GTPLMS S2 Preseason Test 1 - Apricot Hill Open Test - Results Posted and Updated

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@Neil: It's nice to see that someone's keeping track of things while i'm at work.

@ERacer: 10 laps is NOTHING in the season. 25 miles? squat! Some of the endurance races are 80-100miles, with Le Mans being roughly 200m! Oh, pit strategy, tire strategy, and all that good stuff will DEFINATELY come into play.

c
 
ICallShotgun
@Neil: It's nice to see that someone's keeping track of things while i'm at work.
c
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Work!
Work, you say! :boggled:
What's that then?:confused:

Just kidding, I am at work 24/7 (except when I'm at the pub playing pool, that is)
Luckily, I work from home, so keeping an eye on things is easy to do.

Any time buddy, any time!

Neil
 
Ballstothewall
The tractability of the GT-one out of the corners is absolutely awsome :eek:, slightly reduced entry speed combined with a later apex and the diff that causes it to throttle-steer into the corner = a blistering full throttle exit to the final corner & 200 mph+ at the end of the S/F straight!Neil
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Hey Balls ! .. if the GT1 is all that good .. perhaps it shouldnt have a ptw advantage over the rest of the field 💡

In my opinion .. it doesnt handle as well as 'others' .. and it eats its tyres faster than all of them { except maybe the Bently which i havent tested yet }

After 80 laps of testing last night .. ive confused myself :crazy: it'll be another 80 laps before deciding finally on my ride in LM Proto
 
I find the GT-one to be fairly even on the tyres, much better than say the Audi, the Bentley, and the Mac. All of these, in my hands tend to chew-up rears for fun.

Maybe it's down to driving style, maybe down to version of the game (as seen last season when Drew's Mac would do 2 laps more on the rears than mine would)
Don't forget I'm very economical on the tyres, and still able to be as quick as most.

And as to the P/W 'advantage', the car is generally slower at stock power levels than most as shown in this test session. But with the right cornering technique, it is still very handy.
That being said, it was still slower in general, so the power boost is needed. (It is only +2% when all is said and done!)

Neil
 
I guess it all comes down to what we feel comfortable with .. in testing { for Delfino anyway } the Audi definately gets an extra lap over the GT1 ... the C60's definately get an extra 2 .

I know of your 'economics history' on tyres and i'm trying to refine your technique .. whatever .. pit and tyre strategy will make the difference .. { for this driver anyway }
 
Hey ICallShotgun, could you change the numbers on my entries please? I've changed my entry numbers so they should look like this:

RACECAR - #3 Playstation 3 Audi R8

RACECAR - #53 Siemens Audi TT-R
 
Ended up racing 3 cars in each division (yeah, 12 total) and I'm pretty much done. Speeds were what I hoped for, and most were pretty close. looks like all that testing paid off. I tested the cars that were most popular, just to see what I'll be up against mainly :lol:, but also because it shows how equal they are...or arent. I didn't race a tire-test, that's next week. Short breakdown below

Prototype​
In Prototype I raced the Toyota GT-One, Audi R8, and my 'rolo C60.
I find the GT-One to be a real handful, especially on entry. It's power-band is totally un-suited to my style of driving, and it feels like a tank to me, even though it's going about 207 into Turn 1. Good speed and suited for certain people, but not me.
The Audi is a nice drive - smooth, supple, and with more throttle-steer than anything i've driven in a LONG time. If you can apex correctly in this thing, the R8 rockets out of a corner, and at 202 into Turn1 it's got good speed, but not suited to me either.
The C60 hold a special place in my heart, she gave me an overall win in P2 last year. It's not as fast as either of them, but better brakes and entry. More throttlesteer than the GT-One, but less than the R8, corner exit will please the driver if you can launch correctly, which because of the lower top-end, you will have to down long straights. Overall a middle-of-the-road between these two extremes.
Fast Laps:
GT-One - 1:07.4xx
R8 - 1:06.4xx
C60 - 1:07.4xx
Conclusion: The Audi will probably be getting a slight adjustment for the next round.
Grand Touring 1​
For GT1, I picked up the Viper, the McLaren F1, and the Zonda LM.
The Zonda is a beast, brute power barely contained. This Normally Aspirated stallion roars out of the corners with large amounts of torque, and flys into it with barely adequate brakes. Now let me say that I'm a notorious trail-braker, and this car doesn't like that. But it's quick in the right hands.
BMW brings it's McLaren F1GTR, and this car dominated last year's GT1 in the hands of DrewpyBalls OAP. The first thing you notice is that the brakes are designed for a 950kg car, NOT 1045kg. It takes a LOT to get this car whoa'd down. But it corners like it's on rails, almost no throttlesteer and its launch out of corners is a thing of beauty. The body gives lots of downforce, and it's quick down the straights as well, a good car if you can handle the extended braking distances.
the Viper is by far the most popular choice, and for good reason. Last year, the snake gave the Mac a run for it's money all season, takinga round or two, but overall it bowed to BMW. This year's model shows that it's up to the challege. A trail-breaker's dream, it enters well and exits superbly. Only problem is if you don't respect the binders, the back will snap around on you with a slight steering-wheel input.
Fast Laps:
Zonda - 1:14.1xx
McLaren - 1:14.0xx
Viper - 1:14.2xx
Conclusion: Yeah, they're close.

GT2 and GT3 coming soon.
 
Delfino
I guess it all comes down to what we feel comfortable with .. in testing { for Delfino anyway } the Audi definately gets an extra lap over the GT1 ... the C60's definately get an extra 2 .

I know of your 'economics history' on tyres and i'm trying to refine your technique .. whatever .. pit and tyre strategy will make the difference .. { for this driver anyway }
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Well I have just ran the Audi, the C60 and the GT-one round the most tyre shredding track I could think of - Grand Valley (Full).

The C60 definately gets the 👍 on rear tyre-wear, but the 👎 on overall performance. The steering seems to be really vague on the brakes, which it almost makes up for on full throttle neutrality out of the corners, but is rather understeery at the apex, and therefore slow mid-corner. Hense the lack of rear-tyre wear and even wear front to back. So it doesn't have the overall speed of either the Audi or the GT1.
Managed to get 6 full laps plus 4/5 of the 7th before the rears went orange, then it let loose without warning.(probably my fault)

The Audi definately gets a 👍 for speed, but again it is more than a little vague on the brakes. Unlike the C60 however, the Audi is good at the apex and carries good mid-corner speed, on the throttle it tends to rear-drift, so is more rear wearing than the C60.
Managed to get 5 full laps plus about 2/3 of the 6th in before it got undrivable.

The GT-one, again gets a 👍 for speed, but unlike the other two it doesn't understeer that much on the brakes, but rather over-steers slightly when trail-braking into the corner, is very good at the apex, and throttle-steers out of the corners brilliantly. Where it falls down slightly is torque in the lower rev range, so on twisty tracks like Grand Valley getting the gears right is critical to a good lap time.
Managed 5 full laps plus again 1/2-2/3 of the next before it became undrivable.

For this test I had all three cars set to the same top-speed (360), they all topped out just at the braking point for the first corner, but the GT1 suffered in the 'grunt' dept in the middle section of the track.
There were no driving aids used either, and I was pushing hard with no tyre preservation efforts from me. I just wanted to see how they compaired.

So.....

The Audi was the fastest overall, the GT1 was 'slightly' slower, and the Pesci was the slowest.
The Pesci was the best for tyre wear, with the Audi and the GT1 about even (the Audi went about 2 corners further)

Draw your own conclusions, whether the tortoise or the hare is the favorite. But I prefer to have a front end I can depend upon, and maybe have a looser back end with a harder compound on it, and use the traction-control built into my right foot to keep the rear in check.


Sorry for rambling btw!:) Too much coffee!

*EDIT*
If you compare Chris's and my conclusions and comments, it's obvious that our driving styles differ as does or preferences for the way a car handles.
Different strokes for different folks!:cheers:
Neil
 
Grand Touring 2​
GT2 showed a complete mismatch in Season 1, but this year it won't be the case. Picked out the BMW M3 GTR, Mazda RX7 LM, and the Audi A4.

The Audi runs. Good. Good entry, Good exit, Good speed, Good brakes, that's about it. It's not terrible at anything, it's not great at anything. This car will suit someone starting out and wondering what to drive. Now again, I didn't do tire tests, that's for next week, so tires are a toss-up. Bot overall a decent ride.

the RX7. Boo-yah. This is an @$$-kicker. Last year. This car, in the hands of some talented drivers, beat the crap out of everyone, going undefeated. And with good reason. The brakes suck the eyes out of the socket, exit is smooth as silk, and it will stretch it's legs when given the opportunity. Problem is, it feels like it is underpowered, slow, and a flat pig. it's NOT, but you feel the need to rock in your chair to get it moving.

The BMW is a dream...and a nightmare. This car stops superbly, rides corners on rails, and launches like a scalded dog. The only problem is it's shaped like a brick, and suffers at the top end accordingly. This car should OWN short, twisty tracks like Infineon, but Lemans and Fuji will be an "also ran" for any driver who pilots this car (including me).

Fast Laps:
M3 - 1:16.5xx
RX7 - 1:16.0xx
A4 - 1:16.1xx
Conclusion: Still pretty close at a track that's got it all, but the M3 shows it's Achilles Heal.

Grand Touring 3​
Battle of the Japanese makes? Special shout to Sammi for bucking the trend and showing that Europe can play w/ the big boys. Might have to pull the Renault out too, but for now: Honda's S2000 LM, Subaru's Cusco Impreza, and Toyota's Altezza Tourer.

The Altezza is the oddball here, it's only got 5 gears. This can either be a help or a hinderance. Less shifts means more time with power down, but for the faster, longer tracks, it's going to take longer to accelerate. But, this chariot is a well-rounded car otherwise. It's also shaped like it ran into a wall and kept going, but doesn't seem to hinder the speed at all. it's a mediocre cornering car, not suited to me, but someone else might love it. Not bad, just not for me.

The Cusco Impreza has some of the best binders on the planet...or at least on Gran Turismo Planet. This car will stop by just thinking of the brakes. Go deeper into a corner than you ever thought possible. Thing is, this car will also pull you OUT of the corner with a good amount of torque and speed. Good cornering, Good entry and exit, whether you trailbrake or not, and good speed. It's a good car with a GREAT set of stoppers.

Lastly is the S2000 LM. I love this car, so i might be a little partial. There's just something about the screaming 4-banger that really gets my blood going. It feels a little sluggish coming out of corners, but it gets up to speed nicely and carries it well through the corners. A surprise is that it's got throttlesteer. Yeah, i know, i was surpised too, but once controlled, it makes the car over a second a lap (I know, I learned the hard way). The car works well at everything it does, but it takes a sure hand and a "Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead" burn the tires off mentality to get the most out of the S2000.

Fast Laps
S2000 - 1:22.1xx
Cusco - 1:22.3xx
Altezza - 1:21.4xx
conclusion: The Altezza is surprisingly fast for its blocky shape. All three are close in overall performance, but with the lack of shifting, the Altezza takes round 1.

That's all for now. I might take the Renault out (see what that pink thing can do), and possibly the Falcon and probably the Ford GT out for a spin before we're done. Stay tuned.
 
Ballstothewall

If you compare Chris's and my conclusions and comments, it's obvious that our driving styles differ as does or preferences for the way a car handles.
Different strokes for different folks!:cheers:
Neil
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:lol: :lol:
People call you the tire king Neil.

The tire companies love me, i tend to burn them off the car. :lol:

Honestly, I think that since the two of us test, you're getting the complete opposits of the spectrum. Good luck all.
 
@ Chris mate!
Which track did you test at? Not that it makes that much difference as your results are comparative to mine in the 'overall' picture (as in the Audi is faster, then the GT1, then the Pesci) but, it would be more conclusive if we tested at the same track.

Mind you, thinking about it more, you're probably running Apricot hill ain't you? As that's where the pre-season is.
And I deliberately went and found the most brutal track for tyre-wear.

OK, i'll do more tyre testing and such @ Apricot today!

Neil
 
@Neil. Did Apricot Hill for tests, but no tire testing yet. running for this round so far.
 
Culled from the JGTC thread!
ICallShotgun
Time Sent.
Won't have time later this week, but I <3 NY!. After you get your braking points, forget about it!

OK OK, no more bad puns. but I was wary trying this track and AI combo after seeing some of the comments, but diving into the Hairpin, and flying through the short-technical 180, you can make up TONS of time. I ended up 2nd place, ~3s behind that bloody McLaren. My best lap was (a hugely draft-assisted) 1.28.3xx! standard was low-low 1.29s. I'm happy with it and it's back to LMS Testing. I can't WAIT to come here in LMS.

Good luck all and see you in the races.
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You are kidding, right?:scared:

Hey, forget about it! ;)

Neil
 
No sir. I've always been pretty good at NY, but we'll see about that later in the season. :)
 
ICallShotgun
Fast Laps GT3
S2000 - 1:22.1xx
Cusco - 1:22.3xx
Altezza - 1:21.4xx
conclusion: The Altezza is surprisingly fast for its blocky shape. All three are close in overall performance, but with the lack of shifting, the Altezza takes round 1.
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Well,we will see.
I think the Clio is a dark horse.Overpowered,underweighted little monster.
Well guys,we will loose the races against a PINK race car driven by Sammi.Bitter end.:)
Time sent,Chris.
 
Well, it was Good Friday today (well, yesterday really, as it's now 1.15am. But you know what I mean) and I had planned to do some more testing in the evening.
Needless to say, that RL interveaned in the form of having to take the puppy to the vet's because of post-surgical complications (his wound from having a 'lump' removed has become filled with fluid:sick: , and the drain they put in isn't working!:nervous: ). Anyway..............

I finally sat down at the PS2 and PC and started to get set to do some runs, only for Paramount Comedy 1 to show the 'Lee Evens, live at Wembley' concert!

Well, I just couldn't concentrate on the track, what with half listening to the TV and half listening to the game. So, I thought that I would stop and watch the concert for a bit and come back to the track later.

2hrs slip by, many, many giggle-fits and quite a few gaffaws later........ no racing tonite!
Seems I needed to laugh a little instead of race a little! (Quite worried about the 'little guy', even though @7 months he weighs over 4 stone/56Lbs and is a complete pain in the arse cos he's constantly full of energy!)

Will get back to this tommorrow, after yet another trip to the vets in the morning!

Laters dudes!

Neil
 
As a pet owner myself - two golden retrievers - I can relate to your mood. I hope all goes well at the vet and that your puppy is okay.

Phil
 
just came back from the track (and will head to japan for some Street Course racing). the Audis are awesome around the circuit. you can easily play with the throttle through the hills and hold it through the carousel turn. the overtaking is tense, but when timed properly, is very easy.
 
Unless there is a way of getting an R390 GT1 Race Car into the lineup, I'm going to have to drop out of the prototype class
 
Had a lot of fun driving both the Pescarolo Judd car and the Ford GT LM II. Surprisingly, it was the Ford car that showed me how to drive the Pesci around this track. Man, that Ford is twichier than Billy the Kidd's trigger finger and has a lot of character too! :)

And Happy Easter to all!

ERacer
 
Times submitted, I really like the Viper, it has such a nice note and handles better then I remembered. The GT1 was...well the GT1, I've always liked that ride
 
My times went in a little while ago!

Looking forward to seeing how Andy and I fair in our strange rides.

Results will, apparently, be up in fairly short order!

Neil
 
Hey Chris,once I realized I was late getting my times to you I hurridly grabbed my notes and sent off my times to you. Problem is I ran a few rounds in FreeMode and didn't note which times were Free Mode or Single race mode, so if these times are going in the record book I can't be sure if my times are legal so if you need to DQ me no problem. Sorry guys if this causes any problems, but I'm just not sure what times were what!!!
 
Drew22
Hey Chris,once I realized I was late getting my times to you I hurridly grabbed my notes and sent off my times to you. Problem is I ran a few rounds in FreeMode and didn't note which times were Free Mode or Single race mode, so if these times are going in the record book I can't be sure if my times are legal so if you need to DQ me no problem. Sorry guys if this causes any problems, but I'm just not sure what times were what!!!
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Just work out what's what buddy(if you can), and re-send em if you need to!

Still time to go before deadline!


BTW, do you like the new photo of Proximo? The sleeveless hoody is to try and stop him catching or scratching his shoulder. But he's getting bigger ain't he?

Neil
 
it's just the pre-season Andy, so no big deal unless there's a huge public outcry.

No Neil, your vote doesn't count. :lol:
 
Awwww!;)
 
I went to look at replays to determine what was what, but I didn't save a single race, guess I thought I would run again before deadline, but I'm 80% sure my times were from single race cause when I ran in free run I was experimenting with braking points and lines and not running at full out. So whatever you decide Chris it's fine with me, but if the times were worth points or official I'd just DQ myself for stupidy. My mind and time were focused on JGTC this week being it's the final race for the season and there's only 2 points between Neil and I and those Simpson girls :)

Hey Neil, that's a real good look for Proxi, maybe you should try dressing yourself better:)
 
Hey to all, glad to be a part of this series, it's gonna be fun. Actually surprised I got in the points (not counting those T-car runs), seing the race I had, but I'm happy all-round. Ten seconds is a lot to make up though! This is my first sim-race series of any kind, plus I only started playing GT1 last fall, then GT2, then started GT4 in January. I hadn't even messed with Arcade mode until I found out about GTPLMS a few weeks ago. Big-time thanks to ICallShotgun for all of the work behind this deal.

Small suggestion, how about a (R) designation next to the rookies?

You guys rock!
 
chollo9
Hey to all, glad to be a part of this series, it's gonna be fun. Actually surprised I got in the points (not counting those T-car runs), seing the race I had, but I'm happy all-round. Ten seconds is a lot to make up though! This is my first sim-race series of any kind, plus I only started playing GT1 last fall, then GT2, then started GT4 in January. I hadn't even messed with Arcade mode until I found out about GTPLMS a few weeks ago. Big-time thanks to ICallShotgun for all of the work behind this deal.

Small suggestion, how about a (R) designation next to the rookies?

You guys rock!
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Welcome to the gang chollo .. i'm a relative newbie too and agree with your compliment to the race director { it helps to get into his good books .. he sends christmas cards } Racing O/L in Arcade Mode was new to me .. and it is certainly a great way to race ... gl
 
Welcome Joe, you've gotten yourself in deep now buddy :) Race here at GTP for a year and you'll see a vast improvement in your driving from wherever you are now, I think most everone here will agree. It will bring out the best in ya.
You really should get GT3 also, I never ran GT1 or 2, I started shortly after GT3 came out and I still have alot to learn. My biggest disadvantage is age, I surely don't have the reflexes I did at 20 so I gotta work extra hard to stay up with the kids :) no not you Neil or JR or even GTX, I mean the real kids.

"What I used to do all night now takes me all night to do"
 
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