yourself in online play where the real racing takes place. Of course all the casuals wouldn't notice, they'd be too busy getting knocked off the track by the slow AI cars.

 

[artboy76]

You'd have to be a casual to not notice you can set the laps yourself in online play where the real racing takes place. Of course all the casuals wouldn't notice, they'd be too busy getting knocked off the track by the slow AI cars.

If you mean by casual someone who has a life outside of a computer game, a wife, child and who showers regularly and takes exercise and has a job and even drives cars in real life on tracks...................then i guess that makes me a casual.


I find both your posts deliberately spikey and aggressive. Grow up, just cause your whole time is spent playing games, doesn't make you cool.....

 

[bleurabbit7]

Some of us can't play online at the moment and are stuck with short lap races.

 

[Gallinho]

You'd have to be a casual to not notice you can set the laps yourself in online play where the real racing takes place. Of course all the casuals wouldn't notice, they'd be too busy getting knocked off the track by the slow AI cars.

If you read my OP you would see that i said that i dont want to do long races online because the physics are awful and also what happens when my internet connection drops out? What about the people who havent got the internet?
Also if you consider the lobbies of forza to be where real racing takes place then you might want to take out an iracing subscription and then come back to me. The forza lobbies are on par with NFS lobbies and im not going anywhere near them until all the kids have dissapeared.

 

[Gallinho]

Pit stops and longer races do need to be added but without these feature it still doesnt make the game casual

Its not just the length of races but the length of tracks also. The amount of times you have to race club circuits or test tracks or shortened layouts of circuits is so annoying!!!! Racing high powered cars around mugello club circuit for 3 laps, why not let us race the full track????? Do they think we can't handle it?

 

[ShylockHolmes]

If you mean by casual someone who has a life outside of a computer game, a wife, child and who showers regularly and takes exercise and has a job and even drives cars in real life on tracks...................then i guess that makes me a casual.


I find both your posts deliberately spikey and aggressive. Grow up, just cause your whole time is spent playing games, doesn't make you cool.....

No way, you have a job? You shower? You exercise? No wonder you don't have time to come up with a better insult then that. My whole life is spent playing games? Know what the first three letters of assumption are?

When I grow up I'm gonna shower , get a job and exercise! Maybe I can even become "cool" like the fonz!

If you read my OP you would see that i said that i dont want to do long races online because the physics are awful and also what happens when my internet connection drops out? What about the people who havent got the internet?
Also if you consider the lobbies of forza to be where real racing takes place then you might want to take out an iracing subscription and then come back to me. The forza lobbies are on par with NFS lobbies and im not going anywhere near them until all the kids have dissapeared.

Nah, I'm not into subscription based games. I have a thing called a "friends list" and no kids are on it. Give it some research! As for NFS I don't touch crap like that, look at my gamertag.

 

[Gallinho]

Nah, I'm not into subscription based games. I have a thing called a "friends list" and no kids are on it. Give it some research! As for NFS I don't touch crap like that, look at my gamertag.

lol nice one, so no comment about how i said about not wanting to do long races online because of poor physics and the line dropping out, or the people without internet not being able to to longer races with the need to pit stop?
Just more high quality sarcasm, thanks for posting.

 

[Luminis]

Sorry dudes, but this thread is so full of BS it's not even funny.

Controller or wheel isn't an indicator of whether you're a casual or not, and neither is your XBL subscription. Not even the amount of laps you're racing should be an indicator of whether you're a casual gamer or not. It's about how competitive you are, and about how seriously you're approaching the game.

Trust me, I know some controller users, who are playing offline 99.5% of the time who are being more hardcore about FM than most of the people who do endurance races online.

Anyways, I would appreciate longer races in the single player mode. Not necessarily endurance stuff, but races that last for 20 minutes or so, where you can actually race, instead of having to blast past the AI. Because, as it is, you have to win withint a very short period of time...

 

[Gallinho]

I'm not questioning who's a casual gamer or who's not, people play the game different ways and thats cool but there's no denying that turn 10 ha ve aimed this game squarely at the more casual racer this time, from the way the game practically throws money and cars at you to knocking down bowling pins in your career. I mean for any kind of semi serious racer 'world tour' is a complete write off posing no challenge whatsoever, and the event list is populated by events on shortened circuits with not many laps.

I dont mind them keeping the game easy and fun so everyone can stay interested, but why not give the rest of us something to get our teeth into? Also if your going to have a $250 fanatec wheel (more with pedals) as the official wheel for forza motorsport shouldnt you think about the sort of people who are going to buy that wheel (namely more serious racers) and put content in the game they might want, aswell as programming the game to work properly with that wheel?

 

[Zoom!Zoom!]

Sorry dudes, but this thread is so full of BS it's not even funny.

Controller or wheel isn't an indicator of whether you're a casual or not, ....

Who is more likely to spend up to $500 on a ffb wheel, someone who occasionally races Mario Kart and NFS or someone who heavily races sims like Iracing? Who is more likely to run 24hour endurance races, hardcore racer with a wheel or a casual gamer with a controller?
It may not to the only indicator but it's a good one.

 

[bleurabbit7]

Just because a player uses a controller does not make them a 'casual gamer'. I use a controller and I am very heavy into racing games. Hell, I probably play more than some steering wheel players. I can't go out and dump $500 on a steering wheel. But to name players as 'casual gamers' does not make you better than them because you play with a steering wheel.

This thread was started to express one's feelings about playing offline. The lack of challenge, length of races, full use of some tracks, and everything from credits to vehicles are practically handed to you. This type of gameplay isn't good enough and interest can be lost. Therefore one HAS to go online for the challenges and endurances but the physics are reduced, AI's ocilating and of course the risk of connection being lost.

This thread has taken a wrong turn. IMO

 

[Killer46]

Therefore one HAS to go online for the challenges and endurances but the physics are reduced

Um, what?

 

[Luminis]

Who is more likely to spend up to $500 on a ffb wheel, someone who occasionally races Mario Kart and NFS or someone who heavily races sims like Iracing?

Mostly the guy who's got the money to spare. And, at least judging by the folks I know in person, it's usually guys who are still living in their parents' basement who are able to afford that kind of gaming equipment. The rest of us is pressed hard enough to pay the rent and food and stuff.

See, I can throw some stereotypes around, too... But, honestly, this is just like judging how 'hardcore' a Counterstrike or StarCraft player is, based on his computer. Some of us just aren't able to just spend a grand on gaming equipment. That doesn't say anything about how seriously a person is taking the game, too.

The lack of challenge, length of races, full use of some tracks, and everything from credits to vehicles are practically handed to you.

This is something I'm torn about. First, I like the fact that the game is throwing money and cars at you. There's still the sense of acquiring stuff, but it's a lot let tedious than it could've been. That sort of grinding doesn't make the game more challenging, it just means you have to sink lots of time into it to get anywhere.

I agree with the races, though. The AI's pace is one thing, but I dislike the very short races. Mostly because it feels so very unnatural. It's just weird that you've got to pass seven other drivers in three minutes, or something like that.

Therefore one HAS to go online for the challenges and endurances but the physics are reduced, AI's ocilating and of course the risk of connection being lost.

Wrong game, bro, wrong game

 

[Wolfe]

My current wheel is a Logitech G25 I bought for $250, and I've been on PC sims since Grand Prix Legends was new. My first experience with a gaming wheel was when my parents bought me a Thrustmaster for my 10th birthday. It had springy paddles on the back for the gas/brake, no pedal set or FFB, but I played the bajeezus out of games like The Need for Speed and Interstate '76. I've always had at least one gaming wheel since then, and I've gone through a few. The three sims currently on my hard drive are Live for Speed, rFactor, and Richard Burns Rally.

Obviously I'm just a casual console kiddie with my contemptible controller of newbie doom.

Honestly I've never played any console game that required, or even rewarded a wheel, and that's convenient with 360 games like 4za because my Logitech is incompatible anyway.

...but the physics are reduced

Gallinho kept saying this too. Dunno where you guys get that feeling while driving, but that's definitely false. And I haven't noticed any "oscillating AI," as you both mentioned.