GT5 Rooms are packed, should we worry?

andryush
dialed back graphics...
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WHAT???

You mean the physics that are leaps and bounds better and more true to life in their reaction?

This will be the GT that lives on PS3, so making it half assed isn't in their best interest. However, given that the servers for GT5 go down in May, it is a great opportunity to get the game out, canvass public opinion, and then improve it before there is inevitable migration.
 
Johnnypenso
I doubt PD is ever coming up with an iRacing driver rating any time soon so a license test doesn't sound like such a bad idea. However, I'd like to see a special license test or series of tests, specifically around online racing, like the WRS qualifying system. 2 or 3 different types of cars on 2 or 3 different tracks, run your best laps, submit, and based on your times you get one of say five online licenses. Hosts would then have the ability to restrict lobby access to any level of license they desire, or leave it open to anyone.

Outside of an actual iRacing style safety rating, speed is the best indicator of how clean a driver is. Usually the faster someone is, the cleaner they are, although it's far from guaranteed. You'd also be sorting drivers in you lobby so they are close to you in speed. If you're in the level 5 (slowest class) you might limit your lobby to level 5 or 4 to keep the competition tight. Level 1 or 2 drivers might do the same. For that reason alone it's worth doing in my books.

I can't really see PD taking it any further than this being that the game is obviously geared to casual video game players and not actual racers or people interested in racing.
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I like this idea but I really don't see PD doing anything like this because they are trying so hard to appeal to casual gamers/kiddos. Case in point: driver aids forced on in seasonals/license tests, lack of proper racing offline (chase the rabbit format plus AI that slow down to let you win), etc.
 
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Voodoovaj
WHAT???

You mean the physics that are leaps and bounds better and more true to life in their reaction?

This will be the GT that lives on PS3, so making it half assed isn't in their best interest. However, given that the servers for GT5 go down in May, it is a great opportunity to get the game out, canvass public opinion, and then improve it before there is inevitable migration.
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For the graphics, check my thread "GT6 graphics downgrade over GT5". I did few comparison shots, and results are really better for GT5.

This leaps and bounds better and more true physics were changed 4 times since the release of the game, so maybe they're not so perfect...

In any case they need to improve GT6, it doesn't look good in current shape.
 
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Why should we worry? It's their business if they're playing GT5. Not everyone buys a game on release, and at least for what I know, the ones who are still playing GT5 don't have GT6 yet for reasons other than they are not interested.

However, if I'm wrong and it's not a money or time thing and they prefer GT5, then it goes beyond me of why they choose it over the new product. Once a new GT is out, the last one becomes obsolete, no matter how much negatives the new one has.

But worry? Nah... What others do is not of my concern. And it won't kill Gran Turismo, if this is what's being suggested. In a year or so, I see those people moving to GT6.
 
raven214
Case in point: driver aids forced on in seasonals/license tests.
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What‽ I've done all my career so far with all assists turned off (including ABS -0) and in car view, so far I have all gold except for 2 one make races in AI that I haven't tried yet and 1 Red Bull 2014 race which I have silver in... I've golded all the seasonals that I've tried all with assists at 0 too.

No-ones forced me to use assists... Although I do have to check at the beginning of every race/challenge to make sure I've turned the sliders back to 0

Today's challenge for me was the S5 Mission race at Nordschliefe... In the GT40... It's taken me 3 afternoons... God knows how many attempts but I've only made it across the line a handful of times...
Finally cracked it this arvo with almost 2 seconds to spare.
 
andryush
For the graphics, check my thread "GT6 graphics downgrade over GT5". I did few comparison shots, and results are really better for GT5.

This leaps and bounds better and more true physics were changed 4 times since the release of the game, so maybe they're not so perfect...

In any case they need to improve GT6, it doesn't look good in current shape.
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Sorry, I thought you wrote physics, not graphics.

As for graphics, I still think that there must be something in your drinking water. I play this game pretty much daily and have never noticed those big blocks of light in your screenshots. Also, it's a completely new lighting model.

You also wrote that GT5 managed to render 16 premium cars. Nope. It didn't. It rendered 16 cars at various levels of detail, and what it used was pre-rendered L.O.D. cars. You could see the cars swapping from higher resolution models to lower resolution models over distance, This has been the norm for 3D rendering for almost 2 decades now.

GT6 however is doing real time tessellation, which means the polys are dropping out at a more progressive rate. You can still see the cars popping from higher resolution to lower ones, but it appears that they are using fewer L.O.D.'s (if any) which frees up some memory for other stuff.
 
Voodoovaj
Sorry, I thought you wrote physics, not graphics.

As for graphics, I still think that there must be something in your drinking water. I play this game pretty much daily and have never noticed those big blocks of light in your screenshots. Also, it's a completely new lighting model.

You also wrote that GT5 managed to render 16 premium cars. Nope. It didn't. It rendered 16 cars at various levels of detail, and what it used was pre-rendered L.O.D. cars. You could see the cars swapping from higher resolution models to lower resolution models over distance, This has been the norm for 3D rendering for almost 2 decades now.

GT6 however is doing real time tessellation, which means the polys are dropping out at a more progressive rate. You can still see the cars popping from higher resolution to lower ones, but it appears that they are using fewer L.O.D.'s (if any) which frees up some memory for other stuff.
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GT6 is magical game, some people say, they have cars missing from the dealership, some say they have log in bonus reseting, some say, there is some pit stop bug in online mode... why my GT6 can't have those big blocks of light as exclusive bug? :lol: But to be serious, this is how game looks in photomode. In race it doesn't look that bad.

And yeah, i know that GT5 uses LOD swaping for car models, GT6 uses tesselation, but still it looks like it didn't help in delivering same level of user experience as in GT5 (16 Premium cars vs 8 mixed models in GT6 and choppy framerate)

As for freeing up memory, why we are seeing lower quality effects all around and reduced car count? Compared to GT5 which uses LOD models swaping.
 
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jonboy1066
What‽ I've done all my career so far with all assists turned off (including ABS -0) and in car view, so far I have all gold except for 2 one make races in AI that I haven't tried yet and 1 Red Bull 2014 race which I have silver in... I've golded all the seasonals that I've tried all with assists at 0 too.

No-ones forced me to use assists... Although I do have to check at the beginning of every race/challenge to make sure I've turned the sliders back to 0

Today's challenge for me was the S5 Mission race at Nordschliefe... In the GT40... It's taken me 3 afternoons... God knows how many attempts but I've only made it across the line a handful of times...
Finally cracked it this arvo with almost 2 seconds to spare.
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Check again. In some seasonals/license tests aids are forced on (namely SRF if memory serves) meaning you don't have the option of setting them to 0, or off. Unless PD recently ninja patched it, which would get a big kudos from me.
 
andryush
Yeah, i know that GT5 uses LOD swaping for car models, GT6 uses tesselation, but still it looks like it didn't help in delivering same level of user experience as in GT5 (16 Premium cars vs 8 mixed models in GT6 and choppy framerate)

As for freeing up memory, why we are seeing lower quality effects all around and reduced car count? Compared to GT5 which uses LOD models swaping.
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I'm not sure what game you are playing. A premium car versus a standard car is only relevant to the driver and observers at the highest LOD. I don't know where you are getting your numbers from. I've seen 16 premium cars on track online many times in GT6(In fact, I see it almost weekly in league racing), so your limit of 8 makes no sense.

I'm not seeing reduced car count, beyond the topic of this thread (more people playing GT5 online). Also, there is a big difference between offline and online physics in GT5. I've had my car slammed back to the ground in GT5 when there should have been a roll over. In GT6, the difference is far less noticeable (in fact, I haven't noticed a difference at all, if there is one). That right there will affect performance. Also, more tracks are using the time of day rendering which forces dynamic shadows and, in many cases, dynamic lights from the cars. Not only is that costly from a pure rendering standpoint, but networking that is more costly.

I turned off my anti-aliasing (sharpen image option) and I've found my frame rate is much better than the default.
Under the same conditions as GT5, it performs better. In GT5, I refused to race on the weather enabled tracks online because of the terrible frame rate and screen tear. Now, on those tracks in GT6, with the anti-aliasing off, performance is far better. The frame rate is acceptable all the way up to 16 cars and no screen tear.
 
Voodoovaj
I'm not sure what game you are playing. A premium car versus a standard car is only relevant to the driver and observers at the highest LOD. I don't know where you are getting your numbers from. I've seen 16 premium cars on track online many times in GT6(In fact, I see it almost weekly in league racing), so your limit of 8 makes no sense.

I'm not seeing reduced car count, beyond the topic of this thread (more people playing GT5 online). Also, there is a big difference between offline and online physics in GT5. I've had my car slammed back to the ground in GT5 when there should have been a roll over. In GT6, the difference is far less noticeable (in fact, I haven't noticed a difference at all, if there is one). That right there will affect performance. Also, more tracks are using the time of day rendering which forces dynamic shadows and, in many cases, dynamic lights from the cars. Not only is that costly from a pure rendering standpoint, but networking that is more costly.

I turned off my anti-aliasing (sharpen image option) and I've found my frame rate is much better than the default.
Under the same conditions as GT5, it performs better. In GT5, I refused to race on the weather enabled tracks online because of the terrible frame rate and screen tear. Now, on those tracks in GT6, with the anti-aliasing off, performance is far better. The frame rate is acceptable all the way up to 16 cars and no screen tear.
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What are you talking about, you can't completely turn off AA in GT... i play on "Standard" image setting.

And i tested both games offline, so AI comes into play, maybe that's the case of bad framerate and low car count on track in GT6. Anyway GT5 outperformed GT6 in many ways in this test.
 
Go to the "sharpen image" setting. It reduces anti-aliasing if not removing it entirely. It's easier on the renderer. I wouldn't recommend it if your TV is running 720.

andryush
And i tested both games offline, so AI comes into play, maybe that's the case of bad framerate and low car count on track in GT6. Anyway GT5 outperformed GT6 in many ways in this test.
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...you tested offline :rolleyes: ...

Did it ever occur to you that the person who laid out the races limited the number of cars on track?

A fair test would be to go to arcade and set the races up EXACTLY the same. Try it on different tracks, some with variable weather, some with night, some with only dry daytime.
 
jonboy1066
Today's challenge for me was the S5 Mission race at Nordschliefe... In the GT40... It's taken me 3 afternoons... God knows how many attempts but I've only made it across the line a handful of times...
Finally cracked it this arvo with almost 2 seconds to spare.
Click to expand...

You didn't try to beat the Ford GT, right? Because it's not necessary. As a matter of fact, it helps you when its in front of you since you can draft a bit :P
 
I got it by 10 seconds on my 2nd try, but first try was ruined by the end of the first sector...Aced it second time though.
 
Voodoovaj
WHAT???

You mean the physics that are leaps and bounds better and more true to life in their reaction?

This will be the GT that lives on PS3, so making it half assed isn't in their best interest. However, given that the servers for GT5 go down in May, it is a great opportunity to get the game out, canvass public opinion, and then improve it before there is inevitable migration.
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The physics that are leaps and bounds better, how so? Camber is broken, theyve had to patch MR and AWD cars endlessly because they represented them poorly, and honestly, its still not fixed. I havent played GT6 in over a month, and 2 weeks before that I bought back my old G27 setup from a friend for a few hundred bucks, so thats telling you how disappointed I am. And I think the lobbies or lack there of, is reflecting what a majority thinks. PD needs to put out a big update, and soon, otherwise many are going to be gone, and after GT5, and now GT6, I dont think many will be returning.
 
P_Lav
The physics that are leaps and bounds better, how so? Camber is broken, theyve had to patch MR and AWD cars endlessly because they represented them poorly, and honestly, its still not fixed.
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So, if camber worked, then the physics would be awesome in your opinion? It's one setting against a backdrop of a very nice system that is (in my opinion) much better than GT5. I'm pretty sure the consensus is with me on that one.

Endless patches on MR and AWD? Where have I been? I'm only on version 1.04 :p. I'm curious what's broken and still "not fixed" about it in your opinion.

This brings me to another thread about damage, which supposedly "doesn't work", as I am watching my son drive a pretty dented to heck Ferrari around (he likes wrecking the cars) ... dents on the side, dents on the roof, dents on the trunk lid... dents everywhere. It looks way better than GT 5 IMHO. The car isn't all distorted like they used to be.

An online friend came into a 550 race with a mustang and got bent because he couldn't overpower his way to victory. "Screw this" was his reply, "I'm going back to GT5"

Sounds like a lot of people just complaining that it's different. Seeing as GT5 is one of the most popular online console games of this generation, I can understand the negative reaction to change.
 
raven214
Check again. In some seasonals/license tests aids are forced on (namely SRF if memory serves) meaning you don't have the option of setting them to 0, or off. Unless PD recently ninja patched it, which would get a big kudos from me.
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Which ones specifically? I'm sure I wound assists off every time, although I may have missed some events earlier on before I realised that TCS & ABS came on as default every time you got a new car.



HuskyGT
You didn't try to beat the Ford GT, right? Because it's not necessary. As a matter of fact, it helps you when its in front of you since you can draft a bit :p
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Nope, my first attempt I did, but the GT spun me on the long back straight, after that I let him repass me on the last straight then used him to draught me along... Gaining 6mph top end.

I did beat it easily when I got a 7:50.1 but when I finally got the 7:48 we crossed the line neck and neck.
 
jonboy1066
Which ones specifically? I'm sure I wound assists off every time, although I may have missed some events earlier on before I realised that TCS & ABS came on as default every time you got a new car.
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I don't remember off the top of my head but I'm sure someone else here does. Next time I see it I'll try to remember to post it here if no one beats me to it.
 
Hot off the presses this morning...

As previously mentioned in past announcements, the remaining online services for Gran Turismo 5, including Online Lobby, Seasonal Events, Museum, News, Community, Remote Race, Log in Bonus, Online Dealership and DLC purchase, will no longer be available after 03:00 EDT, 30 May, 2014.

We would like to thank everyone for their passion in supporting Gran Turismo 5’s online services, and we look forward to providing even better online services for Gran Turismo 6.
 
Voodoovaj
Hot off the presses this morning...

As previously mentioned in past announcements, the remaining online services for Gran Turismo 5, including Online Lobby, Seasonal Events, Museum, News, Community, Remote Race, Log in Bonus, Online Dealership and DLC purchase, will no longer be available after 03:00 EDT, 30 May, 2014.

We would like to thank everyone for their passion in supporting Gran Turismo 5’s online services, and we look forward to providing even better online services for Gran Turismo 6.
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Still waiting for those "even better" online services - or just equivalent for starters...
 
DaDog
I ain't sure , but honuestly i found it so much easier to find lobbies in GT5 ...

Streetcar 450-500-550pp on sport ( hard if possible ) no aids rooms we're popping up left and right , nowadays i spend more time looking for a lobby then actually racing ... All i come accross are 450pp on RS lobbies , starting to get annoying ....
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yes i am quoting myself , but yesterday and today ( only been online 1 hour so far ) I am unable to find any decent rooms ...

enterd 3 different 450pp rooms for the ring ... all 3 with racing soft tires and aids allowed ( exept for one ) :banghead::banghead:

enterd 4 different 500pp rooms all without aids ( yippie :D ) but also on racing softs ...

i mean comon people i have no problem with people liking those settings , it is their game afterall , but i wanna race .
I really am starting to regret using my GT5 copy to get a discount on GT6 ...

yes if they keep GT6 as it is now i can understand why they wanna force us to GT6 ( by closing GT5 servers ) because if i had known this ....

No i ain't a hater in case you are wondering , but I cannot remember the last time i was in a fun lobby with enjoyable settings . I don't mind waiting but at this moment GT6 doesn't feel half the game GT5 was for me ....
 
JohnScoonsBeard
I looked at the public lobbies in GT5 the other day and there were hundreds of different rooms open (obviously only 100 come up at a time). Lots of dirty and cops'n'robbers rooms but also lots of clean racing too. When I did a search for lobbies with SRF disabled it still came up with 47 rooms just in my region (uk). In GT6 that many never appear (maybe 3 or 4). Now considering GTPlanets GT5 threads are practically dead there are still a hell of a lot of people still playing and enjoying GT5 online (obviously we at GTP only represent a small proportion of online players).

I wonder if we are getting all available rooms shown or if PD are just giving a limited number of results (either on purpose or due to a bug). I understand that GT5 has possibly sold 4 times the number of games that GT6 (allowing for ? PSN sales).

If those GT6 results are indicative of the sparsity of public rooms then is it because all GTP events are only using friends only rooms? Are many people waiting for bug fixes, the community upgrades to see what we get? Are people still working through career mode first? I know that's something I have been more focussed on to try and enjoy career mode by giving myself a greater challenge in races and have also spent quite some time just trying out new cars in arcade mode while building up a collection. Personally I can't be bothered to go through the hassle of setting up a series through GTP until GT6 makes it easier for us.
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You asked if we should be worried? No, GT5 servers are getting shut off.
 
raven214
Still waiting for those "even better" online services - or just equivalent for starters...
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I hear you, but the news release would indicate that they are deliberately on hold and supposedly in the queue.

I still think the shocking difference in driving between the two games are keeping people from an immediate move. Once there is no more choice, there should be a migration. Although, I think the migration will still be tempered by the potential of GT7 on the horizon.
 
Voodoovaj
I hear you, but the news release would indicate that they are deliberately on hold and supposedly in the queue.

I still think the shocking difference in driving between the two games are keeping people from an immediate move. Once there is no more choice, there should be a migration. Although, I think the migration will still be tempered by the potential of GT7 on the horizon.
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I agree with you except for the shocking part. Are you suggesting the difference is that shocking that people who have bought GT6 are returning to GT5, or that they aren't buying it in the first place based on second-hand accounts? I like the new physics and I wouldn't want to trade them back for GT5's, but I don't find the change that dramatic. Then again I've been playing racing games for the past 20 years now so maybe I'm more accustomed to change than those you are referring to.
 
raven214
Are you suggesting the difference is that shocking that people who have bought GT6 are returning to GT5, or that they aren't buying it in the first place based on second-hand accounts?
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Both. I've heard people over the mics saying that they were going back to GT5 because they couldn't get to grips with GT6. They drive the same as GT5 and they tune like GT5, and the differences frustrate them.

Then those people's accounts affect the uptake by others.

I'm with you. I haven't even considered going back to GT5.
 

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