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  • Thread starter Jimlaad43
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I think it a fair enough that he doesn't want to appear on the show at a weekend he was very ill on, it's just a shame that that was one of the main reasons for such a meltdown from the team that weekend. It seems like scapegoating but it's probably a fair request.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if Mercedes don't want it to see the light of day either. Five years of many faultless weekends. Why would any of them want their most horrendous weekend by far to be documented in that way, especially when they feel the documenting of the weekend had a hand in the disaster that it became.
 
MatskiMonk
When you consider his wage and lifestyle, which is effectively afforded to him by fans of the sport, I don't think anyone should give a **** what he wants.
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Because he hasn't earned a penny of it, has he?

Not like he has to sweat really, no one else wants to be an F1 driver at all...

Honestly, this is a weird thing to go at someone about. If he doesn't want the footage out, it shouldn't go out, regardless of his reasoning; the entire intrigue of the episode would hang on Lewis being under the weather and a crappy weekend I'm sure the whole team would sooner forget. When you're making a film of any kind, you should fully expect to have to chuck away a whole day's footage because someone walked through the shot, or some business didn't want to appear in the background, or whatever.

It'd take a very talented lawyer/producer to get Mercedes to sign a "we get to air it no matter what" type of agreement. It is not outside the realms of possibility however.
 
MaxAttack
Because he hasn't earned a penny of it, has he?

Not like he has to sweat really, no one else wants to be an F1 driver at all...

Honestly, this is a weird thing to go at someone about. If he doesn't want the footage out, it shouldn't go out, regardless of his reasoning; the entire intrigue of the episode would hang on Lewis being under the weather and a crappy weekend I'm sure the whole team would sooner forget. When you're making a film of any kind, you should fully expect to have to chuck away a whole day's footage because someone walked through the shot, or some business didn't want to appear in the background, or whatever.

It'd take a very talented lawyer/producer to get Mercedes to sign a "we get to air it no matter what" type of agreement. It is not outside the realms of possibility however.
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I've clearly misunderstood the scenario, I hadn't realised Netflix were just producing marketing material for one person. My mistake.

I'm surprised F1 makes any money since clearly they are not in control of any rights at their races.
 
MatskiMonk
I've clearly misunderstood the scenario, I hadn't realised Netflix were just producing marketing material for one person. My mistake.

I'm surprised F1 makes any money since clearly they are not in control of any rights at their races.
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Netflix are producing their own product for their own purposes (profit) BUT they are relying on the brand of F1 and the likenesses of everyone involved to do so, and that always means F1/The driver has final say as to what actually goes out.

the TV broadcast deal is an entirely different animal altogether; though you should bear in mind that if F1 was truly dissatisfied with the coverage, or it somehow showed things they didn't want out there, they would be shopping around for another contract as soon as possible.

There are reasons for these rules. It wouldn't be fair for Netflix to come film a whole year of F1, then edit together a 3 hour hitpiece movie that highlights everything bad about the sport and paints everyone in a terrible light and then just say "shouldn't have let us film then mate". It's important that F1 and any driver/engineer/coffee boy have the right to choose whether they're broadcast or not. If we didn't have this standard in place, anyone with a camera and a big enough budget could seriously damage a brand or career just because they decide they don't like someone. An extreme example, but that is basically why Lewis has the right to say no.

Making documentaries is a massive pain in the ass.
 
MaxAttack
Netflix are producing their own product for their own purposes (profit) BUT they are relying on the brand of F1 and the likenesses of everyone involved to do so, and that always means F1/The driver has final say as to what actually goes out.

the TV broadcast deal is an entirely different animal altogether; though you should bear in mind that if F1 was truly dissatisfied with the coverage, or it somehow showed things they didn't want out there, they would be shopping around for another contract as soon as possible.

There are reasons for these rules. It wouldn't be fair for Netflix to come film a whole year of F1, then edit together a 3 hour hitpiece movie that highlights everything bad about the sport and paints everyone in a terrible light and then just say "shouldn't have let us film then mate". It's important that F1 and any driver/engineer/coffee boy have the right to choose whether they're broadcast or not. If we didn't have this standard in place, anyone with a camera and a big enough budget could seriously damage a brand or career just because they decide they don't like someone. An extreme example, but that is basically why Lewis has the right to say no.

Making documentaries is a massive pain in the ass.
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Lewis is not F1. F1 should want to present a fair, true, and exciting depiction of the series, if whats being heralded as the best race of the season can't focus on the efforts of the outright winners of this, and the past few seasons - on the rare occasion they **** up... it's not a pain in the ass, it's a joke... it literally is no better than propaganda.

FWIW, I've only ever been involved with commissioning adverts, so I've not seen the documentary process first hand. I do like Stereoscreen's efforts - those particularly centred around BMW's - these would include not winning at the Nurburgring 24, not winning at Spa 24, and a segment about messing up a DTM championship based on one race.
 
MatskiMonk
Lewis is not F1. F1 should want to present a fair, true, and exciting depiction of the series, if whats being heralded as the best race of the season can't focus on the efforts of the outright winners of this, and the past few seasons - on the rare occasion they **** up... it's not a pain in the ass, it's a joke... it literally is no better than propaganda.

FWIW, I've only ever been involved with commissioning adverts, so I've not seen the documentary process first hand. I do like Stereoscreen's efforts - those particularly centred around BMW's - these would include not winning at the Nurburgring 24, not winning at Spa 24, and a segment about messing up a DTM championship based on one race.
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Lewis isn't F1, but he is Lewis Hamilton. F1 could approve, and Hamilton not, and it won't go out and vice versa.

What I can see happening is the F1 powers that be/ those responsible for the agreement with Netflix talking to Mercedes about allowing the episode to be made in the interest of continuity with the notion that the documentary is a net positive for F1 regardless of if it shows your best weekend or not. I would always prefer to see more behind the scenes stuff make it to air, but ultimately Lewis and the team have the right to say no and the producers will have to respect it.
 
MaxAttack
Lewis isn't F1, but he is Lewis Hamilton. F1 could approve, and Hamilton not, and it won't go out and vice versa.

What I can see happening is the F1 powers that be/ those responsible for the agreement with Netflix talking to Mercedes about allowing the episode to be made in the interest of continuity with the notion that the documentary is a net positive for F1 regardless of if it shows your best weekend or not. I would always prefer to see more behind the scenes stuff make it to air, but ultimately Lewis and the team have the right to say no and the producers will have to respect it.
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Hopefully Lewis and Mercedes will give the filmmakers the opportunity to maintain their own integrity then.
 
Apparently that quote you all + other F1 communities are freaking out about was doctored.

Via Reddit/Twitter



Actual quote: (for those who can't view Twitter)

Hamilton: "I don't think it was a distraction at all, I think they were really great.

I probably won't be in it much because I was sick the whole time and I won't allow them to release me [being] sick probably so I won't even be in it!"

EAufzQSXoAAq6jS


For some of you, Hamilton will still be some kind of diva loser, so who gives a damn? What a mess.
 
No, still gives pretty much the same idea. He was feeling sick and didn't want that shown so he "won't allow it". Who cares if you were sick, we just want to see how the weekend went from inside Mercedes, for better or worse.
 
Jimlaad43
That second use of the word "sick" most likely means "vomiting". I doubt any of us want to see that...
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Pretty sure the cameraman doesn't follow him into the bathroom. We can get the idea from him being outside the door and Lewis making noises. That happens in documentaries a lot. He's a diva that only wants the best parts of him shown. Sorry Lewis, but you had a bad day and it happens to be the day that the world might see on more levels than just the public broadcast. Deal with it like a professional. It's called PR.
 
MatskiMonk
Hopefully Lewis and Mercedes will give the filmmakers the opportunity to maintain their own integrity then.
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It wouldn't be the first time a filmmaker has had to chuck hours of gold. The convention really exists to protect people - if you shoot in public and there's someone in your shot, even literally any Joe Public, that doesn't want to be in your film, it might not be possible to edit around them and you just have to blur them or bin the footage. Merc could go behind Hamilton's back and say hey, show the weekend, but don't show Lewis or play anything he said, but I imagine that making a pretty bad bit of TV and I'm sure all parties would rather the best footage possible or none at all.

Likeness rights aren't up for debate - but I understand the skepticism toward Lewis' reasons for invoking his right to deny the footage be put out, though I personally think "i felt like crap that weekend and don't really want it displayed for all to see" is a good enough reason, I can see why people would be disappointed and might think he had another motive.

I can see a situation where this episode is never broadcast and rumours abound for years about the missing footage where Lewis lost his rag and spat in his engineers' faces, even though if the episode is killed it will likely be purged from every SD card and hard drive, since all footage only exists digitally these days.

To the info posted while I was writing this reply: cameramen can be pretty nosy and I wouldn't be surprised if close-up footage of Hamilton blowing chunks exists, and you can understand why you wouldn't want that on Netflix.
 
DesertPenguin
No, still gives pretty much the same idea. He was feeling sick and didn't want that shown so he "won't allow it". Who cares if you were sick, we just want to see how the weekend went from inside Mercedes, for better or worse.
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So he's supposed to let them film him puking?

In that case every driver should also be ridiculed for not allowing footage of them taking a dump.
 
Why are we all taking Jimlaad's post as fact? None of us know specifically what he means when he says "sick"
 
DesertPenguin
Why are we all taking Jimlaad's post as fact? None of us know specifically what he means when he says "sick"
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Because the exact meaning of "sick" is irrelevant in this instance. He could have puking, squatting on a toilet or in bed curled in the fetal position. None of those specific things really have any affect that cant be accomplished by just mentioning the fact Lewis wasn't feeling good at the time.
 
DesertPenguin
Pretty sure the cameraman doesn't follow him into the bathroom. We can get the idea from him being outside the door and Lewis making noises. That happens in documentaries a lot. He's a diva that only wants the best parts of him shown. Sorry Lewis, but you had a bad day and it happens to be the day that the world might see on more levels than just the public broadcast. Deal with it like a professional. It's called PR.
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You're trying too hard. It's like you're playing troll, but skating in between the lines of ******** and getting banned. You just haven't done any personal attacks, so I guess we have to deal with it.

Just a waste of screen space. Been a bit since I had to ignore someone in this forum.

Make yourself a Lewis Hamilton thread.
 
It was used as an excuse for not having something on film. I came up with a solution to that which would still work. To the point that it doesn't matter what he meant by sick, yea I agree. My point is that no matter what kind of sick it was, there are ways to have it on film without being grotesque and still getting the same message to the viewer. Therefore, him being sick is a crappy excuse. In my opinion. They could edit out the really bad bits and still convey the idea that he was sick. To scrap the whole episode seems childish.
 
DesertPenguin
It was used as an excuse for not having something on film. I came up with a solution to that which would still work. To the point that it doesn't matter what he meant by sick, yea I agree. My point is that no matter what kind of sick it was, there are ways to have it on film without being grotesque and still getting the same message to the viewer. Therefore, him being sick is a crappy excuse. In my opinion. They could edit out the really bad bits and still convey the idea that he was sick. To scrap the whole episode seems childish.
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I really am curious why you so adamantly want to see Lewis being sick? Because even a cameraman standing outside the door seems pointless since it's not like it was stress induced. It really would add nothing to the show and would actually seem pretty unprofessional. Than again, maybe they're aiming for the Jersey Shore crowd.

It really is starting to come off as you wanting a reason to ridicule or mock Lewis. People get sick and during that period they usually aren't their photogenic selves, deal with it.
 
MaxAttack
It wouldn't be the first time a filmmaker has had to chuck hours of gold. The convention really exists to protect people - if you shoot in public and there's someone in your shot, even literally any Joe Public, that doesn't want to be in your film, it might not be possible to edit around them and you just have to blur them or bin the footage.
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These things are not analogous, shooting in a GP is not the same as shooting in a public place. The biggest star of the sport not allowing you to broadcast a less than perfect weekend makes the premise a joke, it undermines everything.. and for what? He/they are still going to win the championships. "Still I rise".. from selected media that only paints me in a positive light. He's nearly as bad a role model as fallover football players.
 
Lewis being the perfect Lewis, yea anything to make him look fallible is pounced upon. That's kinda how that works when you're not a fan of someone. I imagine it's the same for someone that's not a Yankees fan in baseball. In that sport I'm the opposite. I love my Yankees and want nothing bad to happen to them. See how that works? It's completely irrational. But sports are also meaningless in the grand scheme of things. As long as we're all entertained in our own ways, it's a success right?
 
phillkillv2
You're trying too hard. It's like you're playing troll, but skating in between the lines of ******** and getting banned. You just haven't done any personal attacks, so I guess we have to deal with it.

Just a waste of screen space. Been a bit since I had to ignore someone in this forum.

Make yourself a Lewis Hamilton thread.
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The irony, you couldn't sound anymore peevish if you tried.
 
I don't think not wanting to be filmed either audibly or visibly throwing up and having it broadcast on the world stage is unique to Lewis, it's naturally quite shameful and embarrassing for a lot of people, assuming that is what he means specifically by "being sick".
 
DesertPenguin
No, still gives pretty much the same idea. He was feeling sick and didn't want that shown so he "won't allow it". Who cares if you were sick, we just want to see how the weekend went from inside Mercedes, for better or worse.
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Yeah, no. There's two parts of the sentence:

"I probably won't be in it much because I was sick the whole time"
and
"I won't allow them to release me [being] sick probably so I won't even be in it!"

In the first part Hamilton says he probably won't be in it much, due to his illness. In the second part he says probably won't allow any footage of him being sick to be released so he won't even be in it. If you think "sick" means "unwell" in both cases, then you must also think Hamilton is contradicting himself within a sentence - he can't not be in it and not be in it much.

The fact that he draws a line between the former sick limiting his presence and the latter sick precluding his presence demarcates the two states of sickness: being sick, the state of unwellness; and being sick, the state of vomiting (and a very common British term for it).

That means you can - and should - read his statement as follows:
"I probably won't be in it much because I was unwell the whole time, and I won't allow them to release me vomiting probably so I won't even be in it!"


Fun fact, in Britain "sick" can also be what you throw up, but I doubt Hamilton was referring to himself reverting to the state of a puddle of puke.
 
To anyone who is already a fan of Formula One, the documentary makers can hardly pull the wool over the viewers' eyes even if they are told to make Mercedes look favourable in some Orwellian act of directorship.

We all know how Mercedes' weekend went so any voice over culminating in a "...and Mercedes-Benz AMG Petronas had a great weekend at their home Grand Prix celebrating their XXXth anniversary." In fact, it would be far more fascinating and humanising anyway if they went with the Murray mantra of "anything can happen in Formula One and it usually does."

They might get more fans if their fallibility was exposed.
 

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