GT Sport Gr.4 - How does it work?

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Aussie_HSV

Aussie_HSV

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Gr.4 is quickly becoming a mystery in GT Sport.

We know Gr.1 cars are BoP'd, and all cars in that class race against each other.
Gr.3 cars, the same.

We have heard from Kaz (repeatedly) since the Copperbox presentation, that Gr.N cars will be classified according to horse-power output.
eg. N200, N300, N500 etc.

But what about Gr.4 cars?
It would seem that Gr.4 cars are the race modified versions of the Gr.N cars.
But what about their inherent performance differences?


Unfortunately, we've hardly seen any official image of Gr.4 cars.
The only image (to my knowledge) we've seen is the general car class image showing the groups.

i1QPCRXoi7ZZr_zpskwol1cfj.jpg



Curiously, at this stage we haven't seen any image showing a Gr.N car classified as, for example. N300.
But to contrast that, we have seen what we would class as a Gr.4 car, labelled as 'N200'.

Roadster%20N200_zpsjuurssum.png



So were does that leave us?
Are Gr.4 cars based on horse-power groups like Gr.N cars?
Is it actually Gr.4 cars that Kaz talks about in the presentations, and Gr.N events will be one-make events and not BoP'd to horse-power classes? (translation error?)

After recent images of what would seem to be a Gr.4 Toyota S-FR, or the earliest images of the MX-5 Gr.4, surely these cars won't be put on the grid against, for example, a Merc. SLS AMG Gr.4.
Or will they?

So are we looking at horse-power group classes for Gr.4, or are we looking at serious BoP to get all these cars on the same grid?
 
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GTEFGHA
View attachment 580531

Well as you can see there are options which seem to be used for modifying cars for Gr.4 so that might affect something, I dunno
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I would have thought that was simply a 'naked' Audi GT3 waiting for livery addition.

But you have raised another question.
Do we get aero parts available, or general race modification functions, allowing us to create Gr.4 versions ourselves?

Personally, I doubt it.
I feel Gr.4 cars are something the game supplies.
Not something we can create.

The question for me is, how are these cars classed against each other?
BoP'd, or classified in some other way?


Let me put it this way.
We have seen many road cars ... but none labelled N200, N300, etc.
We have seen many Gr.3 and Gr.1 cars.
And yet, even though PD has had many opportunities, we are yet to see any cars labelled Gr.4.
Why not?

Apologies for the double post.

But thinking about it, I can answer one of the questions myself.
I have seen (probably the only one) a race around the half-mile track using S-FR's and MX-5's as AI cars.
I saw no evidence that it was specifically a Gr.N N200 race, but it does show that all Gr.N events aren't one-make races.
 
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Like you said Aussie_HSV those Gr.4 cars look like ready made cars GT Sport provides. I cannot shake the feeling that the GR.4 class may perhaps be a rendition of GT4/ GT cup car classes.

It would indeed be nice to see a race mod feature to create our own GR.4 and GR.3 cars but the decision to solidify this feature in GT games seems to be an ongoing internal war within PD. :confused:

GT2 and GT5 4 EVA!!!:bowdown:
 
I'm not sure why GR.4 is so hard to understand.

Basically take road-based race cars from the Euro GT4 Comps and a lot of the N24 classes (SP Pro, SP3T, etc), that don't conform to GT3 or Faster and dump them in here.
 
You could just call them Spoiler and Kit version. Easier, PD could've gave a option to add simple kit but they have to bump the Carlist.
 
Castrol96
You could just call them Spoiler and Kit version. Easier, PD could've gave a option to add simple kit but they have to bump the Carlist.
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I don't think you, or @Robbks, have picked-up on the question I'm asking.

You can't just add a spoiler kit to an AMG SLS and an MX5, and go racing in the same class.
Similarly, you can't just clump cars from different real world race categories into the same class, and expect similar performance, and therefore fair, racing.

Why haven't we seen any Gr.4 cars officially named as such on in-game menus?
Do we have Gr.4 cars grouped into hp classes, as per Gr.N?
Or is it a case of serious BoP'ing?

As the thread title asks, how does it work?
 
Aussie_HSV
You can't just add a spoiler kit to an AMG SLS and an MX5, and go racing in the same class.
Similarly, you can't just clump cars from different real world race categories into the same class, and expect similar performance, and therefore fair, racing.
Click to expand...
You can in a video game, that's how they get concept cars that have never been track tested like the VGT's to compete with purpose built race cars. You can plug in any values you want for cars to equalize them, it doesn't need to be related to real life performance at all.
 
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Aussie_HSV
As the thread title asks, how does it work?
Click to expand...

The simple answer is we don't really know. My guess, and it's only a guess, is that PD themselves weren't quite sure how the groups were all going to work out when they first announced it. That is why I believe we've seen the same MX-5 labelled as Group 4 on the website image you posted in the OP and also in-game as 'N200'. I think originally perhaps the N category were going to be the ones with the basic wing and stickers, then they changed it to Gr.4 but that MX-5 didn't get changed in time.

Either way I think once you remove the MX-5 from the mix the three other Gr.4 cars make sense, competing against each other. They would still need balancing obviously but none are so far off at base than the MX-5. I would guess they'll all be leveled out to around 400BHP, so the Evo will have to be tuned up, the Merc down and so on. I don't think there will be sub-categories to Gr.4 like Gr.N but honestly, we just don't know.

Plus with the delay it could all be moot anyway, they could change them up again.
 
Take any car, add a wing and three brands stickers : you have a gr4 car IMO. The N200 must be a sub category for cars like MX5 or S FR.

Gr4 is like GT4, modified cars but not too far like GT3. IRL they try to push GT4 category a lot. Many thinks it's the future and now GT3 cars are too expensive and will disappear like the GT1 cars. (Which was the golden era of GT racing I think)
 
Aussie_HSV
I don't think you, or @Robbks, have picked-up on the question I'm asking.

You can't just add a spoiler kit to an AMG SLS and an MX5, and go racing in the same class.
Similarly, you can't just clump cars from different real world race categories into the same class, and expect similar performance, and therefore fair, racing.

Why haven't we seen any Gr.4 cars officially named as such on in-game menus?
Do we have Gr.4 cars grouped into hp classes, as per Gr.N?
Or is it a case of serious BoP'ing?

As the thread title asks, how does it work?
Click to expand...

I understand, I was speaking about PD rasing there Carlist. ;)
 
Johnnypenso
You can in a video game, that's how they get concept cars that have never been track tested like the VGT's to compete with purpose built race cars. You can plug in any values you want for cars to equalize them, it doesn't need to be related to real life performance at all.
Click to expand...
For example, the Bugatti VGT weighing about a thousand pounds less than it would have any chance of weighing in real life.
 
It's quite confusing at the moment. From what I understand "Gr.4" cars refer to race modified road cars. While "Gr.N" are completely stock road cars.

At some point in development i'm sure "Gr.4" cars were called "Gr.N", which makes sense considering they're further categorising race modified cars by their horsepower using "Nxxx". The SLS probably isn't meant to race against the Roadster, but rather other race modified cars in it's HP class (N600?).
 
Group 4 very much reminds me of improved production cars, which should be prove a lot of fun. The skill needed to handle the cars wouldn't be ridiculously high, but enough to be challenging.
 
It could be similar to how FIA GT4 class started. The cars looked like showroom stock cars. Later, rules changed to allow GT wings.
Not to say GT are mimicking that. I'm mentioning this is how it appears in my eyes.

Some cars look like VLN. Some GT4. Some look like Conti Tires Production cars.
Can't help thinking about that Manufacturer's Cup. Is it fair to pair an AMG GT with an A45?
Mustang GT with a Focus ST?

In the latest videos, we see an AMG GT in the same class as a Charger. Does this mean the MINI VGT might be in the Gr.4 class?

I remember those online Shuffle races were pretty balanced. Hope PD can start giving us more info shortly.
 
With that, maybe there's some sort of multi-class racing going on, as @05XR8 says. The below image clearly shows what looks like a Group 4 spec Lancer Evolution X competing against (at least visually) stock cars that would presumably compete in the N-Series. Maybe it's possible to tune up the stock Lancer Evolution to compete against higher performance N-Series cars through some sort of BoP system... Maybe the cars can be modified to compete in more than one class at once, such as the N200 and Group 4 MX-5, which look identical. Also, it seems odd there's been no other cars seen with some sort of N-Series BHP grouping, no?
Brands_Hatch_Indy_Normal_02.jpg
 
No doubt. That pic above has a One-77 followed by an Evora. Granted, it's an early pic of the game, showcasing whatever. The first GTS trailer, had a few GT3 cars running behind LMP cars on the Nurb'. If we only go by what they're showing us, it looks like Multiclass racing is a possible option.
 
05XR8
No doubt. That pic above has a One-77 followed by an Evora. Granted, it's an early pic of the game, showcasing whatever. The first GTS trailer, had a few GT3 cars running behind LMP cars on the Nurb'. If we only go by what they're showing us, it looks like Multiclass racing is a possible option.
Click to expand...
To be fair, it could be just that they're holding their cards close to their chest with regards to the car list, and only showing off the cars that have been unveiled thus far. Perhaps when more Group 1 and Group 4 cars are unveiled, they'll start using them in screenshots rather than padding out the screenshots with cars from all over the place. I'm reminded of this shot from one of the GT6 trailers, which shows, among others, a Fisker Karma, a BMW Z8, a Toyota GT86, a Corvette C7, a Tesla Model S, a Megane Trophy, a Shelby Daytona Coupe, an MP4-12C, and a Viper all competing on the same track...

gt6 pic.png


Obviously, there's a complete mishmash of cars that couldn't possibly be considered competitive, in the same way that the above GT Sport photo shows a variety of cars of wildly different power outputs and performance. The GT6 shot seems to be almost entirely composed of cars new to the franchise, and ones that had been unveiled for GT6, and therefore Polyphony opted to show them off together.
 
chzsln485
To be fair, it could be just that they're holding their cards close to their chest with regards to the car list, and only showing off the cars that have been unveiled thus far. Perhaps when more Group 1 and Group 4 cars are unveiled, they'll start using them in screenshots rather than padding out the screenshots with cars from all over the place. I'm reminded of this shot from one of the GT6 trailers, which shows, among others, a Fisker Karma, a BMW Z8, a Toyota GT86, a Corvette C7, a Tesla Model S, a Megane Trophy, a Shelby Daytona Coupe, an MP4-12C, and a Viper all competing on the same track...

View attachment 599432

Obviously, there's a complete mishmash of cars that couldn't possibly be considered competitive, in the same way that the above GT Sport photo shows a variety of cars of wildly different power outputs and performance. The GT6 shot seems to be almost entirely composed of cars new to the franchise, and ones that had been unveiled for GT6, and therefore Polyphony opted to show them off together.
Click to expand...

I agree, probbably the best explanation for this...
 
chzsln485
To be fair, it could be just that they're holding their cards close to their chest with regards to the car list, and only showing off the cars that have been unveiled thus far. Perhaps when more Group 1 and Group 4 cars are unveiled, they'll start using them in screenshots rather than padding out the screenshots with cars from all over the place. I'm reminded of this shot from one of the GT6 trailers, which shows, among others, a Fisker Karma, a BMW Z8, a Toyota GT86, a Corvette C7, a Tesla Model S, a Megane Trophy, a Shelby Daytona Coupe, an MP4-12C, and a Viper all competing on the same track...

View attachment 599432

Obviously, there's a complete mishmash of cars that couldn't possibly be considered competitive, in the same way that the above GT Sport photo shows a variety of cars of wildly different power outputs and performance. The GT6 shot seems to be almost entirely composed of cars new to the franchise, and ones that had been unveiled for GT6, and therefore Polyphony opted to show them off together.
Click to expand...
I can agree with that.
 
i dont see any strange things about the Gr.4...
there is a GT3 and a GT4 championship with fia regulations...
there are also GT4 variants of cars that spawned GT3 ones...
For example the AM vantage has a GT4 version and a GT3 version...

I think that
Gr.1 is for LMP1
Gr.3 is for GT3 cars
Gr.4 is for GT4
Gr.N is for the tuned cars
 
Lancer Evo X Final Edition Gr.4
RC-F Gr.4
Roadster S (ND) '15 Gr.4

Corvette Stingray N-Series
Focus ST '15 N Series
Mito N-Series

Roadster S (ND) N200


That's what we have so far.

https://webbrain.com/u/1A6h

Where did you see the SLS classed as a Gr.4? I may have missed that one...
 
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ribloGT
I think that
Gr.1 is for fantasy cars and a couple of LMP1
Gr.3 is for GT3 cars, couple of competition cars that have nothing to do with GT3 class and fantasy cars
Gr.4 is for tuned cars pretending to be GT4
Gr.N is for the tuned cars
Click to expand...

Fixed!

And dont forget the group b! Fantasy cars pretending to be rally cars. Ford mustang? Yeah right, the lchrysler 300c could be a good rally car too.

:cheers:
 

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