GT 6 (False advertising)

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Famine
What? :lol:

Have you tried playing v1.00?
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Funnily enough I was actually stupid enough to get it on release day as a PSN download and it still doesn't feel any different really, They added a few events i.e the Vettel challenges fair enough but they were in the last iteration, They added a daily log in bonus again was in the last iteration so should have been there from the beginning truth be told, They fixed the handing of MR cars well truth be told again that should have been fixed before the game was released, I mean yes this is a GT forum so lots of praise will be thrown PD's direction but lets for sake of argument compare GT6 and GTA:V released roughly around the same time yet GTA is now on v1.12 compared to GT6 v1.06 and the fact that GTA actually feels better of a game than at the start yet GT6 just doesn't.
 
Oh yes, GTAV where you couldn't even play online for a month.

And that was in from the start on GTA4, so it should have been there from the beginning truth be told...
 
I guess that all these frustrations from us all comes back down to my original point that PD can alleviate all of our frustrations if they are more opened on their developments
PD seriously need to proactively update their website/blog about their development progress, at least on these promised features
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.

I take your point @Famine that some of us will still complain about this and that, that certain things are taking XYZ long. But at least we know that they are still in the works and some of us will still complain. Who knows, these might help them prioritise development based on customers feedback right on their site instead of sniffing forums etc. (if they even do that as part of their business practise)

But hey, having a more open communication approach always trump on not having any. At the end of the day, we gamers are part of their community if not their most important.

PS. I hope that some of our disagreements isn't what Kaz's idea of "Pushing the virtual divide" :D
 
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Soulfresh_ACV
I guess that all these frustrations from us all comes back down to my original point that PD can alleviate all of our frustrations if they are more opened on their developments.
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It's SCE's website/blog!

However, some people have been suggesting that the studio takes a more direct approach with a dedicated community manager (some folk in that thread were even suggesting I should do it :D SCEE have my contact details and know where to find me). It's not a bad idea at all but you need to remember that PD is effectively a first party studio under total SCE 'control' and any content a community manager can release is only the same as SCEE/A/I's Brand Managers can release. It'd benefit us tremendously to have someone who can say concerns have been directly communicated to the studio - fewer complaint threads - but you're unlikely to get significantly more information back than we already do. Maybe a shade more as SCE Brand Managers deal with all first party games and a PD Community Manager would only deal with one - less filtering.

It's also worth remembering that, if such a thing were to come to pass, PD are almost exclusively a Japanese language studio and this means they'd probably only hire Japanese speakers for efficiency (and my Japanese language stopped at about 10-year old level, 15 years ago :lol: ).
 
Famine
Oh yes, GTAV where you couldn't even play online for a month.

And that was in from the start on GTA4, so it should have been there from the beginning truth be told...
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Except that the online aspect was and is a totally different kettle of fish between GTA4-5 one being an MMO of sorts and the other well not. But we are moving off topic a tad here unfortunately.

The thing is yes PD may well have a smaller team than R* for example but I highly doubt they are any less funded but it does certainly appear that the updates are less frequent than they could be, and also less game changing, The communication between PD and its fan base is truthfully non existent to the point of all people really do is speculate and are left let down when PD fail to deliver something which people deem to be glaringly obvious especially when PD, SCE or whoever suggests something is coming/hints at, Do I need remind you about that famous photo of Mr Yamauchi standing on stage and on the big screen behind him the faithful words.

  • Livery creator
 
ghostrider135
The communication between PD and its fan base is truthfully non existent
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That is literally true. PD do not communicate with fans because that is not what they are paid to do. They are paid, by SCE, to make the game. SCE and its divisions (SCEE, SCEA, SCEI) communicate with the fans.
ghostrider135
to the point of all people really do is speculate and are left let down when PD fail to deliver something
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Does that strike you as sensible?

I mean, we're back at what I said yesterday, that the greatest of sins is to not live up to the expectations others have of you...
ghostrider135
Do I need remind you about that famous photo of Mr Yamauchi standing on stage and on the big screen behind him the faithful words.
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ghostrider135
  • Livery creator
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No:
Famine
But again, as an old hand now in GT releases (and gaming in general), my advice is "don't believe a word if you don't see it on a press release". We do our best to bring you mostly verbatim press releases to keep you informed. This hasn't been one (that I'm aware of) so it doesn't matter who says it - remember the slide for GT5 that included livery editor and number plate customisation?
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Did it appear in any press releases or promotional material for the game? Not that I'm aware of. So it wasn't used for advertising purposes and thus wasn't false advertising (though, as I mentioned earlier, an unscrupulous lawyer will take your money to fight that losing case).


Everything that appears in press conferences should be treated as plans. If it appears in a press release, it should be treated as actually present.

For reference, things have been included in adverts, promotional material and official press releases that have not come to fruition... GT5AE was supposed to come with a discount code for the GT Store - and didn't. GT5 was supposed to have a kart track at Siena - and didn't (it was removed for legal reasons regarding the flags used for the Palio horse race).
 
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Famine
It's SCE's website/blog!

However, some people have been suggesting that the studio takes a more direct approach with a dedicated community manager (some folk in that thread were even suggesting I should do it :D SCEE have my contact details and know where to find me). It's not a bad idea at all but you need to remember that PD is effectively a first party studio under total SCE 'control' and any content a community manager can release is only the same as SCEE/A/I's Brand Managers can release. It'd benefit us tremendously to have someone who can say concerns have been directly communicated to the studio - fewer complaint threads - but you're unlikely to get significantly more information back than we already do. Maybe a shade more as SCE Brand Managers deal with all first party games and a PD Community Manager would only deal with one - less filtering.

It's also worth remembering that, if such a thing were to come to pass, PD are almost exclusively a Japanese language studio and this means they'd probably only hire Japanese speakers for efficiency (and my Japanese language stopped at about 10-year old level, 15 years ago :lol: ).
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Sorry but that's what the issue is in regards to what you described. I'm not too familiar on corporate communications in Japan and make wild generalisation of the entire nation because of SCEE or PD. Being protective of "brands" is to not ignoring voices as you suggested that they're most likely going to be doing. It is to give consumer a false sense of being listened to whether good or bad. That's why you see the rise of social media in the corporate sector (as much as politics) in most western countries.

And seriously, language barriers is not an excuse regardless they are in Japan. Finding people fluent in both English and Japanese can't be that hard in Japan. I would even dare to say that it's easier to find then that producer who created that GT movie which I think I'll never bother to watch regardless what pointless award it had won.
 
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They may not be paid to communicate but it's hardly unheard of for developers to directly communicate rather than the publisher. It's especially worrying that the developers aren't even communicating with the publisher properly, if statements by SCEA of recent are anything to go by.
 
Soulfresh_ACV
Sorry but that's what the issue is in regards to what you described. I'm not too familiar on corporate communications in Japan and make wild generalisation of the entire nation because of SCEE or PD. Being protective of "brands" is to not ignoring voices as you suggested that they're most likely going to be doing. It is to give consumer a false sense of being listened to whether good or bad. That's why you see the rise of social media in the corporate sector (as much as politics) in most western countries.
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That thread exists for that reason.
Soulfresh_ACV
And seriously, language barriers is not excuse regardless they are in Japan. Finding people fluent in both English and Japanese can't be that hard in Japan. I would even dare to say that it's easier to find that producer who created that GT movie which I think I'll never bother to watch regardless what pointless award it had won.
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Well, I was more saying that if the call for a community manager is answered it's likely to be a Japanese person (or at least Japanese linguist) rather than me :lol:

I'd totally do it though. But I'd probably have to stop being a GTP admin, which would cause me some pain.
Samus
They may not be paid to communicate but it's hardly unheard of for developers to directly communicate rather than the publisher. It's especially worrying that the developers aren't even communicating with the publisher properly, if statements by SCEA of recent are anything to go by.
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I don't know who was at fault for the Zahara farce, so I won't lay any blame - but I don't think any SCEE employee ever made a statement of that ilk. "Monthly track" DLC seems to have been universal in May and nonexistent in November, so it's clear it was planned and has since been abandoned for whatever reason - no idea who's at fault there either.
 
Famine
That thread exists for that reason.Well, I was more saying that if the call for a community manager is answered it's likely to be a Japanese person (or at least Japanese linguist) rather than me :lol: I don't know who was at fault for the Zahara farce, so I won't lay any blame - but I don't think any SCEE employee ever made a statement of that ilk. "Monthly track" DLC seems to have been universal in May and nonexistent in November, so it's clear it was planned and has since been abandoned for whatever reason - no idea who's at fault there either.
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@Famine Maybe you can play a role as their English speaking community manager and reports directly to someone who are fluent in both to relay the message. It might work but definitely hasn't been tried yet. :D

By the way, Kaz twitter account paints the picture that definitely there's opportunity for PD to incorporate some sort of communications manager. Just look at his sparse updates. :D
 
GTA 5 came out about a month or so before GT6, and was plagued by many problems. Rockstar disappointed many people, probably more than PD did. There is no way that GTA 5 was / is more complete. Both games have bugs, some got fixed in both, some still remain.

I agree that GT6 has many issues that need to be addressed, but false advertising? That's not one of them! We will get all the promised features, sure they're not here yet, but they'll come when they're ready. It's only been a few months, it's not like it's been a year and we're still waiting. We've gotten several updates, some added content, some fixed and / or broke the physics, but everything will come with due time. I'm not entirely happy with PD, but I would never sue them, or claim false advertising, that's just laughable.

If you're "already bored" with GT6, odds are that any update released whether it contains new content or not, will not make you happy.

The community manager would be a great idea, and better communication would be great too, but if PD gave us their schedule, and for some reason couldn't meet it, people would cry foul. Just sit tight and be patient, good things come to those who wait.
 
I have to admit that my patience is starting to wear a little.

Both store.sony.com and amazon.com advertise GT6 as having the following features:-

Largest Collection of Vehicles
New Physics Engine
Course Maker
Online Race Organizer
Mobile Device Compatibility.

I have contacted both organizations to alert them to the errors in the description. Sony ignored me, Amazon thanked me, neither has taken any action.

Amazon offered to provide a refund if I returned the game, even though it was purchased nearly six months ago. I declined the offer.

My decision to buy GT6 was based on the product description on gran-turismo.com, so I received what I expected. However, I did kind of expect that more of the "future" features would have arrived by now. Of course, I have nothing in the way of facts to back this up apart from wishful thinking.

PS All this talk about how Polyphony Digital needs to communicate with us is hogwash. PD is the development arm, and has no marketing responsibilities or authorities. Take a look at their website to understand what they choose to communicate.
 
GBO Possum
I have contacted both organizations to alert them to the errors in the description. Sony ignored me, Amazon thanked me, neither has taken any action.
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The Sony Store is a weird case - I have literally no idea who's responsible for them but, like the SEN Store, it seems not to be any of the SCE branches. I think it's Sony Electronics Inc - the arm of Sony responsible for... well... making TVs and DVD players. Whoever they are, it seems that they've got absolutely nothing to do with SCE and continue to do stuff like this.

This is why people often confuse Sony (the games publisher) with Sony (the PR company), Sony (the electronics firm) and Sony (the film maker).
GBO Possum
PS All this talk about how Polyphony Digital needs to communicate with us is hogwash. PD is the development arm, and has no marketing responsibilities or authorities. Take a look at their website to understand what they choose to communicate.
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I've been saying this incessantly for months and few listened to me. I hope you have better luck!

That said, just because they don't do it doesn't mean it wouldn't be nice if they did. From our point of view it'd be great to have someone else to receive all of the complaints and try to sift through them :lol:
 
:lol:We probably will get all of these content in 2.0. My only problem with the game is the bugs in this game (when someone join/leave a lobby, lag occurs,). Who knows, something good might come into the game.
 
Famine

For reference, things have been included in adverts, promotional material and official press releases that have not come to fruition... GT5AE was supposed to come with a discount code for the GT Store - and didn't. GT5 was supposed to have a kart track at Siena - and didn't (it was removed for legal reasons regarding the flags used for the Palio horse race).
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The Evo 7 WRC in GT4 also counts, might I add. 💡

Lilslick510
:lol:We probably will get all of these content in 2.0. My only problem with the game is the bugs in this game (when someone join/leave a lobby, lag occurs,). Who knows, something good might come into the game.
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GT6 Spec II?
 
zooburner
I think probably the biggest sadness for me in all this is that when, in a few years the servers go offline we wont be left with the updated game on re-install, we will be left with the limp lettuce of a game that came on the disc.

I think in future I will buy all games based on how they are at release, not how they are after many upgrades.

Still waiting for the promised updates, the ones so far have been cosmetic at best and haven't improved (in my opinion) the game as a whole at all.

Z
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you'll probably still be able to update to the latest patch as long as you're connected to PSN.

ghostrider135
Funnily enough I was actually stupid enough to get it on release day as a PSN download and it still doesn't feel any different really, They added a few events i.e the Vettel challenges fair enough but they were in the last iteration, They added a daily log in bonus again was in the last iteration so should have been there from the beginning truth be told, They fixed the handing of MR cars well truth be told again that should have been fixed before the game was released, I mean yes this is a GT forum so lots of praise will be thrown PD's direction but lets for sake of argument compare GT6 and GTA:V released roughly around the same time yet GTA is now on v1.12 compared to GT6 v1.06 and the fact that GTA actually feels better of a game than at the start yet GT6 just doesn't.
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Apples to oranges:

GTA V came out mid September, soon to be 8 months old, is from a huge developer and multinational who has a a dedicated, official website and forum. The project started in 2008 and took 5 years to complete.

GT6 came out early December, is now 5 months old, and is from a small dev who barely communicates and has no official forum. Project started in November 2011 so just a little more than 2 years to complete.

The only valid comparison IMHO is the fact both have yet failed to deliver very anticipated online content: GTA's heists, and track creator/shuffle/real endurance career racing/drag track/(enter favorite missing content) in GT6's case.

Oh, I still play GT6 5 months later, I got bored of GTA in early December, not even 3 months after it was out.

Famine
Oh yes, GTAV where you couldn't even play online for a month.

And that was in from the start on GTA4, so it should have been there from the beginning truth be told...
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you couldn't play online for 2 weeks, September 17th to October 1st.

ghostrider135
The thing is yes PD may well have a smaller team than R* for example but I highly doubt they are any less funded
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haha good one! GTA V cost $265 Mil to make and surpassed $1 Billion in sales in 3 days. I don't think all GT games combined can claim that!

DeifieD
GTA 5 came out about a month or so before GT6
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almost 3 months before... good post otherwise.

Famine
This is why people often confuse Sony (the games publisher) with Sony (the PR company), Sony (the electronics firm) and Sony (the film maker).
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could be Sony's fault lol
Seriously though, we need someone fluent in Japanese and English (or Japanese & French)...
 
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amar212
But it was PROMISED!

PROMISED!!

PROMISEDDD!!!

THEY CAN'T CHANGE THEIR PLANS ONCE THEY PROMISEEE!!!

/faints
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It's funny that even though your post is laced with a heavy dose of sarcasm, it's actually a pretty accurate depiction of how the real world works -

* If I promise my wife something, then "change my plans", she wouldn't be happy
* If I promise my boss to complete a job in an hour, then "change my plans", he wouldn't be happy
* If I, or someone who represents me promises my customers something, then I "change my plans", they won't be happy.

But, in all of the above cases the hurt party can still be understanding about the situation and any potential conflict mitigated. The problem for Polyphony is that they have all but run out of good will with their broader customer base - their plans seem to change more often than not and people only have a limited amount of patience.
 
I'll be impressed if your wife is understanding about the situation and even more impressed if she doesn't still bring it up twenty years later :-)

On a more serious note I think the best you can hope for is to get your money back if you are really that upset.

Personally I am a little disappointed that some features are still lacking and that we never know what's coming until the last minute. On the other hand, now that the dust has settled, I quite like GT6 and I really like the extra tracks that have been added since GT5. I appreciate that it's a long way from perfect but I like it a lot more than GT5. Due to having a lot of kids and running a business I haven't been able to plunge into GT6 but instead have dipped in every few weeks so perhaps that's why I have grown to like it, despite its faults.

Better communication about bugs and what to expect when would certainly make us all happier. On the other hand, I bought GT6 based on the Eurogamer review of what was there on day 1, which may be another reason why I'm reasonably happy with the game.
 
in the mean time, we get 10 cars monthly with every now and then a nice detailed track... in another well known game... Honestly, I don't know how the die hard GT fans can still trust PD and Kazumory with horse's blinds...
 
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zooburner
I think probably the biggest sadness for me in all this is that when, in a few years the servers go offline we wont be left with the updated game on re-install, we will be left with the limp lettuce of a game that came on the disc.

I think in future I will buy all games based on how they are at release, not how they are after many upgrades.

Still waiting for the promised updates, the ones so far have been cosmetic at best and haven't improved (in my opinion) the game as a whole at all.

Z
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Well at least on PS3 you can do a full system backup and everything will be fine as long as your PS3 is still able to turn on.

(God knows why the next generation of consoles don't have this feature despite pushing more and more for us to go digital)
 
Soulfresh_ACV
These are some of the promised features yet to even appear on the game (minus Vision GT cars):
  • Players can create their own personalized custom car in the game.
  • Cars will be continually added online
  • More new tracks will continue to be provided online
  • New Course Maker
  • Online - Quick Match
  • Community/Club/Race Organiser
  • Real/Virtual "Edge Effect" Activity (Whatever that is!!!?)
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1: Has been there all along though not to the degree many would like
2: Cars have been added periodically since release
3: Not happened yet, still no idea why we did not get that new track they indicated would be coming in Feb.
4: I wasn't expecting to see this before June at the earliest so no surprise that it is not here yet
5: Sounded like this would be here shortly after Jan 1 but nothing as of yet, Very disappointing
6: Same as 5 though they did add the time trial lobbies which were mentioned together with the club and quick match stuff. One would have thought they would have all came at the same time.
7: Been there since 1.01

So of the 7 we have 3 at this point and they did tell us that the updates would be coming over the course of 1 year of which we are less than 1/2 into at this point so there is still a lot of time.

That said it sure would be nice to get the Community features active and the course maker or at least start seeing some new tracks available. Would also be nice to see some of the seasonal races like were in GT5 rather than just these super lap 1 and done things we've been getting so far.
 
Samus
No they didn't.
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Yes they did say that they would be updating the software for the first year.

Of course I would not take that to literally but more as an about 1 year could be more or less depending on how things go along the way.
 
HBR-Roadhog
Yes they did say that they would be updating the software for the first year.

Of course I would not take that to literally but more as an about 1 year could be more or less depending on how things go along the way.
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Citation required.
 

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