GTP Cool Wall: 2015+ Nissan GT-R LM NISMO

2015+ Nissan GT-R LM NISMO


  • Total voters
    129
  • Poll closed .
15,465
United States
Orange County, NY
GTP_GT916
Nii916
2015+ Nissan GT-R LM NISMO nominated by @AudiMan2011
132616_1_5.jpg


Engines:
3.0L Twin Turbo V6 + Energy Recovery System
Power: 1250 hp (combined)
Torque: Unknown
Weight: 870 kg
Transmission: 5-speed sequential
Drivetrain: Front engine, front wheel drive/Front engine, four wheel drive
Racing Class: LMP1-H
Additional Info: "Nissan's radical new Le Mans racer thinks outside the box by being the first front wheel drive LMP car to race at Le Mans. The 2015 car uses a 2MJ hybrid system sending all the power exclusively to the front wheels. From next year, it is set to use an 8MJ system sending electric power to the back wheels which was the original intention for the car in 2015."​
NISSAN_GT-R_LM_NISMO_01.jpg

nissan-gt-r-lm-nismo-9.jpg

Nissan_GT-R_LM_NISMO_04.jpg

Nissan-GT-R-NISMO-LM-P1-rear-3-4.jpg

Nissan-Heritage-Livery-LM-2015.jpg
 
Quite a radical approach to a Le Mans prototype, and it's definitely out of the ordinary. FF layout is.... An interesting decision. It's cool and refreshing it because it's so different from all the other P1s, but the FF drivetrain is just no. Balances to Meh.
 
Usually a race car is subzero by default in my mind, but I don't think there is much to the idea of a FF LeMans car, besides maybe playing the rules to gain an advantage. Not necessary a bad thing, but then it's still FF which is the most boring and least capable drivetrain.

If they do develop it more and it becomes successful maybe I'll change my mind.
 
If you look up the word "joke" in the dictionary, you'll see this car because the 2015 project has been nothing short of a disaster especially since it's only raced at Le Mans (where it still wasn't working right) and has now withdrawn from the next 3 rounds of the WEC.

Front wheel drive works in a 350hp touring car, not a 1200hp+ hybrid LMP, no matter how much front downforce you put on it or how wide the front tires are compared to the rears.

If it sent ICE power to the back wheels and hybrid power to the front, then the pig-ugly styling from the front engined layout might have been excused, but nooooo, they had to go against a tried and tested formula that also worked for Porsche and Toyota, not just Audi.

SU.
 
Not only it's a race car and therefore seriously uncool, it's the hipster-ish race car that generates massive hatred among motorsport nerds for reasons normal people can't understand.
 
Once you get over the understeer it becomes really fun to drive in GT6. But this is real life.

Cool.
 
LMP cars are 'meh' at best anyway. A FWD LMP car that supposedly wasn't very good (I don't watch LMP racing) is SU.
 
If you look up the word "joke" in the dictionary.

I have to stick up for the the GTR LM here, because not only is what you've said not exactly accurate, but also shows you don't understand the thinking behind the project.

We'll start off with the one thing you are right about: the car clearly wasn't ready for Le Mans, or indeed for racing this season at all. The hybrid system wasn't working, which not only meant they were as much as 700hp down on power (but still lugging the weight around), but meant they had no brake regen, so stopping distances were massive and the discs were overwhelmed. In its underdeveloped state, the suspension was too fragile to handle kerbs so the drivers often had to use dirty parts of the track to avoid damaging anything. Those two factors alone lost them arguably tens of seconds per lap.

However, let's think of the two big reasons why they ran with this concept. First, the way the current LMP1 regs are set out, there are strict limits on the amount of rear downforce the cars can run. For that reason, Nismo developed a car which focussed its aero performance around the front of the car. This in turn led the engineers to place the engine ahead of the driver (so that weight distribution was in closer equilibrium with the aero balance), and eventually to send ICE power to the front wheels. It also meant that it could be much less draggy than the mid-engined LMP cars, giving it potential for higher straight line speeds. Very handy at Le Mans.

In response to

Front wheel drive works in a 350hp touring car, not a 1200hp+ hybrid LMP

Well thanks to the aforementioned lack of hybrid power, the actual figure going through the fronts at Le Mans was nearer 550hp - which given 14"-wide front slicks and a heap of downforce seems is entirely reasonable at a time when hot hatches with road tyres have 300hp+. Had they managed to get the hybrid system working how they'd hoped, it would have been sending the rest of the power to the back anyway...

Despite running at less than half the power they were hoping for, the GTR LM was still faster than the Audis, Porsches and Toyotas at the end of Le Mans' long straights, which goes a long way to proving that the concept has plenty of potential.

The second reason for Nismo going down the route it has is to do with budget. It decided to go against the "tried and tested" formula of the other three, figuring it would be hard to beat rival manufacturers with more money and years of extra experience (i.e Audi) without trying something radically different to beat them.

So it didn't work this year. Big woop. Regardless, I completely respect Nissan for having the balls for doing something so unusual. You don't like the way it looks? Fine, that's subjective. Personally, I love it, especially in the retro colours the #21 used.

Nismo isn't just trying to be weird, it wants to win. Some of the engineering involved in the GTR LM is absolutely fascinating, and when everything is actually running how it should, I'm really interested to see how it turns out.
 
Love it for its novel approach, even if it wasn't really ready for Le Mans this year. Seriously Uncool for the usual reason.
 
However, let's think of the two big reasons why they ran with this concept. First, the way the current LMP1 regs are set out, there are strict limits on the amount of rear downforce the cars can run. For that reason, Nismo developed a car which focussed its aero performance around the front of the car. This in turn led the engineers to place the engine ahead of the driver (so that weight distribution was in closer equilibrium with the aero balance), and eventually to send ICE power to the front wheels. It also meant that it could be much less draggy than the mid-engined LMP cars, giving it potential for higher straight line speeds. Very handy at Le Mans.

One thing that gets me is that could do sort of the same with with a front biased RWD car and get the benefits of RWD as well. Although I guess there are some disadvantages, like having to route the driveshaft.

The bulbous shape of the front of the car also looks more draggy than what you might get out of a MR LMP, but it's probably offset by induced drag if they can run much lower downforce. Wide front tires are more draggy than wide rears though.
 
Looks cool, it's very innovative and unique, but that FF layout made it a pain to drive in GT6, and in Le Mans it was riddled with issues...
Cool I guess
 
I'm not huge on it's looks, but I do like it when something new pops up, even if it does have some serious flaws that need working out. Thankfully Nissan seems at least committed to giving it one more go so hopefully we can see what this thing can really accomplish.

-Cool.
 
A disastrous LMP1 with an FF drivetrain. Need I say more?

You say it like it's a static project. I voted SU cause I do so with every race car even my favorites despite how much a technological wonder it is, because at the end of the day these aren't real road going machines that symbolize us as people who enjoy driving (unless your voting and a professional race car driver here). Point is the bad jokes people are making about this car and just going for face value is a bit silly. Even if it was purely a FWD (which it isn't) how in reality is that so bad...?

Perception or a wild use of it is the issue here, FWD are thought of as your cheap Honda, Peugeot, and so on that are made into hot hatches and so on. And thus their gaudy image or dorky not only give a bad name to the great potential FWDs have in given areas, but also a bad name to 4 cylinder engines as well. Like the negative talk Porsche got until everyone saw it was a V shape and seemed to be fine with it (V4 Turbo engine is what I'm talking about). If you saw the reason why Nissan went this route I doubt this comment would have been made in regards to a AWD car.
 
Last edited:
Seriously uncool because racecar.

But... honestly, a very high cool for doing something different that... well... didn't work this year, but hell... got to give them props for the guts it takes to build something this unusual.

Next year, we'll know if the thing works as specified or not, but it's stuff like this that raises interest in racing amongst people bored of formulas...

That there are beyond-left-field ideas like this that can see the light of day gives me hope for the future of racing.

Cool.
 
This is outside of the box enough but without the brought upon stigma following it (like the Deltawing) that I would give it a cool if they didn't name it so stupidly.

then the pig-ugly styling from the front engined layout

Not sure what events you've been watching, but from where I'm standing it's been quite a few years (coinciding with the 2011 rule change, in fact) since any of the LMP1 entrants (other than the final 908) have been what I would call aesthetically pleasing. The Porsche that won this year is a polar opposite from the Nissan in terms of engineering but certainly doesn't look any better.
 
Last edited:
One thing that gets me is that could do sort of the same with with a front biased RWD car and get the benefits of RWD as well. Although I guess there are some disadvantages, like having to route the driveshaft.

My memory is a bit fuzzy on the exact details, but I seem to remember they chose FWD for packaging and efficiency reasons. The engine is incredibly low and compact for a 3.0-litre twin turbo V6, and fitting in a prop shaft might have been a little too much hassle. A pair of short driveshafts to the front wheels also bear much lower driveline losses than those that would occur from sending power all the way to the back.

The bulbous shape of the front of the car also looks more draggy than what you might get out of a MR LMP, but it's probably offset by induced drag if they can run much lower downforce. Wide front tires are more draggy than wide rears though.

A big part of the reason why it's so slippery is thanks to its "aero tunnels":

16752794474_050af0c4c1_c.jpg


The two big boxes there channel air entering from the front of the car around the engine bay and cockpit, and straight out the back above the rear diffuser. Because the MR LMP1 cars haven't the space to do this, the air entering from the front has to exit at the side, just behind the front wheels. This effectively increases their frontal area, making them more draggy.
 
My memory is a bit fuzzy on the exact details, but I seem to remember they chose FWD for packaging and efficiency reasons. The engine is incredibly low and compact for a 3.0-litre twin turbo V6, and fitting in a prop shaft might have been a little too much hassle. A pair of short driveshafts to the front wheels also bear much lower driveline losses than those that would occur from sending power all the way to the back.
True, at a race like LeMans, all those advantages could outweigh the low speed grip with RWD. I suppose that the intent to drive the rear wheels with the hybrid system also gives it the best of both worlds. I wasn't aware that the rear wheels were meant to be driven.



A big part of the reason why it's so slippery is thanks to its "aero tunnels":

View attachment 439533

The two big boxes there channel air entering from the front of the car around the engine bay and cockpit, and straight out the back above the rear diffuser. Because the MR LMP1 cars haven't the space to do this, the air entering from the front has to exit at the side, just behind the front wheels. This effectively increases their frontal area, making them more draggy.
I'll have to look at some LMP images later, I wouldn't think that they couldn't have some kind of tunnel to pass air through the car. The engine will make shaping the rear of the tunnels more complicated though.

I don't have any numbers on me, obviously, so it's mostly guesses on my part compared to what Nissan has done. Unfortunately 2015 was not really representative of the fully developed car, so I'll have to wait and see how valid my feelings on the car are.


EDIT

It looks like the MR LMP's go the Ford GT route and just expand the air over narrower body work. This should be as using the tunnels in the Nissan except there is less skin friction drag. To me, it looks like the tunnels exist to bring the Nissan to parity with existing designs. Do you know if Nissan has published anything going into detail on the tunnel design?
 
Last edited:
Back