GTPLMS Round 3: Race ***RESULTS***

[ABud]

GTMSA Presents
GTPLMS Season 5 Round 3: Race
Suzuka Circuit; 43 Lap Endurance Race (250km)
Deadline 11.59pm GMT Sunday 23rd May​

Welcome to the first of 2 Endurance Races in this years GTPLMS championship. 250km of hard fought racing around the twists and straights of Suzuka's wonderfull circuit is going to be a real challenge, so let's see who can handle it best!

Please don't discuss total race times or lap times. You may discuss stategies if you wish though.



Results

Standings

​

General Information and Regulations

All rules, regulations, car specifications, and races are controlled by GTPLMS sanctioning body, GTMSA. Any and all questions should be directed to GTMSA officials (ABud or oldmodelt) and officials will do their best to answer in a timely and accurate manner.

All drivers must run at the specified weights and horsepower settings provided by GTMSA for each round. Horsepower and/or weight settings are adjusted for competitive reasons each round based on finishing positions from previous rounds.

IMPORTANT
For this season the track is defined as the area between the parallel white/yellow lines (see image below). This means that rumble strips no longer count as track.

• Standard Online Racing Rules Apply.
• No Cheating, hybrids, etc. You must run the car specifications I give you
• Try keeping at least 2 wheels on course. Long races = small mishaps, but absolutely NO shortcuts
• No wall-riding as well. Combined with penalties, this will slow you down considerably, so don't do it.
• All decisions by GTMSA officials are final

Endurance Race

• Arcade Mode>>>Single Race>>>World Circuits>>>Suzuka Circuit
• 43 lap endurance race (250km)
• Weight penalties in place
• RS, RM, RH tyres or any combination thereof
• Strong Tyre Wear
• AI at +8, +4 for GT1
• AI tyres RS
• Forced Pit Entry penalty system
• ASM is prohibited TCS is optional
• Points for race: 10-8-6-4-2-1
• 8 points for finishing within 103% of race winning time
• 4 points for finishing outside 103% of race winning time

Time sending format

PM me with the following data. Please make sure all details are correctly filled in and DONT MISS THE DEADLINE

User Name:
Class:
Car:
Number:
HP:
Weight:
Total Time:
Fastest Lap:
No. of Pits:


Good luck all 👍

Andy

 

[Austin343]

My observations dramatically contradict those that fogbound made in the Qualifying thread; the grip level of the surface seems, if anything, lower than that of other tracks, and I get horrifying tire wear in the Panoz. I'm sure that the weight penalty doesn't help, but the front tires are very orange after three laps on mediums, and are worryingly close to red midway through the fifth lap on hards. After testing for a little while, I don't know whether I should pit every five laps on hard tires, which are quite slow here, or stop every three laps on medium tires. The latter option seems to come out ahead when I calculate its costs and benefits, but the idea of pitting thirteen times is just sickening, and I'm having trouble accepting that stopping so frequently can actually be faster in the long term.

 

[fogbound]

My observations dramatically contradict those that fogbound made in the Qualifying thread; the grip level of the surface seems, if anything, lower than that of other tracks, and I get horrifying tire wear in the Panoz. I'm sure that the weight penalty doesn't help, but the front tires are very orange after three laps on mediums, and are worryingly close to red midway through the fifth lap on hards. After testing for a little while, I don't know whether I should pit every five laps on hard tires, which are quite slow here, or stop every three laps on medium tires. The latter option seems to come out ahead when I calculate its costs and benefits, but the idea of pitting thirteen times is just sickening, and I'm having trouble accepting that stopping so frequently can actually be faster in the long term.

You have mentioned your tire wear issues with other cars also. Watching your driving I would assume your tire wear would be lower than most people in the same vehicle. But, I also notice you you initiate your turns earlier and end later, spending more time turning and likely at a greater rate of lateral acceleration causing the tires to vaporize. 'be my guess anyway.

 

[SuperShouden]

i agree. with your aggressive driving, you'd have to pit every lap on the Ring...and LeMans. It's alright though. For long endurance races like this, it's alright to gun it for the first couple laps and then cruise the rest of the way. That's how it is in real life. If you push the car to it's limit constantly, it's gonna break. Racing isn't about the fastest lap, but about who can stay out of the pits. If you pit 13 times, you might actually lose this one.

 

[oldmodelt]

If you pit 13 times, you might actually lose this one.

"oldmodelt sees his one chance to grab a podium position." 💡 Now how does he get rid other the other drivers?

 

[Austin343]

You have mentioned your tire wear issues with other cars also. Watching your driving I would assume your tire wear would be lower than most people in the same vehicle. But, I also notice you you initiate your turns earlier and end later, spending more time turning and likely at a greater rate of lateral acceleration causing the tires to vaporize. 'be my guess anyway.

You're exactly right. Suzuka also has an unusually high percentage of the time of a lap spent in corners, particularly high-speed ones, which just tears up the front tires.

i agree. with your aggressive driving, you'd have to pit every lap on the Ring...and LeMans.

No, I'd definitely make two laps on hard tires at Nurburgring. It's because of the constant, high-speed turning at Suzuka that tire wear is giving me fits. And at La Sarthe, I expect to last five laps or so, because there are so many straights.

It's alright though. For long endurance races like this, it's alright to gun it for the first couple laps and then cruise the rest of the way. That's how it is in real life. If you push the car to it's limit constantly, it's gonna break. Racing isn't about the fastest lap, but about who can stay out of the pits. If you pit 13 times, you might actually lose this one.

That's all correct in real life, but this is GT4. You can afford to push hard every lap, and there's no penalty beyond the risk of being slowed by a sand trap. Also, GT4 models tire wear such that going slower to conserve tires is always slower overall. Again, in real racing, the situation is very different, but I'm very certain of the situation in GT4. If staying out of the pits were the reason behind victories, then obviously we'd all stay on hard tires the whole way, since the pits in GT4 are limited to stops to change tires, not to make repairs. 💡 I'm not saying that I'm going to win this race, just that I would go slower if I adapted my driving to go further on a set of tires. There's only so far that this car can go, particularly with the weight penalty, on a track that's so unfriendly to front tires.

I completed a race with the medium-tire strategy (yes, thirteen stops), and although I had been planning to do another with the hard tires instead to make sure that I had done it the right way, I may just skip it, because I felt pretty good about the one that I finished. I had a completely clean race (keeping two tires on the tarmac) until lap 37, when I had a moment of indecision when trying to lap the Ford GT on the narrow straight between Spoon and 130R and lightly clipped it on the way past. I then lost focus at Spoon a couple of laps later and put two tires in the sand, with the other two on the rumble strips. So that was slightly disappointing, but I was still pleased with the race overall.

I forgot to mention that I enjoyed this race quite a bit, which was very much a surprise to me because I was driving a car with cataclysmic understeer at a track that punishes it severely.

 

[viperin]

Thirteen pit stops !! Yikes.
I wonder how many that will be in the Bimmer ?

Hmm, I have a cunning plan.I am going to bribe the Pit crews of the other drivers to "Go Slow".
Bound to make up a few seconds that way.

Good luck all.

 

[oldmodelt]

Have put the Bentley away for the time being. Got my run in today and am happy. Fastest lap notwithstanding. I was able to keep myself out of the sand until the last time around Spoon while riding on tyres one lap longer than I like and got rear ended into the sand. It's not worth another trip to maybe pick up those 12 seconds.

 

[fogbound]

"cataclysmic understeer" best line ever...!

 

[east]

Time sent.

Did 1 run, and it was funny, because I actually managed to get myself quite nervous before I did my one and only run as it dawned on me that if I had a crash id have to report a DNF lol, this kept me quite tense for the first lap as I weaved my way through the AI, and for the following few laps as I tried to find my rythm. Luckily I got through this little period of nerves unscathed and started setting some ok times. In the end I had a few small offs, I went wide at 130R a couple times, and twice on the long left hander that leads up to the Degners, which lost me a little time, but thankfully wasnt enough to end my race premature Good luck all.

 

[Austin343]

I just retried the race, this time doing eight stints of five laps on hard tires and finishing with three laps on medium tires, and to my astonishment, I was fully fifty seconds faster. Evidently, I didn't test thoroughly enough, because the hard tires turned out to be significantly faster on a single lap than I had thought. Regrettably, this race wasn't anywhere near as clean, as I strayed too far onto the curbs around eight times, although I did perform the usual self-imposed penalty each time. It might have been free of AI contact, but the BMW Mclaren might have grazed my right rear fender after I dove past it into the first corner when attempting to lap it.

 

[fogbound]

Times sent. This was a tough week. I raced just LMP and GTS and if I finish in the money in either race I will be very pleased. I did find a fast way around the track but mistakes are soooo costly here. I went mediums most of the way with RH doing one stint to make the laps work out. I also botched fuel management and had to "full stop" while the BMW blew a few donuts in the middle of the track for the crowd.

 

[viperin]

Times sent.
What with doing this plus watching the F1 Race as well as Aussie V8 Supercar Racing, Nascar and WRC, I have had my quota of Motor Sport for this week.
Whew. Too much fun.

 

[GTsail]

Greetings all -
I have sent in my GTS and GT1 times after some very enjoyable battles at Suzuka

My initial tire strategy with my Dodge Viper in GTS was mediums all the way with pit stops at laps 6,12,18,24,30,36 and a final 7 lap stint on very orange tires. The very end of the race was somewhat marred due to the lack of grip.

Thinking that I might be able to improve my time with an extra pit stop and a short stint on softs, I tried a race with the following pit stops: 6,12,18,24,30,35,39 (the last two stints were on soft tires).

When the winning time was flashed on the screen, what did I see?

My total race time was almost exactly the same! The second race was 0.212 seconds slower than my first race. After an hour and twenty plus minutes, the two race times were less than a quarter second apart!

I submitted the slower race since it had a faster "best lap" that I set during one of the stints on the soft tires at the end.

Respectfully,
GTsail

 

[MadMax]

You guys are submitting early , as it clearly states in post #1 that the deadline is on the 23rd

GTMSA Presents
GTPLMS Season 5 Round 3: Race
Suzuka Circuit; 43 Lap Endurance Race (250km)
Deadline 11.59pm GMT Sunday 23rd May​

I haven't given this one a go yet ,
as the last week drained my attention on ice hockey.
This week won't be different , but I'll try to find time to run this race.



MadMax

 

[oldmodelt]

My total race time almost exactly the same! The second race was 0.212 seconds slower than my first race. After an hour and twenty plus minutes, the two race times were less than a quarter second apart!
Respectfully,
GTsail

Really ticks you off. Been there a few times. Now on these longer ones I give it one shot and out. Have to drive more conservatively but I'm not going to improve the 2 - 3 mins I need to challenge the speedsters.

 

[GTsail]

*snip*You guys are submitting early , as it clearly states in post #1 that the deadline is on the 23rd....
MadMax

You're right MadMax, I missed that!

But then I'm just the driver, I leave all the scheduling stuff up to my pit crew

I won't mind going back and re-running both races, looking for a few extra seconds. I really did like the racing even if the races were a little long.

Respectfully,
GTsail

 

[oldmodelt]

Both races submitted. Thanks to ABud for doing two weeks on the enduros. Never would have gotten both runs in. With middle son's IL HS Water Polo sectionals last week and State this week.

Yeah Baby!

Sorry for being slightly off topic.

 

[SuperShouden]

I've got my GT1 and LMP races done. GT1 was fun 'cause it ended up being a back and forth battle between the CLK-GTR and me with everyone a lap behind the two of us. LMP was a little closer with only one car a lap down.

I have found two things about this race. 1 - it's nearly impossible to do this race without at least 1 penalty stop. (I tried like 7 times and ended up just going with it) 2 - I HATE the stupid hitting the wall penalty. You barely touch the wall and you're in the pits. It's stupid 'cause hitting the wall is going to slow you down anyway. A wall-riding lap will ALWAYS be slower than a regular lap. Hopefully, with the damage in GT5, they'll eliminate being forced into the pits or slowed down when hitting a wall as with most wall hits, the car will be damaged enough to be out of the race or pit anyway. Those light taps should require a pit stop.

 

[Austin343]

I have found two things about this race. 1 - it's nearly impossible to do this race without at least 1 penalty stop. (I tried like 7 times and ended up just going with it)

It's entirely possible. Granted, it's much harder when your pace is even with that of an AI car and you're trading places frequently, but I earned no penalties in either of my two attempts. And I know that others also avoided AI cars and walls.

A wall-riding lap will ALWAYS be slower than a regular lap.

In GT4, that couldn't be further from the truth, as long as you're talking about city courses, dirt and snow courses, and tracks like Motegi, High-Speed Ring, Nurburgring, Grand Valley, or Motorland, each of which has walls close to the track. Sure, in some corners, either the shape of the wall or its distance from the preferred line prevents its being faster, but just do one lap at Costa di Amalfi with wallriding and one without and tell me which is faster.

 

[SuperShouden]

well, hopefully with damage, that'll be eliminated. There was mechanical damage in GT2 but not on career, which kinda sucked. Hopefully you'll only be able to turn off damage during online battles. Although, while playing Forza 2, we always left it on to discourage people from using others as a brake. We also turn on the "invisible while stopped or going the wrong way around the track" option.

 

[GTsail]

*snip*
I have found two things about this race. 1 - it's nearly impossible to do this race without at least 1 penalty stop. (I tried like 7 times and ended up just going with it).....

I think its ok to accept one DTP during a long race such as this one at Suzuka, but in short races it makes sense to just re-run the race.

I normally get a drive-thru-penalty on my first attempt at any of these race tracks (and often on the second attempt as well) due to minor impacts with the other AI cars. This ocurrs in the first lap or two of the races, so I just abort the race and re-start. I get these DTP's because I'm being agressive trying to pass the other AI in the early part of the race, and the AI are all bunched up. After a few aborted attempts, I learn where the AI can be passed cleanly and I learn where the AI brake really, really early, and I need to brake early or get off their bumpers to prevent impact.

Once the race is decently underway, and if I start to lap another car, I always drive slightly more conservative to prevent any DTP impacts since they will badly affect your overall race time.

Here at Suzuka, I earned 3 DTP's on my first full race. But this 1st race was really just a practice race and a tire evaluation race. On my next two races, I had no DTP's since I knew where the danger spots were. I had two very close calls where the AI was coming back on the track after their trips to the sand traps, but no DTP's from wall impacts or AI impacts.

Respectfully,
GTsail

 

[SuperShouden]

yeah. I had a race like that. I was coming around the Sppon Curve and the Nissan GT-R (R35) LM car was coming back on the track and I thought it was just going to turn back on the track like a normal car would do in a real race. But noooo...he pulled ALL THE WAY ACROSS the track and I ended up in his door.

 

[oldmodelt]

I have found two things about this race. 1 - it's nearly impossible to do this race without at least 1 penalty stop. (I tried like 7 times and ended up just going with it).

I had no trouble avoiding the DTP's. But I drove pretty conservatively. Knowing I'd have only one shot. Thanks Austin343. Used your strategy of 8 pits I think, and copied it. Only with my car and driving style I was able to go with RS the whole race. Final lap before pits was a little dicey but doable. Pit laps excluded, I was able to keep my splits within 1.5 or so off my best lap.

Ran my Top speed slider at 380 and 350 for the LMP and GT1. What was everyone else using?

 

[SuperShouden]

I ran at about 440.

 

[fogbound]

Did anyone do reruns? I took a side trip to the 'ring for hotlaps just for fun.

I think I had my speed at 380 in LMP and 360 for GTS or so for this latest race.

 

[SuperShouden]

I didn't. All mine are done and times are submitted. I don't think I could stand another hour and a half of this track.

 

[raz_10]

Times submitted!
GL all 👍

 

[ABud]

Time done. Spun off on half of all laps done. 2 mins off predicted time. Awful.

 

[MadMax]

Submitted my LMP time.



MadMax