FullDive Technology | Hyper-Advanced VR Discussion

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Evening ladies and jellybeans.

I haven't noticed a thread about this, nor have I read anything about it on the forums (had a quick search, found nothing except stuff going on about Sword Art Online), so I figured I'd make a thread.

FullDive technology, as I'm coining it, and as it was coined in SAO, is a consciousness based hyper-advanced Virtual Reality system. Your mind functions, feelings, movements, emotions, and receptors, are wirelessly monitored and translated into a Brain-Computer Interface (BCI). This allows the conscious or unconscious mind to exist within a real-space reality, effectively, within a computer. Sword Art Online is the finest of the examples of this technology, which does and will exist within the next half decade. This is not just typical anime lunacy.

This technology has fascinated me enough to start research and development into it. In this thread I encourage you all to discuss this tech, if anyone is interested in it also, and if not, I will be posting here my updates on the technology has it is developed by either myself, or other companies.

Details of my personal research into the tech will be very limited until I can get the system patented, and Prototype 1 is developed (a fully conscious calibration unit for test subjects). Once the initial systems are created I will have to set up a website and recruit test subjects. My main concern is the legal and political blow-back of this technology, since it will be foreign in understanding to any of the higher powers in this society. In addition to that, there are ~7 billion other people out there that would love to steal my research and turn themselves into millionaires, so I cannot be public with it until it is under steady development.

Basically this thread is to see if I get any bites with anyone interested here. Disucuss away if so ^.^
 
Sounds to me like you want to mine us for ideas, but are unwilling to share anything substantive yourself. I don't know if that's your intent but that's how I'm seeing it.
 
Mining for ideas is the last of my interests, considering I already have the system ready to go into prototype stages. No ideas that come out of this thread would be anything that I haven't already thought of or considered anyway. I just wanted to know if anyone here was interested in it as well.
 
Mining for ideas is the last of my interests, considering I already have the system ready to go into prototype stages. No ideas that come out of this thread would be anything that I haven't already thought of or considered anyway. I just wanted to know if anyone here was interested in it as well.


Picture's?
 
A working neurological input /output interface would require you to decipher thoughts from the minor electric impulses within the brain and manipulation of said impulses as well. The latter alone is hugely interesting as you'd have to accurately target a very specific area of the brain with an electric impulse that had to be wirelessly transmitted with pinpoint accuracy.

Neuronic patterns differ from person to person to my knowledge, but let's assume you found a way to decipher thoughts, calibrate your device to the individual's brain (which I think is the hard part), how do you manage to wirelessly transmit an electric impulse to an area that is possibly only a few micrometers in diameter? I don't want to know enough to copy your "full dive technology", just that little tidbit of information.

Okay, I'm sure you won't answer since "someone might steal your intellectual property", but I'm calling weeaboo infused Be on this one until you provide at least some scientifically sound details ;)
 
A working neurological input /output interface would require you to decipher thoughts from the minor electric impulses within the brain and manipulation of said impulses as well. The latter alone is hugely interesting as you'd have to accurately target a very specific area of the brain with an electric impulse that had to be wirelessly transmitted with pinpoint accuracy.

Neuronic patterns differ from person to person to my knowledge, but let's assume you found a way to decipher thoughts, calibrate your device to the individual's brain (which I think is the hard part), how do you manage to wirelessly transmit an electric impulse to an area that is possibly only a few micrometers in diameter? I don't want to know enough to copy your "full dive technology", just that little tidbit of information.

Okay, I'm sure you won't answer since "someone might steal your intellectual property", but I'm calling weeaboo infused Be on this one until you provide at least some scientifically sound details ;)

Simple. Highly advanced EEG's. Essentially off the shelf units that are highly modified. And whereas regular BCI EEG systems run anywhere up to 24 channels, this has the potential to require several hundred. Hence why Prototype 1 is a calibration system. Each unit will be indervidually tailored to every person, it has to be, but a core 'proof of concept' system has to be designed for anyone to take me remotely seriously, as well as to patent the tech so my now going on 3 years of research dosn't go 🤬 up.

Picture's?

The hardware hasn't arrived yet, and it will take me a couple weeks to get it to a stable state, and several months/years after that to turn the technology into a reality. As soon as I get the hardware though I'll be putting up frequent updates with images here and on an alternate forum thread dedicated to the tech.
 
Simple. Highly advanced EEG's. Essentially off the shelf units that are highly modified. And whereas regular BCI EEG systems run anywhere up to 24 channels, this has the potential to require several hundred. Hence why Prototype 1 is a calibration system. Each unit will be indervidually tailored to every person, it has to be, but a core 'proof of concept' system has to be designed for anyone to take me remotely seriously, as well as to patent the tech so my now going on 3 years of research dosn't go 🤬 up.
That doesn't remotely answer the question :confused:

EEGs are able to detect the cumulative brainwaves - they'd show what area of the brain is currently active and assuming you could modify an EEG to the point it was able to pick up individual impulses without confusing them, that does not give you any means to manipulate impulses and thereby thoughts and feelings.

So, how are you doing that? How are you transmitting a computer generated image right into someone's brain?

And while I'm at it, "highly modified" doesn't mean anything unless you're specifying the modifications.
 
Waveforms of EEGs are never the same. Small changes in the way each waveform manifests itself can, in theory, be understood by a system in order to recreate that waveform in a practical manner. For example, if a person performs no actions while in a statis trance, the computer takes a reading of the waveform of that, lets say, femtosecond of time. In the next femtosecond, the computer takes a reading of all waveforms and notices a major spike in Theta wave activity. This alerts the PC to the fact that the person has undertaken some form of physical action. Be that of moving a limb, blinking, breathing, etc. Likewise a change in alpha frequencies may mean a subject's mental state is changing. Higher alpha waves usually mean a state of calming. It's all very vague, purely because I don't know exactly how different the changes in waves will be from patient to patient, or how much fine tuning is needed for off the shelf EEG's to read such precise waveforms.

Combining that with a wireless tap into the primary nervous system (which is another thing to work on entirely), somehow, and the location of each of these changes within the body can be pinpointed, and replicated with the in-program reconstruction. if a person moves a finger, the computer senses the change in Theta wave activity, knows that the patient has moved a limb. The nervous system tap then pinpoints the location of the attempted limb movement, and replicates it.

All of the above takes place within femtoseconds of time, if not less. That's what makes the editing of each EEG channel so important. How it's edited though is trial and error. First off bandwidth will be a huge limiting factor, simply because of the sheer amount of information that is to be transferred. In only a few seconds of uptime the system may produce several hundred exabytes of extractable data, excluding that of interfered data from external sources (bump, distraction, bugs, etc). I will need dedicated input and output signals for each diode, as well as a central hub that each diode links to so they can understand each other. My area of expertise into circuitry and all that jazz is limited, so I will have to get outside help for that.

Each diode will also have to be changed, I assume mostly software side, to read further into the brain than it normally would. Regular units are designed to not penetrate the brain impulses to the levels required for high end tuning, so power levels would increase.

In addition to that because of the amount of processing power needed no current civilian computer would be able to take the strain. We're in supercomputer territory.

I'll also have to, eventually, modify the frequencies each diode can receive. Make them 'variable' instead of 'static'. A current eeg diode may be focusing on, for example, 5.5 - 5.6Htz, within theta wave territory. If I have a single diode recieveing only 10 decihertz alterations, I would require 1000 diodes, making the machine far too large to fit on a human head.

Almost all of this tech is trial and error, combined with theory and fact. It's a bit like coming up with electricity or noticing gravity. You know it exists, but until you can get the required materials (in this case, funding, hardware, software, time, space, and manpower, all of which I am lacking currently) to prove it, explaining it is like explaining an atom bomb to a 2 month old.

EDIT:
proto pictures will do
The hardware hasn't arrived yet,.

I could show you a photo of my messy desk if you like, but I'm not sure that will help :P
 
Waveforms of EEGs are never the same. Small changes in the way each waveform manifests itself can, in theory, be understood by a system in order to recreate that waveform in a practical manner. For example, if a person performs no actions while in a statis trance, the computer takes a reading of the waveform of that, lets say, femtosecond of time. In the next femtosecond, the computer takes a reading of all waveforms and notices a major spike in Theta wave activity. This alerts the PC to the fact that the person has undertaken some form of physical action. Be that of moving a limb, blinking, breathing, etc. Likewise a change in alpha frequencies may mean a subject's mental state is changing. Higher alpha waves usually mean a state of calming. It's all very vague, purely because I don't know exactly how different the changes in waves will be from patient to patient, or how much fine tuning is needed for off the shelf EEG's to read such precise waveforms.

Combining that with a wireless tap into the primary nervous system (which is another thing to work on entirely), somehow, and the location of each of these changes within the body can be pinpointed, and replicated with the in-program reconstruction. if a person moves a finger, the computer senses the change in Theta wave activity, knows that the patient has moved a limb. The nervous system tap then pinpoints the location of the attempted limb movement, and replicates it.

All of the above takes place within femtoseconds of time, if not less. That's what makes the editing of each EEG channel so important. How it's edited though is trial and error. First off bandwidth will be a huge limiting factor, simply because of the sheer amount of information that is to be transferred. In only a few seconds of uptime the system may produce several hundred exabytes of extractable data, excluding that of interfered data from external sources (bump, distraction, bugs, etc). I will need dedicated input and output signals for each diode, as well as a central hub that each diode links to so they can understand each other. My area of expertise into circuitry and all that jazz is limited, so I will have to get outside help for that.

Each diode will also have to be changed, I assume mostly software side, to read further into the brain than it normally would. Regular units are designed to not penetrate the brain impulses to the levels required for high end tuning, so power levels would increase.

In addition to that because of the amount of processing power needed no current civilian computer would be able to take the strain. We're in supercomputer territory.

I'll also have to, eventually, modify the frequencies each diode can receive. Make them 'variable' instead of 'static'. A current eeg diode may be focusing on, for example, 5.5 - 5.6Htz, within theta wave territory. If I have a single diode recieveing only 10 decihertz alterations, I would require 1000 diodes, making the machine far too large to fit on a human head.

Almost all of this tech is trial and error, combined with theory and fact. It's a bit like coming up with electricity or noticing gravity. You know it exists, but until you can get the required materials (in this case, funding, hardware, software, time, space, and manpower, all of which I am lacking currently) to prove it, explaining it is like explaining an atom bomb to a 2 month old.

EDIT:



I could show you a photo of my messy desk if you like, but I'm not sure that will help :P

well you said you had a proto.. that means to me a physical item. but i think you better off asking nasa not gtplanet no offence.
 
Dude, I'm sorry as you seem real enthusiastic about the whole thing, but...

Lots of somehows, ifs, maybes, shouds, coulds, but not a single, solid, scientifically sound answer.

How do you get an EEG to measure the minuscule changes in the brain wave pattern? You say you've got so somehow upgrade it - how exactly? What exactly are you going to do to an off the shelf unit to enable the sort of precise measurement you'll need? How do you interpret the brainwave patterns? Even with all the processing power and bandwidth in the world, you'll have to decrypt the patterns. How do you get the diodes to work fast enough to support the bandwidth and processing power? How are you going to make them read deeper into the brain? How are you going to make the diodes switch frequencies? What does each specific frequency transmit? What are the frequencies you're targeting? How are you going to fit and calibrate thousands of diodes with variable frequencies into something the size of a bike helmet? How are those diodes going to manipulate brain waves to actually generate some sort of input? What should that input be to actually change the brainwaves in a way that gets you to the desired result?
Almost all of this tech is trial and error, combined with theory and fact. It's a bit like coming up with electricity or noticing gravity. You know it exists, but until you can get the required materials (in this case, funding, hardware, software, time, space, and manpower, all of which I am lacking currently) to prove it, explaining it is like explaining an atom bomb to a 2 month old.
Yeah, well, noticing that brain waves exists and imagining that they can possibly somehow be manipulated isn't much of an achievement, is it? I mean, c'mon, all you've done so far is throw a few fancy words around and dreamed up the idea that somehow it should be possible to do what was shown in Sword Art Online. Doesn't seem like you've gone any further than the author of that anime. You ain't got nothing but an elaborate fantasy unless you've got an answer to the how.

You could also claim to have 'invented' cold fusion because it'd work if you'd be able to somehow prevent the fusion from generating excess heat. Because that means absolutely nothing unless you've found a way to prevent the generation of excess heat.

/edit:
You know what, let's make this a little easier.

If I gave you the funds you needed, do you - right now - have the knowledge to take a guinea pig and wirelessly transmit an impulse into its brain to manipulate its brainwaves to alter its behaviour without causing damage or getting a false positive by directly muscle contraction and the like?
 
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Even better, let's put this to bed. I shall post here again in a few months when I'm beginning trials and explain things in full depth once it is patented. The exact reason I haven't gone public with it until this point is simply because of the inability for most people to understand, and for the more questions they ask, the more likely it is others will steal. I know I keep hammering on about that but there's too much theft these days for me to openly allow a large corperation to nick my research.

As for your edit, given some months of tuning and software work, yes, I could, eventually. This thread isn't designed to say "hi i've made awesome". it's to introduce people to this concept. Again I come back to my gravity analogy, when an apple fell on Newtons head, he knew it existed, but I would put money on the fact that no one believed him until he could show it to other minds.
 
As for your edit, given some months of tuning and software work, yes, I could, eventually.
So you can't.

Good luck with becoming a leading expert in neurology, circuitry, software engineering, medical engineering and whatever other scientific fields are going to be relevant. I'd have more faith in you if you were one of those already, though.

Oh, and regarding Newton: He was a leading expert in his fields and he didn't just point out that gravity must be a thing, he was able to mathematically describe it and formulate the physical laws pertaining to it accordingly. People should really see past that bedtime mes story of the apple.
 
Thankyou for being honest, I know it all sounds very crazy, and it is. Once I've done more work on it I'll revisit this and see if I can explain it a little better.
 
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For example, if a person performs no actions while in a statis trance, the computer takes a reading of the waveform of that, lets say, femtosecond of time. In the next femtosecond, the computer takes a reading of all waveforms and notices a major spike in Theta wave activity. This alerts the PC to the fact that the person has undertaken some form of physical action.

So you've also got a computer that's responding at femtosecond levels? It's a shame that normal PCs only have ~5x10^9 cycles a second, each cycle would have to analyse and respond to ~5x10^5 of your femtosecond measurements.

It's a shame that modern supercomputers are made up on lots of computers linked together, and that delays in the networking will probably cripple anything you want to do at those timescales. Not to mention response delays in your detection and impulse generation equipment.

Sounds like bollocks.

That's what makes the editing of each EEG channel so important. How it's edited though is trial and error. First off bandwidth will be a huge limiting factor, simply because of the sheer amount of information that is to be transferred. In only a few seconds of uptime the system may produce several hundred exabytes of extractable data, excluding that of interfered data from external sources (bump, distraction, bugs, etc).

Exactly. And then you need to process that.

A supercomputer big enough probably doesn't exist, and yet you think that this is viable tech in the next five years.

Sounds like bollocks.

Almost all of this tech is trial and error, combined with theory and fact. It's a bit like coming up with electricity or noticing gravity. You know it exists, but until you can get the required materials (in this case, funding, hardware, software, time, space, and manpower, all of which I am lacking currently) to prove it, explaining it is like explaining an atom bomb to a 2 month old.

No, it's not. You're making up science fiction, but because you're not actually doing research you don't know the enormous gulf that exists between having and idea and actually making it work. You somehow think that you can have a good idea and build it in your shed.

If you were doing legitimate research into this topic, you'd either be able to explain exactly how existing solutions are able to be applied to solve these problems, or you'd know exactly why existing solutions are not applicable. If you can't explain it to other intelligent, interested people then you don't understand it well enough yourself to do anything with it. Your hand waving that we're all too dumb to understand doesn't fool anyone.

You're a dilettante.

Watch Steins Gate when you need your next crazy idea. You can make us a time machine out of a microwave and a banana.
 
It doesn't sound crazy, it sounds arrogant. Beyond arrogant.

In all your posts, all you're showing is a very vague and superficial understanding of how a human brain works and how we're currently able to draw (very limited) data from it. And yet, you somehow come to the conclusion that simply coming up with the idea of "oh, we gotta somehow tap into that and manipulate it like in SAO" makes you the Isaac Newton of the 21st century? :lol: You're essentially pissing all over those who're doing actual research on those scientific fields and dedicate years of their lives to actually come up with meaningful results - results you seemingly glossed over and decided that that alone made you a luminary in the field of neurosciences and computing.
Watch Steins Gate when you need your next crazy idea. You can make us a time machine out of a microwave and a banana.
Imagine him being exposed to MacGyver...
 
So you can't.

Good luck with becoming a leading expert in neurology, circuitry, software engineering, medical engineering and whatever other scientific fields are going to be relevant. I'd have more faith in you if you were one of those already, though.

Oh, and regarding Newton: He was a leading expert in his fields and he didn't just point out that gravity must be a thing, he was able to mathematically describe it and formulate the physical laws pertaining to it accordingly. People should really see past that bedtime mes story of the apple.


It was actually a comet that proved newton law of physics haili's if i am correct as he watched the tail of it go behind the sun the emerge the other side pointed out into space away from earth and the direction it was pointed before... the apple is a story .

But to tlowr4 this is how you come across to me personally just an example below

It made a flux capacitor mate its amazing can go through time any direction you want...But!!!! i cannot show even a picture because you are all thief's and all stupid to understand the concept anyway, but if i had a few billion dollors a hoard of minions i'll prove it '' one day '' ..

cannot help being skeptical ... i was put in the outrageous claims thread for less but i had proof!!! to back me up they had to have humble pie that day... i'll start baking my pie ready to eat.. but you need some proof before that happens anything will do
 
Make no mistake, your attempts to gang up on me and insult me aren't working, nor do they interest me in explaining anything more to people who apparently cannot comprehend. I have attempted to introduce you all to a new concept and, while making yourselves look stupid, you've also managed to give me even more ambition to continue with the project.

I'm not going to waste time individually replying, I have much better things to do. You can also thank me for having already edited my previous comment towards you, @Luminis. I guarantee you the original was far more insulting.

EDIT: Requesting closure if a Mod sees this. I'll just post my updates in the What have you done today thread, there's no excuse for hostility such as this.
 
Make no mistake, your attempts to gang up on me and insult me aren't working.
You know, if one person tells you you're wrong, there's that. If everyone does, you might actually be.

Besides, if insulting you was what I wanted to do, I wouldn't have replied. Just made a screenshot and put it in on 9gag for the world to see, but I tend to not act on my malicious tendencies :lol:
You can also thank me for having already edited my previous comment towards you, @Luminis. I guarantee you the original was far more insulting.
Man, I'm trembling right now.

You sound like a typical millenial :lol:
 
Make no mistake, your attempts to gang up on me and insult me aren't working, nor do they interest me in explaining anything more to people who apparently cannot comprehend. I have attempted to introduce you all to a new concept and, while making yourselves look stupid, you've also managed to give me even more ambition to continue with the project.

I'm not going to waste time individually replying, I have much better things to do. You can also thank me for having already edited my previous comment towards you, @Luminis. I guarantee you the original was far more insulting.

EDIT: Requesting closure if a Mod sees this. I'll just post my updates in the What have you done today thread, there's no excuse for hostility such as this.


Sorry if it came across like that it was not my intention i wouldn't like you to feel like we were ganging up on you. Maybe it just the wrong place for this subject as it it quite intense stuff.

I was not trying to put you down in anyway inventions can be made by anyone look at the wright brother's they made bicycles but introduced flight to the main stream.

In the same breath you will come up against more intelligent people than us in your struggle to get this idea off the ground, And if we are making you flustered these people with more scientific understanding that us. They may also be scientifically aggressive as well .

I wish you all the best i truly do
 
Thankyou @vasiliflame, I appreciate that. All I wanted to do was bring the concept to the forefront. My own work on it wasn't really the focus of the thread. I know I will come up against a lot of hostility, all be it I didn't expect it here :P. A lot has changed since I left.

My biggest concern for it all is the political stuff. Tampering with peoples consciousness in its current form gets people twitchy as it is, even if it is medically based. Something to ponder anyway.

Thanks for being mature about it ^^
 
Thankyou @vasiliflame, I appreciate that. All I wanted to do was bring the concept to the forefront. My own work on it wasn't really the focus of the thread. I know I will come up against a lot of hostility, all be it I didn't expect it here :P. A lot has changed since I left.

My biggest concern for it all is the political stuff. Tampering with peoples consciousness in its current form gets people twitchy as it is, even if it is medically based. Something to ponder anyway.

Thanks for being mature about it ^^

That's OK mate i don't think anyone was actually trying to say it cant be done or attacking you. One thing my father taught me nothing is impossible it's improbable but not impossible.

As for your biggest concern yeah that will be the fight of you life especially from the religious crowd. But there's always people who will give it a bash so to speak. May have to become a mad scientist :D
 
Make no mistake, your attempts to gang up on me and insult me aren't working, nor do they interest me in explaining anything more to people who apparently cannot comprehend.

There's nothing to comprehend. Your "explanations" so far have been fluff, full of buzzwords and references to anime.

When you've got some actual explanations for how you're going to tackle the hard problems involved in this sort of project then maybe you'll get people willing to listen and give input. But so far you've said nothing worth giving input on, it reads like a pseudo-scientists wet dream.

For example, how do you intend to stop the "player"s body responding to their actions in the game world? In RL, if I think about moving my leg then my leg moves. Presumably the idea is that your system detects me thinking about moving my leg and moves my leg in the game world as well. What stops me from crashing around the room with your EEG hat on?

Obviously it can be done, in dreams we can have agency without flailing around (mostly, sleepwalking and those dreams where you trip over excepted). But you're doing this on demand, so you need to know how it works. Explain.

How do you deal with the player receiving two sets of perceptions? You're feeding them perception through your system, but they're still getting touch/sight/whatever through ordinary channels. Do you block that? Does your system override ordinary perception, or are they additive? What happens when someone gets two contradictory sets of perceptions at once?

You're assuming that you can detect somehow all the relevant feedback in the brain for perception and action, and can decode that such that you can then feed back in your own perceptions. Let's assume that's possible. Are you going to have to map everyone's brains individually to get this to work? How long is it going to take to map a brain to the point that you can reliably stimulate it to perceive what you want it to perceive? How are you going to do it? By feeding them known perceptions and reverse engineering the EEG signals?

How small a unit of the brain can you stimulate? A cubic millimetre? A cubic micrometre? A single neuron? How small a unit of the brain do you need to be able to stimulate to be able to generate meaningful perceptions? How many units can you stimulate at once, and at what update frequency? Again, what frequency do you need to create a meaningful perception of fluid motion?

You can explain your approaches to these problems without giving away any proprietary research, just as I can explain how to create a polymer with certain properties without giving away any proprietary formulations. I know how polymers work, and I can explain those in general terms without giving away restricted information.

Likewise, if you have the knowledge that you claim, you can explain in general terms how these sorts of problems are addressed without giving away any proprietary information, because you'll know as well as I do that the real difficulty is in engineering a solution. If coming up with the idea was the hard part, then the problem would have been solved decades ago.

If you're doing world leading research like this, and let's be honest, that's what it is, then you no doubt have some credentials. One does not simply go from high school student to designing SAO, you'll have done other stuff in between. Tell us about it. Link us to some of your research papers, you don't even have to tell us which one of the authors you are. Give us your PhD dissertation, which you must have because this is well any beyond PhD level. This research would be worth a handful of PhDs and then some. Universities would fall over themselves to fund you working on this in their name, as would no doubt a number of tech companies.

If you actually have anything that is. If you don't have enough to go to any of these places and get funding, you don't have enough to be here bragging about it.

Put up, or eat crow.
 
If you're doing world leading research like this, and let's be honest, that's what it is, then you no doubt have some credentials. One does not simply go from high school student to designing SAO, you'll have done other stuff in between. Tell us about it. Link us to some of your research papers, you don't even have to tell us which one of the authors you are. Give us your PhD dissertation, which you must have because this is well any beyond PhD level. This research would be worth a handful of PhDs and then some. Universities would fall over themselves to fund you working on this in their name, as would no doubt a number of tech companies.

The only part of that wall of text worth replying to. Here's my list of qualifications:

PhD in breathing, living, and thinking.

As strange as this may seem, knowledge is not just because you have a peice of paper to say you read a study book and took a pop quiz. If I choose to be interested in a subject and work on it, for several years in this case, that's my choice. I have a decent understanding of neurobiology, an even better understanding of BCI/EEG systems, and a limited understanding of circuitry engineering. As development continues, I learn along with it. That's how discovering things works.
 

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