Fuel consumption

[Wits]

I agree with you. Driving agressively, whilst hitting the rev limit will heavily consume fuel, compared to road driving.

For a top speed run with a Bugatti Veyron, it will empty the tank in 15 minutes. I wonder how GT5 will simulate this...

And that fueltank of the Veyron is larger than 80 litres. Wondering how they implement the fueleconomy of the Veryon with the 80 litre fueltank tough. A race with more than a few laps would mean pitting in for refueling.

 

[supersub7]

When Top Gear tested the Ford GT around their test track, they got 4mpg.

If i remember correctly when they put the FQ400 round the track it came in at 3.5mpg.

 

[jotskis]

And that fueltank of the Veyron is larger than 80 litres. Wondering how they implement the fueleconomy of the Veryon with the 80 litre fueltank tough. A race with more than a few laps would mean pitting in for refueling.

Yeah but the veyron will not get to its high speed not even in nurburgring and thats why its should have more reasonable fuel consumption in races

 

[[UK] ANDYW]

That would be a completely wrong formula, sorry.
Fuel consumption depends mainly on how much power is used at a given moment, and for how long. External or internal factors (such as mileage, rpm, load, engine type, age, fuel type, atmospheric conditions, etc) can affect it in several ways.

Weight would be an indirect factor as the higher it is, the more the engine would be used at a high power output/load, resulting in increased consumption.

I wasnt giving an accurate mathmatical formula - I was just saying that you could get a credible idea of fuel economy by using Power & Weight..

i.e.
500 hp pulling 500kg will probably get 40mpg
500 hp pulling 2000kg will probably only get 10mpg

Why make it any more complex than that?

 

[Zuel]

I see a lot of good points as well silly ones, though all good points all based around carbureted and fuel injected motors. But one area now one has touched yet is the type of fuel. Ever ones points have been based on regular pump fuel not racing fuel. For example we get a car stock take it out on the track run it dry to get the lap count and mileage. Now was that run done on pump or race fuel? Change the oil and then run it dry again. Now was it done in the same matter as before pump or race? We have no clue if it was or not. Now we tune the car adding power gains from 25% to 60%. Engine ECU has been remapped to give of the right A/F mixture. Do two more runs in the same fashion as before. , Would we get a better fuel range yes. You also have to take in your driving still as well in this matter don’t forget.

The reason why this is so race fuel burns faster, cleaner and cooler than pump gas due to the lighter weight and higher Octane mix, The typical A/F mixture for standard engines is 14.7:1 (14kg fuel / 1kg Air). Some typical race fuel allows you to have your A/F 12.7:1 due to its spark mark and heat range. Now hoping that PD has taken this to mind we’ll see a number of different fuel range for the cars that have been modified in GT5.

Sorry Akira you did say fuel type..

It you want a better understanding on how it would work pick up a copy Bosch Fuel Injection & Engine Management. It helped me through school…

 

[profi]

The typical A/F mixture for standard engines is 14.7:1 (14kg fuel / 1kg Air).

Vice versa...

 

[GTJake]

Without an accurate fuel model the game, IMO, will be missing an important factor. Imagine a 24 hour endurance race with all cars on the same fuel model. Any element of strategy will be lost as similar fuel consumption will mean everyone pitting at similar times, discounting tire wear. However with PD I'm sure they will get it right or produce at least some sort of variation in the fuel model.

 

[shirakawaa]

It would be nice if in the final build we will be able to select different ECU settings for the general air/fuel ratio like this (to be unlocked for example with the "Racing ECU" upgrade):

Lean -> Less fuel consumption at the cost of decreased engine reliability (in GT5: faster engine wear/loss of power over time and use)
Normal
Rich -> Slightly more power at the cost of increased fuel consumption
Richer -> Increased engine reliability at the cost of noticeably increased fuel consumption and somewhat slightly less power than normal. Useful for highly tuned engines.

 

[Missed_the_Apex]

The typical A/F mixture for standard engines is 14.7:1 (14kg fuel / 1kg Air)

I'd have to agree with Profi, thats a tad on the rich side, haha.

 

[Zuel]

I'd have to agree with Profi, that's a tad on the rich side, ha ha.

Yes it may seem on the rich for a modified engine but not for a daily used car. You may have left out that factor. An engine that hasn’t been modified will use more fuel to get the same power out than a modified engine would. You also blow up that engine putting all that fuel in it. Plus you got to take in account the Octane of the fuel as well.

 

[Famine]

Yes it may seem on the rich for a modified engine but not for a daily used car. You may have left out that factor. An engine that hasn’t been modified will use more fuel to get the same power out than a modified engine would. You also blow up that engine putting all that fuel in it. Plus you got to take in account the Octane of the fuel as well.

They were pointing out that you said 14.7 fuel to 1 air. Stoichiometric ratio is 14.7 air to 1 fuel.

 

[Zuel]

They were pointing out that you said 14.7 fuel to 1 air. Stoichometric ratio is 14.7 air to 1 fuel.

Well we have a typo don't we.

 

[Famine]

That's life.

 

[RenesisEvo]

Then there's the question of diesels - the Audi R10 features, and I'd hope they're building on the presence of the 120d in GT4, by at least including a few more road cars without spark plugs.

 

[SgtWhitten]

I hope the fueling is part of the set up so we can adjust fuel levels for qualifying and then race etc. It would be great to set up your own pit strategies.

 

[analog]

Then there's the question of diesels - the Audi R10 features, and I'd hope they're building on the presence of the 120d in GT4, by at least including a few more road cars without spark plugs.

I also hope for some more diesel road cars somehow, I really liked the fact GT4 both had the petrol and diesel version of the 1-series.
Just loved the largely irrelevant inclusion of a diesel car in a videogame and actually enjoyed the diesel version ( though when tuned it sounded like a Scania truck which strangely added to the appeal for me at least ).
Maybe it's due to me driving diesel cars occasionally myself but mostly perhaps that diesel-powered cars have improved enormously over the last 10-15 years and play a significant role in Europe at least.
They're not sluggish like they used to be, even some performance models are diesel-powered these days, and they have their own unique character which are an acquired taste perhaps but at least add some variety.

 

[Neal]

The question is will the second hand diesels sound like London taxi cabs compared to the new ones?

 

[analog]

The question is will the second hand diesels sound like London taxi cabs compared to the new ones?

Actually I wouldn't mind it to be honest, actually I wouldn't mind a London taxi cab itself to be included.

 

[arseneH]

So may be for the internet game room, someone may host game with the following rule:

This is a fuel economy game:
Each of you will have one tank of fuel, no re-fuel is allowed. The one who first complete 10 laps of Nurburgring wins!

 

[Neal]

Actually I wouldn't mind it to be honest, actually I wouldn't mind a London taxi cab itself to be included.

I would be mildly disappointed if that wasn't the case, if there's a 2008 2.2D Avensis in the used car lot I'll be able to confirm if they got it right.

London taxi would be very cool, you could pretend to be Stephen Fry and hurl abuse at people when you cut them up

 

[analog]

London taxi would be very cool, you could pretend to be Stephen Fry and hurl abuse at people when you cut them up

Trouble is that when hurling abuse to people as eloquently as Mr Fry they probably regard it as a compliment...
A London taxi would be a nice addition wouldn't it? It's probably one of the most iconic cars recognised around the world ( add a yellow Checker cab or beige Berlin-taxi for competiton perhaps or a few dodgy mini-cabs with accurately replicated kebab stains on the backseat.....or not ).

 

[Neal]

Trouble is that when hurling abuse to people as eloquently as Mr Fry they probably regard it as a compliment...
A London taxi would be a nice addition wouldn't it? It's probably one of the most iconic cars recognised around the world ( add a yellow Checker cab or beige Berlin-taxi for competiton perhaps or a few dodgy mini-cabs with accurately replicated kebab stains on the backseat.....or not ).

And at 41.5mpg on the extra urban cycle for the 1,975 kg LTI TX4 the fuel consuption isn't too bad

 

[analog]

And at 41.5mpg on the extra urban cycle for the 1,975 kg LTI TX4 the fuel consuption isn't too bad

Returning on-topic ( sorry for going off ), hybrids anyone? Or fully electric cars ( how would that work anyway when pitting? ).

 

[Neal]

Returning on-topic ( sorry for going off ), hybrids anyone? Or fully electric cars ( how would that work anyway when pitting? ).

Discussing diesels is always related to fuel consumption is some way.


Quick charge solution for electric car pit stops 💡

 

[analog]

Quick charge solution for electric car pit stops 💡

Or....

( Why not? No practical concerns, apart from being perceived as unrealistic perhaps, in a videogame. Just make sure the extension cord is long enough )

 

[Zuel]

I’m going to get fired here if my boss catches me again. No I wont he’s a car lover too plus he’s on the west coast. Any way I was thinking, was there a picture with an ECU mapping chart on in the News area of GTP? I looked and I couldn’t find it. Wish I would have saved it before Jordan updated that part of the news.

 

[[UK] ANDYW]

Returning on-topic ( sorry for going off ), hybrids anyone? Or fully electric cars ( how would that work anyway when pitting? ).

Battery swaps?

I'm sure we could forgive Polyphony if it's just an instant-charge when going through the pits?

I remember seeing a technology where they 'charged' fluid, then it reacted with some kind of catalyst when injected into the battery reservoir... (I'll find a link and drop it in this post asap)

Perhaps this kind of modification will be a purchase-able item in the tuning area?!

 

[analog]

I'm sure we could forgive Polyphony if it's just an instant-charge when going through the pits?

Agree, a truthfully replicated hours long battery re-charge in the pit-area would be far more annoying and even unlikely and pointless in my view than the small price of inaccuracy paid to have an instant-charge or battery swaps, etc.

 

[Griffith500]

Battery swaps?

I'm sure we could forgive Polyphony if it's just an instant-charge when going through the pits?

I remember seeing a technology where they 'charged' fluid, then it reacted with some kind of catalyst when injected into the battery reservoir... (I'll find a link and drop it in this post asap)

Perhaps this kind of modification will be a purchase-able item in the tuning area?!

That is perfectly possible and far more sensible than dismantling the assembly to swap a whole battery pack out. Good work! 👍

Fuel economy is important, it's easily calculated from the current power being generated (assuming a certain efficiency of power generation from fuel, which may have to be standard across manufacturers for a given mixture - obviously "higher" for diesels...) so hopefully it'll add more depth to the experience, especially if we do see more diesel powered cars.

This could be tactical, e.g. buying certain "upgrades" that improve fuel economy in the lower rpm regions (Audi's FSI, among others, anyone?).

 

[MustangRyan]

So may be for the internet game room, someone may host game with the following rule:

This is a fuel economy game:
Each of you will have one tank of fuel, no re-fuel is allowed. The one who first complete 10 laps of Nurburgring wins!

That could be fun in a change-of-pace type of way. The big question is would your car roll to a stop when you ran out of gas, or would you be able to roll at ~25mph forever like in previous games? Imagine trying to go all out for 9 laps and then coasting around at 20mph for that last lap while a car that was two laps down was still running strong at his pace. The strategies could be pretty fun.