Fuel Question.

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VeDub6785

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if i need tires but have more then half my fuel left i dont get fuel and get it the next time i need tires. depneing ont he course/tires/car i can go 3 pits stops b4 i get fuel. now besides saving time in the pits does the game know that the car is lighter? IE makeing the car faster. can someone shed some light on this. thanks.
 
I have been watchn this race closly (Formula GT, New York) At my 1st pit stop i have about 2 bars over half. I dont refuel. The 2nd set of tires has set my fastest lap each time. The 1st set in the cycle with a full fuel load is consitantly .5 off the pace and cant get anywher near the fast lap. Each new fast lap has been on the 2nd set of tires and about 2 laps befor i pit. The tank has about 2-3 bars in it and the tires and yellow.

In a close race i woudl suggest not refueling unless you need to. This helps alot in the Formula GT races as all the cars are even the time you save in the pits and the faster lap times helps put your car out in front.

my fast lap is a 1.17.169 and the next fastest lap is a 1.19.431. my guess is that computer refuels every stop
 
wow, cos thats how i have been racing. to increase realisim. but it works, thats cool
im might actually to the F-GT races today
 
I agree with the absolutly not comment. I asked this question a while back in a thread called "fuel and weight ratio" or something like that. The result of that thread was NO. The game did not calculate fuel weight.

Actually, here's the link to that thread
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=59687&highlight=fuel+weight+ratio

There are also MANY other threads on this. Do a search and you shall see what has been said before.
 
i did an experiment round the test course about this like two, three months ago. results were inconclusive. as i went around and around, times were varying but that could have just as easily been attributed to slight inconsistencies in my driving line or tire wear as it could fuel weight.
 
well i have been paying attention to the difference in my cars perfomance on a full fuel load, half and nearly empty. and every fast lap the car sets is with less then 1/4 tank of gas. if the game knows how much fuel is in the car why not give the fuel a weight, it wouldnt be very complicated. During the Formula GT races on a full tank of gas all of the cars are with in a 1 sec of each other, you would expect this since everycar is the same. But after a few pit stops when i have figured out how much fuel i need to make it to the next stop, my car is at least 2sec a lap faster. My assumtion is the AI fills up at every stop makeing there cars heavier=slower.

At Infineon (my current race) the 5 AI cars have fast laps ranging from 1.16.409-1.15.769 but my fast lap is a 1.13.961. And have laped each car in the feild once. The difference between 2nd and 6th is less then 6sec. Since my car only uses about 25 units of fuel between pit stops, they dont even get there tanks half empty. I think this shows that the game knows the car is has lost weight.

The times are by my b-spec driver so ther was no cheating or anything like that.

edit: another thing. My 1st lap after my pit stop lap is significantly quicker then the the AI cars. I only put in 25 units of fuel. I dont see how my car could b that much faster then the other carsafter they pit, when both are on cold tires.

The advantage doesnt seem to show its self much on high speed courses (High Speeed Ring, Supr Speedway) Since all the cars have same top speed anyway. It saves time in the pits but not much on the track.
 
Oliver_Newton
I agree with the absolutly not comment. I asked this question a while back in a thread called "fuel and weight ratio" or something like that. The result of that thread was NO. The game did not calculate fuel weight.

Actually, here's the link to that thread
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=59687&highlight=fuel+weight+ratio

.
Click to expand...

I think you may have linked to the wrong thread - because that one has nothing more than a few peoples opinions...

Bring out some tests that we can all verify to prove what you are saying. Otherwise your words are just blowin' the wind.
 
Yeah...GT4 is unrealistic, but I'm pretty sure that PD's programmers wouldn't miss out on this... :lol: I mean, they bothered to include fuel usage in the first place, why not include a piece of code along the lines of "for every X amount fuel, add +1 lb."...?
 
Personally, I don't believe the loss of weight as fuel is used up is simulated in the game, but that's just my belief.

Anybody ever run out of gas though? I think I almost did like 2 hours into the 24 hours at la Sarthe I. For some reason my driver went around 8 laps and made it on the last liter if I remember correctly. The last notch on the fuel gauge went out near the end of the Mulsanne straight, I thought for sure he wasn't going to make it.
Sadly, I had to retire anyways since the R92CP started kicking my butt after that, my lap schedule got all messed up. I was using the Jaguar XJR-9.
 
I know we've talked about this before, but I'm too busy to search (at work).

Fuel is modelled in the weight. Given that full load weighs maybe 50kgs, the difference is not that obvious for heavier road cars or for high powered race cars. What PD does not seem to have modelled is WHERE that weight goes. Dynamic balance doesn't seem to change much whether on a full tank or on an empty tank. (I could be wrong). What does change is tire wear. On a near empty tank, B-Spec Bob will go about 1/2 to 1 lap more before activating the Pit light than on a near full tank, depending on how twisty the course is. A full tank exerts more lateral load on the car than an empty tank, but only very slightly.
 
yes less fuel gives better lap times and less tire wear. i have seen 1-3 laps depending on car set up on tires. i agree with the ai refueling every lap as i have noticed being much quicker at infinion like someone else said. its not always a huge difference but it can be if used right. even braking is helped a bit. this point can be seen in races like the miata enduro and the el capitan enduro.

as to what happens when you run out of fuel... HA! i've done it two times. the first in the f1 car at suzuka right before the pit so it wasnt a big deal. the other time though was in a ruf rgt and i had to drive about 10 miles around the nurburgring to get to the pits. what happens is you get speed limited to 50mph. its a real buzz kill having to do about only 4000 rpm that long.
 
Sleek Stratos
Anybody ever run out of gas though? I think I almost did like 2 hours into the 24 hours at la Sarthe I. For some reason my driver went around 8 laps and made it on the last liter if I remember correctly. The last notch on the fuel gauge went out near the end of the Mulsanne straight, I thought for sure he wasn't going to make it.
Sadly, I had to retire anyways since the R92CP started kicking my butt after that, my lap schedule got all messed up. I was using the Jaguar XJR-9.
Click to expand...
When you run out of gas, the car doesn't stop. If so, the top speed will be limited to 80 km/h.

Regards
the Interceptor
 
ok to show proof, doing the tokyo 60 lap enduro with the amg clk gtr race car on r3 tires i pitted first at the end of lap 8 with a best time of 1:28.630. on a lighter fuel load with the same r3 tires i turned in a fast lap of 1:26.110 and went an extra lap on he tires. thats a difference of 2.52 seconds.
 
I paid very close attention to this question during FGT Championship and I say low fuel indeed makes you (or at least your driver) go a tiny little bit longer on your tires. It's was maybe just half or quarter of a lap longer until "P" was activated by B-Spec.

BTW, I also have a story about running out of fuel: it was my first serious attempt on the Infineon Enduro. It was a damn tough race and due to my excitement I stopped the final refuelling process too soon, but I was in the lead. And then, believe it or not, I ran out of fuel in the last lap in the very last hairpin and the R92CP on fresh tires overtook me (on red tires)!!! One of the biggest mistakes I ever made in GT.
 
niky
What PD does not seem to have modelled is WHERE that weight goes. Dynamic balance doesn't seem to change much whether on a full tank or on an empty tank. (I could be wrong).
Click to expand...

I'm willing to bet you're right.... :) 👍
 
Wolfe2x7
I'm willing to bet you're right.... :) 👍
Click to expand...

I'll see you and raise you $20 on that bet. :dopey:

I'm going to try and see about this sometime. The cars that would be most affected dynamically would have to be the Alpines and the RUFs, or more than likely, sub 1000kg FFs. I feel, however, that PD had to put that weight as centered ballast for reasons of simplicity.

Here's a thought? What if it's just lumped together with ballast? And if you have your ballast all the way to one side but set at zero, every new load of fuel will make the car uncontrollable? :lol: ...unlikely, but a fun idea.
 
niky
I'll see you and raise you $20 on that bet. :dopey:

I'm going to try and see about this sometime. The cars that would be most affected dynamically would have to be the Alpines and the RUFs, or more than likely, sub 1000kg FFs. I feel, however, that PD had to put that weight as centered ballast for reasons of simplicity.
Click to expand...
Glad I'm not the only one wondering about this. I have been driving the Shelby Cobra 427 in single player (ie. without fuel being calculated) a lot lately, and I had a go on LAN with my dad today, where fuel was being calculated. I noticed that it wasn't as easy to drift, and it felt to me like the extra weight was behind the centre of gravity, moving the weight distribution backwards. Holding a long slide was more difficult, and I would spin the car more often (made it feel more like a ruf, basically :) ). My brother and dad have both been spending a lot of time recently in the 330i at the 'Ring in single player (fuel not being calculated). They both had a go on LAN today (fuel calculated of course), and both of them seemed to be having more trouble with oversteer than before, possibly suggesting that the weight distribution has moved backwards again.

Since this messing around on LAN, I have had a go with a couple of cars in different modes, to see if there has been the same difference due to fuel calculation, and I have noticed the same thing.

I'm not certain about this, but I am certain that I noticed a difference in handling between the two modes, and I thought the change in weight distribution would be a plausible explanation.
 
Depends where they're running single player. Is it in Sim or Arcade? In Sim vs. LAN, you still have to account for the handling difference between Arcade mode and Sim mode. If they play single player in Arcade, then it's likely mostly the fuel's fault.
 
niky
Depends where they're running single player. Is it in Sim or Arcade? In Sim vs. LAN, you still have to account for the handling difference between Arcade mode and Sim mode. If they play single player in Arcade, then it's likely mostly the fuel's fault.
Click to expand...
They were running single player in Sim mode. Having done some testing yesterday, I thought in LAN mode it ran the Sim mode physics. As it's in the arcade mode area, I was expecting it to be the arcade mode physics, but it didn't feel like it to me. But perhaps that's because of the fuel being modelled. I tried to find a link talking about the physics for LAN mode, but was unable to. I did notice the same difference when using fuel in sim vs no fuel in sim, so I agree, whether you're in arcade or sim, the fuel will probably have a similar effect.
 

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