How American is your car?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Joey D
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When it comes to determining "nationality," I don't really care where the car was built (that's only useful when you're explaining to your southern, conservative relatives why you just pulled up to their house in a Honda -- "no, no, no, it's built in Ohio!"). I care where the engineering and design took place.
 
I just hate the people that say they will only buy an American car because they want to support the American economy. According to this you are more likely to support the Canadian or Mexican economy. I don't care what badge is on the car, if it's good I'll give it it's due respect....unless it's a Chrysler because I think that whole company is utter rubbish, but that's more of a personal thing than anything.
 
I knew my TL was pretty American as even the sticker had said, "Manufacturered in Ohio."

Plus, I can't think of any Honda model that is essentially, the TL Type-S.


I did know though, that my BMW was all German since only the X5 and Z4s were made in America. I can't believe they actually brought in Ferrari though.
 
Also just a reminder that list shows % of US/Canada, I think they did that because if they showed just America the numbers would be pathetically low.
 
and its also funny how the japanese f'd it up for the american companies and we actually need to have things built in other countries for cheaper labor.
 
No we need to have things built in America, out sourcing kills the American economy.
 
My 1990 Camaro is probably 99% American. The 1% is the radio and speakers which were probably made in China or Taiwan. But, since I took out all of the interior including the radio and speakers that means that it is currently 100% American. My Focus on the other hand is probably 85% American and 25% Canadian...or something.
 
yes but Americans are also killing the American economy. I try to have pride in my country and my countries cars but its kind of hard to when the average American is a complete jackass, the government is a bunch of retards, and our companies are struggling because of the worst designed cars in American history ( with some exceptions for the 80's and 90's :yuck: ) I don't know whose designing these atrocities, but id like to give them a nice swift kick in the nuts.

Take the ford edge for example, if a ford dealership near you has one thats white/cream colored like the one near me, it looks like a big friggin marshmallow

Its times like these where i know i should just buy a 1968 fastback barracuda and move to Australia.
 
JCE, there is no way that your Camaro is 100% American, there are hoses, lines, and other parts not built in this country...you can take that to the bank. There might be a large portion of it that was built in America but it's not 100% or 99%.

Diablo, yes Americans are killing the American economy because they are moving jobs out of the country and complaining when they can't find work. I'm a little bitter about this since I live in the state with the worse economy in the union. American car designs aren't bad, they are actually the best they've been in years, its just that when I can buy a Civic that will last longer and run better than a Cobalt, I'm going to get the Civic.
 
Hoses, lines, and little plastic pieces would only make up less than 5% of the total car you know. I'd still consider it almost all American, until someone provides evidence to the contrary. :sly:
 
Do you understand the amount of parts GM out sources to different suppliers which in no way makes their parts in the US because of cost. GM has been doing this for years. And the hoses, lines, filters, etc. make up a large portion of your car.

Go outside and pop the hood of your Camaro, a lot of the parts will be stamped with a Made In stamp, look to see where it was made. I've done it with my Blazer and I found more parts with Taiwan and China on it then I did with USA...and the USA parts were ones I put on there. Just because my truck was "built" in Liden, New Jersey does not make it American by any stretch of the imagination.
 
BlazinXtreme
Diablo, yes Americans are killing the American economy because they are moving jobs out of the country and complaining when they can't find work. I'm a little bitter about this since I live in the state with the worse economy in the union. American car designs aren't bad, they are actually the best they've been in years, its just that when I can buy a Civic that will last longer and run better than a Cobalt, I'm going to get the Civic.
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Where have you been in the past couple of years, lol, jk.

I do have to agree that they are better if you compare them to some of the late 70's, 80's and 90's designs :yuck:.

all i want is to have the golden years back. American cars back to the even 30's to early 70's pwned wicked hard. you can find cars that have been sitting in the woods or in fields for 30-50 years and still be able to restore the car fairly easily. now thats some long lasting quality if i must say.

Put a civic and a cobalt out in a field, they'll be completely garbage in less than a couple years.

I would argue that a civic is nowhere near better than most American coupes and sedans but im too tired to get into that kind of long argument. its mostly all about opinion and taste ( and hatred, don't forget that, lol )
 
1) My Camaro is 18 years old with 237k original miles on the engine--therefore absolutely NOTHING in the engine compartment is able to be read.
2) Why are you trying so hard in rebutting my point? Its not that important to argue over something so trivial. So in order to stop this rediculous arguement I'll just conceed that some crap is made in other countries because it really isn't that important to me that it is either way. Remember I'm German not American, so I don't have some over sensitivite American patriotic crap.
 
TEAMDiablo3
Put a civic and a cobalt out in a field, they'll be completely garbage in less than a couple years.
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No they won't, cars are designed to last more then a couple years. Leave either one of those cars in a field and you'll probably have rotted tires, a dead battery, and some faded paint. We live in 2007 not 1957.

I would argue that a civic is nowhere near better than most American coupes and sedans but im too tired to get into that kind of long argument. its mostly all about opinion and taste ( and hatred, don't forget that, lol )
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If you think a Cobalt is better then anything you need to drive more vehicles. It's one of the cheapest, crappiest cars I've ever been in. GM tried and failed on that one. The Civic is a great car and is better than anything the Americans are offering currently in the compact car department.

JCE3000GT
Why are you trying so hard in rebutting my point? Its not that important to argue over something so trivial.So in order to stop this rediculous arguement I'll just conceed that some crap is made in other countries because it really isn't that important to me that it is either way. Remember I'm German not American, so I don't have some over sensitivite American patriotic crap.
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You claimed your car was 100% American, I'm calling you on it. And where you are from doesn't make one bit of difference.
 
BlazinXtreme
No they won't, cars are designed to last more then a couple years. Leave either one of those cars in a field and you'll probably have rotted tires, a dead battery, and some faded paint. We live in 2007 not 1957.
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a car from 1957 would do the same surprisingly with it being made of.... dare i say it..... actual metal, oooh ahhhh.


If you think a Cobalt is better then anything you need to drive more vehicles. It's one of the cheapest, crappiest cars I've ever been in. GM tried and failed on that one. The Civic is a great car and is better than anything the Americans are offering currently in the compact car department.
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I never said i thought the cobalt was great, i think its a POS in my opinion. what im talking about is say a Ford Taurus. my mom had i think it was a 2003 taurus and it was really nice. The ride was great, it handled the snow perfectly, it didn't rust at all ( like a japanese car would, not ragging on japanese cars but they don't last too long with the salt ) The interior was pretty nice and comfortable ( except for the leather version, OMG did it get hot or cold. we had both a leather and whatever the other kind of upholstery is version ) I'd take that car over a civic anyday. Id actually rather take a geo over a civic, thats how much i hate japanese cars but thats off the topic
 
At least in my opinion, the parts content built in America really isn't that important to me, I generally care more if the car is completely assembled in America or not. Yes, it is a shame that my home state (Michigan) is literally falling apart because automotive companies aren't building their cars here anymore, but it is a sign that things needed to change, and that our state needs to change.

...Certainly, they still build cars like the Mustang, F-150, Silverado, CTS (and other Sigma-chassis models), Outlook (and other GMT960 models), etc in Michigan, but it is nowhere near the numbers of what it used to be. We can thank the UAW and our State government for pushing jobs out of here, but then again, the companies are at fault too...

More often than not I talk about this subject in my Poli Sci classes, and it is a discussion that often gets heated because so many people don't understand whats going on. Japanese car companies build their cars in America so that they don't have to pay as much to sell them here, beyond that, they can get away with comparatively paying their workers less money in America than they would in Europe or Asia (thanks Socialism!), and at the same time manipulate the Yen in order to make parts cheaper in Asia and have them shipped to the US for final assembly...

...They are no better than we are, plain and simple. Of the Big Three, GM still has a somewhat large heart, and still builds a majority of their vehicles in the US, but is looking to adjust it slightly with the introductions of their new updated platforms in the next five years...

Globalization is both a curse and a blessing, and like it or not, we're stuck with it. You may think $23K is a lot to pay for a Chevrolet Impala LT now, but if it was built completely within the United States, a price north of $30,000 doesn't seem out of the question...
 
They don't make the Taurus anymore...ok well they but it's just a 500 with a different face. And the Taurus are notoriously known for rusting, ask around, I'm sure people will tend to agree. I would take one over a Civic as well, but they aren't in the small class, you would have to put the Accord and Camry in the class with the Taurus which effectively makes the Taurus the worst car out of those three. The Camry is the best mid-sized car you can buy, you might not like the looks, but it's still the best you can buy.

You can't be a true car person and hate a car company based on origins. Japanese cars have done nothing against the US, if anything they have provided jobs to a slipping economy. I'm not a huge American car fan but I can tell you some decent ones (non sports cars).
 
BlazinXtreme
If you think a Cobalt is better then anything you need to drive more vehicles. It's one of the cheapest, crappiest cars I've ever been in. GM tried and failed on that one. The Civic is a great car and is better than anything the Americans are offering currently in the compact car department.
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I'm going to whole-heartedly disagree there. What GM did with the Cobalt is prove that they can build small cars in a pretty decent way, the problem is, they benchmarked a car that already had both feet out of the door (the MKIV Jetta). I cannot stand the new Civic, and I'm not alone in that... The car is over-styled both inside and out, the plastics are disappointingly cheap for a Honda, and the performance isn't anywhere near where it should be in the segment.

...The funny thing is about the Civic is that the Kia Rio5 is often considered to be a better car these days, and keep in mind that sucka' is a Kia. Not to mention there is the Mazda3 that would wipe the floor with it in any situation. There is one American car that is better than the Civic, problem is, they don't sell it here... The MKII Ford Focus. And I'm certain the Astra will do its best against the Civic later this fall...

So, no, I don't think the Cobalt is the best thing out there (that award goes to the Rabbit in this price range), but it is a damn-good car for the price, and I wouldn't hesitate recommending that someone consider it while looking at other models. They are built rather well, perform as good as most of the competition, and certainly are priced more aggressively as well. It may be my Michigan bias, but I'd take the Cobalt any-day over the Civic...

The Camry is the best mid-sized car you can buy, you might not like the looks, but it's still the best you can buy.
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What the hell happened to you while you were gone? Have you gone completely insane?

...The rather old Honda Accord is still arguably the best car in that class, but when it comes to brand-new cars, the Aura is certainly better than the Camry (more value, better looking, actually entertaining to drive), and hell even the Kia Optima has proven to be a worthy competitor, managing to out-Toyota Toyota.

Grasshopper becomes sensei? You bet your ass it happened...
 
I went and test drove one, a non supercharged SS, I was think hey 170hp compact should be decent right? I just hated the thing from the time I sat in it, the seats were uncomfortable, the dash looked cheesy, the sound system was awful, the ride was harsh (I was expecting that though) and it just didn't feel good at all.

Now I test drove a new Civic and loved it, it had a harsh ride and the sound system wasn't great, but I was comfortable in it and I liked the way it looked (that's a personal thing though).

Then I drove a Rabbit, which trumps both of them hands down.
 
Isn't a Probe basically a MX6? Correct me if I'm wrong.
 
Well like I said I'm a bit bitter with the whole thing, living in southeast lower Michigan and all. I mean I live now more then 8 miles from the DCX world headquarters in Auburn Hills, I live 30 or so miles from GM's in Warren, and I live 50ish miles from Ford in Dearborn. I remember when I moved here GM was still going strong, DCX actually could design and build cars, and Ford was just getting over it's tire thing and it was looking at a rebound.

Well since these companies have found it better to outsource everything to Mexico and Canada, jobs are going away. I live in essence right next to the GM Orion plant (I can see it from my front yard) and over the years it's been less and less productive and more and more of my friend's parent have been laid off from their jobs at that plant. Look at Flint, MI, GM pulled out of there and the city went to hell.

I don't understand how any of the big 2.5 expects anyone in this area to buy their cars when they've shipped everyone's job off to some other country. Hell even GM support lines are outsourced. I called the other day looking for a way to snag one of those "American Revolution" windshield banners and they guy was from some country where English was not their favorite language.

I'm sure it's much different is other areas, Michigan is the only state with a failing economy right now.
 
...And you can thank our Governor for much of that. If Detroit would shut their mouths and let the successful part of the state run the economics, things could be much better. But no, we have to elect some stupid lady from Canada who has done more damage to the state than her predecessors while she attempts to appease to the Japanese and the Germans and completely fails at it... All while wasting taxpayer money flying around the world for these meetings.

...And we wonder why our schools can't afford to teach kids anymore?

There is more than enough blame to go around for the perceived 'failure' of the companies in and out of Detroit. The UAW has done their share of damaging the reputation of the companies, and promoting a style of worker that is neither responsible, nor shows any sign of remorse for what they have done to a once-great industry in a once-great city.

...Then you have a collective citizenship that has yet to mobilize and demand from their corporations, employers, governments, etc that things be changed. We just sit on our couches, crying about how everything went to hell. Beyond that, we continue to sit there and watch the Lions while Ford runs another property into the ground. Sure, the stadium is great, but they can't continue to treat the team like the Focus...

Ford and GM have done their best to keep jobs in Michigan, and I have to thank them for that. The nearest plants to my house do some panel construction, and the final assembly point for the Sigma cars and GMT960 trucks is about 45 mins from here. Both places are going strong, and people seem to be happy...

Chrysler, well, they are just idiots. I could be brutally honest and say that I want to see the company fail to teach Ford and GM a lesson, but the apocalyptic nature of that would be so outstanding in this state that I pray it doesn't. May God have mercy upon that company, as I see nothing but bad-roads ahead for the foreseeable future...

---

The entire subject is indeed a touchy one for people from Michigan, and unfortunately it is hard to put all of those feelings into words, much less have anyone really understand how it feels when they aren't from around here. My entire family has worked for the auto industry at some point, and we have been die-hard domestic drivers for as long as I can remember (VWs and Nissans are considered 'okay' in my family)...

...But no matter how hard these companies continue to 'screw' us and the entire state, we just can't let them go. Thats why we still see a 90% domestic rate in Michigan (GM has 40% of that...), and similar figures are seen in states like Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Wisconsin, and Iowa.

If we could get a reasonable government installed that actually realizes that good business goes south because of cheaper taxes and the lack of a UAW presence, maybe we could convince more companies (besides ones that are already here) to come to Michigan.

...We missed out on the Honda engine factory because of Granholm's stupidity. We got lucky with the Toyota plant, but its so close to Indiana, its scary. Carlos Goshn says he wants to expand Nissan's capacity in the US, and has expressed definitive interest in re-opening closed plants of GM, Ford, and DCX, but our government has done nothing to reel them in...

Plan and simple, its not just the companies' fault. Its everyone's fault in this state. Everyone says they have an idea, and nothing ever gets done. Its about time we call-up the Michigan Militia and take back our government and run things the right way...

[/rant]
 
BlazinXtreme
If you think a *Saturn ION* is better then anything you need to drive more vehicles. It's one of the cheapest, crappiest cars I've ever been in. GM tried and failed on that one.
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I fixed it for you. The Cobalt is actually a fairly decent car (better than the Focus and Caliber, on par with the Sentra). It was the ION that was the total piece of garbage.
And this is coming from someone who loathed the Cobalt originally.
 
Totally agree with the bit about the governor, I dislike her as much as I dislike the president. She doesn't know what's going on and how she got elected to a 2nd term blew my mind...although DeVos was a shady guy too.

The UAW does hurt the companies, I learned that with my summer working at the GM Truck Mock-up in Pontiac. They are worthless...well the ones there were, could be different else where but I'm not holding my breath.

If DCX failed my area would be devastated in ways I don't want to think about, hell my school, Oakland University would lose a ton of money and the City of Auburn Hills (my summer employer) would lose out quite heavily as well considering DCX provides AH with over 30% of its revenue, not to mention the $1 police cars and work trucks. I hate DCX though and there is a part of my wishing a painful death to them.

Granholm needs to just take any opportunity that comes along that will give us jobs. We are struggling and it's sad, I go to other states and they don't have nearly the issues we have. But it's not just the car companies that are failing, it's the whole Michigan economy because everything is related to the auto industry in some way...my dad lost his job and my mom lost a large portion of her accounts.

But you are right, the government is all talk and no action, they just want to raise taxes on a broke population.


I fixed it for you. The Cobalt is actually a fairly decent car (better than the Focus and Caliber, on par with the Sentra). It was the ION that was the total piece of garbage.
And this is coming from someone who loathed the Cobalt originally.
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I hate the ION. They are ugly, slow, poorly made, and just rubbish. A buddy of mine has a Redline and it's trash on wheels with a stupid looking spoiler.
 
Toronado
I fixed it for you. The Cobalt is actually a fairly decent car (better than the Focus and Caliber, on par with the Sentra). It was the ION that was the total piece of garbage.
And this is coming from someone who loathed the Cobalt originally.
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I'd call the Cobalt better than the neuvo-Sentra, but thats just crazy-me again. When you have a car that was that highly anticipated and should have been so much better, that later turned out to be a Pug with four wheels, you want to beat down Goshn's door and knock his teeth out with your Renault keys...

If I was to rank the small car market today:

- Rabbit/Jetta
- Mazda3
- Cobalt
- Focus
- Civic
- Sentra
- Corolla
- Caliber
- Ion

...The wild-card will be the Astra, which I think could bump the Mazda3 this fall...

BX
But you are right, the government is all talk and no action, they just want to raise taxes on a broke population.
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...And the funny thing is, she promised that she wouldn't raise taxes. Beyond that, she continues to move towards that point despite the fact that what, over 80% of the state isn't in support of it? Its like she is planning for a French-Revolution scale coup d'état... Such an idiot, and a Canadian to boot...
 
YSSMAN
If I was to rank the small car market today:

- Rabbit/Jetta
- Mazda3
- Cobalt
- Focus
- Civic
- Sentra
- Corolla
- Caliber
- Ion
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- Rabbit/Jetta
- Civic
- C30
- Mazda3
- Impreza
- Cobalt
- Focus
- Corolla
- Sentra
- Caliber
- Ion


Eh, close enough.
 
I was generally thinking of 'value priced' compacts... But with the C30 in contention, I'd pretty much shoot that to 1st place after sitting in one in Chicago. Dear God is that a brilliant car!

...I'm not sure why I forgot the Impreza. Probably because they are overpriced and don't fare too well with the fuel-economy. But they are pretty good cars. They're in need for an update though...

But yes, close-enough. Move the Civic south of the Cobalt on penalties of ugly design, stupid dashboards, and cheap plastics, stupid dealer networks, and we'd nearly be spot-on...
 

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